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DL Does Not Award Miles For Flights To Iran, Syria  
User currently offlineCOSAMICLE From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 1 month 16 hours ago) and read 7795 times:

In reading the fine print on Delta's skymiles earnings page (http://www.delta.com/skymiles/ways_to_get_miles/earning_miles_partners/airline_partners/), I noted that all flights on partner airlines to Tehran, Damascus, and Havana are excluded from the skymiles program. I can understand Havana, I suppose, as there is a US travel ban there, but Tehran and Damascus are not banned. As for other US SkyTeam members, Continental and Northwest have no such restrictions. Any idea why Delta has them?

33 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFlyDreamliner From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2759 posts, RR: 15
Reply 1, posted (7 years 1 month 16 hours ago) and read 7737 times:

i guess they really love America down there in ATL.

that is definitely strange. i'm not sure you could get miles for a trip to HAV... since you'd find yourself fined/imprisoned if US authorities found out that you'd been there (at least if you are a US citizen). the others, I really don't know. that's very strange. do any other US airlines have similar policies, outside of skyteam?



"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
User currently offlineUPPERDECKFAN From Spain, joined Jun 2007, 992 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (7 years 1 month 16 hours ago) and read 7697 times:

Quoting COSAMICLE (Thread starter):
I can understand Havana, I suppose, as there is a US travel ban there

I would expect some non-US citizens on DL FF program, these ones wouldn't have restrictions to fy to HAV



744,742,741,772,773,762,732,735,738,752,727,717,DC10,DC9,M82,M87,319,320,321,343,346,L1011,CRJ2,CRJ9,E190,ATR42,DSH8,
User currently offlineCOSAMICLE From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 1 month 16 hours ago) and read 7665 times:

I just checked United, American, and US Airways and none of those airlines mention markets in which you cannot accrue miles (except within Sweden and Norway, which apparently is prohibited by Swedish law; you learn something new every day).

User currently offlineB4REAL From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2644 posts, RR: 5
Reply 4, posted (7 years 1 month 16 hours ago) and read 7646 times:

Quoting FlyDreamliner (Reply 1):
i'm not sure you could get miles for a trip to HAV... since you'd find yourself fined/imprisoned if US authorities found out that you'd been there (at least if you are a US citizen).

AF flies CDG-HAV, and DL SkyMiles members can earn miles on AF flights. Not sure about this one, however. Same with AA miles on MX, MX flies MEX-HAV also.



B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
User currently offlineCOSAMICLE From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (7 years 1 month 16 hours ago) and read 7606 times:

Quoting B4REAL (Reply 6):
AF flies CDG-HAV, and DL SkyMiles members can earn miles on AF flights.



I guess this goes for most flights. A footnote from Delta's earning miles site states:

3Air France:
Mileage may be earned on Air France-coded flights operated by Air France or any SkyTeam partner. Mileage credit is not applicable for fares booked in L, N, O, G, or X class, for Air France travel via boat/ferry service, or for flights to/from Havana, Cuba; Tehran, Iran; or Damascus, Syria.


User currently offlineLaxintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25370 posts, RR: 49
Reply 6, posted (7 years 1 month 16 hours ago) and read 7606 times:

Quoting COSAMICLE (Reply 5):
I just checked United,

UA MP wont award miles to Cuba. Check flyertalk and can see older postings about folks whom flew AC or TA and failed to get credit.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineFoxBravo From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2998 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (7 years 1 month 16 hours ago) and read 7606 times:

There are restrictions on U.S. companies doing business in those countries. Giving mileage credit for flights to those countries might seem like a stretch, but my guess is that they are just covering themselves in order to avoid any appearance of impropriety. I wouldn't read any political leanings into this--it's more likely just the work of a careful in-house (or outside) counsel.


Common sense is not so common. -Voltaire
User currently offlineB4REAL From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2644 posts, RR: 5
Reply 8, posted (7 years 1 month 16 hours ago) and read 7586 times:

AA, DL, CO, MQ, and probably others operate special flights to Cuba occasionally, I would not imagine miles are available for those flights.


