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Aeromexico "new" T7. Old Seats?  
User currently offlineOrbis From Mexico, joined Dec 2003, 244 posts, RR: 1
Posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 4283 times:

Continuing with the previous topic about the new Aeromexico´s T7.

I just returned from NRT and for the first time in several trips I´ve had to Japan with AM, I had the chance to fly on N774AM, which I think it is ex-varig PP-VRA (please correct me if I am wrong).

Having only flown on "Diego Rivera" and "Frida Kahlo" brand new T7´s I expected the same kind of pod seats on Premier in this frame, but to my surprise I found old, broken and worn out ex-B767 seats. I believe that economy seats were brand new though......

Many premier seats had inoperable AVOD and of course the AVOD content was not the same as on the other T7s. I have to recognize of course that the friendly FA´s as usual tried their best to fullfill passenger demands by passing out personal DVD´s, etc. but this being a full flight, even that was not enough.

So I guess if the upcoming T7 being painted, reeingined and reburbished in China will suffer the same kind of "retrofitting"...

Anyway I will be posting asap a trip report with many pics.

As an aditional note I have to mention that both AM058 and AM057 flights I flew were oversold both in Y and C, at least on the TIJ-NRT-TIJ legs. On AM057 Volunteers giving up their seats were given rooms at the Hilton Narita for 4 nights (until the next AM flight) !!! transport and meals vouchers included plus a R/T to any AM worldwide destination.


we should live our lives as if we were really alive!!! H.M.
16 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineLatinPlane From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2738 posts, RR: 14
Reply 1, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 4215 times:

So they replaced Varig's old seats with worn-out 767 seats? I thought they had grounded that 777 for a few days to install the seats found on the other two aircraft, but I guess not.

Anxious reader waiting for your trip report!  Wink


 Smile LatinPlane


User currently offlineOrbis From Mexico, joined Dec 2003, 244 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 4027 times:

so now the new t7 is at mex, perhaps someone can verify it fot us


we should live our lives as if we were really alive!!! H.M.
User currently offlineJfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8491 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 3927 times:
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I'm surprised AM would do this with their 777, the old Varig one should be the same as the new ones.

User currently offlineOrbis From Mexico, joined Dec 2003, 244 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 months 16 hours ago) and read 3714 times:

some photos to better illustrate what I mean....

Premier Cabin as advertised on the first 2 777





Premier Cabin on the third AM T7 N774AM (ex Varig PP-VRA)



Note the old projector






Has anyone seen the interiors of the "new" AM T7????



we should live our lives as if we were really alive!!! H.M.
User currently offlineJuventus From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 2835 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 months 15 hours ago) and read 3686 times:

Quoting Orbis (Thread starter):
Many premier seats had inoperable AVOD and of course the AVOD content was not the same as on the other T7s. I have to recognize of course that the friendly FA´s as usual tried their best to fullfill passenger demands by passing out personal DVD´s, etc. but this being a full flight, even that was not enough.

It worries me when I hear things like this. I wish Banamex and their gorup would harry up and buy this airline, and hire some executives who have actually ran a succesfull airline. Not much time to play with. On the flip side, nice to hear the Tokyo flight was full.


User currently offlineAM001 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 221 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 months 12 hours ago) and read 3577 times:
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I flew J on this ship on a TIJ-MEX flight late December 2006 (that Japanese menu was awesome... including the oriental service ware), and I can say with certainty that it had the nicer seats. I am sure that it was 774 because at that point it was the only T7 sporting the new livery.

Perhaps a mx or other technical issue made them change the seats?

Perhaps a yield/revenue management idea on how to cram more J pax?

Oh well, hopefully it will be a temporary measure.  ashamed 

In Citigroup we trust  Wink

AM001, now serving non-stop from LAS...



