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American Eagle To Samana, D.R., Plus AA JFK-MCO  
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11559 posts, RR: 62
Posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 5645 times:

Didn't see another thread on this, so figured I'd post it.

American Eagle (Executive Airlines, specifically) will be launching flights from San Juan to Samana, Dominican Republic (AZS) from 13 December. Flights will, of course, be operated with 68-seat ATR72s, and will be once-daily. The schedule:

AA5046 SJU 1345 AZS 1510 AT7
AA5047 AZS 1540 SJU 1700 AT7

In other news, AA mainline will also be starting a new route on 13 December: for the first time since I believe 2002 or 2003, they'll be returning to JFK-MCO -- very cautiously, of course (after all, this is AA) with a single-daily MD80 timed primarily for European connections:

AA2629 JFK 1535 MCO 1840 M80
AA2626 MCO 1210 JFK 1445 M80

Cheers.

52 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFLYGUY767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 5534 times:

Quoting Commavia (Thread starter):
In other news, AA mainline will also be starting a new route on 13 December: for the first time since I believe 2002 or 2003, they'll be returning to JFK-MCO -- very cautiously, of course (after all, this is AA) with a single-daily MD80 timed primarily for European connections:

AA2629 JFK 1535 MCO 1840 M80
AA2626 MCO 1210 JFK 1445 M80

Looks like American Airlines is going to be a little competition for Delta on this route as well. It cannot come as a suprise since American Airlines presence is larger than Delta at JFK, and AA has a much larger overall presence in the New York market than Delta Air Lines.

-JD


User currently offlineDelta4eva From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 344 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 5496 times:

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 1):
It cannot come as a suprise since American Airlines presence is larger than Delta at JFK, and AA has a much larger overall presence in the New York market than Delta Air Lines.

Umm, much larger, not quite. They are very neck-and-neck in the New York market. In fact, DL may have already surpassed AA in JFK. If they haven't already, then they will in the next year.



FLY DELTA JETS
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11559 posts, RR: 62
Reply 3, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 5453 times:

Quoting Delta4eva (Reply 2):
Umm, much larger, not quite. They are very neck-and-neck in the New York market. In fact, DL may have already surpassed AA in JFK. If they haven't already, then they will in the next year.

For June 2007, AA+Eagle was still slightly (~2-3%) larger than Delta+Connection at JFK. But that's JFK. For the New York market overall, though, AA is still well ahead (by at least 10%).

AA (mainline) is still -- by a very large margin -- the biggest player at LaGuardia, and when you add in their still quite sizable presence at JFK, plus their relatively strong #2 position at EWR (behind obvious hub powerhouse CO), they put up quite an impressive showing in the Tri-State area, even despite their anemic showing in the growth department of late vs. Delta's continuous gangbusters expansion.

[Edited 2007-08-20 16:55:21]

User currently offlineAAJFKSJUBKLYN From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 904 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 5421 times:

This is great great news!!

I was at JFK when the last 757 went to MCO in 2002. It will also be nice to see the MD80 back at JFK, which is also going to be making a guest appearance from ORD very shortly as well.


User currently offlinePanAm330 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2673 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 5368 times:

Finally! I never thought they'd bring MCO back, but they did! Hopefully they'll add a mid-evening MCO departure soon (that works best for me)!

User currently offlineTommy767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6584 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 5355 times:

this is surprising about MCO. I flew AA JFK-MCO out of the ol' T8 back in 2003 on a 757. Good times.

This past month I flew AA LGA-MCO on the 757 in F and really enjoyed the service.



"Folks that's the news and I'm outta here!" -- Dennis Miller
User currently offlineFLYGUY767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 5327 times:

Quoting Delta4eva (Reply 2):
Umm, much larger, not quite. They are very neck-and-neck in the New York market. In fact, DL may have already surpassed AA in JFK. If they haven't already, then they will in the next year.

Commavia has answered the question as to AA's presence in the NYC market rather well..