B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
User currently offlineDLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3592 posts, RR: 10
Reply 9, posted (7 years 1 month 15 hours ago) and read 7422 times:

Quoting FoxBravo (Reply 7):
There are restrictions on U.S. companies doing business in those countries. Giving mileage credit for flights to those countries might seem like a stretch, but my guess is that they are just covering themselves in order to avoid any appearance of impropriety. I wouldn't read any political leanings into this--it's more likely just the work of a careful in-house (or outside) counsel.
??

Yup. There are economic sanctions in place by the USA government against these countries. Giving miles for these flights could be construed by some as doing business with the countries in question.

The other USA airlines seem to just have a more general "catch-all" disclaimer to the effect the some "special condition routes" may not be eligible, without specific statement of the affected routes.

[Edited 2007-08-20 20:29:10]

User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 26987 posts, RR: 57
Reply 10, posted (7 years 1 month 15 hours ago) and read 7381 times:

What a stupid rule. If you are a US Citizen then thats fine but if you are a member of the Skymiles or Mileage Plus based in Europe then EU rules should apply and people flying AF or AC to Cuba should get miles.

User currently offlineFLYGUY767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (7 years 1 month 15 hours ago) and read 7377 times:

Quoting COSAMICLE (Thread starter):
In reading the fine print on Delta's skymiles earnings page (http://www.delta.com/skymiles/ways_to_get_miles/earning_miles_partners/airline_partners/), I noted that all flights on partner airlines to Tehran, Damascus, and Havana are excluded from the skymiles program.

It is amazing how the rules in the US apply to certain people and companies.. When it comes to air travel I can assure you that Delta Air Lines code-shares on the Los Angeles to Paris flight operated by Air France, where people connect to an Air France flight that Delta Air Lines does not code share on to Tehran.

The same from NWA code-sharing on the Los Angeles to Amsterdam flight that is operated by KLM, and the KLM service from AMS-THR that NWA does not share a code with.

Does Delta not sell the ticket to the person that calls them?

Does NWA not sell the ticket to the person that calls them?

Some how people travel from the USA to Iran. There is a demand, yet will still continue with government hands to dictate certain restrictions telling the airlines and us as Americans where we can and cannot fly to.

-JD


User currently offlineCOSAMICLE From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (7 years 1 month 14 hours ago) and read 7256 times:

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 9):
The other USA airlines seem to just have a more general "catch-all" disclaimer to the effect the some "special condition routes" may not be eligible, without specific statement of the affected routes.

Maybe, but I have received miles and EQMs with OnePass for both KLM and Air France operated flights to DAM since the US sanctions. Anyway, I didn't want to start a political debate, and I apologize if anyone has taken offense at responses. I noticed a few of them have been deleted.


User currently offlineFlyDreamliner From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2759 posts, RR: 15
Reply 13, posted (7 years 1 month 14 hours ago) and read 7256 times:

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 11):
Some how people travel from the USA to Iran. There is a demand, yet will still continue with government hands to dictate certain restrictions telling the airlines and us as Americans where we can and cannot fly to.

If I'm not mistaken, there is not a travel restriction in place to Iran quite like to Cuba, in that it's not criminal for an American to go to Iran, you just can't buy the ticket in the states, or some such. I've known people who've flown to Iran, just buying their tickets in DXB and FRA.... so it seems possible. Then again, I know a good number of Americans who have gone to Cuba too...



"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
User currently offlineDLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3592 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (7 years 1 month 14 hours ago) and read 7249 times:

Quoting OA260 (Reply 10):
What a stupid rule. If you are a US Citizen then thats fine but if you are a member of the Skymiles or Mileage Plus based in Europe then EU rules should apply and people flying AF or AC to Cuba should get miles.

A USA corporation is considered a USA citizen and as such is required to follow USA laws, including any USA sanctions against doing commercial business with a sanctioned foreign government. The citizenship of the passenger in this case makes no legal difference to the USA company.