"Je vole car cela libere mon esprit de la tyrannie des choses insignifiantes" - St. Exupery
User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7632 posts, RR: 43
Reply 7, posted (7 years 3 months 11 hours ago) and read 3521 times:

The first thing that strikes me as funny is that when ex-PP-VRA was about to enter revenue service, many a.net users mentioned that it was never going to be deployed to NRT, and that only Diego Rivera and Frida Kahlo (the factory-new ones) were going to be used over the Pacific.

Anyway, I think it is terrible that this 772 does not sport the new Clase Premier seats, first because the old seats are really subpar (no in-seat AVOD IFE... terrible!!!), and second because AM has made a big deal of its new Clase Premier (seats, pitch, IFE, etc.) offered in the 777s. I hope that, like Juan Carlos (hey buddy! how are you? long time...) said, the reason for this is maintenance or technical-related and is only temporary.



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlineN77014 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 months 10 hours ago) and read 3469 times:

So who is the genius who thought of 3-abreast J-class?

Thinking like this won't catapult AM into the major leagues of airlines.


User currently offlineAM001 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 221 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 months 8 hours ago) and read 3413 times:
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Quoting N77014 (Reply 8):
So who is the genius who thought of 3-abreast J-class?

Thinking like this won't catapult AM into the major leagues of airlines.

Well, first, let us be honest: As much as I love it, AM's Clase Premier is a Business Class (or "Business First" if you will), but not a First...

So if you consider AF, CX, EK, KL, MH, SQ and other similar carriers "major leagues of airlines", as I believe they are, guess what do these fine companies have in common with AM? Indeed!!! the 2-3-2 configuration in J on their 772 fleets... even in planes with 2-class config...

Also, IFIRC, there was an airline, an European one I think, that actually placed a huge galley on the entire starboard side of their premium cabin, at least for some time... Can't pinpoint which one did... but it must have been awesome to sit next to a bulkhead on your side! like the old DC-8 times...

That being said, I do agree that there is oh-such-a-long-way to have a world-class Mexican carrier, but give them a little break... with their management history, it is truly amazing that MX is as old as it is, and that AM actually still exists...

Wishing for better times for the Mexican FSC,

AM001



"Je vole car cela libere mon esprit de la tyrannie des choses insignifiantes" - St. Exupery
User currently offlineLatinplane From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2738 posts, RR: 14
Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 months 7 hours ago) and read 3385 times:

Actually, those are not AM's 767 seats. Those are the old Varig Business Class seats upholstered with AeroMexico's seat fabric. There's a huge difference between those seats made in 2001 and AM's Classe Premier seats built in 2005.




Here's N774AM taking off from Tijuana on its last leg from Narita. You can clearly see that everything apart from the new seat covers is all Varig stock.



View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Paulo Herren
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © F-ILIP



 Smile LatinPlane


User currently offlineOrbis From Mexico, joined Dec 2003, 244 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (7 years 3 months 6 hours ago) and read 3351 times:

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 7):
Anyway, I think it is terrible that this 772 does not sport the new Clase Premier seats, first because the old seats are really subpar (no in-seat AVOD IFE... terrible!!!), and second because AM has made a big deal of its new Clase Premier (seats, pitch, IFE, etc.) offered in the 777s.

Considering the USD$ 6000 r/t TIJ-NRT-TIJ or nearly the $9000 all the way from MEX !!!!!!



we should live our lives as if we were really alive!!! H.M.
User currently offlineN77014 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3273 times:

Quoting AM001 (Reply 9):
Well, first, let us be honest: As much as I love it, AM's Clase Premier is a Business Class (or "Business First" if you will), but not a First...

So if you consider AF, CX, EK, KL, MH, SQ and other similar carriers "major leagues of airlines", as I believe they are, guess what do these fine companies have in common with AM? Indeed!!! the 2-3-2 configuration in J on their 772 fleets... even in planes with 2-class config...

