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Allegiant Off To A Strong Start At IWA  
User currently offlineItsnotfinals From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 3281 times:

According to Channel 15 news last night, G4 is saying that first week LF's were 25% above expectations.

I took a trip out to the IWA /AZA terminal the other day and saw that they are already expanding the parking lot into a ramp area and that parking was pretty full.

The gate area for Allegiant looks pretty nice too.

Congrats to G4!

[Edited 2007-11-01 09:54:34]

39 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAsuflyer05 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2372 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 3226 times:

I was surprised to see the number of arizona-based travelers using G4 to get to the midwest. The first few flights out to Cedar Rapids and Sioux Falls were nearly full from what I understand.

User currently offlineFlyPeoria From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 434 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 3208 times:

When the PIA-IWA service was announced G4 planned to use an MD-87, but bookings were high enough that they had to substitute an MD-83, at least on the first "turn" to PIA. I figure additional weekly frequencies will come soon.

User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 3213 times:

If bookings are this good, has US missed something with these communities by not serving them and by not serving DSM with mainline instead of RJs.

MLI/CID/PIA-PHX 2x daily with CR7s or CR9s
DSM-PHX 2x daily with 733 or A319


User currently offlineDbo861 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 888 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 3198 times:

DSM is only served twice daily, one of the two has (once again) been switched to a CR9. I'm sure they'd add frequencies before they'd make it mainline. In recent years, it has had a 3rd frequency..and I remember when I was a kid flying this route on a 737. I actually was lucky enough to fly on one of the Fokker 70 when America West Express first started. Those were the days.

[Edited 2007-11-01 11:31:35]

User currently offlineAirCop From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 3188 times:

I do have to admit it different now having the MD-80's flying over the house on approach to IWA. I figure Allegiant knows what they are doing, and will be successful.

User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 3133 times:

Hopefully, they wont be knocked down by $90 oil, those MD-80s are owned but thirsty.

User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6764 posts, RR: 32
Reply 7, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 3104 times:

Quoting Asuflyer05 (Reply 1):
I was surprised to see the number of arizona-based travelers using G4 to get to the midwest.

The only issue is that unless these folks are paying higher-than-average fares or renting cars or paying baggage fees/buying suff on-board, long-term they're not actually who Allegiant wants on the planes. The airline itself lost about $6.5 million last quarter, but the company as a whole made $9.5 million thanks to $16 million in "ancillary revenue."


User currently offline4holer From United States of America, joined Feb 2002, 3018 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 3040 times:

Saw one of the flights overhead on final the other day and was wondering what the early numbers were; thanks for posting.
Gotta say I loved hearing those Pratts so low over my house!



Ghosts appear and fade away.....................
User currently offlineItsnotfinals From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 3024 times:

Quoting ScottB (Reply 7):
The airline itself lost about $6.5 million last quarter, but the company as a whole made $9.5 million thanks to $16 million in "ancillary revenue."

They didn't lose anything, their business model is all about ancilliary revenue. That is how Ryanair makes their profit and EasyJet too. This is the business model G4 is going for, and it works, why all the negativity?

Allegiant's stock is up 45% in the past 12 months, the market LOVES ancilliary revenue because there is no jet fuel needed to generate that income.

http://ir.allegiantair.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=271984

3Q07 3Q06 Change
Total operating revenue (millions) $86.3 $60.9 41.7 %
Operating income (millions) $9.5 $2.9 230.1 %
Operating margin 11.1 % 4.7 % 6.4pp

Net income (loss) (millions) $7.0 ($1.2) N/M
Diluted earnings per share $0.34 ($0.19) N/M


Scheduled Service:
Ancillary revenue per passenger $21.31 $17.99 18.5 %
Total revenue per ASM (cents) 9.59 8.75 9.6 %

[Edited 2007-11-01 14:34:06]

User currently offlineSkyymarc From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 86 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2958 times:

I grew up in AZ, south of IWA, and hope that G4 continues to do well. When Williams AFB was closed and turned civilian, there where high hopes that it would one day be a convenient alternative to PHX. With all the growth in the East Valley more services are sure to follow. I would certainly give G4 a try if they decide to operate a GSP-IWA flight or from somewhere near CAE. IWA would be a lot easier to get into and out of compared to PHX.

[Edited 2007-11-01 16:29:15]

User currently offlineFlyAZA From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 35 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2934 times:
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Quoting 4holer (Reply 8):
Saw one of the flights overhead on final the other day and was wondering what the early numbers were



Quoting Asuflyer05 (Reply 1):
I was surprised to see the number of arizona-based travelers using G4 to get to the midwest. The first few flights out to Cedar Rapids and Sioux Falls were nearly full from what I understand.

From the aircraft turn that just came in and went out: 100% full flight in from Cedar Rapids, near full out to Sioux Falls.


User currently offlineItsnotfinals From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2934 times:

If someone would start a cheap flight IWA to CMH I would be on it 3 out of 4 weekends in a row.

