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New A350 XWB Cockpit Design Unveiled  
User currently offlineBells From Singapore, joined Nov 2001, 157 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 66671 times:

Airbus has dropped the A380 cockpit for the A350 XWB and gone for bigger screens like the 787.

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...ew-a350-xwb-flightdeck-design.html

Are they doing the right thing, ie abandoning commonality? Can they have a common type rating anymore?

28 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineZeke From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2006, 8643 posts, RR: 75
Reply 1, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 66538 times:

Still looks fairly similar, the devil is in the detail with systems etc. The information from the 10 A380 screens seems still to be on the 6 larger ones in this new picture.


We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
User currently offlineEaglewarrior From Barbados, joined Aug 2005, 32 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 66435 times:

I think it looks better. It gives it a futuristic look. And maybe they are making up for the new nose design.  Smile

User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 66429 times:

Quoting Bells (Thread starter):
Airbus has dropped the A380 cockpit for the A350 XWB and gone for bigger screens like the 787.

B787


A350XWB


A380


The number / function of primary & secondary displays is different, the windows / layout, control stick/side stick.. a totally different cockpit from the 787.

Zeke, what about : “The ability to share some of this airport and navigation information on the centre display is seen as advantage for the pilots because it means they can be looking at the same display together." it seems logical to have the ability to point things to each other when sharing info on the same display, would that have value in your opinion?

[Edited 2007-09-25 13:39:23]

User currently offlineVoodoo From Niue, joined Mar 2001, 2053 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 66293 times:

I suppose, given a bit of time, Airbus could 'upgrade' the 380 to the 350 cockpit. 'A380SNG' (Slightly New Generation).


` Yeaah! Baade 152! Trabi of the Sky! '
User currently offlineZeke From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2006, 8643 posts, RR: 75
Reply 5, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 66237 times:

Quoting Keesje (Reply 3):
totally different cockpit from the 787.

This the information being displayed is basically the same, the main difference between the two is the PFD.

Quoting Keesje (Reply 3):
would that have value in your opinion?

The middle screen is basically the FMC screen, pilots are supposed to cross check the information each others are putting in.



We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
User currently offlineMcdu From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 1436 posts, RR: 17
Reply 6, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 65882 times:

I really like the proposed A350XWB flightdeck. I have a 20+ year career of flying mostly Boeings and only about 4 years in the Airbus 320 Series. In my opinion I like the comfort, fit, finish and noise levels of the Airbus over the Boeings. The 777 may be the finest airplane I have ever flown but the 320 cockpit is best for long days. If the A350 meets the design targets for laid out by Airbus then I think they will have a very successful airplane. In addition the technical difficulties that Boeing is currently having with the 787 may be giving Airbus some catch up time. I am curious if Airbus is using this time effectively?

MCDU


User currently offlineBadge From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 79 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 65726 times:

Looks like they have gone to the Boeing style rudder pedals.

User currently offlineTdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 8, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 65656 times:

Quoting Bells (Thread starter):
Are they doing the right thing, ie abandoning commonality? Can they have a common type rating anymore?

They couldn't have had a common type rating anyway (twin vs. quad).

Tom.


User currently offlineKappel From Suriname, joined Jul 2005, 3533 posts, RR: 17
Reply 9, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 65478 times:

Quoting Badge (Reply 7):
Looks like they have gone to the Boeing style rudder pedals.

What's the difference in rudder pedals? I thought they already worked the same.

Quoting Tdscanuck (Reply 8):
They couldn't have had a common type rating anyway (twin vs. quad).

Is that the important factor? I thought the a343 has a common type rating to the a330 and a320 series? Or am I wrong?

Quoting Bells (Thread starter):
Airbus has dropped the A380 cockpit for the A350 XWB and gone for bigger screens like the 787

If I look at the comparison photo's between the 787 cockpit and the new a350 cockpit, it seems that the 787 screens are much bigger. Is this just perception? I'd think the bigger the screens the better, right? Wonder why Airbus didn't go for even bigger screens.



L1011,733,734,73G,738,743,744,752,763,772,77W,DC855,DC863,DC930,DC950,MD11,MD88,306,319,320,321,343,346,ARJ85,CR7,E195
User currently offlineSkyexRamper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 65430 times:

Quoting Bells (Thread starter):
Are they doing the right thing, ie abandoning commonality?

They aren't really...the main PFD symbology looks that same as all other FBW airbuses.


User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 65382 times:

Maybe they optimized the size of the screens on the XWB to be able to place them all next to each other, contrary to the low A380 info displays and the 787 EFB displays..

User currently offlineMoo From Falkland Islands, joined May 2007, 3829 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 65356 times:

Quoting Kappel (Reply 9):
Is that the important factor? I thought the a343 has a common type rating to the a330 and a320 series? Or am I wrong?

As far as I know, they don't. They do however allow for quick crew training across types due to Airbuses 'Cross Crew Qualification' system due to the way the cockpits are designed to a common layout - it cuts crew training significantly.


User currently offlineIwok From Sweden, joined Jan 2005, 1107 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 62335 times:

Does this mean the overall nose is going back to the original design? Or, are they just changing the flighdeck and keeping the 380 nose section? It appears to me that the former is true based on the view of the window panes on the 350 & 380.

iwok


User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16345 posts, RR: 86
Reply 14, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 62267 times:

Quoting Bells (Thread starter):
Are they doing the right thing, ie abandoning commonality? Can they have a common type rating anymore?



