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Official Dubai 2007 Airshow: Airbus Thread  
User currently offlineModerators From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 514 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 52821 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

The much awaited 10th Dubai Airshow is upon us and we have decided it would be appropriate to run 3 Official threads on the major LoI / MoU / Order announcements and one for any engine selections announced.

You can find the official Dubai airshow details at the following link

Dubai Airshow 2007

This thread is for Airbus announcements, below are links to the Homepage, Official Event Site and Press Release Site

Airbus Home Page Airbus Official Event Site Press Release Site

We ask that you refer to the following 2 links for Boeing and Powerplants

Official Dubai 2007 Airshow: Boeing Thread

Official Dubai 2007 Airshow: Engine Thread

Additionally, we realise that many Military Contracts may be announced. We ask that those be posted in our Military Aviation & Space Forum

The purpose of these threads is to keep a daily tabulation on any announcements made and to keep seperate each companies announcements. Though we understand there will be split orders, having the official threads should make it a lot easier to track orders for each OEM and make for a good reference for the future of the site.

We do realise that there will / may be major orders announced given recent speculation and some media reports. Therefore, if an order is announced and listed here, by a New A380 / 747-8 Operator, a Major A350 / B787 Commitment or by a carrier of regional or strategic importance, it should be entitled to it's own seperate thread. We ask that order be posted here with a link to the relevent thread and a link back to this thread, that way a free and open discussion can be had on EK, QR, GF or whoever, without overwhelming the official threads.

In relation to Regional orders such as ATR, Bombardier, Embraer and Sukhoi etc or any developments of new frames or further news of R&D in existing projects please feel free to go ahead and post as normal.

Some news may well be worth posting in our Tech / Ops Forum

Any enquiries please direct to moderators@airliners.net on behalf of the Moderating Crew we thank you for your assistance. It's a good week for aviation, let's make it a good week for the Forum.

[Edited 2007-11-08 01:25:21]


Please use moderators@airliners.net to contact us.
281 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 61
Reply 1, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 52638 times:

GF - I'd like to see a load of A350s for them. I think an A350 and A320 fleet would suit them really well.


What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineWINGS From Portugal, joined May 2005, 2831 posts, RR: 68
Reply 2, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 52560 times:

I think this rightfully belongs in this thread.  Smile

Yemenia Places $2 Billion Order for Airbus Jetliners.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...=conews&tkr=BA:US&sid=aQvzACzwTovY

By Massoud A. Derhally

Nov. 7 (Bloomberg) -- Yemenia, the national airline of Yemen, said it ordered Airbus SAS A350 jetliners with a value of more than $2 billion at list prices and that the planes represent better value than Boeing Co.'s rival 787 Dreamliner.

Yemenia agreed to buy 10 A350 widebody planes two months ago and will make a formal announcement at the Dubai Air Show next week, Chairman Abdulkalek al-Kadi said in an interview.

''The A350 is a very competitive airplane with the 787 and the financial offer was better for us,'' al-Kadi said from Sanaa, Yemen's capital. ''They will replace the existing fleet and we expect our delivery six to seven years from now.''

Regards,
Wings



Aviation Is A Passion.
User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 61
Reply 3, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 52275 times:

Right so - who do I think is going to order Airbus at Dubai? Forgive the shameless speculation but I think these all have a chance:


Emirates - A350s, A333s (already announced I think) but I think they may also go for A332F.
Sri Lankan to get some of the EK A350s.
Air Asia - more A320s.
Gulf Air - A350s.
Air Arabia - more A320s
Aegean - more A320s (unless they did earlier this year I cant remember)
Turkish - A350s.
PIA Pakistan - A320s and A321s.
Oman Air - A350s.
Jazeera - more A320s.
Jet Airways - A380s.
Etihad - Newbuild A320s and A321s. Maybe A350s.
RAK - A332s.
Tarom - A320s.
Air Madagascar - A332s.
Thai - A350s and A321s.



