AS739X From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 5445 posts, RR: 27 Posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 21751 times:
Virgin America flight 837 just executed an emergency landing at SFO. The flight departed 1L and ran into a flock of birds. They then proceeded down the bay and returned to SFO with no further incident. They were escorted in my the fire department and airfield safety. Condition of the aircraft unknown at this time.
ASSFO
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
AS739X From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 5445 posts, RR: 27 Reply 2, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 21039 times:
Just confirmed that the aircraft has engine damage. Some of the fan blades are bent and torn up.
ASSFO
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
DavidT From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2005, 474 posts, RR: 0 Reply 4, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 20717 times:
Do VX have an evening arrival at SFO? I was on the Stanford campus yesterday and saw what looked like a VX 320 making a turn ready to land at SFO. Would this be the same a/c that got struck this morning?
I will be at the international terminal in sfo later today and will see if I can see anything (if the plane is near the terminal and not in a hangar somewhere)
Previous flights: BA LHR-YVR, MAN-JFK (Club); BA MAN-HEL; AY MAN-HEL,TLL; Next Flights: BA LGW-ANU, BA LHR-DXB
Xpfg From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 603 posts, RR: 9 Reply 5, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 20679 times:
I just went and checked out the aircraft. The tail number is N621VA, or Air Colbert as they call it. After i just did a walk around of the plane, there is a significant amount of blood spatter on the captains window, with some blood spots on the nose as well. No cracks in the windows though.
On the #2 engine there is plenty of blood, guts, and feathers, and aside from a very nasty smelling engine, there are a few fan blades bent, but not a whole lot. i have a picture I took of inside the engine that I will post later.
AS739X From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 5445 posts, RR: 27 Reply 6, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 20644 times:
Bok269 From United States of America, joined May 2007, 2100 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 20369 times:
Ouch. At least it wasn't something they could control. Any idea on how long it will be out of service?
Evan767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 2954 posts, RR: 2 Reply 8, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 20175 times:
Ahh yes, I can see it on the Colbert Report now...
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
Tozairport From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 660 posts, RR: 1 Reply 9, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 18473 times:
Quoting Evan767 (Reply 11): Ahh yes, I can see it on the Colbert Report now...
Virgin America deliberately killed Steven Colbert's son in retaliation for the interview with Branson last week. Does SRB know bounds to his evil? That poor young eagle had just barely learned to be sarcastic!
EMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9134 posts, RR: 15 Reply 10, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 16790 times:
....just one of several dozen yet to come this fall. Bird Strikes are VERY-VERY common this time of the year. So common that in fact many ATIS reports will state bird activity in the area.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
EIDAA From Ireland, joined Oct 2006, 776 posts, RR: 17 Reply 11, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 16589 times:
Quoting Xpfg (Reply 8): I just went and checked out the aircraft. The tail number is N621VA, or Air Colbert as they call it. After i just did a walk around of the plane, there is a significant amount of blood spatter on the captains window, with some blood spots on the nose as well. No cracks in the windows though.
On the #2 engine there is plenty of blood, guts, and feathers, and aside from a very nasty smelling engine, there are a few fan blades bent, but not a whole lot. i have a picture I took of inside the engine that I will post later.
Many thanks Xpfg, I work for the leasing company involved with that aircraft... the reason for asking. If you can upload the photo later that would be great. I will try and get some more information from my guys at VX in the morning anyway. Again, thanks for confirming.
Sfomb67 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 416 posts, RR: 0 Reply 12, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 16040 times:
I see they got another acft and departed SFO about 3 hrs late and it delayed the 9:10 flt, LAX- JFK 3 hrs. Kinda surprised they were able to cover this so fast. They must have a spare?
EMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9134 posts, RR: 15 Reply 14, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 14013 times:
Quoting Wingletsman (Reply 13): already an accident to add to the list on Wikipedia!!
Bird strikes are not accidents... just a common everyday fact of life.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
SSTsomeday From Canada, joined Oct 2006, 1247 posts, RR: 1 Reply 16, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 12730 times:
Quoting EMBQA (Reply 14): Bird strikes are not accidents... just a common everyday fact of life.
I would consider a bird strike an accident if it causes a plane to make a hasty landing and requires repair. Just because it happens frequently at certain times of the year or in certain areas would not disclude it from being an accident, in my books.
More serious than two A/C coming in contact with each other on the ground, I would opine.
Itsnotfinals From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 17, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 12651 times:
Quoting SSTsomeday (Reply 16): I would consider a bird strike an accident if it causes a plane to make a hasty landing and requires repair. Just because it happens frequently at certain times of the year or in certain areas would not disclude it from being an accident, in my books.
It's not considered an accident as mentioned since this is something that could not have been prevented via training, procedure, or with the aircraft itself.
This is like saying a lightening strike is an accident.
Xpfg From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 603 posts, RR: 9 Reply 18, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 12593 times:
Quoting EIDAA (Reply 11): If you can upload the photo later that would be great.
Yep, here ya go. The stench was pretty gnarly! The fan blades were rotating, so I didn't really catch any of the selected few that were bent, but they are in a pretty funky twist! There were about 4-5 blades that were a little out of whack.
The picture dumbs down some of the stuff blood and guts wise, but I did this quick and had to go! The portion of "dirt" on the white area is actually bird too. Haha...see ya!
B6FA4ever From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 807 posts, RR: 15 Reply 19, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 12483 times:
R.I.P little bird....
but seriously. bird strikes are no fun. i remember having one a couple years ago. this happened on my LGB - OAK flight and thankfully it was right at landing. i remember as we were braking to slow down...the stench of bar-b-que'd bird came into our back galley. plane was grounded of course to get fixed and we had to delay our return flight back to LGB about 3 hrs or so waiting for the spare plane to come in from LGB and we work it back. apparently it was 2 seagulls that were the victims of this incident.
