Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
ATA To Discontinue DCA/LGA  
User currently offlineSeeTheWorld From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 1325 posts, RR: 4
Posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

According to Ben Mutzabaugh at USA Today:

http://blogs.usatoday.com/sky/

ATA to end flights to New York LaGuardia, Washington National

[Edited 2007-10-11 11:24:20]

[Edited 2007-10-11 11:35:56]

57 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2493 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5704 times:

I wonder who will get the slots and gates?

User currently offlineFWAERJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 3737 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

One only wonders if those precious LGA slots are being sold to WN...


Primary Airport: FWA/Alternate Airport: DTW/Not employed by the FWACAA or their partners
User currently offlinePanAm747 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4242 posts, RR: 8
Reply 3, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

Quote:
One only wonders if those precious LGA slots are being sold to WN...

You couldn't get a twenty-minute turn-around at LGA at 3 AM!!

The article, interestingly enough, makes this reference:

Quote:
resulting in poor financial performance in spite of the high load factors.

Full planes do not always equal profitable flights. Maybe that was in there just for us a.netters...  highfive 



Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22877 posts, RR: 20
Reply 4, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

Quoting Quickmover (Reply 2):
I wonder who will get the slots and gates?

There was a rumour floating around here that VX wanted TZ's gates at MDW.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineSeeTheWorld From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 1325 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 5):
There was a rumour floating around here that VX wanted TZ's gates at MDW.

Can't really see WN allowing that to happen.


User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 3):
One only wonders if those precious LGA slots are being sold to WN...

I dont wonder...if these slots are slot exemptions that TZ won in a lottery, do they go back in for another carrier to apply for?


Also basically what is TZ flying scheduled now other than Hawaii???


User currently offlineGr8SlvrFlt From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 1602 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

Their gates are next to AirTran at both airports. I've heard rumors of FL expanding at LGA; maybe this is how.

User currently offlineSeeTheWorld From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 1325 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 7):
I dont wonder...if these slots are slot exemptions that TZ won in a lottery, do they go back in for another carrier to apply for?

I suspect they are ... DCA for certain, not sure about LGA.


User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4659 posts, RR: 11
Reply 9, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

Most important line in the article:

Quoting SeeTheWorld (Thread starter):
This move allows us to retain the aircraft in the fleet and makes them accessible for our planned international expansion in 2009.

Its been vaugely discussed for the past year, but it sounds like WN's INTL plan is probably further allong than many of us think. Wouldnt suprise me if they had 1/2 the routes already picked out.



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6603 posts, RR: 24
Reply 10, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

IIRC, in the case of the DCA slots, they were special slots added to increase competition. They can't be sold and will be returned to the DOT for redistribution. Expect to see a dogfight for these....though I expect LCC's will have the advantage because these slots were created to help LCC's get their foot in the door at DCA.

As for ATA, it's not a good sign that they are coughing up valuable assets like slots at LGA/DCA. Not so sure if ATA can survive in the long-run.


User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2493 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 5):
There was a rumour floating around here that VX wanted TZ's gates at MDW.

I was thinking about the ones at DCA and LGA. If anyone takes over any MDW gates, it will be WN.

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 3):
One only wonders if those precious LGA slots are being sold to WN...

You could be right. When ATA pulled out of DEN, WN shortly thereafter announced DEN service.


User currently offlineIFlyATA From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 242 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 11):

As for ATA, it's not a good sign that they are coughing up valuable assets like slots at LGA/DCA. Not so sure if ATA can survive in the long-run.

They aren't valuable assets to ATA if they are causing them to hemorrhage money. It's plain and simple: the routes were the primary reason ATA is still in the red. So one would think, by removing them, it might bring ATA in the black.

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 7):
Also basically what is TZ flying scheduled now other than Hawaii???

Flights other then Hawaii include MDW-DFW, MDW-CUN and MDW-GDL.

As it says in the blog post, the planes will be used for charter operations and then scheduled, international service.



ATA - an honestly different airline.
User currently offlineCOERJ145 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1421 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5703 times:

Wow, never expected this.

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 7):


Also basically what is TZ flying scheduled now other than Hawaii???

MDW-DFW
MDW-CUN
MDW-OAK
MDW-ONT
MDW-GDL

A pretty weak route network if you ask me.

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 11):

As for ATA, it's not a good sign that they are coughing up valuable assets like slots at LGA/DCA. Not so sure if ATA can survive in the long-run.

I'd like to see YX, SY or FL buy them out or merge. It appears they arn't doing too well alone.


User currently offlineLGAtoIND From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 490 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 5703 times:

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 4):
You couldn't get a twenty-minute turn-around at LGA at 3 AM!!

Interesting, because that was a reason many people cited as to why WN would never go to PHL.


User currently offlineIFlyATA From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 242 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 5703 times:

Quoting COERJ145 (Reply 14):

MDW-ONT

MDW-ONT-HNL is also being discontinued on January 7th.