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineFCKC From France, joined Nov 2004, 2348 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 52091 times:

CHRISBA777ER

Did you hear something about Air Madagascar getting A332s ?It's new to me they are thinking at this plane .


User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 61
Reply 5, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 51949 times:

Quoting FCKC (Reply 4):
CHRISBA777ER

Did you hear something about Air Madagascar getting A332s ?It's new to me they are thinking at this plane .

I dont have anyone in Air Madagascar and havent ever spoken to them actually, but as i understand it they are State-backed, and AF has a small share. They used to use the 742 but it was too big but the 767-300ER must be at its payload limit at that range to CDG/MRS etc. Its a very long flight! I bet they carry a lot of cargo on that route as well and I think the A332 is a better fit. Similar operating costs but better cargo uplift capacity and more seats down the back for the low-yielding stuff that they probably view as a public service. They are one of those airlines I've had my eye on for a new Airbus order for the last few years and I think it is bound to happen eventually. Question is if it will happen now or later.



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineChiad From Norway, joined May 2006, 1188 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 51776 times:

[quote=CHRISBA777ER,reply=3]Forgive the shameless speculation but I think these all have a chance:

 Big grin
I forgive you!


User currently offlineAutoThrust From Switzerland, joined Jun 2006, 1610 posts, RR: 9
Reply 7, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 51031 times:

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 3):
Gulf Air - A350s.

Don't think that Gulf Air can afford to buy some A350 at the moment. And now that Andre Dose gone i don't expect the financial situation to get better. Please feel free to correct me.



“Faliure is not an option.”
User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 50996 times:

On the previous show Dubai airshow Airbus did the now famous steep & slow routine for the first time



will there be any A380 orders on this show?


User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 61
Reply 9, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 50980 times:

Quoting AutoThrust (Reply 7):
Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 3):
Gulf Air - A350s.

Don't think that Gulf Air can afford to buy some A350 at the moment. And now that Andre Dose gone i don't expect the financial situation to get better. Please feel free to correct me.

They are wholly-owned by a ministry of the Bahraini Government - yes they most certainly can afford to buy new planes. The restructuring and cost cutting is part of a wider improvement programme. It isnt about financial difficulties, it is about making the airline competitive - They will get the A350.



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12181 posts, RR: 51
Reply 10, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 50705 times:

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 10):
It isnt about financial difficulties, it is about making the airline competitive - They will get the A350.

So, how do you know they will select the A-350? They can become just as competitive buy buying the B-787, too.


User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 61
Reply 11, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 50459 times:

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 11):
Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 10):
It isnt about financial difficulties, it is about making the airline competitive - They will get the A350.

So, how do you know they will select the A-350? They can become just as competitive buy buying the B-787, too.

Touchy. LOL  Wink

I never said they wouldnt be competitive with the 787. In fact I never mentioned the 787 - perhaps that is the problem?

I said they would get the A350 in my opinion. Theres a load of reasons why they would likely favour the A350, but I agree with you that the 787 would also be great for them. A bunch of Trent-powered 788s would do just as well, but I think the commonality thing with the A332 and A320 fleets which are likely to still be in service when they get their new widebodies, and their long-standing relationship with Airbus means they may well favour the A350.

If you want another excuse, I would surmise that there is a lot more European investment in Bahrain than there in US investment, so you've got your political angle covered there.



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineScouseflyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 3403 posts, RR: 9
Reply 12, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 50345 times:

Quoting Keesje (Reply 9):
will there be any A380 orders on this show?

IMHO - we'll at least see the firming of the 8 EK signed a MoU for at Paris and a couple of the posters in the know on this board hinted that there would be a new A380 order after the BA one and it wasn't the Marsans order that they expected............


User currently offlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12970 posts, RR: 25
Reply 13, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 50195 times:

Quoting Keesje (Reply 9):
On the previous show Dubai airshow Airbus did the now famous steep & slow routine for the first time

It's kind of like watching a fat lady dancing...



Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 61
Reply 14, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 50150 times:

Quoting Scouseflyer (Reply 13):
Quoting Keesje (Reply 9):
will there be any A380 orders on this show?

IMHO - we'll at least see the firming of the 8 EK signed a MoU for at Paris and a couple of the posters in the know on this board hinted that there would be a new A380 order after the BA one and it wasn't the Marsans order that they expected............

I've not heard anything I have to say. Usually I get an inkling or tiny hint but the only one I've heard of is CX and thats not happening till the new year

[Edited 2007-11-08 07:04:23]


What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineScouseflyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 3403 posts, RR: 9
Reply 15, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 49998 times:

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 15):
I've not heard anything I have to say. Usually I get an inkling or tiny hint but the only one I've heard of is CX and thats not happening till the new year

That's a shame - looks like they've shot their A380 bolt for this year, we'll just have to settle for a stampede of XWB orders Big grin


User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 61
Reply 16, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 49819 times:

Quoting Scouseflyer (Reply 16):
That's a shame - looks like they've shot their A380 bolt for this year, we'll just have to settle for a stampede of XWB orders

I still think they'll buy it but alas, not this year.



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 31436 posts, RR: 85
Reply 17, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 49529 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 10):
It isnt about financial difficulties, it is about making the airline competitive - They will get the A350.

Agreed.

EK wants capacity and for the moment, the A350 is going to be the plane that most competitively offers it in 2015. So it's logical they will choose it for both that reason, just as they have been buying 77Ws by the score as of late because the plane that most competitively offers it in 2007.


User currently offlineArt From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 3398 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 49455 times:

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 15):
Quoting Scouseflyer (Reply 13):
Quoting Keesje (Reply 9):
will there be any A380 orders on this show?

IMHO - we'll at least see the firming of the 8 EK signed a MoU for at Paris and a couple of the posters in the know on this board hinted that there would be a new A380 order after the BA one and it wasn't the Marsans order that they expected............

I've not heard anything I have to say. Usually I get an inkling or tiny hint but the only one I've heard of is CX and thats not happening till the new year

Was it not CX that ten days or so ago said no VLA (pax?) order for another 2 years? Sorry if I've got it wrong.


User currently offlineMoo From Falkland Islands, joined May 2007, 4089 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 49358 times:

Quoting Art (Reply 19):
Was it not CX that ten days or so ago said no VLA (pax?) order for another 2 years? Sorry if I've got it wrong.

'No plans for the A380 or the 787 in the next few years' was actually what was said, more or less.


User currently offlineSandroZRH From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 49301 times:

What about AI? I know that the chances of them announcing a possible A380 order that soon is small, but it's a chance.

User currently offlineKL808 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 1585 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 49208 times:

Im hoping the A380 order will come from NH.

Drew



AMS-LAX-MNL
User currently offline797charter From Denmark, joined Jun 2005, 219 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 48890 times:

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 3):
Jet Airways - A380s.

That would be a great surprise to me!

They have been talking about a bunch of A320's I think(?)



Regards

Steen



Keep it clear of the propellers
User currently offlineYOWza From Canada, joined Jul 2005, 4919 posts, RR: 15
Reply 23, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 47774 times:

Guys let's try keep this on topic and leave politics out of this please.

Does anyone else think Air Arabia will make an order? I think this would be their show of choice to announce one.

YOWza



12A whenever possible.
User currently offlineScbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12897 posts, RR: 46
Reply 24, posted (7 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 47464 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting YOWza (Reply 28):
Does anyone else think Air Arabia will make an order? I think this would be their show of choice to announce one.

They already told us they will place an order at the show for between 34 and 50 planes. All they didn't tell us was, which ones.



Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana! #44cHAMpion
25 YOWza : Well they only operate 320s so I would be very surprised to see the venture away from that model or at the very least the 320 family. YOWza
26 AirbusCanada : there was some post here about Venezuelean Carrier Conviasa announceing an order for ten 330s. Anyone has any info on that? conviasa is currently oper
27 LH506 : And Boeing has an UFO for 34 738s booked end of September...coincidence???
28 Post contains images Scbriml : We'll find out in just a few days!
29 Aircellist : They must be having so much fun performing that!...
30 Post contains images A5XX : So big, yet, so graceful. A5XX
31 PanAm_DC10 : Moderator Note That would be the preferred thank you.
32 Post contains links and images Scbriml : Airbus's Dubai 2007 site is here: http://www.airbus.com/en/myairbus/events/dubai_2007/index.html Looks like it's just about ready, but no link to it f
33 Beaucaire : The French Financial paper "La Tribune" reports that EK are poised to place an order for about 100 aircraft with Airbus- most likely 50+50 A350's,30 A
34 Moo : Here are a list of notable press conferences that may be of some interest - I shall post it in both threads: Airbus Sunday 3.00pm - Conference Room A
35 Post contains links Lumberton : Yes, the news is starting to leak. Here's a report from Reuters. This confirms what a few of us have been saying all along: this deal was going to th
36 BestWestern : Interesting leak... sounds right though.
37 Post contains images Stitch : Another 20 A388s? Amazing... JL wasn't kidding when he said he'd sell 700 of them. He just omitted that they'd all be going to EK.
38 Post contains images Astuteman : If so, won't that make around 50 net orders for the programme this year? That'll be full production completely wiped out until early 2014, if my calc
39 Stitch : There never was going to be a 748I order, so I can only guess the threat of it knocked down the A388's price as EK expected. Kind of surprised they d
40 Post contains images Astuteman : They got plenty of time to grab the other 25... Regards
41 Jack : Of interest are the changes made with a recent update to the above (on the official web site). Airbus previously had listed Monday Room C 4pm, but th
42 EI321 : Mine is still listing Le bourget for some reason. Honestly, I cant see why EK are so eagar to have over 70 of these things on order before they even
43 Stitch : My best guess is they want to grab as big a share of the market connecting North America, South America, Europe, Asia and Oceania as they possibly ca
44 Lumberton : Unfortunately, Dubai--wonderful as its attractions are--simply doesn't bring to the table the same market that the U.S. and Europe do. But that's a m
45 SandroZRH : So did mine, then i removed and re-installed it and now it's working fine.
46 Scbriml : The majority of EK's passengers are going somewhere else. The UAE will sign an "open skies" agreement with anyone that's interested. Complete recipro
47 Stitch : Bingo. (We need a cigar emoticon). When two countries announce an Open Skies pack that are pretty far apart (like, say, the US and India in 2005), th
48 Lumberton : Does EK have unlimited rights to the EU now?
49 LTU932 : No. One example of that is that EK is trying to get rights to fly to TXL and STR (correct me if I'm wrong about those airports being in question thou
50 Flysherwood : Except that now that the long range aircraft are available to directly fly between India and the USA, who is going to want to stop in Dubai? I can un
51 Post contains images Scbriml : I don't think with the whole EU (yet). I think they do with UK (judging by the number of destinations and flights each week).
52 Stitch : You answered your own question. If they have to connect, anyway, why not save the most money doing it? A DXB stop will be quicker then a SIN or HKG s
53 FCKC : La Tribune also wrote , Airbus is expecting a great show............for them ! They should reveal the name of the first A380VIP customer , which refer
54 Cricket : My (very very reliable) sources tell me it is Prince Alwaleed Bin Talal who has ordered the A380VIP plane!