Tozairport From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 660 posts, RR: 1 Reply 20, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12311 times:
Quoting Rikkus67 (Reply 15): IIRC, Steven Colbert's parents were killed in an airline crash... best not to roast him on here....
True enough...
From Wikipedia:
"On September 11, 1974, when Colbert was ten years old, his father and two of his brothers, Peter and Paul, were killed in the crash of Eastern Air Lines Flight 212 while it was attempting to land in Charlotte, North Carolina. They were en route to enroll the two boys at Canterbury School in New Milford, Connecticut.[7][11] "
However, I don't think anyone was roasting Colbert. Even if they were though, considering the nature of his show and the banter he had with SRB last week, I don't think anything said here has been distasteful. I obviously don't know the man but I think of all people he would be able to take a little roasting OK.
SSTsomeday From Canada, joined Oct 2006, 1247 posts, RR: 1 Reply 21, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12200 times:
Quoting Itsnotfinals (Reply 17): This is like saying a lightening strike is an accident.
It's my humble opinion that a lighting strike is also an accident, if the A/C is impaired.
I believe we are on a slippery slope if we seek to categorise something as "unavoidable" and therefore routine, so as to ignore the apparent hazard. Or to suggest it is not a hazzard because it is commonplace.
We might consider the same types of deterrents that grape farmers use to deter birds (pieces of tin foil), or we could drain swamps adjacent to runways. If this is environmentally incorrect, we could create artificial swamps some miles away from the airport in question.
As to lighting, apparenty we are somewhat cavalier regarding how we operate around thunderheads. This is why we see accidents regarding windshear or lighting that may have otherwise be prevented. My understanding is that airlines in Southeast Asia operate routinely during typhoons (is that correct) or at least in extreme weather because such weather is so common there. Recently we witnessed a horrible disaster in Southeast Asia on take-off where weather was a primary cause.
I understand that at Orly or CDG, there were once large jet engine fans positioned next to runways that were designed and used to blow away fog prior to an arriving A/C landing. My point is that natural hazzards exist, and we can address almost all of them.
Also, I would suggest we must have the technology to monitor potentially active volcanoes so that 747s won't fly through plumes of ash and lose all 4 engines. Would a 747 that comes down due to volcanic ash be considered to not be in an accident, just because volcanic ash is not in the training manual?
I would suggest it's a better course to try and address saftey issues which might conveniently be considered acts of God, and therefore unavoidable. I remember that the shuttle program was once considered by some NASA scientists as to have entered an "operational" or "routine" stage, but they changed their tune quickly after the Challenger disaster.
If lighting strikes and bird strikes are officially not considered accidents, then I respectfully disagree, and I would suggest it takes a dangerous attitude to define them as such; a form of denial, really.
Maverick623 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 3715 posts, RR: 4 Reply 22, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12142 times:
Quoting EMBQA (Reply 10): Bird Strikes are VERY-VERY common this time of the year. So common that in fact many ATIS reports will state bird activity in the area.
Just had a bird strike pull into my gate this afternoon... I think it was US287 DEN-PHX-SJC, the outbound to SJC took a 45 minute minute delay to make sure nothing was seriously damaged, which it wasn't. Just some blood and gut splatter on the outside of the #2 nacelle.
SSTsomeday From Canada, joined Oct 2006, 1247 posts, RR: 1 Reply 23, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12048 times:
I recall that an governing safety body (FAA? NTSB?) was doing a series of tests of bird strikes on A/C by shooting grocery store chickens out of a specially made canon into a running engine, or onto an A/C cockpit windshield.
Another agency (from another country, or from an airline?) was also trying to do the same testing, but with disastrous results; huge damage to A/C engines, gaping holes in leading edges, and completely blasted out windshields.
They frantically wrote a memo or sent a telex to the FAA: "What are we doing wrong? Can you help us?"
A return memo was dispatched:
"Thaw the chicken."
(Ed. note: This is a true story, but some details may be incorrectly recalled)
AirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 12323 posts, RR: 31 Reply 24, posted (4 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 11835 times:
I've seen that video in A&P school, that was fun to watch! Lots of icky damage occured on that!
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
25 Pilotaydin: ive had so many birdstrikes....it's so common nowadays....damn birds lol the cfm 56 is really good at spitting them right out
26 AirframeAS: Here is a good video of what an bird ingestion looks like on a 752 for those who have never seen one.
27 EIDAA: Thanks for the photo. Our guys in the US were notified of the birdstrike yesterday. Obviously I can't give too much detail on here, but they were goi
28 Cubsrule: As you probably know, the government's definition of an accident is "an occurrence associated with the operation of an aircraft which takes place bet
29 Itsnotfinals: I am very familier with that, but the NTSB will not consider this substantial damage because of CFR49 Sec 830.2 page 184: It states: damage to landin
30 Cubsrule: ...assuming there's no damage to the engine itself, which we don't know. Nonetheless, your previous definition of accident is incorrect.
31 Itsnotfinals: Take it up with the NSTB then, I found 10 pages of Incidents for this kind of thing, but I guess you think they don't know what they are talking abou
32 Cubsrule: I guess I'm a bit confused. As you point out, the regulation you cite above is pretty clear, but it appears the NTSB is not following it (there's no w
33 EMBQA: A bird strike is NOT an accident. In the NTSB report you used there is one key statement that mandated that case as reportable.....The left engine im
34 Itsnotfinals: You mis-qouted me, I was the one pointing out a bird strike is an incident most all the time, you need to be careful with that "Quote Selected Text"
35 Cubsrule: I think I might. What I'm wondering is whether there's some regulation somewhere that categorically defines a bird strike as an incident. It's pretty
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