ATA - an honestly different airline.
User currently offlineLGAtoIND From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 490 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 5703 times:

A little off topic, but does anyone think that B6 would be interested in obtaining some DCA slots?

User currently offlineN353SK From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 821 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 5703 times:

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 4):
You couldn't get a twenty-minute turn-around at LGA at 3 AM!!

or PHL, or LAS. I think WN has the possibility of being a contender if TZ is indeed allowed to sell, but does anybody know how many slots TZ has at LGA? I can't see WN going in with only a few slots.


User currently offlineSt530 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 139 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 5703 times:

This is interesting, I flew TZ for the first time on Tuesday, from MDW to DCA. I had no idea the route even existed, I was thrilled when I found it for a one-off, one-way trip from Chicago to DC. The total fare, tax included, was $54. Aircraft was pretty full, but at that fare, not surprised they're losing money. It's a shame though; it was a very convenient flight.

User currently offlineSeeTheWorld From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 1325 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 5703 times:

Quoting N353SK (Reply 18):
or PHL, or LAS. I think WN has the possibility of being a contender if TZ is indeed allowed to sell, but does anybody know how many slots TZ has at LGA? I can't see WN going in with only a few slots.

They only have six departures from LGA (four from DCA).


User currently offlineLrdc9 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 610 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 5703 times:

Quoting SeeTheWorld (Thread starter):
ATA to end flights to New York LaGuardia, Washington National

Its time for a mad fight. I propose exects rolling in the mud for winner!



Just say NO to scabs.
User currently offlineTinPusher007 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 977 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 5703 times:

I wonder if DL will now go mainline on LGA-MDW?


"Flying isn't inherently dangerous...but very unforgiving of carelessness, incapacity or neglect."
User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 5703 times:

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 11):

As for ATA, it's not a good sign that they are coughing up valuable assets like slots at LGA/DCA. Not so sure if ATA can survive in the long-run.

As long as the charter side is making money, the scheduled side could continue to lose money and it not be a huge issue. With World and North American under the Global Aero Logistics umbrella alongside TZ, they're practically printing money with the military charter flights (and the ACMI cargo flights), and can really to an extent balance out the losses the scheduled ops of TZ may have {I wonder if NA's scheduled ops are profitable?})

Quoting COERJ145 (Reply 14):
I'd like to see YX, SY or FL buy them out or merge. It appears they arn't doing too well alone.

That depends if Global Aero Logistics would be interested in selling off the scheduled side of TZ, which at this time, looks to be unlikely.


User currently offlineAndrewUber From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2528 posts, RR: 40
Reply 23, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 5089 times:

Quoting COERJ145 (Reply 14):
MDW-DFW
MDW-CUN
MDW-OAK
MDW-ONT
MDW-GDL

A pretty weak route network if you ask me.

Nobody actually asked you...

Are you joking, or do you really not know anything at all about ATA??? Next time you bash an airline, take 30 seconds to have a look at that airline's website to get your facts straight first.

Nonstop from Las Vegas, NV; Los Angeles, CA; Oakland, CA; Ontario, CA; Phoenix, AZ to Honolulu.
Nonstop from Los Angeles, CA; Oakland, CA; Phoenix, AZ to Maui.
Nonstop from Oakland, CA to Hilo.
Nonstop from Oakland, CA to Kona.
Nonstop from Oakland, CA to Lihue.
Nonstop from Las Vegas, NV to Maui.
Nonstop from Chicago-Midway to Dallas/Ft. Worth, TX; Oakland, CA; Ontario, CA; Guadalajara and Cancun, Mexico.



I'd rather shoot BAD_MOTIVE
User currently offlineCopaair737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 5089 times:

Quoting AndrewUber (Reply 23):
Nobody actually asked you...

Are you joking, or do you really not know anything at all about ATA??? Next time you bash an airline, take 30 seconds to have a look at that airline's website to get your facts straight first.

I think he was talking about their routes out of MDW, not their entire network...