SOURCE: JFK.PDF" target=_blank>http://www.panynj.gov/CommutingTrave...orts/pdfs/traffic/JUN_2007_JFK.PDF

JFK MARKET

Domestic Passengers
#2 American Airlines 3,757,982 * #9 American Eagle 450,107
4,208,089 Passengers

#3 Delta Air Lines 3,674,993 * #4 Comair 1,475,533 * #15 Delta Connection 413,781
5,564,307 Passengers

Domestic Delta Cumulative Above American Airlines Cumulative = 1,356,218 Passengers

International Passengers
#2 American Airlines 3,858,261 * #9 American Eagle 174,126
4,032,387 Passengers

#3 Delta Air Lines 2,541,029
2,541,029 Passengers

International American Airlines Cumulative Above Delta Cumulative = 1,491,358 Passengers

Overall JFK Standing
#2 American Airlines 7,616,243 * #9 American Eagle 624,233
8,240,476 Passengers

#3 Delta Air Lines 6,216,022 * #4 Comair 1,475,533 * #15 Delta Connection 413,781
8,105,336 Passengers

Total American Airlines Cumulative Above Delta Cumulative = 135,140 Passengers

SOURCE: http://www.panynj.gov/CommutingTrave...orts/pdfs/traffic/JUN_2007_REG.PDF

NYC - JFK/EWR/LGA MARKET
#3 American Airlines 14,238,684 with #10 American Eagle 1,954,435
16,193,119 Total Passengers

#4 Delta Air Lines 10,151,455 with #9 Comair 2,494,628 with #13 Delta Shuttle 1,101,931
13,748,014 Total Passengers

Total American Airlines Cumulative Above Delta Cumulative = 2,445,105 Passengers

>>>>> In closing I think it would be hard for Delta Air Lines to push a growth of 2,445,105 passengers within a year to overcome American Airlines in the New York City market. However, and as is widely known both airlines are overshadowed in the JFK market by Jet Blue, and overshadowed on a massive scale compared to Continental Airlines with their Newark hub.

Quoting Commavia (Reply 3):
For June 2007, AA+Eagle was still slightly (~2-3%) larger than Delta+Connection at JFK. But that's JFK. For the New York market overall, though, AA is still well ahead (by at least 10%).

Thanks Commavia, as always great data from yourself!  thumbsup 

-JD


User currently offlineB752fanatic From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 918 posts, RR: 8
Reply 8, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 5311 times:

So this will be AMR's 6th destination in Dominican Republic. Interesting, SDQ, LRM, PUJ, STI, POP and now AZR.


"Truth is more of a stranger than fiction." Mark Twain
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16862 posts, RR: 51
Reply 9, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 5205 times:

It's about time AA got back on JFK-MCO, however 1 daily M80 is not enough (IMO). Why not rotate some A300s and 757s 3xs a day. JFK-MCO-MIA.

As for JFK,

IIRC at JFK it's B6, DL and AA.

Overall in the NYC market it's CO (by a wide margin), AA, with B6 and DL neck and neck for #3..



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineFLYGUY767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 5202 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 9):
IIRC at JFK it's B6, DL and AA

Already answered..

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 7):
Overall JFK Standing
#2 American Airlines 7,616,243 * #9 American Eagle 624,233
8,240,476 Passengers

#3 Delta Air Lines 6,216,022 * #4 Comair 1,475,533 * #15 Delta Connection 413,781
8,105,336 Passengers

Total American Airlines Cumulative Above Delta Cumulative = 135,140 Passengers

-JD


User currently offlineAAJFKSJUBKLYN From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 904 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 5175 times:

No cargo to MCO...not economical in anyway. MCO is also not a true maintenance base for the A300. What they have now they can not truly accomodate (A300's from MIA and SJU). If an A300 breaks down in MIA..its sure to be a 6 hour delay...

User currently offlineSESGDL From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3474 posts, RR: 10
Reply 12, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 5162 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 9):
Overall in the NYC market it's CO (by a wide margin), AA, with B6 and DL neck and neck for #3..

B6 has surpassed AA in the New York market. It's now CO, B6, AA, and DL in that order.

Good to see AA returning to JFK-MCO, albeit with one daily MD-80. B6 totally dominates the route though, so no reason for AA to offer anything more than a few European connections to MCO, everyone else can use LGA.

Jeremy


User currently offlineElmoTheHobo From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 1539 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 5149 times:

Anyone heard of the other routes they plan to add to JFK? I read an article linked from A.Net that quoted an American Airlines insider saying that they were going to announce more European routes.

User currently offlineAA 777 From United States of America, joined May 2002, 807 posts, RR: 13
Reply 14, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 5142 times:
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I believe that the main reason the new JFK-MCO flight exists is due to operational restraints at LGA. AA wanted to keep 3x NYC-MCO flights, but also wanted to add a LGA-PBI flight (which starts in december). Due to slots at LGA they had to move or get rid of a flight and therefore the MCO flight was moved to JFK.


CRJ-700 FO
User currently offlineFLYGUY767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 5124 times:

Quoting SESGDL (Reply 12):
B6 has surpassed AA in the New York market. It's now CO, B6, AA, and DL in that order.

