Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
SAA To Fly To New York Via Accra  
User currently offlineSAA201 From South Africa, joined May 2001, 512 posts, RR: 2
Posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 5461 times:

According to this article: http://www.busrep.co.za/index.php?fSectionId=&fArticleId=4041217, SAA will switch 4 of its daily JNB-DKR-JFK flights to route via ACC instead. No date is given for the start of this service.

Anyone with more info?

18 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineAndz From South Africa, joined Feb 2004, 8416 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 5446 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

I heard something on the radio today about SAA changing routes into Africa as part of restructuring, along with lounge changes, but no details. Wait until next week and things will change again.


After Monday and Tuesday even the calendar says WTF...
User currently offlineLouA340 From Canada, joined Oct 2005, 384 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 5396 times:

Why would they go back to Accra though? I thought after their JNB - ACC - IAD route didnt work out that they would stick to DKR


RyEng
User currently offlineReggaebird From Jamaica, joined Nov 1999, 1174 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 5301 times:

They are returning to Accra because Delta is doing very well on the JFK Accra route and SAA sees a revenue opportunity. I have read that Delta's loads are above expectations. SAA are thinking "why leave that whole market Delta?".

User currently offlineN77014 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 5256 times:

What is the status of traffic rights ex ACC for either SA)">DL or SA to JFK and JNB?

User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 5234 times:

Quoting Reggaebird (Reply 3):
SAA are thinking "why leave that whole market Delta?".

That is a fine strategy so long as they can also sell ACC-JNB.....why sell JFK-ACC, and displace a JFK-JNB pax unless you can also sell ACC-JNB? Someone at SA better be good ar RM.


User currently offlineN383PA From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 104 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 5135 times:

SAA used to fly the JNB-ACC-JFK route in the past but didn't have any traffic rights between ACC and JFK. It looks like the government in Ghana changed there mind. SAA is currently flying to ACC with A340 from JNB.A few of them flights go via ABJ.

As SAA is flying the daily JNB-IAD service via DKR anyway I guess this opportunity to fly a certain amount of JFK services via ACC is an additional money maker for them.

I think they dont go daily JNB-ACC-JFK as their wouldn't be any US flights to DKR as the IAD-JNB service goes nonstop.
It could be that SAA didn't get any more frequencies from the government in Ghana to go daily on this route.


User currently offlineSA7700 From South Africa, joined Dec 2003, 3432 posts, RR: 26
Reply 7, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 5089 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
HEAD MODERATOR

Quoting N383PA (Reply 6):
SAA used to fly the JNB-ACC-JFK route in the past but didn't have any traffic rights between ACC and JFK

SA started their JNB-IAD service via ACC - I was on one of those flights. SA never flew JNB-ACC-JFK. They used to fly JNB-SID-JFK and at some stage flew JNB-LOS-JFK (codeshare with the defunct Nigeria Airways) in order to provide service between the USA and Nigeria. Thereafter, SA switched their stopover for the JFK-flight from SID to DKR.


Rgds

SA7700



When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
User currently offlineCXA330300 From South Africa, joined May 2004, 1553 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 5085 times:

Maybe they're also trying to nip DL-as DL has joined the competition with their ATL-DKR-JNB flights. Are they doing well enough to compete with SAA?


The sky is the limit as long as you can stay there
User currently offlineRdwootty From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2005, 901 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 5029 times:

Just as an aside, thus route would not have been possible in the 1970's as SAA had a strict colour rule.No Coloured person could be seated next to a white person. In additon this was also a Clipper route for PANAM . Just for your info

User currently onlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8208 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 4952 times:

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 5):
That is a fine strategy so long as they can also sell ACC-JNB.....why sell JFK-ACC, and displace a JFK-JNB pax unless you can also sell ACC-JNB? Someone at SA better be good ar RM.

 yes 


User currently offlinePanAm747 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4242 posts, RR: 9
Reply 11, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 4924 times:

Quote:
In additon this was also a Clipper route for PANAM.

PA also operated this route as JFK-ROB-JNB for a time, a long with an extensive West African network.

The problem with SAA is the announcement of routes and then withdrawing before they start - Chicago is a prime example.

While there is a good need for NYC-South Africa, I would like to see SAA concentrate on IAD - that's the Star Alliance hub, and a good place to get feed.

And I agree about the ACC-JFK traffic rights - did something change in Ghana?



Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 4878 times:

Quoting CXA330300 (Reply 8):
Maybe they're also trying to nip SA)">DL-as SA)">DL has joined the competition with their ATL-DKR-JNB flights. Are they doing well enough to compete with SAA?

SA)">DL has already upgraded this route from a 763 to a 764 and is talking about putting a 777 on the route I think the real question is whether SA can compete with SA)">DL; the latter is in much better financial shape and has airplanes to xpand throughout its growing African network.