Also, IFIRC, there was an airline, an European one I think, that actually placed a huge galley on the entire starboard side of their premium cabin, at least for some time... Can't pinpoint which one did... but it must have been awesome to sit next to a bulkhead on your side! like the old DC-8 times...

That being said, I do agree that there is oh-such-a-long-way to have a world-class Mexican carrier, but give them a little break... with their management history, it is truly amazing that MX is as old as it is, and that AM actually still exists...

Wishing for better times for the Mexican FSC,

AM001

Regardless of the airline, there is still no excuse for a 3- abreast J-class. The middle seat should be the domain of Y-class and nowhere else.


User currently offlineXA744 From Mexico, joined Mar 2004, 734 posts, RR: 3
Reply 13, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3205 times:

I had promised not to bash Aeromexico anymore, at least in the A.Net forums, but this time just could not resist. Here I am !!!

You see, if you wanted your product, whatever this might be, to be up there and well positioned among the consumers, the number one rule to achieve is named " Consistency ". I understand very well that this key marketing concept is not part of the Mexican corporate culture, in general, I have to say. However, in the case of an airline, especially a trunk and flag carrier, this becomes extremely critical and sensitive.

I think Aeromexico made a terrible mistake by not having standardised, accordingly, their 777 product. This will tremendously affect, not only the image, but the performance of the airline as a whole. No matter how friendly and efficient the inflight service could get, the negative perception of flying in " Inconsistency " will always take its toll.

If in almost one year of operation of the Tokyo run, Aeromexico had somehow the possibility to position its product in the Japanese business market, which by the way needs to be mentioned, is very perceptive and demanding, with this very incompetent move, any prior efforts and achievements are bound to go down the drain. Same thing is likely to happen with the Brazilian and Spanish markets, where AM is also deploying its T7 fleet.

I don´t understand why things like these are done, but if somebody at AM thought that by cutting corners, he or she would be able to save the airline some pennies, then it is totally wrong. It will actually be the way around. Such crappy corporate decisions is exactly what cost companies dearly and make them appear, to the eyes of the client, as very cheap and unprofessional.

I just hope the new Aeromexico owners to be, really risk it by hiring true expert people that could run the airline under a truly globalized and competitive scope. Cross my fingers !!!

Quoting N77014 (Reply 12):
Regardless of the airline, there is still no excuse for a 3- abreast J-class. The middle seat should be the domain of Y-class and nowhere else.

I can see your point and very much agree with you. Folks, check this out:

Two real world class airlines, feature in their business cabins these type of seats:

1.- MAS, as we can see, has something similar to what Aeromexico is offering, except for the pitch and the exhilarating decor and superb inflight service Malaysia Airlines has to offer. Don´t
know about AM, but MAS´pitch on their 777s J cabin is an outstanding 79 inches. Like this, I just wouldn´t mind it to be 3 abreast in the middle !!!



Now, as per Etihad on their 340s J or " Pearl " cabins, wow, what a beauty !!! Two abreast in the middle at 49 inches pitch, but Geez, what an amazing and heavenly environment !!!

Thanks to Chrisrad for the pic. Should any one care, check out Chrisrad´s latest TR on Etihad. You are just going to love it !!!




One last thing, another one that I don´t understand. Why in the name of god Aeromexico has not updated its website by introducing all the amenities on their T7s ? They still present to you with " pride " their old fashioned and rusty 767 product. Who´s in charge of marketing at AM ?

Promise not to bash Aeromexico anymore, unless something extraordinary or breaking occurs !!!....   

Best regards

[Edited 2007-09-20 18:26:23]


No matter how you fly...just never get your wings clipped !
User currently offlineGhost77 From Mexico, joined Mar 2000, 5233 posts, RR: 51
Reply 14, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3197 times:

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 7):
The first thing that strikes me as funny is that when ex-PP-VRA was about to enter revenue service, many a.net users mentioned that it was never going to be deployed to NRT, and that only Diego Rivera and Frida Kahlo (the factory-new ones) were going to be used over the Pacific. Anyway, I think it is terrible that this 772 does not sport the new Clase Premier seats, first because the old seats are really subpar (no in-seat AVOD IFE... terrible!!!), and second because AM has made a big deal of its new Clase Premier (seats, pitch, IFE, etc.) offered in the 777s.

