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Delta To Add 3 New Routes From CVG  
User currently offlineDAL767400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 8543 times:

...albeit only 3 EAS routes:
http://biz.yahoo.com/pz/071009/128290.html

Quote:
CINCINNATI, Oct. 9, 2007 (PRIME NEWSWIRE) -- Delta Air Lines (NYSE:DAL - News) will offer customers in Cape Girardeau, Mo., Jackson, Tenn., and Owensboro, Ky. their first nonstop access to Delta's global network of destinations beginning Nov. 18 with new nonstop service between their hometowns and Delta's second-largest hub at Cincinnati/Northern Kentucky International Airport. Delta Connection(r) carrier Big Sky Airlines will operate the new flights using 19-seat Beechcraft 1900D aircraft, featuring stand-up cabins.

At the Cincinnati/Northern Kentucky International Airport, passengers will have connecting opportunities to more than 400 peak-day departures to 112 nonstop destinations.

In each market, Delta Connection(r) carrier Big Sky will initially operate one to two daily round-trip flights timed for convenient connections to and from Cincinnati.

These are three former EAS markets that used to be served by Regions Air with service to STL till that carrier went bust. But didn't the DOT award these cities to Big Sky months ago?

37 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 8543 times:

Ho hum.

...dunno why I was excited before opening this.


User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2016 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 8543 times:

Quoting DAL767400ER (Thread starter):
These are three former EAS markets that used to be served by Regions Air with service to STL till that carrier went bust. But didn't the DOT award these cities to Big Sky months ago?

That's correct, they did award these back during the summer. I guess this press release is mainly intended to give a formal start date for service, and provide the schedule.



Good goes around!
User currently offlineSQ452 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1128 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 8543 times:

Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 1):
Ho hum.

...dunno why I was excited before opening this.

Maybe because you (like I did) thought that this was a DL mainline announcement...instead its just old news with really small aircraft that could fly into Lunken (LUK) Airport in Cincy if they want...ho hum indeed.



SIN > CVG > BOS
User currently offlineFlyinryan99 From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 2025 posts, RR: 13
Reply 4, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 8543 times:

It's good to see they finally have announced the routes and they are going to be implemented. The sucky thing for the passengers as it is only 1 aircraft doing the flights. If there is a delay at any point of the day, there is no recovery. Hopefully we'll see Big Sky add additional cities to help boost the amount of aircraft and crews based in CVG.

User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2016 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 8543 times:

Quoting Flyinryan99 (Reply 4):
It's good to see they finally have announced the routes and they are going to be implemented. The sucky thing for the passengers as it is only 1 aircraft doing the flights. If there is a delay at any point of the day, there is no recovery. Hopefully we'll see Big Sky add additional cities to help boost the amount of aircraft and crews based in CVG.

I wouldn't count on GQ doing too much to bolster the number of aircraft in CVG. They LOVE to spread their aircraft as thin as possible. On most days it works okay, but as you say, when one little thing goes wrong, it wreaks havoc on everything. I've been in HQ in Billings before on a bad day, and it was amazing to say the least, to see the problems that this system creates.



Good goes around!
User currently offline764 From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 628 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 8543 times:

OK, I love the Beech 1900, but I cetainly wouldn't talk about the cabin as "stand up cabin"..... Although to be fair I have to admit that I am 6'5".

Other than that great news for my folks in CGI. Too bad it's CVG and not ATL, cause that would make connections a lot easier for them.


User currently offlineSampa737 From Brazil, joined May 2005, 637 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 8543 times:

Jackson is about an hour southwest of Memphis. Would Jackson be any more advantageous than Memphis? Is it really that cost effective for an airline to set up shop for a flight or 2 so close to a larger city? Memphis has around 1.5 million inhabitants or more. Jackson? Where there is money to be made...

User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 8543 times:

Owensboro will work, the other two are an example of EAS wasted tax payer money..... Jackson, TN should have nonstop flights to MEM codeshare with NW and CGI to STL. codeshare with AA.

User currently offlineSkibum9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1229 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 8543 times:

Quoting SQ452 (Reply 3):
Maybe because you (like I did) thought that this was a DL mainline announcement...instead its just old news with really small aircraft that could fly into Lunken (LUK) Airport in Cincy if they want...ho hum indeed.

Are you kidding? You could charter that Island Air cherokee that flies those discreet "flights of fancy" out of LUK and it still be cheaper, faster and more comfortable. YAWN!



Tailwinds!!!
User currently offlineAtrude777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5700 posts, RR: 52
Reply 10, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 8053 times:

Good to see!

I am 45 minutes drive from CGI and if I find myself needing to ride Delta, I will check them out also!