User currently offlineAA767400 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 2300 posts, RR: 26
Reply 13, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 4611 times:

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 12):
SA)">DL has already upgraded this route from a 763 to a 764 and is talking about putting a 777 on the route I think the real question is whether SA can compete with SA)">DL; the latter is in much better financial shape and has airplanes to xpand throughout its growing African network

Only a DL supporter would say something like that. SA can hold it's own in Ghana even with their present situation which is far better than what DL went and is still going through.



"The low fares airline."
User currently offlineSA7700 From South Africa, joined Dec 2003, 3432 posts, RR: 26
Reply 14, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 4539 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
HEAD MODERATOR

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 11):
And I agree about the ACC-JFK traffic rights - did something change in Ghana?

Quoted directly from the article. Link already provided by OP: SAA pursues growth plan across African skies.


The national carrier has secured air traffic rights to take passengers on from Accra, Ghana's capital, to New York. It was denied these rights last year, although travel agents in Ghana had expected it to be a popular route. As a result, SAA routed its flights from Johannesburg to New York by way of Dakar.

As usual the media has one or two facts wrong. SA was actually flying JNB-ACC-IAD-ACC-JNB at the time. I am not aware of any ACC-JFK-ACC plans by SA last year.


Sean, if you are out there, how does G0 feel about this development or are you guys going to concentrate on LGW for the time being?


Rgds

SA7700

[Edited 2007-09-20 07:55:58]


When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4731 posts, RR: 45
Reply 15, posted (6 years 7 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 4527 times:

Interesting.

Will become even more so soon I would imagine...



Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlinePanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4792 posts, RR: 25
Reply 16, posted (6 years 7 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 4428 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting AA767400 (Reply 13):
SA can hold it's own in Ghana even with their present situation which is far better than what DL went and is still going through.

Correct about what DL went through, but not what DL is "still going through". Last I checked, DL has been making profits...SAA has not.


User currently offlinePA110 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1979 posts, RR: 24
Reply 17, posted (6 years 7 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 4424 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting AA767400 (Reply 13):
Only a DL supporter would say something like that. SA can hold it's own in Ghana even with their present situation which is far better than what DL went and is still going through.

Actually, the situation is quite the opposite. SA's current management has risen to its highest level of incompetency, and can't really progress any further without some fresh ideas, and new managers. DL collected several years of passenger data at SA's expense (basically handed to them on a silver platter) during the years SA operated out of ATL in marketing partnership with DL. DL easily recognized SA's incompetence and grabbed the first opportunity they could, given their finances at the time, to start their own operation, capitalizing on their domestic feed, and SA's inability to negotiate its way out of a paper bag.

SA is moving the transit stop from DKR to ACC because their JFK-JNB service isn't performing up to expectations. SA must rely almost entirely on the JFK O&D market, because SA's current marketing partner (UA) lacks any significant feed to/from JFK. Almost all North American traffic is routed over IAD, which has much better feed.

Second, despite large numbers of Senegalese living in the New York Area, there has never been enough traffic to justify daily service between JFK and DKR, even if it is only to "top-off" the JFK-JNB loads. Plus, there is virtually no local traffic at all between DKR and JNB. SA can't fill the flight all the way to JNB, and when they fill it just to DKR, they can't fill the empty seat between DKR and JNB. Not a very profitable way to operate a route if you ask me.

Third, DL has siphoned off quite a bit of business from SA, due to the strength of their presence in the NY area, their corporate and leisure marketing, and their frequent flyer brand loyalty.

The truth is SA continues to hemorrhage cash at an alarming rate, and Khaya continues to fiddle while Rome burns. SA is grasping at straws, because they currently lack the leadership to do much of anything else.

[Edited 2007-09-20 10:52:49]


It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
User currently offlineAndz From South Africa, joined Feb 2004, 8416 posts, RR: 11
Reply 18, posted (6 years 7 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4337 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting PA110 (Reply 17):
currently lack the leadership

Interesting little article about another SAA "leader" Coleman Andrews in this week's Financial Mail.

http://secure.financialmail.co.za/07/0921/fox/mfox.htm



After Monday and Tuesday even the calendar says WTF...
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Why Not MH And SQ To New York Via Syria Or Lebanon posted Sat Jun 14 2003 16:31:51 by Airmale
Cayman Airways To Start New York Flights posted Sun May 20 2007 19:38:08 by Semsem
British Airways To Fly Cardiff - New York JFK? posted Mon Dec 4 2006 01:55:13 by 8herveg
Royal Air Maroc To Increase New York, Montreal + posted Tue Mar 28 2006 22:34:37 by ETStar
Tarom To Resume New York And Beijing posted Wed Jan 12 2005 04:00:54 by Connector4you
Air Tahiti Nui To Start New York To Papeete Flight posted Mon Apr 26 2004 20:56:34 by Aeri28
CX To Fly London - New York posted Thu Nov 27 2003 12:55:46 by ANstar
Tarom To Drop New York And Beijing . . . posted Thu Sep 26 2002 21:36:07 by Connector4you
What's Happening To TWA's New York JFK Terminal? posted Fri Nov 16 2001 02:33:48 by Crosswind
Please Don't Fly "New York Air" posted Sun Sep 9 2007 16:58:46 by Dtwclipper