User currently offlineSkyyMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2924 times:

Allegiant is smart in that they are serving cities from IWA with no service from PHX, with maybe one or two exceptions (I don't have my OAG in front of me - I know there's at least one). I see no reason why they won't make it work just like they have their other focus cities. They know their niche and they serve it well.

User currently offlineTreebeard787 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 660 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2915 times:

I'm sure G4 will successful in the long term from IWA. That east valley area is growing pretty fast right now and it can take a while to get to Sky Harbor from the east valley.
On a side note, I will be trying G4 for the first time on the 30th for a day trip to BIL from IWA, I can't wait.  Big grin



Allons-y!
User currently offlineItsnotfinals From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2907 times:

Good to see G4 proving for all that this model can work and work well.

Hopefully more airlines will be drawn to IWA soon so those of us in the EV don't have to enjoy the I-10 or 101 to the 202 crawl  Smile


User currently offlineJetBlueGuy2006 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1660 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2869 times:

Quoting Treebeard787 (Reply 14):
On a side note, I will be trying G4 for the first time on the 30th for a day trip to BIL from IWA, I can't wait

You'll love it. So simple and easy. When I flew them last year, it was so nice to drive like 5 minutes to LAN and be able to catch a non-stop to Florida.

I am hoping that if they continue to do well, they will announce more cities. I know the economy in Michigan is in the dumps, but I think LAN could potentially be successful in the long run and would love to try them out to IWA/AZA as I have never been there.



Home Airport: Capital Region International Airport (KLAN)
User currently offlineAsuflyer05 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2372 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2795 times:

Quoting FlyAZA (Reply 11):
From the aircraft turn that just came in and went out: 100% full flight in from Cedar Rapids, near full out to Sioux Falls.

FlyAZA, do you know what the DOJ is doing with the 2 MD80s parked at the NW end of taxiway Bravo? I've noticed they are now using Ryan and another charter company for all of their flights.


User currently offlineNational757 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 720 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2785 times:

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 6):
, those MD-80s are owned but thirsty.

Makes you wonder how high fuel prices have to go before owning MD-80 aircraft becomes impractical.

Quoting ScottB (Reply 7):
long-term they're not actually who Allegiant wants on the planes

Right on the money. You can't sell hotels and car rentals to people traveling to Billings and Fargo. Having said that, any seat filled (even with a passenger living in the destination) is still better than an empty seat altogether.

Quoting 4holer (Reply 8):
Gotta say I loved hearing those Pratts so low over my house!

I am sure you were about the only one, LOL  Smile When I worked for G4 at McCarran and heard a screaming loud plane, I didn't even have to look to know it was one of our MD-80s. Gotta love those Pratts on the Mad Dogs!

Quoting Skyymarc (Reply 10):
I would certainly give G4 a try if they decide to operate a GSP-IWA flight

GSP-LAS was a bust for Allegiant, not sure I see them looking at GSP-IWA but you just never know with them.

Quoting Itsnotfinals (Reply 12):
If someone would start a cheap flight IWA to CMH I would be on it 3 out of 4 weekends in a row.

Skybus..Hint Hint..Nudge Nudge  Smile There aren't many sure bets in the aviation business, but I guarantee you many airlines will be watching G4's performance at IWA/AZA very closely. Where Allegiant goes, Skybus is not too far behind. 3 out of 4 weekends to CMH eh?..that's like $60 bucks a month plus taxes. Not bad..just have to be quick to snatch up those $10 fares.

Quoting Treebeard787 (Reply 14):
On a side note, I will be trying G4 for the first time on the 30th for a day trip to BIL from IWA, I can't wait

Enjoy! Be sure to write a trip report! It would be interesting to see what kind of items Allegiant is selling on board flights to Phoenix.



Formula 1 Grand Prix Trips: YUL '08, MEL '09, BCN '10, SIN '11, and LGW '12
User currently offlineAsuflyer05 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2372 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 2740 times:

Quoting National757 (Reply 18):
Skybus..Hint Hint..Nudge Nudge Smile

Let's hope not.  Smile


User currently offlineAlexPorter From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 2737 times:

The Midwest has a lot more ties than you'd think to the Phoenix area. I know at least in my ZIP code in central Tempe, the Midwest is the most common birthplace outside of Arizona (and Mexico). Basically if you take a random person who lives near me, they are more likely to be from the Midwest than California or the West in general. I also ran a ZIP code of just west of IWA and here were the numbers for that area:
"Place of birth for U.S.-born residents:


This state: 3577
Northeast: 394
Midwest: 1760
South: 725
West: 1766"
There it is a bit more evenly split with the West but a majority were born outside of Arizona. Compare that to a typical ZIP code in say suburban Chicago:

"Place of birth for U.S.-born residents:


This state: 36501
Northeast: 4420
Midwest: 8544
South: 3514
West: 2593"
There, a majority of people were born in Illinois, while in Phoenix people tend to be from elsewhere. Essentially PHX should do well for leisure flights to the Midwest and West since a lot of people (about at least one out of every three people) have family ties to such places. My impression is that they will differ from the Vegas flights (where most pax are visitors to Vegas), and will have a lot of people from PHX visiting home or peoples' relatives coming down to visit PHX relatives, etc.

