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Will 2007 Be A 777 Record Sales Year?  
User currently offlineOldAeroGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 3499 posts, RR: 66
Posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 4724 times:

As of 7 August, the 777 family has had 94 net sales in 2007.

This is the fourth best 777 sales year on record.

The other best years are:

2005: 153
2000: 116
1995: 101

With over four months left to go this year, where will 2007 rank in terms of total 777 sales?


Airplane design is easy, the difficulty is getting them to fly - Barnes Wallis
48 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineEI321 From Iraq, joined Jul 2009, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 4650 times:

05 will be hard to beat but so far so good.

User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 60
Reply 2, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 4600 times:

Quoting OldAeroGuy (Thread starter):
As of 7 August, the 777 family has had 94 net sales in 2007.



Quoting EI321 (Reply 1):
05 will be hard to beat but so far so good.

Will probably not beat 05, but might very well be the 2nd best year for the B777.. biggrin ......



"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineThering From Brazil, joined Jun 2006, 530 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 4582 times:

2nd best I think.... +-120/130 frames.... !!!  Smile


146 319 320 321 332 722 732 733 734 735 73G 738 742 743 744 762 763 772 773 CRJ ER4 100 F50 F27 M11 D10
User currently offlineBaron95 From United States of America, joined May 2006, 1335 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 4444 times:

How about breaking down sales for the 77L generation (the 77L, 77W, 77F)?

Can someone break the sales of those models by year from 2002 to 2007? I think 2007 may break the reccord for what I think off as the 777NG.

That is important because those planes are significantly more expensive and bring significantly more cash flow to Boeing and GE.

Thanks in advance if someone can provide the numbers.

[Edited 2007-08-10 07:10:20]


Killer Fleet: E190, 737-900ER, 777-300ER
User currently offlineTdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 5, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 4312 times:

Quoting Baron95 (Reply 4):
Can someone break the sales of those models by year from 2002 to 2007? I think 2007 may break the reccord for what I think off as the 777NG.

Virtually any question about Boeing orders is pubically answerable from:
http://active.boeing.com/commercial/...definedselection.cfm&pageid=m15527

If we assume "777-Classic" = 777-200/200ER/300 and "777NG" = 777-200LR/300ER/F, then the breakdown looks like this:

2002:
777-Classic: 19
777NG: 13

2003:
777-Classic: 9
777NG: 4

2004:
777-Classic: 14
777NG: 28

2005:
777-Classic: 10
777NG: 143

2006:
777-Classic: 1
777NG: 76

2007 (through July):
777-Classic: 9
777NG: 78

Tom.


User currently offlineOldAeroGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 3499 posts, RR: 66
Reply 6, posted (7 years 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 4084 times:

Boeing's orders for the week bring total 2007 777 orders to 96.

Six more orders to go for 2007 to pass 1995 as the third best 777 order year.

Ad only one more to go to reach 1000 777 sales.



Airplane design is easy, the difficulty is getting them to fly - Barnes Wallis
User currently offlineOldAeroGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 3499 posts, RR: 66
Reply 7, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 3847 times:

Boeing's orders for the week bring total 2007 777 net firm orders to 100.

Two more orders to go for 2007 to pass 1995 as the third best 777 order year and seventeen more to pass 2000 as the second best year..



Airplane design is easy, the difficulty is getting them to fly - Barnes Wallis
User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30865 posts, RR: 86
Reply 8, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 3779 times:
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I think her top year will be around 2010 or 2011, assuming the A350 is on schedule and on target. As the A350 soaks up orders and availability is pushed out, the 777 will enjoy the sales spurt the A330 is now under the same conditions for, like the A330, she will be the "next best" choice and airlines will still desire her to hold them over until they can get A350s. Also, Boeing is likely to get more aggressive with price, which will help sales as well.

User currently offlineSunriseValley From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 4938 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3659 times:

The 41 unidentifieds is a considerable number in my view and quite a large share of year to date orders.. Was there any consensus on A-net which carrier might have ordered the 12 77W on July 31st.? Perhaps EK.?

User currently offlineRaggi From Norway, joined Oct 2000, 998 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3647 times:

Quoting SunriseValley (Reply 9):
The 41 unidentifieds is a considerable number in my view and quite a large share of year to date orders.. Was there any consensus on A-net which carrier might have ordered the 12 77W on July 31st.? Perhaps EK.?

I believe these to be for AF to replace their 744s


raggi



Stick & Rudder
User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30865 posts, RR: 86
Reply 11, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3625 times:
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Quoting Raggi (Reply 10):
I believe these (12 77Ws) to be for AF to replace their 744s

AF operates 12 744s/744Ms and they have bought 12 A388s to replace them one for one.

Also, AF already has 23 77Ws in service with 5 more on order. Would they need an additional 12? Unless they plan to replace their A343 fleet with them? But at that rate, why not get 787-8s/787-9s or A358s/A359s to replace their A332/A343 fleet together?