At least they have a code share going...Great Lakes at MWA here needs working to do!

Alex



Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
User currently offlineSkibum9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1229 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 7793 times:

On to another related topic, why the heck does OWB need air service? It is only 25 miles from EVV which has plenty of air service. What a waste of taxpayer money!!!

Also, likewise PAH is only 39 miles from CGI. Another waste of taxpayer money!!! Crap like this proves that the EAS program is seriously flawed.



Tailwinds!!!
User currently offlineSTLGph From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 9496 posts, RR: 26
Reply 12, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7429 times:

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 11):
why the heck does OWB need air service? It is only 25 miles from EVV which has plenty of air service. What a waste of taxpayer money!!!

and you're wrong. it's about 50 miles, and to the Evansville airport ... actual drive time is probably 90 minutes or so

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 11):
likewise PAH is only 39 miles from CGI. Another waste of taxpayer money!!! Crap like this proves that the EAS program is seriously flawed.

and you're wrong again. it's a 74 mile drive, but there's no direct route or interstate -- drive time is at least 2 hours.



if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
User currently offlineLexy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2515 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 7350 times:

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 11):
why the heck does OWB need air service? It is only 25 miles from EVV which has plenty of air service. What a waste of taxpayer money!!!

It HAS NO air service. Do some research on it and you would see that. And it is about 50 miles to EVV which is a source on contention with OWB travellers for the most part..


In a poll back earlier this year conducted by the Owensboro Messenger Inquirer (their daily newspaper), more travellers in OWB wanted n/s service to BNA than anywhere else. CVG wasn't even on their radar, that's the joy of EAS flights! WOO HOO! Even with the knowledge that WN was a dominant player here, they still wanted the service. This is just governement force feeding people into a hub that is grossly overpriced to fly out of. At least that's my opinion.

FWIW, most people from OWB travel to SDF or (maybe less likely) BNA for their flights anyway. It's just cheaper for them to do so than to hop on a puddle hopper in EVV and then connect in the hubs. EVV would seem to me to be rather expensive to fly out of given the little competition is has. Just my  twocents 

[Edited 2007-10-10 05:26:35]


Nashville, Tennessee KBNA
User currently offlineUSPIT10L From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 3295 posts, RR: 7
Reply 14, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7282 times:

I've been waiting for DL to start service to MKL, although I would've expected it to start with EV from ATL. So much for an "all-jet" hub.


It's a Great Day for Hockey!
User currently offlineSkibum9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1229 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7263 times:

Quoting Lexy (Reply 13):
It HAS NO air service.



I OBVIOUSLY stated that! My point is, why does it even deserve service? It ONLY has a population of 54,000. Why should American taxpayers fund flights to such a small population when all they have to do is get their lazy behinds in a car and drive for an hour or so. It is one thing for EAS to be used in states like Wyoming and Montana, but when it is used in a state like Kentucky where you have a number of options, it is a waste. Just because you are too dang lazy to drive an hour or so, it does not mean that you are entitled to have flights at your closest airport. Wake up...people in large cities, like Cincinnati or Washington D.C. regularly drive an hour or so to catch a flight. CVG to DAY, IAD and DCA to BWI. What do you want next, a runway paved in your backyard so the taxpayers can fund a private flight. What a waste of taxpayer money.

Quoting Lexy (Reply 13):
In a poll back earlier this year conducted by the Owensboro Messenger Inquirer (their daily newspaper), more travellers in OWB wanted n/s service to BNA than anywhere else. CVG wasn't even on their radar, that's the joy of EAS flights!

That's the waste of taxpayer money. Get in your car and drive.



Tailwinds!!!
User currently offlineDAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 7236 times:

More CRJ or prop flights to/from CVG is NOT where DL needs to focus it's attention on CVG.


One Nation Under God
User currently offlineMaiznblu_757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 5112 posts, RR: 50
Reply 17, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 6768 times:

I was really hoping to see year round service to TVC start this winter. Ah well.

User currently offlineSkuertz From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 7 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 6393 times:

It's sad they can't use Lunken more than CVG... Prices are horrific at CVG and passagers have almost no other option except driving to Dayton, Columbus, Indy, Louisville, or Lexington. Lunken has room to expand too. I wish another airline would look into that.

User currently offlineLexy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2515 posts, RR: 8
Reply 19, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 6393 times:

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 15):
That's the waste of taxpayer money. Get in your car and drive.