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 11):
It is amazing how the rules in the US apply to certain people and companies.. When it comes to air travel I can assure you that Delta Air Lines code-shares on the Los Angeles to Paris flight operated by Air France, where people connect to an Air France flight that Delta Air Lines does not code share on to Tehran.

The same from NWA code-sharing on the Los Angeles to Amsterdam flight that is operated by KLM, and the KLM service from AMS-THR that NWA does not share a code with.

Does Delta not sell the ticket to the person that calls them?

Does NWA not sell the ticket to the person that calls them?

Some how people travel from the USA to Iran. There is a demand, yet will still continue with government hands to dictate certain restrictions telling the airlines and us as Americans where we can and cannot fly to.

I do not believe that NWA or DL will sell you a ticket to Tehran. You would have to buy the ticket from a foreign carrier.

The USA does not prohibit travel to and from Iran and Syria, only certain commercial transactions, apparently including air travel.

Similar economic sanctions were used by governments around the world to persuade South Africa to end aparthide.

The only travel restriction I know of is the Cuba policy initially instituted under the Kennedy administration.

[Edited 2007-08-20 21:45:55]

User currently offlineCOSAMICLE From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (7 years 1 month 14 hours ago) and read 7221 times:

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 14):
The USA does not prohibit travel to and from Iran and Syria, only certain commercial transactions, apparently including air travel.

Not sure about Tehran, but nwa.com will sell tix to DAM.


User currently offlineExFATboy From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2974 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (7 years 1 month 13 hours ago) and read 7180 times:

Quoting OA260 (Reply 10):
What a stupid rule. If you are a US Citizen then thats fine but if you are a member of the Skymiles or Mileage Plus based in Europe then EU rules should apply and people flying AF or AC to Cuba should get miles.

I don't see this as being much of an issue, as a French citizen is very unlikely to want to take their SkyTeam miles on a DL account anyway. It's a little more likely that a Canadian might want to accumulate Star Alliance miles on a UA account instead of AC, but I'd guess that's still pretty rare.


User currently offlineFLYGUY767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (7 years 1 month 13 hours ago) and read 7180 times:

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 14):
I do not believe that NWA or DL will sell you a ticket to Tehran.

I was wondering as on my last KLM flight from LAX-AMS there was a good number of people travelling onward to Tehran, and the people I am talking about all lived in Los Angeles, and were only going to visit family in Tehran. Arent all KLM transactions in the states handled by Northwest Airlines? When you go online in every other country has its own website, in the US we have to deal with NWA..  Sad



-JD


User currently offlineFlyingcat From United States of America, joined May 2007, 541 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (7 years 1 month 13 hours ago) and read 7163 times:

I wonder if one could earn miles on the KE flight to FNJ?

[Edited 2007-08-20 22:03:21]

User currently offlineDLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3592 posts, RR: 10
Reply 19, posted (7 years 1 month 13 hours ago) and read 7117 times:

I think the issue might be even more complicated, Travelocity (A USA company based in Texas) will at least price out tickets to THR or DAM (I didn't try to buy one).

Unless someone have the energy to peruse all the government regulations on this one (I don't), I don't think a difinitive answer is easily found as to the level of travel restrictions between USA companies and Iran or Syria. I know there are export restrictions on alot of technology items, but I do not know the extent of other commercial restrictions for USA citizens.


User currently offlineNickofatlanta From Australia, joined May 2000, 1488 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (7 years 1 month 13 hours ago) and read 7048 times:

Quoting COSAMICLE (Reply 3):
I just checked United, American, and US Airways and none of those airlines mention markets in which you cannot accrue miles (except within Sweden and Norway, which apparently is prohibited by Swedish law; you learn something new every day).

Within the Earning Miles section of those AA partners that fly to Cuba (IB, LA and MX), the AA web-site states:
"Flights to/from Cuba are not eligible for mileage accrual or redemption."