User currently offlineBmacleod From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 2259 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3622 times:

Don't think this year will surpass 2005, though it will easily pass 2000. NZ and NH had said they will replace their 744s with 777s. Wonder what SQ will do?

Hopefully more U.S. carriers will start to sign into the orderbooks once their financially woes have abated. I'm refferring to AA, UA and DL which has already ordered the 77L. (I'm passing over NW for obvious reasons but add CO to this list too...)



The engine is the heart of an airplane, but the pilot is its soul.
User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 13, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3617 times:

Quoting Stitch (Reply 8):
I think her top year will be around 2010 or 2011

I expect the 777 sales record set in 2005 to stand forever and that 2007 will stand as the year of the 2nd highest sales. The 777 is waning.  tombstone 


User currently offlinePYP757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 148 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3586 times:

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 13):
The 777 is waning.   

What a strange conclusion! For a plane to sell more than 100 frames in one year, 13 years after its launch, that's a remarkable achievement. Definitely not waning...


User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30865 posts, RR: 86
Reply 15, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3580 times:
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Quoting Zvezda (Reply 13):
I expect the 777 sales record set in 2005 to stand forever and that 2007 will stand as the year of the 2nd highest sales. The 777 is waning.  tombstone 

Unless Boeing can get Y3 out the door by 2015, or the 787HGWs are both amazing and also available by 2015, I think the old gal still has life in her yet...  yes 


User currently offlineOldAeroGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 3499 posts, RR: 66
Reply 16, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3569 times:

Quoting SunriseValley (Reply 9):
The 41 unidentifieds is a considerable number in my view and quite a large share of year to date orders.. Was there any consensus on A-net which carrier might have ordered the 12 77W on July 31st.? Perhaps EK.?

Could be SQ exercising a few of their 13 options.

Is wouldn't be surprising since they have had the type in operation for about a year.



Airplane design is easy, the difficulty is getting them to fly - Barnes Wallis
User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 17, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3555 times:

Quoting PYP757 (Reply 14):
For a plane to sell more than 100 frames in one year, 13 years after its launch, that's a remarkable achievement.

True.

Quoting PYP757 (Reply 14):
Definitely not waning...

The 777 is past the peak of her sales life. It's downhill from here. Or do you really think the 2005 sales record will be broken in the future?

Quoting Stitch (Reply 15):
Unless Boeing can get Y3 out the door by 2015

Zero chance.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 15):
or the 787HGWs are both amazing and also available by 2015

This seems likely to happen.

Quoting OldAeroGuy (Reply 16):
Could be SQ exercising a few of their 13 options.

SQ have options for 6 WhaleJets, 13 777-300ERs, 20 A350s, and 20 787s. Of these, the 777-300ER has the advantage of being available soonest and the disadvantage of having the highest CASM.


User currently offlineRaggi From Norway, joined Oct 2000, 998 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 3542 times:

Quoting Stitch (Reply 11):
Also, AF already has 23 77Ws in service with 5 more on order. Would they need an additional 12? Unless they plan to replace their A343 fleet with them? But at that rate, why not get 787-8s/787-9s or A358s/A359s to replace their A332/A343 fleet together?

If you look at Boeing's order site, AF has nine 777s on order. They have made several add-on orders, and I for one have lost track of them all, although I think they ordered 12 777s at LeBourget. Do a search.
I didn't say that those 12 you were referring to are positively destined for AF, I said I believe they are.

AF/ KL have not yet made a decision on the 350/787. Unless Airbus can get some GEs under the ThreeFiddy's wings, I'd say it smells like a 787 order.


raggi



Stick & Rudder
User currently offlineOldAeroGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 3499 posts, RR: 66
Reply 19, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 3536 times:

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 17):
SQ have options for 6 WhaleJets, 13 777-300ERs, 20 A350s, and 20 787s. Of these, the 777-300ER has the advantage of being available soonest and the disadvantage of having the highest CASM.

Can't argue. If they need the lift in the near term, the 773ER is the only game in town.

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 13):
The 777 is waning

The 777F will be on the scene for quite a while though.



Airplane design is easy, the difficulty is getting them to fly - Barnes Wallis
User currently offlineSunriseValley From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 4938 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 3513 times:

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 17):
Of these, the 777-300ER has the advantage of being available soonest and the disadvantage of having the highest CASM.

A valid observation. My quite unscientific take is that SQ don't always operate by the letter of the CASM rule. Somewhere the yields for the routes that the type are expected to operate seem to get factored in and CASM's get tempered by this. Their seat density on the 77W is somewhat less than optimum and their 19" wide Y seat has to be almost decadent  yummy 


User currently offlineGrantcv From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 430 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 3322 times:

Quoting Stitch (Reply 15):
Unless Boeing can get Y3 out the door by 2015, or the 787HGWs are both amazing and also available by 2015, I think the old gal still has life in her yet...