[Edited 2007-11-01 21:17:34]

User currently offlineItsnotfinals From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 2662 times:

Quoting Asuflyer05 (Reply 19):
Let's hope not.

lets hope so!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
why is G4 ok and SX is not?


User currently offlineSkyyMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 2616 times:

Quoting National757 (Reply 18):
GSP-LAS was a bust for Allegiant, not sure I see them looking at GSP-IWA but you just never know with them.

Seems unlikely considering a good portion of GPT travellers are going to casinos. Phoenix is a lot closer to Vegas and Laughlin. Unless they'd try to market it as a beach destination, but even then I would not count on it.


User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6764 posts, RR: 32
Reply 23, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2576 times:

Quoting Itsnotfinals (Reply 9):
They didn't lose anything, their business model is all about ancilliary revenue. That is how Ryanair makes their profit and EasyJet too. This is the business model G4 is going for, and it works, why all the negativity?

It has nothing to do with negativity or criticism of the business model; read what I said again:

Quoting ScottB (Reply 7):
The only issue is that unless these folks are paying higher-than-average fares or renting cars or paying baggage fees/buying suff on-board, long-term they're not actually who Allegiant wants on the planes. The airline itself lost about $6.5 million last quarter, but the company as a whole made $9.5 million thanks to $16 million in "ancillary revenue."

The business model only works due to the ancillary revenue -- which is absolutely fine because the route system is structured to try to maximize the ancillary revenue. The point is that IWA/AZA-based travelers typically won't be contributing much to the ancillary revenue picture; therefore Allegiant needs to get somewhat higher fares (as compared to system average) in order to make flying them worthwhile. Travelers going from other places to IWA/AZA and buying hotel packages/renting cars are the people G4 wants on their planes. Yes, passengers from the Phoenix area will help fill the planes (and cut the loss from the airline operation) but they won't bring in the high-margin ancillary revenue, and that's what G4 builds its business on.

There is a reason why the company is called "Allegiant Travel Company" and not "Allegiant Airlines, Inc." It's the same reason why they don't sell connections.

If G4 needs to rely on, say (as a wild guess), 80-90% IWA/AZA-area originating passengers, the routes probably won't be successful given the way their business model works. If the IWA/AZA-area passengers help fill planes at low points in demand from the outstations, they'll probably be very happy with that.


User currently offlineItsnotfinals From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 2554 times:

Quoting ScottB (Reply 23):
The business model only works due to the ancillary revenue --

That is their business model, just like RyanAir and Easy Jet they Plan on making their profit on ancilliary fees.

G4 had an operating profit of $9.5 Million as posted from the link above , it was the SG&A that would have made a loss.


25 ScottB : Thank you for the selective quoting; isn't that exactly what I said? No need to "validate" against Ryanair or Easy Jet because we can see that Allegi
26 Itsnotfinals : yes the airplane cost supposts the real profit which is ancilliary sales, we are both saying the same thing. the main focus is on bringing people int
27 Post contains images Cerretaman : I saw a G4 land on Runway 12R while I was climbing out in an MPD Warrior on 12L. Pretty cool to watch it land lol. I love IWA...nice airport
28 Asuflyer05 : IWA is so convenient to the folks at Leisure World who want to go visit their families in the MidWest. You go to MPD? Sweet. I'm at ATP out at IWA. Al
29 Luv2cattlecall : Doesn't AA do their maintenance? I'll admit the sales pitches get old, but not much worse that hearing the broken record about getting an airline cre
30 CIDflyer : I've always thought if HP (US) ever came back via PHX it would be successful here at CID. We did have HP in the late 80s/early 90s to PHX and those f
31 FWAERJ : Yes, AA's Tulsa maintenance center does their C/D checks. Still, good to hear that Allegiant's first IWA flights are filling up well. Let's hope that
32 7E72004 : How are the SBN flights doing?
33 HUbsnotDubs : Hey all, 2 questions... 1) Where and when do you think G4 will fly to next out of IWA? and 2) What would have to happen to lure a mainline carrier fro
34 Post contains images Itsnotfinals : It would take a major major snarl at PHX or some other paradigm shift to get any major carrier to start IWA service. WN and US both hub out of PHX an
35 National757 : From what I can tell, looks like LAS and SFB are doing pretty well from SBN while PIE is doing okay. I see Allegiant adding IWA and/or FLL during the
36 Post contains images Floridaflyboy : Hey, enjoy your flight on G4, and enjoy my hometown!!
37 CIDflyer : I am hoping G4 will add CID-FLL in their next expansion round. There was an article in the news here that they expect it to be added sometime down the
38 JetBlueGuy2006 : I would hope that list comes true. Looking up Faremeasure: The catch area for LAN (FNT, MBS, AZO, LAN) There is 145 daily between them and PHX When y
39 Itsnotfinals : Faremeasure reports total r/t daily traffic, so it more like 73 a day each way, but with the right price point this number could grow very quickly fo
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