True with the gap between American and Delta being 2,445,105 Passengers

For Delta Air Lines to attain the passenger level of American Airlines they would have to add the equivelant of the following aircraft and frequencies to match American Airlines passenger numbers in the New York market:


13 767-300ER Round-Trip Flights per day

or

18 757-200 Round-Trip Flights per day

or

23 737-800 Round-Trip Flights per day


-JD


User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4748 posts, RR: 45
Reply 16, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 5104 times:

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 15):
18 757-200 Round-Trip Flights per day

So 10 of those next year...

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 15):
13 767-300ER Round-Trip Flights per day

A few of those coming...

should close the gap a little.



Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlineSESGDL From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3474 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 5079 times:

Quoting ElmoTheHobo (Reply 13):
Anyone heard of the other routes they plan to add to JFK? I read an article linked from A.Net that quoted an American Airlines insider saying that they were going to announce more European routes.

Unless AA plans to put 757s on TATL, which they canned, I can't see anymore than 2-3 new European destinations. AA simply doesn't have the aircraft to open up many long-haul routes, besides the already announced JFK-STN service with 2x daily 767-300 service, I can't see much else.

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 15):
True with the gap between American and Delta being 2,445,105 Passengers

And the reason for once again mentioning this gap is what?

Jeremy


User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 60
Reply 18, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 5070 times:

Quoting SESGDL (Reply 17):
Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 15):
True with the gap between American and Delta being 2,445,105 Passengers

And the reason for once again mentioning this gap is what?

..to show a point.....



"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineFLYGUY767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 5047 times:

Quoting SESGDL (Reply 17):
And the reason for once again mentioning this gap is what?

It is to show a point as early on in this forum it was discussed by someone that Delta Air Lines was larger than American Airlines, and would become larger than AA in the New York market..

-JD


User currently offlineFLYGUY767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 5039 times:

Quoting SESGDL (Reply 17):
Unless AA plans to put 757s on TATL, which they canned, I can't see anymore than 2-3 new European destinations. AA simply doesn't have the aircraft to open up many long-haul routes, besides the already announced JFK-STN service with 2x daily 767-300 service, I can't see much else.

The new Stansted service will increase the AA JFK market by up to 328,500 passengers

Adding to that the new Las Vegas flight that will add 137,240 passengers

Adding to that the new Orlando flight that will add 102,200 passengers

Totalling to a potential gain of 567,940 passengers

-JD


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16862 posts, RR: 51
Reply 21, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 5025 times:

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 16):
should close the gap a little.

That is if AA remains stagnant, I have a strong feeling they will not remain stagnant.

We shall see, we already know about Stansted with the 767-300. Im sure there will be other surprises in time for next Summer from AA at JFK.

[Edited 2007-08-20 22:24:38]


Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineFLYGUY767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 5017 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 21):
We shall see, we already know about Stansted with the 767-300. Im sure there will be other surprises in time for next Summer from AA at JFK

I have heard of a few markets moving to JFK from LGA to make room for expanded schedules on certain LGA routes. I have also heard that American Airlines is in a defensive mode. When they are prepare yourselves. American Airlines has sat back for a while and watched Delta Air Lines grow. As STT757 says above American Airlines is getting ready for a few more surprises in 2008. American Airlines is not going to let Delta Air Lines take any claim away from them...

-JD


User currently offlineElmoTheHobo From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 1539 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 4990 times:

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 22):
American Airlines is not going to let Delta Air Lines take any claim away from them...

Not if it comes at the expense of their bottom line. Since American decided to shape up in 2003, they have showed us time and again that they are not willing to sacrifice their bottom line for market share, with the sole exception of their Love Field mistake.

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 20):
Totalling to a potential gain of 567,940 passengers

Assuming 100% load factor. At a more realistic 85% loadfactor that's around 476,000 passengers. Either way, you're on point with the fact that American will will remain bigger in New York than Delta.

Quoting SESGDL (Reply 17):
Unless AA plans to put 757s on TATL, which they canned, I can't see anymore than 2-3 new European destinations. AA simply doesn't have the aircraft to open up many long-haul routes, besides the already announced JFK-STN service with 2x daily 767-300 service, I can't see much else.

American ought to bring some of the mothballed MD-80s back online by Summer 08 to bump some of their 757s and 767s off domestic and Caribbean routes to move them to European routes.


User currently offlineFLYGUY767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (7 years 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 4972 times:

Quoting ElmoTheHobo (Reply 23):
American ought to bring some of the mothballed MD-80s back online by Summer 08 to bump some of their 757s and 767s off domestic and Caribbean routes to move them to European routes.