55 SSTsomeday : If there are going to be two threads to keep track of Boeing and Airbus orders, especially this close to years end, with competition mounting, I hope
56 Post contains images Scbriml : Oh dear, we were all getting along so well! It's very easy to keep track of the orders, Hamlet69 does an excellent job in his order threads. Airbus d
57 HAWK21M : Are there Any proposed Indian Aviation orders. Thanks. regds MEL
58 Post contains images Scbriml : We were hoping you'd tell us!
59 Post contains images Baroque : And even if there were/are not - so what? How about including cancellations up to, oh say end April 2008. I guess there will be some, but we are not
60 Post contains links PanAm_DC10 : Could the following report have finally revealed part of what many expect......... Airbus snatches Gulf order Dominic O’Connell - Financial Times AI
61 JetBlueGuy2006 : Probably, while I like Boeing and Airbus...I am kind of wondering if they mean the 100 a/c order is the blow or the 50 A350's? If it is just the 350'
62 PM : Unless it is W A Y more than "100 aircraft" this makes no sense. An average cost per plane of $1 billion?!
63 SSTsomeday : I stand to be corrected, but this is not what was reported on Airwise. I also understood that one company records orders when they are more "statemen
64 PanAm_DC10 : Indeed, I think the reporter was meaning to quote all business done at the show in US$ value terms. Thus the re-direct to Non-Aviation. No more on th
65 DL767captain : When will they stop comparing the 787 to the A350? The only comparison is the A350-800 and the 787-900 but there havent been many orders for the A358
66 Iwok : I wonder if EK is going to announce all their orders today, or will they spread it out. I'm still hoping for a 748i, but the chances seem grim. iwok
67 PanAm_DC10 : Official: Emirates Order the following; 1: 3 x A388 new orders 2: 8 x A388 orders re-affirmed from Le Bourget 3: 70 x A350s Firm 4: 50 x A350 Options
68 Iwok : WOW!!!! Thats what I call a mega order. 70 Firm, plus 50 options is very impressive, and much more that I thought. Congrats to Airbus and EK. iwok
69 HummingBird : Congrats to both EK and Airbus.
70 ANstar : Wow... nice order the A350.... how many orders are there now for the 350?
71 Beaucaire : Congratulations to Airbus and EK.... Now the pressure grows for GE to jump on the project !
72 Post contains images PM : I make it 334 but that includes MOUs, LOIs, IOUs and sundry other vague promises. No mention of A330s?
73 Ba6590 : Hi everyone this is my first post on a.net, i have been reading this forum for years and have finally decided to take part. This really is a huge orde
74 Airbuske : Congrats to EK and Airbus. The XWB is going to be a wonderful a/c family to fly in.
75 KL808 : HOLY COW. WOW congrats to EK and Airbus. Drew
76 Post contains images Scbriml : Nice. PanAm_DC10, Do you know if these are all firm, or MOU or LOI? My guess now is that EK are still going to order the 748i, since they were talkin
77 Post contains links Scbriml : Hitting the news now: http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...601087&sid=aopfnzNjDKXg&refer=home I can't wait to hear Andrea's friend's comments on thi
78 Beaucaire : those were always considered leasing-aircraft to be ordered through one of the major lessors..
79 QatarA340 : The Emirates 787/350 race is finally over! Although expected, it is still exciting to see the A350 gaining momentum 7 years before first delievery!!
80 KL808 : Is the EK order for additional A380's what Airbus was talking about for additional orders or is there going to be another order? Drew
81 Scbriml : I think it's far from impossible that EK could still end up ordering 787s. We need to see which models of A350 they've ordered.
82 Slz396 : Interesting to note too how EK keeps on signing EVERY A380 slot that comes free. They had announced 8 at Paris, but in the mean time wasn't it QR who
83 Post contains images PM : Care to bet on the -1000?
84 Post contains links Scbriml : I'm sure they will take the -1000 (so no bet), but I'm interested to know if it's just that model. This report says deliveries starting in 2014, and,