25 EXAAUADL : how much logner can DFW-MDW last???? I think FL should re-enter that market and drive TZ of fthe route. Does one receive WN Rapid Rewards for travel
26 PHLBOS : When the last remnants of the Wright Ammendment restrictions expire around 2014(?).
27 Floridaflyboy : Well, we've also got to remember that with the second phase of the wright amendement repeal (whenever that comes into play), WN will be able to do DA
28 Cubsrule : I can't really see WN having any say. The 170 is the perfect aircraft for this route. 70 seats to mainline is a HUGE change. Why? Their utilization a
29 SRT75 : COERJ145's post was completely accurate and validated by your own post. He was identifying NON-HAWAII routes that ATA still operates. It's simply a m
30 Tornado82 : Same with PIT. Neither of those are slot restricted airports though. ATA probably isn't within their power to sell said slots, and if they were they
31 Wjcandee : Clue: They do.
32 Tornado82 : Reiterating the point that if ATA can't make money flying to NYC with a full plane, it's their own dang fault for killing their own dang yields.
33 LGA777 : Actually PanAM 747 the US Shuttle turns 319's in 20 mins and less almost every time there are ATC/Weather days,and the flights are runnig late and ha
34 Post contains images KC135TopBoom : I use to fly TZ flights from DFW-MDW-BOS, buy they dropped BOS some time ago. Then I used DL DFW-BOS, then DFW-ATL-BOS or DFW-CVG-BOS. Sooner or late
35 Atrude777 : FL already tried DFW, Couldn't work at all. AA nearly drove them out of DFW. Yes, WN folks may receive credit on ATA flights, and ATA on WN flights.
36 FlyPNS1 : I think this is exactly why FL has shied away from building up at MDW. In a market like NYC-CHI, UA, AA, DL and CO get all the corporate traffic while
37 IADLHR : I was planning to fly DCA-MDW-DCA, for the day, in early Dec. As we speak my plans are not firmed up. However, I can tell from the ATA website. that A
38 Iloveboeing : I think WN would be smart to pick up those slots at LGA and DCA. They've been wanting to get in there for years, haven't they?
39 MAH4546 : No.
40 Tinpusher007 : Whats so huge about it if no one else is competing on the route?
41 B757capt : I think you have to look at this as a good thing for airtran. Regardless if its nonstop or not, ATA's continued reductions helps them big time! FL may
42 TZTriStar500 : No, they're not. There are no gates, TZ only has a lease on 1 and not giving it up. Yes, it is much further along, has been openly discussed, and is
43 FreequentFlier : What is the status of the slots at LGA and DCA now that TZ is pulling out? I assume it differs for each airport. Does it go out for competitive biddin
44 Post contains images SkyexRamper : That is just great logic....ATA and FL's gates are right next to Midwest's gates at both airports too and Midwest is expanding too. What are the chan
45 SkyexRamper : ATA and FL's gates are right next to Midwest's and YX is expanding too.....
46 CitrusCritter : If the DOT indicates they want to redistribute ATA's DCA slots to be used on Chicago-DCA, it wouldn't surprise me to see FL risk MDW-DCA. There are w
47 FlyMD : This really is sad. ATA used to be my airline of choice at MDW. And they really did offer a great service at reasonable prices. The WN deal really did
48 Contrails : I've never flown TZ, but I'm saddened to hear this news just the same. I always enjoyed seing their 737's (and their 757's until a few years ago) comi
49 Post contains images Pacallen : ATA only has one gate (B26) at Midway. B25 and A3 (used for intl flights/overflow) are city-owned gates. I don't see them giving that one up any time
50 Flyingcat : Exactly why an established LC like FL might be the one to get them. The legacies might want them to add cities not currently served. In DCA US got sl
51 Cubsrule : There's plenty of competition at ORD, where yields are also far better. Low demand and poor yields do not a viable mainline route make.
52 Cubsrule : Sorry, I made a typo in the original post... I see I've confused people. IIRC, the original poster of that rumour is an ex-TZ employee (who has poste
53 LACA773 : What a shame TZ is axing ONT-Hny NL. Any thoughts who might pick this route up? AS, HA, AQ? I'm hoping either HA or AS pick it up. LACA773
54 FlyPNS1 : I don't think the DOT would require these DCA slots to be used for Chicago. In fact, they would probably favor seeing the slots used for less served
55 IFlyATA : Apparently it just never caught on. Marketing put in quite some effort from what I heard in trying to drum up passengers for the flights, including f
56 Pacallen : When TZ went belly up, WN started sucking up all the gates to prevent any competition from moving in (especially FL, who used to have some grand aspi
57 Cubsrule : Yes, but that was 4 years ago. Today, a carrier could have a 20 flight focus city with city gates alone (it would take DL completely moving in with C
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
ATA To Discontinue LGA-HOU posted Wed Apr 18 2007 06:07:43 by ATA767
AA To Launch DCA-LGA-BOS Shuttle posted Thu Jul 18 2002 20:27:47 by B747-437B
WN Using ATA To Test Grounds For LGA Service? posted Wed Apr 26 2006 19:31:46 by LGAtoIND
ATA To Drop LGA-PIE posted Fri Jul 16 2004 06:30:07 by ATA767
ATA To Start LGA-PIE And PIE To SJU! posted Mon Mar 15 2004 00:13:50 by ATA767
ATA To Increase Flights To DCA And MSP posted Tue Aug 26 2003 08:14:40 by Timberwolf24
UA To Discontinue HNL-KIX posted Wed Sep 26 2007 00:12:51 by CALMSP
NW/Pinnacle To Start DSM-LGA Nov. 4 posted Fri Aug 31 2007 07:57:08 by DSMflyer
YX To Discontinue MQT Service posted Wed Aug 29 2007 18:10:02 by N917ME
Air France To Discontinue Daylight JFK CDG posted Mon Aug 13 2007 16:05:16 by HB-IWC