If the 777 is an old gal, then surely the 737, 747, 767, A32X, A330, and A340 are all ancient. Other than airliners that have yet to EIS, what can be considered newer or more modern than a 777.


User currently offlineBringiton From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 866 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 3296 times:

I think that boeing has a very good chance to top 2005 sales record this year .

User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 23, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 3170 times:

Quoting Grantcv (Reply 21):
If the 777 is an old gal, then surely the 737, 747, 767, A32X, A330, and A340 are all ancient. Other than airliners that have yet to EIS, what can be considered newer or more modern than a 777.

We're talking about sales here, not deliveries. Replacements for the A320 and 737 are not on sale yet and won't be for a few more years. Replacements for the 777 i.e. the 787 and A350 have together already nearly caught up with the 777 in sales.

Airlines are ordering phenomenal numbers of 787s, already cutting into 777 sales. The expected announcement of the 787-10 will further limit 777 sales. Some 777s will probably still be flying in passenger service twenty years from now, but sales will be declining over the next several years.


User currently offlineAtmx2000 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4576 posts, RR: 38
Reply 24, posted (6 years 12 months 2 days ago) and read 3123 times:

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 23):
Replacements for the 777 i.e. the 787 and A350 have together already nearly caught up with the 777 in sales.

Kind of irrelevent, when the bulk of 787 sales are for the 787-8 which isn't replacing a 777 model, and most of the airlines ordering the 787-9 so far will likely operate it in a 8Y configuration taking it out of competition with the 777, and a signficant number of A350 sales are for the A358.



ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
25 Zvezda : I disagree. I expect many airlines will replace 777s with 787-8s by fragmenting markets and increasing frequencies. The 787-8 will offer lower CASM a
26 VV701 : I am personally begining to think that the chances of the 777 at least featuring in the BA order to replace its 20 oldest 744s (as well as its fleet o
27 Atmx2000 : Because it is new and hits the portion of the widebody market that naturally has the largest demand. Despite the 787-8, the 777LR models have sold we
28 Grantcv : The 787 is a sibling to the 777, not a replacement. While size of the larger models may encroach upon the 777, the 787's sales success have not been
29 Planemaker : Obviously.
30 777STL : Nevermind the fact that most of the 787 customers, either never ordered the 777 in the first place, or will be operating the 787 along side their pre
31 Zvezda : SQ will be replacing 777s with 787s.
32 Gbfra : The freighter, yes. The pax version, I doubt.
33 777STL : Maybe their -200s, their last new -300ER was received in June. I doubt those will be going anywhere any time soon.
34 Zvezda : SQ have 68 777s in service, only the last 10 of which are 777-300ERs (not counting another 9 777-300ERs on order). It's a safe bet that SQ will repla
35 EBJ1248650 : Boeing doesn't appear to be in any kind of hurry to get Y3 going. Whether this is because their current offerings will suffice in the near term or wh
36 Grantcv : At the 787 Premiere, one of the Boeing execs mentioned that they get to do a an all-new plane every dozen years or once a generation - I forget exact
37 Zvezda : The only possible customers for a 777-300F would be FedEx, UPS, DHL, and the flower transporters. If it doesn't beat a 787F (which would have lower t
38 OldAeroGuy : Boeing's order announcement this week brings 2007 777 sales to 101, tying this year with 1995 as the third best for 777 sales.
39 Insiderinfo : I think the best years are still to come.. When airbus are still in teh same limbo they are today with the A350...airlines may start to wonder if and
40 Stitch : Even if the A350 is on time and on target, that will result in stronger and stronger sales which will fill up delivery slots. In such a situation, as
41 Insiderinfo : expect lots more orders...l 777 is still the best plane flying today...lowest CASM and most efficient... the A380 isn't flying yet.....the 787 isn't f
42 Kaitak744 : The 777 may not be getting as many orders as it used to, but there is a good future for the 777F, which is still unchallenged (and Boeing will likely
43 OldAeroGuy : About seven per month as evidenced by the Boeing Delivery web pages.
44 Post contains images Zvezda : Boeing are currently producing seven 777s per month.
45 Insiderinfo : [quote=Kaitak744,reply=42]Also, the next A350-1000 / 787-11 will be available over 5 years after the next available 777-300ER. The next A350-900R / 78
46 Bringiton : It is a launched project , the design may not be frozen yet but they have had the Authority to launch the program and offer it to potential buyers wi
47 Insiderinfo : Um.. authority to launch..and approval to build are far awide....all that means is that they have a concept that they can propose to customers...and
48 Zvezda : The A350 design is still a bit squishy, but the contracts are firm. They clearly specify some design parameters and performance guarantees. There are
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