Quoting Kappel (Reply 9):
Is that the important factor? I thought the a343 has a common type rating to the a330 and a320 series? Or am I wrong?

Absolutely not. Not even the A340 and A330 have the same type rating, they can't.

However, they will all basically handle the same and display information the same, which is what cockpit commonality is about.

Its called CCQ.

NS


User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21417 posts, RR: 60
Reply 15, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 62140 times:

Quoting Bells (Thread starter):
Airbus has dropped the A380 cockpit for the A350 XWB and gone for bigger screens like the 787.

So, before they had the A380 cockpit wrapped in a new shaped enclosure. From the outside it looked like a 787 nose, but from the inside it felt like the A380.

Now they have adopted the A380 enclosure but have a new cockpit interior? From the outside the nose looks like the A380/A320 series, but inside, it's an all new design?

Or am I not reading the news from the last few days right?



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineGeorgiaAME From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 926 posts, RR: 6
Reply 16, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 60217 times:

Okay, I'm not a pilot, and even my Microsoft skills are wanting at best. Flames on people! Is it possible that even Airbus has realized it has a dud on its hands?


"Trust, but verify!" An old Russian proverb, quoted often by a modern American hero
User currently offlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 11930 posts, RR: 25
Reply 17, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 59627 times:

Cup holders! It needs more cup holders!


Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlineLuisca From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 59443 times:

Quoting Tdscanuck (Reply 8):
Quoting Bells (Thread starter):
Are they doing the right thing, ie abandoning commonality? Can they have a common type rating anymore?

They couldn't have had a common type rating anyway (twin vs. quad).



Quoting Kappel (Reply 9):
Quoting Tdscanuck (Reply 8):
They couldn't have had a common type rating anyway (twin vs. quad).

Is that the important factor? I thought the a343 has a common type rating to the a330 and a320 series? Or am I wrong?

The A330 and A340 have the same type rating, the A320 is a different one and the A380 is a different one, The advantage is that cross training is easier if you fly one of these aircraft and transition to another, it should not be a problem for the A350 since the information is basically the same.


User currently offlineWjcandee From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 4970 posts, RR: 18
Reply 19, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 59100 times:

I thought that the idea was to have a common type rating with the A330, not the A380.

User currently offlineRedFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 4252 posts, RR: 29
Reply 20, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 58766 times:

Quoting Kappel (Reply 9):
Quoting Badge (Reply 7):
Looks like they have gone to the Boeing style rudder pedals.

What's the difference in rudder pedals? I thought they already worked the same.

Don't you know the advantage of the Boeing rudder pedal system? It has a slide out tray that lets you hang your socks on to air them out. You can't do that on an Airbus! They need to go to the Boeing style rudder pedals. Pilots always prefer them once they've been trained to use them.  Smile



I'm not a racist...I hate Biden, too.
User currently offlineSh0rtybr0wn From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 528 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 58455 times:

Nice job by airbus to give A350 bigger 15 " X ? wide screen displays. Boeing features 5 12X9" displays in 787,

Overall I like Boeings flightdeck better, its more space technology-esque, at least the CG of it. The A350 is very very nice though and I like it 10 times more than other Airbus flight decks, which in my view, are only a notch above that goofy Phthalocyanine blue Russian flight decks.

The A380 pic looks like, the flightdeck of a Russian version of the 747.


User currently offlineMaersk737 From Denmark, joined Feb 2004, 668 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 57796 times:

Quoting RedFlyer (Reply 20):
Don't you know the advantage of the Boeing rudder pedal system? It has a slide out tray that lets you hang your socks on to air them out. You can't do that on an Airbus! They need to go to the Boeing style rudder pedals. Pilots always prefer them once they've been trained to use them.

 laughing 

Cheers

Peter



I'm not proud to be a Viking, just thankfull
User currently offlineHowSwedeitis From Sweden, joined Jul 2007, 586 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 57740 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

I especially like the palm-rests on the GPS systems.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 17):
Cup holders! It needs more cup holders!

 checkmark  I want my happy pilot to be able to set his coffee down!!  Smile



Heja Sverige!!
User currently offlineGrbld From Netherlands, joined Dec 2005, 353 posts, RR: 3
Reply 24, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 57524 times:

Quoting Sh0rtybr0wn (Reply 21):
Nice job by airbus to give A350 bigger 15 " X ? wide screen displays. Boeing features 5 12X9" displays in 787

Do the math, a 15" diagonal screen is EXACTLY the same size as a 12" by 9" screen! It's only that Boeing always mentions the width and height of the screens (ie. B777 = 8 x 8 inch).


25 TurkishAviator : Does that mean A380 cockpit has gone obsolete before it's EIS ?
26 Post contains images Kappel : Thanks for the input guys. Guess I misunderstood the concept of cockpit commonality.
27 Tdscanuck : No. Obsolescence of avionics of that cockpit is going to be over 10 years, baring a huge technology breakthrough that nobody knows about yet. Tom.
28 Sh0rtybr0wn : I'm saying I think the Airbus screens are wider than the Boeing; 15 wide instead of 12. Dont the Airbus screens look more wideview to you? I'm guessi
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