85 Post contains images Scbriml : When the airlines stop comparing them in response to RFPs I guess. Well, Boeing has clearly stated they will release a -10, so there will be even mor
86 WestWing : EK's fleet of 58 A380-800s would now be the largest fleet of a single wide body model, passing BAs fleet of 57 744s.
87 Post contains links Scbriml : No. Both manufacturers only list firm, signed orders on their O&D websites. Airbus: http://www.airbus.com/en/presscentre/ (see Excel spreadsheet link
88 Ikramerica : AA has 58 767-300ER DL has 59 767-300ER Granted, 1 A388 equals 2 763s, but still, 763s are widebodies...
89 Post contains links PanAm_DC10 : The Emirates order, taking them to having the largest commitment to date for the A350 Program warrants a thread of it's own. There are more orders to
90 Slz396 : Not to forget that QR and EK will have bigger A350 fleets once all planes will be delivered to them too.. But then again, at the pace EK keeps on pla
91 Cloudyapple : With the kind of repeat orders Emirates have placed with the A388, we may even see them converting some of the 50 A350 options into firm order before
92 Sirtoby : Good question!!! If you consider the day of the first order for each plane, the A350XWB is in the lead. Take firm orders only: A350XWB stands at 276
93 Slz396 : EK just announced they have signed for RR engines too, BTW! GE really is the big looser here, for holding on to their GE90 way too long! Guess that i
94 PM : Can't agree. GE will be selling GE90s in significant numbers for another five years (or more) and building them for another ten. Even beyond that the
95 Victor009 : Hi Guys, here is the order breakdown for Emirates A350 order 50 A350-900s, 20 A350-1000s, plus 50 options for the A350-900s. The first A350 to be deli
96 PanAm_DC10 : Airbus announce the first sale of a Corporate Jet to C JET. It'll be a good show for some of the larger Corporate Jets Regards, PanAm_DC10
97 Flymad : Same goes for PIA I think!
98 Cloudyapple : Useless statistics corner! B787 first order was in April 2004 (42 months ago). 736 orders in 42 months = 17.5/month A350XNB first order in December 20
99 Post contains images Victor009 : you must be really bored to do that stats, good one anyway, tells you how good XWB is
100 PM : Perhaps "useless" but endless fun!
101 Victor009 : I read a article on Airliners world mag that Airbus has offered Gulf air some really good deal, so i think we are going to see more XWB orders. GF ha
102 MEA330 : PanAm_DC10 Any info regarding the ACJ order if C Jet is a Middle East based operator, and when is delivery expected?
103 PanAm_DC10 : It's actually for a Hong Kong indivudual. C-JET is the name of their Company to run it and it will be maintained by BAA Jet Management of HK on behal
104 PanAm_DC10 : N.A.S. National Air Services of Saudi Arabia have firmed their commitment from Le Bourget for 20 x A320s Source: Airbus
105 Post contains images Thorben : Incredible, I have to say that. 120 A350s. who was expecting that? And their A380 number now stands at 58 However, Tim Clark has been a very vocal cr
106 Post contains images OA260 : WOW .......A fantastic start to the show. Congrats to Airbus and EK.
107 Scbriml : Nice to see that one firmed.
108 Flying-Tiger : Reading this Press Release indicates that BAA Jet Management has added one A318Elite to its orderbook: Airbus O&D table only shows one A319CJ so far.
109 Post contains links Scbriml : Confirmation from Airbus that EK's order is firm: http://www.airbus.com/en/presscentre...s/07_11_11_emirates_a380_a350.html And C-Jet's ACJ: http://ww
110 Post contains images Moo : " target=_blank>http://www.airbus.com/en/presscentre....html Interestingly enough, the title of the page says 'Emirates Airline buys 65 Airbus A350s a
111 Post contains links Scbriml : And now the NAS A320 order: http://www.airbus.com/en/presscentre...items/07_11_11_a320family_nas.html
112 Post contains links Flying-Tiger : As previously indicated it is for 20+18 A32X: http://www.airbus.com/en/presscentre...items/07_11_11_a320family_nas.html
113 Col : I wonder if EK is getting any fuel burn/trip cost details from SQ unit?
114 Post contains images Scbriml : So, have I got this right? Airbus tally for day 1: 70 x A350 EK 11 x A380 EK 20 x A320 NAS 1 x ACJ C-Jet 1 x Elite BAA Jet Management Not a bad start.