It wasn't a waste when AA had a hub at BNA. OWB had two or three flights a day on them to BNA and they filled up! So what's up with that? EItherway, if you hate it so bad, write your Congressman and tell him or her about it. But in any case it's not about "deserving" a flight. It's about having the demand for one and providing it with the help of government subsidies. In the case of OWB, I see nothing wrong with it and there's little you can do to prove they don't "deserve" it. If they can support the flight with help from the government and people actually use it, what's your beef?? You keep saying it's a waste, have you ever thought about all the other stuff the government "waste" money on?



Nashville, Tennessee KBNA
User currently offlineSkibum9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1229 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 5892 times:

Quoting Lexy (Reply 19):
If they can support the flight with help from the government and people actually use it, what's your beef??

What's my beef. It is simple abuse of the U.S. taxpayers. The demand you speak of is artifically generated by the U.S. taxpayers. You take away that subsidy, which reduces the fare, and that demand decreases because people would have to pay a fare that actually supports running that route. So where does it stop. Maybe we should use the EAS to set up flights in Bowling Green Kentucky, and every small city of 50,000 in the country, regardless that they are within a CONVENIENT drive to another airport in a larger city. Air travel is not an entitlement that should be funded by taxpayers. If OWB feels it deserves air service then let the local taxpayers fund it.

Yes I agree that the government wastes money on many things, this being one of them. Why should you advocate continual waste?

[Edited 2007-10-10 11:57:26]


Tailwinds!!!
User currently offlineAccess-Air From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 1939 posts, RR: 13
Reply 21, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 5789 times:

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 14):
That's the waste of taxpayer money. Get in your car and drive.

Well since you live in a city like CVG your opinion on this matter of outlying communities with propsed service into "your" hub city has little merit.

Not everyone should have to simply drive to a bigger city when an adequate and quite capable local airport that has supported an airline previously should be overlooked simply because people like yourself "think" its a waste of tax payers money to pay a little incentive money to get the ball rolling....I can think of plenty of other wastes of our tax payer money that goes unchallenged. So why are you so down on the EAS Subsidy? Maybe you should try living in a small community like CGI or OWB or MKL and get in your own car and drive 50+ miles to catch your flight..The first couple of times you might not mind the drive, however about after the 20th or 30th time I can guarantee that it will become a large pain in your ass not to mention your wallet!!!!!!!...Not only do you have the added expense of driving with gas and tolls, if they apply, you have to start your journey 2-3 times as early to make your flight.

Just for the the record, Jackson, Tn used to have Martin 404 prop and DC9 jet service with Southern Airways. Owensboro used to have Ozark with DC9s and FH-227s. Cape Girardeau used to also have Ozark DC9 and FH-227s. Maybe if these airlines had not pulled their service and stayed and tried to develope these markets further perhaps these communities might have grown sufficiently to never have lost their air service in the first place.
Of course after the local service airlines mentioned above left they did have commuter airlines, but some of them have permenatly lost their service and in the process it has hindered alot of smaller communities from growing by losing that air service.

However, one of the many reasons passenger loads go in the crapper in these types of EAS communities is because the airlines that are awarded the contracts are only given a minimum amount of seats that have to be provided per day or week or however they are monitored. There is no restriction on what the FLIGHT TIMES should be and whether they are well timed to actually connect to other airlines. However, in some other cases, the flights are CRAP and connectability is at the very least, totally impossible. In my honest opinion, if a commuter airline cannot provide an EAS community with fligths that actually benefit the community by proividing flights that actually connect into a hub rather than just satisfying a minimum seat requirement, then the Govt needs to take appropriate action. Is this a bit of re-regulation? Damned straight it is!! Since its Federal Subsidy, and the chosen airline is getting financial support from the Federal Govt, then they should provide adequate and quality service with scheduled times that are going to benefit the community not just the pocket books of the airline collecting the subsidy money!!!!
Once a commuter airline enters an EAS subsidized community, their main goal should be to develope that community to ultimately bring that community to a place whereby the subsidy dollar amount could be reduced or even eliminated. They shouldnt just shlep in and out providing the minimum of flights just to get the Govt to add to their bottum line and prop up their small infra structures. Unfortunately trying to get any commuter airline to put the proper resoruces into their smaller communities is just not in their list of priorities....So the small communities lose....And people like Skibum9 continue to bitch about EAS subsidy!!!!!!!

I think its good that these three communities are getting air service back EAS or no!!!!!!!!

Access-Air



Remember, Wherever you go, there you are!!!!
User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 7
Reply 22, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 5789 times:

What Delta is doing in CVG is going to turn around and bite them in the ass I think. but it is all supply and demand. Delta has the supply and people are flying. Don't they have something like 80% of the traffic in Cinci? Even if a low-cost moves in (I think it'll happen eventually) the costs at CVG are a bit managable and they'll just lower fares but they won't be moved out.


