Singapore_Air From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 13756 posts, RR: 18 Posted (15 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 2168 times:
Many airlines provide two class service as in F and Y like well I can't remember and some have two and a half as in Virgin (Economy, Premium Y, Upper) and EVA Air (Economy, Gold or something,m First). ANd some have three like Singapore Airlines and Singapore Airlines. I was wondering, why don't every airline have F, J and Y. It's a bit weird just to have two. They're misssing the middle ppl.
Zrs70 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 3516 posts, RR: 8
Reply 2, posted (15 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 2149 times:
What's interesting here is the history of it.
In the beginning, one class, all pretty much F.
Then airlines began a split F/Y cabin.
In the 60's, some airlines began a C class, but this didn't catch on until the late 70's/ early 80's.
Now, some airlines are adding a forth (BA, for example). The forth is a souped up econ/ souped down business (Like PremEcon on Virgin, but on a 4 cabin airline). This cabin is, in fact, how the airlines originally envisioned Biz Class. A slightly larger seat (8 across on a 747 instead of 10), and an econ meal.
Over the years, Biz has surpassed the old F in seat comfort.
Some airlines just don't have the resourses to offer an F product that makes $$$. So they have a nice C instead.
Airbus_A340 From Hong Kong, joined Mar 2000, 1567 posts, RR: 19
Reply 3, posted (15 years 4 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 2121 times:
Dong forget there are short haul aircraft such as Dragonair which has 3 class's on its longer routes such as beijing (they fly the A330) and shorter routes they fly the A320 and A321 where they only have business class and Economy.
I dont think it is neccessary to have first class seats on a flight less than 3 hours.
People. They make an airline. www.cathaypacific.com
YXDFan From Canada, joined Dec 2000, 193 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (15 years 4 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 2095 times:
I know that both CP and AC used to offer F, J, and Y classes on larger aircraft (747, DC10, L1011, 767) and J and Y services on smaller aircraft (some AC767s, 320, 727, 737, DC9). A number of years ago, they revised the cabins on their longhaul aircraft to have an upgraded J class (ClubEmpress on CP, Executive First on AC) instead of an F and a J cabin. Now AC/CP offers ExecutiveFirst/ClubEmpress on its 744, 343, 763, and 762ER types, along with a Y cabin. Domestically, they offer Executive/Business on the 762, 320, 319, 737, and DC9 (as well as the 142 and F28 regionally) along with the Hospitality/Economy cabin.
I believe they did it because they couldn't make a decent profit flying both upper-end cabins.
OZ777 From Australia, joined Jun 2000, 521 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (15 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 2079 times:
The issue is not simply whether the airline can necessarily make a profit. For many it was an issue of prestige, before rationalism took over. First class was ALL that was available 50 years ago but increasingly the market demanded a cheaper alternative and as aircraft became larger and more reliable, the Y class product provided the bulk of revenue.
For many of the more frequent fliers, Y did not provide the comfort for the longer sectors, yet the first class fares were too expensive. Enter a "mid class" (Qantas was the first) at a premium fare. This was also to remove the annoyance of (a) leisure passengers on very cheap APEX fares flying alongside full fare economy business people, and (b) identify and upgrade the regular business passenger and provide an environment where they could work wothout the distraction of other passengers.
It has quickly become apparent that many city pairs cannot support a first class product at the prices charged, hence the growth of J class. And of course the J class product has been improved substantially as airlines compete for that premium yield passenger.
Now we see airlines configuring their aircraft according to the routes that they fly, deleting the First product and substituting the improved J. KLM, Ansett International are just two examples. Others, such as Air NZ and Qantas still have a first product, but only on selected routes. For many years, first class was not profitable at Qantas, given the low load factors in the front of the aircraft. For most airlines, first is still a marginal product, but is a matter of prestige. J is far more profitable, hence the growth in improving the Business class amenities. The movement to a "4th" cabin is purely a reflection of again separating the full fare passenger from the discount passenger, because the frequent fliers are demanding increased service levels, but at a cheaper fare. (A reflection of the glabal economy and need to cut the costs of travel). Four classes may prove difficult to manage in terms of fare level segregation, but while airlines offer an good business class product, that is all I need.