115 Moo : Not a bad start at all, it takes Airbus well over their 20 A380 orders, and 200 A350XWB orders predicted for this year. Its also cemented their best
116 Columba : I was hoping too see a picture of the A350 with the A380 styled nose the picture still shows the old design.
117 Post contains images CXfirst : E-mail that to EK and I'm sure they'll be quick to order at least 2 more Heck, they might even confirm 10 options of the A350-900, so they have the l
118 B747forever : Wow, that is really great for the A350 and Airbus. That is really good job by Airbus. Think that they are most proud over the huge A350 order.
119 ENU : A question for the well-informed members: are there any signs that Arik Air (Nigeria) will announce an Airbus-order during the show? Thanks!
120 CXfirst : I think that they should have held this announcement until the end, what a great ending to an airshow would that have been. And absolutely everyone he
121 Scbriml : EK likes to make its announcements at Dubai on the first day when all the VVIPs are present. Last year they announced their big 77W order.
122 Post contains images CXfirst : Kinda is a blow. Now we know that there won't be anymore big big big orders.... come on guys.....let's pack up and go home, nothing more to see -CXfi
123 Columba : Don´t forget the huge number of 777s EK is having, too. All these aircraft EK has in its fleet or on order is amazing and has never been seen befo
124 Post contains images SandroZRH : So the EK order is finally in the sack, congrats!! Great way to wake up at 3pm Is that local time?
125 Scbriml : Yes.
126 SandroZRH : Thank you. So that's CET+3, if i aint mistaken?
127 Kaitak : So, what happened to the mooted A330 order? I thought that was going to accompany the A350 deal?
128 Post contains links HawkerCamm : Excellent day for Airbus. 70 A350XWB firm orders 11 A380 firm orders http://www.airbus.com/en/presscentre...s/07_11_11_emirates_a380_a350.html And let
129 Post contains images Stitch : With some 500 pending... [EDIT] - Actually, that 1100 must include those 500 pending... Still, 1100 is a great showing. Another 1000+ year order book
130 Ikramerica : Actually, these are pending too until they appear on the airbus website. But they are as good as firm. Yep. in terms of the "single model" thing, EK
131 Thorben : And not even 500 deliveries. Hm, I don't want to ruin the party, but I'm afraid civil aviation won't develop like that forever.
132 Stitch : Nope, it has to stop at some time. I think we will need to see consolidation in the North American marketplace first (the Big Six US carriers becomin
133 Airbazar : Why does it have to stop? More and more people are traveling by plane. All of these large orders will eventually have to be replaced by something new
134 SandroZRH : Because aviation is a very unstable business. Whenever there is a crisis in economy, aviation is one of the first affected, because people will alway
135 Post contains links Flying-Tiger : Airbus has raised its A350XWB sales forecast: < http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/...les/newstex/AFX-0013-20897767.htm>
136 SSTsomeday : " target=_blank>http://active.boeing.com/commercial/...ash=y Thank you. I will check those out. So where did all the controversy / confusion regarding
137 Lumberton : Given the 70 firm announced today, and what's on Airbus' O & D spreadsheet, they are just about at 300.
138 Stitch : The biggest point of contention was that Airbus counted 150 Airbus A320 family orders for China in 2005 which allowed them to pip Boeing for the #1 s
139 N14AZ : Sorry, but I didn't find any pictures from the air show. Which A380 did Airbus bring? Did you they paint it in EK cls again? Second question: how many
140 Post contains images FRNT787 : "Fly the Brand New Emirates B-2" I agree, despite an admitted Boeing bias. Maybe there is still hope for the 787 as an A-330 replacement, afterall I
141 Acheron : Any idea of the rumored Conviasa order for A330's and A320's?
142 Carls : Welcome !! AFAIK they should annunce their order in Dubai. Let's see.