What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineSkibum9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1229 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 5640 times:

Quoting Access-Air (Reply 20):
Well since you live in a city like CVG your opinion on this matter of outlying communities with propsed service into "your" hub city has little merit.

Obviously you have no idea of what it is like living in a hub city like Cincinnati. You have the OPTION of paying the highest airfares in the country and getting bent over and having every body cavity violated or you have the OPTION to DRIVE at least 50 miles to an another airport like DAY, CMH, LEX, SDF or IND. Just because I live in a hub city, do not assume that I, or many of the people that live here, benefit from it. Many of us, on an every increasing rate drive long distances, much longer than driving from OWB to EVV, to get a reasonable fare.

Quoting Access-Air (Reply 20):
Not everyone should have to simply drive to a bigger city when an adequate and quite capable local airport that has supported an airline previously should be overlooked simply because people like yourself "think" its a waste of tax payers money to pay a little incentive money to get the ball rolling....I can think of plenty of other wastes of our tax payer money that goes unchallenged.

Again I ask, why advocate using U.S. taxpayer money to eliminate a CONVENIENT drive? Air Service is NOT an entitlement. Why shouldn't people have to drive, what is the threshold of an acceptable drive distance and population for air service? And again, why should U.S. taxpayers fund it and not the local municipalities that want it. Just because you have a runway that is the right length and a building that can be used as a terminal is not an adequate arguement. With your analogy we should expand EAS and subsidize flights to every airport that has a runway over 6,000 ft.?

Quoting Access-Air (Reply 20):
Maybe you should try living in a small community like CGI or OWB or MKL and get in your own car and drive 50+ miles to catch your flight

See my first point. Obviously you are clueless on CVG. Many of us drive 50+ miles weekly to travel. Maybe we should demand a similar program to subsidize our fares and have the U.S. taxpayer fund it.



Tailwinds!!!
User currently offlineLexy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2515 posts, RR: 8
Reply 24, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 5535 times:

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 20):
What's my beef. It is simple abuse of the U.S. taxpayers. The demand you speak of is artifically generated by the U.S. taxpayers. You take away that subsidy, which reduces the fare, and that demand decreases because people would have to pay a fare that actually supports running that route. So where does it stop. Maybe we should use the EAS to set up flights in Bowling Green Kentucky, and every small city of 50,000 in the country, regardless that they are within a CONVENIENT drive to another airport in a larger city. Air travel is not an entitlement that should be funded by taxpayers. If OWB feels it deserves air service then let the local taxpayers fund it.

Yes I agree that the government wastes money on many things, this being one of them. Why should you advocate continual waste?

I was going to reply, but what's the use? You have no clue so forget it.



Nashville, Tennessee KBNA
25 Skibum9 : What a typical response for someone that can't substantiate their position! You have failed to address any of the issues that I presented yet you say
26 Access-Air : Yes, I am clueless on CVG...I dont live in that city, but I am a Travel Agent and have been such for 18 years. So, I understand that the CVG area res
27 Skibum9 : I feel that it is a very realistic and reasonable comparison. As has been stated, and you can verify on Mapquest, Owensboro is only a 40 mile drive t
28 Lexy : Hey 'Bum, How many times have you driven from OWB to EVV. I doubt very many. I used to live in that part of KY and I know that drive ALL TOO WELL. No,
29 Skibum9 : If you want to make this personal then that really tells me what kind of person you really are. You still have yet to discuss any issues that I raise
30 SkyyMaster : EAS to some cities is a total waste, and MKL is one of them. Regions Air was averaging 2 pax per flight on it's two flights to STL before it lost the
31 Lexy : And you have? All you've done is b!tched and moaned because your tax money is helping this community, and others, have a choice. Why don't you take y
32 Skibum9 : And yet again you have failed to answer any of the questions I raised, which are all legitimate. You just sit their and thump your chest. And now you
33 SQ452 : There was a time back in the day that they were thinking of reinforcing the runway at LUK to accomodate 737's so WN could fly there possibly. Problem
34 Nickstyro : The main problem with Lunken is the same that stopped service in the first place. It sits in a valley so its prone to fog and due to its prox. to the
35 FlyPNS1 : What does this have to do with EAS subsidies? You're using pure emotion and nothing else. The bottomline is that these subsidies are a waste because
36 STLGph : you're wrong on both counts. Owensboro is about 45 miles or so from Evansville. from the Evansville *airport* it's a 90 minute or so drive. Owensboro
37 Post contains images SQ452 : If you live north of I-275 in Cincinnati anyway, Dayton airport is only a few minutes more of a drive, sometimes equidistant or closer than CVG depen
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