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Can The 77W Beat The 772ER In Term Of Orders?  
User currently offlineLY777 From France, joined Nov 2005, 2688 posts, RR: 2
Posted (7 years 2 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 4411 times:

The 77W is having more and more orders, whereas the 772 orders are really low.
My question is:Can the 77W beat the 772ER in term of orders?


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34 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineManchesterMAN From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 1228 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (7 years 2 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 4347 times:

The 772ER has had a 10+ year head start on the 77W and whilst the latter is racking up a good number of orders the technology will be overtaken by the next generation of aircraft such as the A350 before it could even come close to overtaking the hugely successful 772ER which will continue to attract orders itself in some measure. Even without this there simply isn't the same market for an aircraft the size of the 77W as there is for the smaller 772.


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User currently offlineSebring From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 1663 posts, RR: 14
Reply 2, posted (7 years 2 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 4304 times:

The 772ER has 433 orders, of which 400 have been delivered. Clearly, orders are drying up. More may trickle in, but no surge is likely

The 773ER has 301 orders, of which roughly 100 have been delivered, suggesting that it a better long-term sales outlook. It's not a given that it can't overtake the 772ER


User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 31055 posts, RR: 87
Reply 3, posted (7 years 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 4193 times:
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Quoting LY777 (Thread starter):
My question is:Can the 77W beat the 772ER in term of orders?

It is possible, but it will really depend on how soon airlines need a 350-seater. I do think the 77W has a better then even chance of making 400, but I also think the 772ER should clear 450, which would keep her ahead, overall.


User currently offlineGlom From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 2818 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (7 years 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 4098 times:

The 77W needs about a hundred of so orders to beat the 77B. That's entirely possible given its current marketshare, A350 or not. Think about how many orders the A330 has gotten despite the 787.

User currently offlineKaitak744 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 2379 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (7 years 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3988 times:

Quoting Sebring (Reply 4):
The 772ER has 433 orders



Quoting Sebring (Reply 4):
The 773ER has 301 orders

The 777-300ER can easily get 132 orders within a few years. Even the 767-300ER, which is "more outdated" than the 777-300ER is still picking up lots of orders.

The A350-1000 only competes with the 777-300ER in the looong term. Next available 777-300ER delivery: late 2009/early 2010. Next available A350-1000 delivery: 2016-2017. That is about 7 years later.

(With 228 orders and commitments, the A350 is probably sold out for the first 2-3 years.)


User currently offlineLY777 From France, joined Nov 2005, 2688 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (7 years 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 3801 times:

so, how many orders for each type of 777?

772 :?
772ER: 431
77L: ?
77F: ?

773: ?
77W: 301



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User currently offlineCobra27 From Slovenia, joined May 2001, 1016 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 3787 times:

There are no signs from Boeing for 787-10 or even -11 version, so I reckon the A350 will take the cake, cause 777W wont stay competitive. Lets just hope the 787-11 comes out.

Quoting LY777 (Reply 10):
772 :?
772ER: 431
77L: ?
77F: ?

773: ?
77W: 301

Aren't 777-200LR in 777W category (bigger wings and engine and strenthened fuselage?)


User currently offlineJMO-777 From Germany, joined Apr 2002, 501 posts, RR: 17
Reply 8, posted (7 years 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 3764 times:

Quoting LY777 (Reply 10):

so, how many orders for each type of 777?
772 :?
772ER: 431
77L: ?
77F: ?
773: ?
77W: 301

Hi!