It wasn't until 774 was grounded for interior refurbishment which consisted in configuring the plane with the exact same numbers of seats as 745 and 746 as well changing the interiors to AM's colors as for a moment, nearly for 2 months it flew with those it used to have when flying under RG's reign.

All PTV's in J were nonfunctional and after grounded was untill everything started to work out as well as IFE on Y was broken and supposedly they fixed it all.

AM's Y seats on 774 are those RG used to have. They're not close to what they got on 745 and 746.

These are the problems of having a mix second hand fleet.... now imagine RG mix on engines and configurations in their B737s, 767, 777, M11s!!!!!

If AM is to bring more second hand frames, if AZ dispose some, i think those 777 got the same seats as 745 and 746.

g77



Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
User currently offlineGhost77 From Mexico, joined Mar 2000, 5233 posts, RR: 51
Reply 15, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 3171 times:

Quoting XA744 (Reply 13):
I just hope the new Aeromexico owners to be, really risk it by hiring true expert people that could run the airline under a truly globalized and competitive scope. Cross my fingers !!!

Read yesterday at El Economista that Fernando Flores and Arturo Barahona are high candidates for AM's CEO and are been taken in consideration from Banamex. Exactly the two men in charge of MX and AM during the best days at CINTRA in the mid, late 90s.

Quoting XA744 (Reply 13):
Don´t know about AM, but MAS´pitch on their 777s J cabin is an outstanding 79 inches. Like this, I just wouldn´t mind it to be 3 abreast in the middle !!!

Big difference... MAS has gotten all its T7s out and fresh from the factory. Ok to bash... its really stupid to keep things to yourself and its really worse to admit there are no problems where and when they REALLY ARE issues to be considered.... but heck what can we expect from Conesa.

Best thing for AM is to get in private hands, ASAP, get investment, they need a 10 MD80 fleet reduce accompanied with a staff reduction or else, get your LF to the 90s/100s damn it!!!

g77



Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
User currently offlineFyano773 From Mexico, joined Mar 2004, 789 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3099 times:

Quoting Orbis (Reply 4):
some photos to better illustrate what I mean....

More photos (PPVRA/N745AM):


MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © André Du-pont (Mexico Air Spotters)
MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © André Du-pont (Mexico Air Spotters)



Quoting XA744 (Reply 13):
I think Aeromexico made a terrible mistake by not having standardised, accordingly, their 777 product. This will tremendously affect, not only the image, but the performance of the airline as a whole. No matter how friendly and efficient the inflight service could get, the negative perception of flying in " Inconsistency " will always take its toll.

As G77 mentioned, N774AM was grounded to standardize seat count/distribution similar to N745AM and N746AM layout. Seats are not everything, the inflight service, meals, are the same between the brand-new and new-used T7s. Perhaps Orbis may want clarify this.

I'm not thrilled about the new-used T7s but they are better than nothing.

Quoting XA744 (Reply 13):
Now, as per Etihad on their 340s J or " Pearl " cabins, wow, what a beauty !!! Two abreast in the middle at 49 inches pitch, but Geez, what an amazing and heavenly environment !!!

As far as I know AM's Clase Premier on the T7 has 60" pitch.

Quoting N77014 (Reply 12):
Regardless of the airline, there is still no excuse for a 3- abreast J-class. The middle seat should be the domain of Y-class and nowhere else.

Why? From the perspective of the airline, the inner middle seat helps to increase revenue. For instance, L'Espace Affaire on AF T7 has 3 abreast, as well:


MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Hagop Kavafian
MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Mindscape



Fyano

[Edited 2007-09-20 21:00:37]

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