User currently offlineDLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3592 posts, RR: 10
Reply 21, posted (7 years 1 month 13 hours ago) and read 6987 times:

I found the State department regs overview on the Iran sanctions.

http://treas.gov/offices/enforcement/ofac/programs/iran/iran.pdf

http://treas.gov/offices/enforcement/ofac/programs/iran/iran.shtml

I think the Travelocity website would have a hiccup before actually letting you buy a ticket to THR.

Looks like travel is allowed to Iran by USA citizens. The only things allowed to be imported from Iran to the USA seems to be rugs, dates, and caviar. USA airlines are allowed to pay Iran for overflight rights as well. Pretty much all other commercial transactions seem to be proscribed.

While travel to Syria is also allowed, the Syrian sanctions seem less clear with respect to allowable transactions.

http://treas.gov/offices/enforcement/ofac/programs/syria/syria.shtml


User currently offlineUPPERDECKFAN From Spain, joined Jun 2007, 992 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (7 years 1 month 13 hours ago) and read 6982 times:

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 14):
A USA corporation is considered a USA citizen and as such is required to follow USA laws, including any USA sanctions against doing commercial business with a sanctioned foreign government.

Your statement is so strong that leads me to believe other carriers like AA, CO, NW are breaking USA laws.

I really don't think so, my guess is they're trying to cover their ass just in case.



744,742,741,772,773,762,732,735,738,752,727,717,DC10,DC9,M82,M87,319,320,321,343,346,L1011,CRJ2,CRJ9,E190,ATR42,DSH8,
User currently offlineA380US From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2358 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (7 years 1 month 12 hours ago) and read 6958 times:

Quoting FlyDreamliner (Reply 1):
that is definitely strange. i'm not sure you could get miles for a trip to HAV... since you'd find yourself fined/imprisoned if US authorities found out that you'd been there (at least if you are a US citizen).

thats wierd cause doesn delta fly there?



www.JandACosmetics.com
User currently offlineDLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3592 posts, RR: 10
Reply 24, posted (7 years 1 month 12 hours ago) and read 6922 times:

Quoting UPPERDECKFAN (Reply 22):
Your statement is so strong that leads me to believe other carriers like AA, CO, NW are breaking USA laws.
.

I stand by my statement. USA companies are considered citizens of the USA and required to follow USA laws, including any sanctions imposed by the USA government. There is no doubt about that statements truth. The only question is to the extent of the USA's sanctions against each of the individual foreign governments. I don't know why you are "led to believe" that other carriers are breaking any laws.

The post above yours is has links to the State Department documents I found.


25 UPPERDECKFAN : Because none of the other carriers have such restricions on miles awarding.
26 LTU932 : Highly doubtful. KE, and OZ for that matter, rarely fly any VFR charter to FNJ, if not at all, and even if they do, I highly doubt you can get miles
27 Cedarjet : There are 2m Iranians in LA: "Irangeles". And tonnes of travel between the US and Iran every day. Most of the pax on LH from THR to FRA connect straig
28 ElmoTheHobo : You can't earn miles on any of those carrier's charters, whether or not it goes to Cuba. Definitely true. And with all the Angelinas going to Iran to
29 RyanAFAMSP : Well I guess if the inferior inflight meal service, paying for drinks in coach (other than with the primary meal service), outdated inflight entertain
30 Ikramerica : There aren't nearly that many Persians here. Where are you getting that number from? There are quite a lot (largest population outside iran), but not
31 SpdBrdConcorde : The last time DL flew in Cuba was back in the 50's. There is no law that says you will be imprisoned if you go to Cuba. In fact, there is no law that
32 Post contains links Csavel : There are no restrictions on Americans travelling anywhere. Technically, Americans can't spend money in Cuba or on Cuban products or "cause money to b
33 UAL747 : Can you even book tickets to THR on any US airline website? I've done some "hypothetical" reservations before, and when you try and book US-THR, it sa
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