772: 88
77E: 430
77L: 44
77F: 80
773: 60
77W: 301

GreetZ,
Jan



~~~ Fly with a Triple Seven and you feel like in heaven ~~~
User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4836 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (7 years 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 3762 times:

I hope it gets lots of orders, but one thing I think people haven't noticed is that deliveries are pretty much sold out til 2010... are airlines going to be ordering many 773ER after 2010? Intially I think they will but by around 2012 the 773ER will be getting tired...


56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 10, posted (7 years 2 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 3748 times:

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 9):
The 777-300ER can easily get 132 orders within a few years.

The 777-300ER would need to get 132 orders plus however many the 777-200ER gets in the future, which could be a few dozen.

I seem to be more pessimistic about the future prospects of the 777-300ER vis-a-vis the 787 and A350 than most here, but I think there is a greater than 50% chance that 777-300ER orders will eventually exceed 777-200ER orders.


User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7073 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (7 years 2 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 3715 times:

Quoting Sebring (Reply 4):
The 773ER has 301 orders, of which roughly 100 have been delivered, suggesting that it a better long-term sales outlook. It's not a given that it can't overtake the 772ER

The 777-300ER currently is the best aircraft in its class. The next generation the A350-1000 is another 8 years away and it is very likely that the 77W will see another 50-100 orders in that time.



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineKrisYYZ From Canada, joined Nov 2004, 1593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (7 years 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 3286 times:

Is it fair to say that the A350 will compete with the B777 ? The A350s EIS is 2013, the B77W will have been flying for 10+ years by then. IMO the A340 is the B777s only true competitor.

KrisYYZ


User currently offlineTdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 13, posted (7 years 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 3234 times:

Quoting KrisYYZ (Reply 23):
Is it fair to say that the A350 will compete with the B777 ? The A350s EIS is 2013, the B77W will have been flying for 10+ years by then.

Yes, the A350 and 777 will be direct competitors. 10 years isn't that old for an aircraft design, especially a good one, and, contrary to what seems to be popular belief, designs are continuously updated throughout their lives.

Quoting KrisYYZ (Reply 23):
IMO the A340 is the B777s only true competitor.

They are designed around the same missions but it's a very lopsided competition. The 777 trounces the A340 on economics.

Tom.


User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (7 years 2 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 3200 times:

Quoting KrisYYZ (Reply 23):
The A350s EIS is 2013, the B77W will have been flying for 10+ years by then.

...actually, 9 years, but anyways  Wink


User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21534 posts, RR: 59
Reply 15, posted (7 years 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 3171 times:

Quoting LY777 (Reply 10):
so, how many orders for each type of 777?

Congrats on 1000 posts!!!

Next stop, 10000 posts...  Wink



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineFanblade From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (7 years 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 2994 times:

Quoting JMO-777 (Reply 8):
772: 88
77E: 430
77L: 44
77F: 80
773: 60
77W: 301

Just a newbie question but could someone explain the nomenclature of the W? I figure E is ER, L is LR, F is freighter but I'm missing the W.

fanblade


User currently offlineFuturecaptain From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (7 years 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 2965 times:

77W = 777-300ER

It's the international identifying code for the aircraft. I can't find the complete list, but this will get you started.
http://www.flugzeuginfo.net/table_accodes_en.php


User currently offlineAKelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2193 posts, RR: 5
Reply 18, posted (7 years 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2955 times:

772: 777-200
77E: 777-200ER
77L: 777-200LR
77F: 777-200LRF
773: 777-300
77W: 777-300ER

All of the above codes were determined by IATA, who published an annual "Coding Directory" for all aircraft types (that's why the 737-700 is called the 73G). As for why the 777-300ER is called the 77W, urban legend has it that the 'W' is for the raked wingtips of the 777-300ER, but there's no official reason.


User currently offlineLY777 From France, joined Nov 2005, 2688 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (7 years 1 week 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2838 times:

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 15):
Quoting LY777 (Reply 10):
so, how many orders for each type of 777?

Congrats on 1000 posts!!!

Next stop, 10000 posts...

thanks!



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User currently offlineSkytony From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 145 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (7 years 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2827 times:

I thought the W stands for "Worldliner". Is it not the marketing name that Boeing gave the 777-300ER?


Lower your expectations! You will always be pleasantly surprised!
User currently offlineSkytony From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 145 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (7 years 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2820 times:

Opps. The "World Liner" is the 777-200LR. There goes that theory.


Lower your expectations! You will always be pleasantly surprised!
User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6926 posts, RR: 63
Reply 22, posted (7 years 1 week 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2743 times:

Quoting LY777 (Thread starter):
Can the 77W beat the 772ER in term of orders?

I'd say it's a matter of "when" rather than "if". The 777-300ER is an instant classic - the right design at the right time. (Think of the 727-200ADV.) At the moment, there's nothing to touch it and even if the A350-1000 comes out on top, that's still many years away. Meanwhile, the 777-200ER is on its last legs. It is several years since it won a significant order from a new airline (TAAG for 2 more than two years ago was the last new customer. Before that NZ ordered 4 in 2004 and PIA 3 in 2002). It is almost beyond belief that a new customer will pop up and place a double-figure order. So the 777-200ER is left with small top-up orders (such as 4 for BA in March) but that's about all. The 777-200ER will do well to reach 450 (not that this is any kind of 'failure'!) whereas I confidently expect the 777-300ER to breeze past that number with room to spare.


User currently offlineLY777 From France, joined Nov 2005, 2688 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (7 years 1 week 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2733 times:

And what "killed" the 77E in the last years?


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User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 24, posted (7 years 1 week 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2678 times:

Quoting LY777 (Reply 23):
And what "killed" the 77E in the last years?

That's easy. The 787 offers the ineluctable combination of better range, smaller size, and lower per seat purchase and operating costs than the 777-200ER.


25 Stitch : For near-term orders, it was (and is) the 777-200LR, which can be purchased for a similar price and offers better performance and economics. For long
26 LY777 : Isn't the 77L more expensive than the 77E?
27 Zvezda : Yes, but it's a small difference compared to the difference between the 777-200ER and the 787-9, which are only 0.7 meters different in cabin length.
28 Azhobo : The 77W will likely have 400+ orders by EOY 2008, and 500+ orders sometime in 2010. Unless Boeing launches an upgraded 777 by then. HOBO
29 Stitch : By only a few million. Boeing is discounting the 77L more aggressively then the 77E.
30 Post contains images Lightsaber : Nice numbers. Thank you. So that is 301+80+44 or 425 airframes uncontested for 850 (plus spares) GE-90 engines. Not to mention, the GE-90 is rumored
31 Zvezda : I agree with everything in your post. My expectation is that the only 777-200LR orders we'll see in the future will be top-up orders. The future belo
32 ConcordeBoy : "Instant"? ...depends on when you start counting, launch or EIS. Between its launch and a few months after EIS, orders were rather thin. 2005 seemed
33 BoeingBus : right around the same time fuel prices went through the roof due to supply shortages....
34 ConcordeBoy : they peaked at not-before-seen levels, sure... but fuel had been at a disconcertingly (well, to consumers anyways) sharp rise for three years prior.
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