American Airlines needs the AB3, 757 and 767's that they are using to the Caribbean for the cargo capacity as that is the prime money maker for them in the Caribbean market.

-JD


25 Post contains images MD90fan : You are obviously uninformed about AA and the Caribbean if you think they will swap profitable flights with MD-80s, whose cargo carrying abilities ar
26 DFWEagle : AA also announced they are expanding their JFK-Caribbean network with new non-stop flights to St Lucia and St Kitts. UVF will be 3xweekly 757 and SKB
27 RJpieces : I was in Terminal 9 at JFK today and there is SO much room for expansion there! I have no doubt that we will see AA expanding at JFK in the years to c
28 Delta4eva : For the record, no one ever said that DL was larger than AA, I simply stated that AA is not MUCH larger in the New York area. And in reference to DL
29 ElmoTheHobo : I didn't say use MD-80s in the Caribbean. Bringing MD-80s out of storage to replace domestic 737 capacity is the most cost effective way to free up a
30 FLFlyGuy : Just as a point of information, the 767s we fly to the Caribbean are to avoid sitting an international jet at MIA or JFK for hours on end.....we send
31 MD90fan : Where would the MD-80s be based? I could see it working if they replaced some of the shorter DFW routes currently operated by 738s, but that's about
32 Post contains links FLYGUY767 : Neck and Neck in the New York Market is over 2,000,000 passenger difference? I was responding to the fact that you summized American and Delta as bei
33 ElmoTheHobo : I stand corrected. American flew 767-200s in the 3 class configuration between LAX and San Juan. It's been upgraded to either a 767-300 or a 757-200.
34 TWA757 : Since AA is bringing MD-80s back to JFK, is there any chance STL-JFK goes mainline?
35 DFWEagle : The 767 Caribbean routes are VERY few in number and AA has very specific reasons for using the 767 in these cases. An example is Miami-Port of Spain,
36 AAJFKSJUBKLYN : AA uses one 767-300 to SJU out of JFK, upon's it's return it's usually off to Brussels (its great to lay-back on a 767-300 from SJU to JFK). One (1) 7
37 RJpieces : Are you sure? I thought that JFK-BRU is usually operated by a 767-300 that arrives from SFO...
38 AAJFKSJUBKLYN : I have gone to Brussels (4) times since May for work. Each and every time the plane came in from SJU. It could differ depending on usage, maintenance.
39 Commavia : Well, on Sunday, AA172 to BRU left out of gate 46 (after a 4+ hour delay!) and it looks like AA24 from SFO was at least scheduled to be the plane for
40 AAJFKSJUBKLYN : It changes all the time. The period I flew was May-First week July. Either or..its maximizing use. The inbound SJU could have gone to CDG or FCO as we
41 Post contains images SESGDL : No one even said that. Maybe you imagined it. "Potential" is the key word, as DL of course is adding quite a few new flights this winter as well. I e
42 FLYGUY767 : SESGDL, In reference to American Airlines wanting JFK as a hub in 1998-2000 American Airlines did not plan on having JFK as their third largest hub. A
43 DFWEagle : Yes Jeremy, I have to agree with FLYGUY767 here. I too would appreciate it if you kept to the topic in question and did not resort to personal insult
44 Stl1326 : I really doubt that would occur. They only have one daily Eagle flight. The demand probably isn't there for mainline service, plus they don't want to
45 Delta4eva : This entire thread, you have continued to misquote people. Never did anyone say that DL was bigger than AA at JFK or in the NYC area. It was simply s
46 ElmoTheHobo : American is starting to expand at JFK. That 2,000,000 passenger per year difference will remain.
47 FLYGUY767 : You have said.. New York Market not JFK Market Thank You and Buona Notte.. -JD
48 SESGDL : Only if DL's expansion stops, which it's not. It's only getting started. The gap will get smaller and smaller and eventually disappear unless AA laun
49 CRFLY : I have a question... Why didn't AA focused on JFK years ago when they were based in NYC before moving headquarters to DFW? Or even after PA closed? Ha
50 Commavia : AA was big at JFK long before the move to Texas in July of 1979. AA was a major player at JFK going back to the Idlewild days, when the airport was b
51 SESGDL : Totally agree. I think New York will always have 4-5 big airlines with at least a 8-10% share of the passengers; CO is the only airline that has a la
52 AAJFKSJUBKLYN : American Airlines totally pissed off Mayor Koch back when they relocated everyone to DFW. It was a nightmarish poltical thing, and they basically move
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