143 Post contains links FCKC : http://www.aerospacemedia.com/site/a...p.php?Id=071111174610.uyzprpt2.xml Saudi Arabian Al will buy A320s.No number of units mentionned , and not sure
144 Asiaflyer : Monday Dubai Airshows kicks off with Dubai Aerospace announcing to sign Letter of Intent to buy up to 100 Airbus planes. A350 and A320 mentioned. Wort
145 CXfirst : Heres why: If they have 1000 orders, and only 500 deliveries, then the back log will become too big, and every major airline will have in the orders
146 Asiaflyer : To add some more info to the Dubai Aerospace deal. The LoI consist of 70 A320 and 30 A350XWB the company confirmed.
147 Post contains links PanAm_DC10 : Delivery is from 2013 through to 2022. They have another announcement today too DUBAI, Nov 12 (Reuters) - State-owned Dubai Aerospace Enterprise said
148 Post contains images SandroZRH : Don't they have press conference live streams like they had from LBG? I loved those If yes, where?
149 ETStar : Saudia getting Airbus? Well, seems like Bush, unlike Clinton, is not working hard at delivering personal pitches to sell Boeing aircraft to the King a
150 Post contains links Thorben : http://www.finanznachrichten.de/nach...ichten-2007-11/artikel-9440805.asp DAE Capital? I didn't know that company before. But surely a nice order. 70
151 PanAm_DC10 : They have only recently been formed, as in the past 2 years. They have 100 Boeing's to order too. Also of note Airbus executives are holding a briefi
152 Post contains links Asiaflyer : DEA is the company that placed the 1.8 Billion USD bid for Auckland Airport in September. A little more info about them on this link. http://www.bloo
153 Ikramerica : 15 year time frame? Talk about a paper order. Why would anyone order planes 15 years in advance?
154 Post contains links Flying-tiger : Expected to be 22+8 firm from Airbus plus 20+10 to be leased from GE according to this report: http://yahoo.reuters.com/news/articl...12_L12502279&ty
155 Scouseflyer : Cos they're a leasing company and they see a market for these planes over the next 15 years - I'd also imagine that the A320 orders will be convertab
156 Columba : Interesting, will be interesting who else will buy the A350. I can think of QF, as they recently stated that they are in serious talks with Airbus. S
157 Asiaflyer : Saudi Arabian Airlines will announce the pruchase of 22 A320 on monday with an option to buy 8 more, al-Eqtisadiah newspaper reported. It will also le
158 SandroZRH : And if LH is to order it, LX should be a given. I can see an order of about 30 for LX. Although I don't expect an order by neither of both for this a
159 Post contains images Danny : Congratulations to Airbus for all those orders. Looks like my forecast of 1500 orders this year might prove an underestimate
160 Beaucaire : They might be driven into earlier orders if other airlines keep ordering to an extent,that required delivery slots would be too far out..
161 Columba : Buchholz stated that they could place an order by the end of this year. I think they have to. The A340-300s need to be replaced around 2015 and with
162 Burkhard : Basically, with a backlog of 3000 planes, and a production of below 500, they are sold out for 6 years. So if you want a plane in 2015, better purchas
163 Post contains images PanAm_DC10 : Airbus Confirm that Saudi Arabia's Prince Al - Waleed Orders an Airbus A380 Flying Palace. to the member who called that! Regards, PanAm_DC10
164 Scouseflyer : I was just doing some quick maths, based on the various annoucenments that have been made over the last year, Airbus predicts their eventual producti
165 Post contains images Asturias : Wow. That's a major boost for Airbus. Congratulations!!! The A380 is flying and gathering new orders and the 350XWB has become a success. After all th
166 Post contains images Danny : He must have missed recent announcements. They are already above that.
167 Burkhard : Isn't the final number of A320s built in Europe 36 ( plus China )? And I do not expect the A330 to remain in production when A350s roll out, Airbus I
168 LY777 : So, what is the total Airbus firm orders for 2007?
169 Post contains links PanAm_DC10 : Loaded question really, what's listed on their O&D Spreadsheet is firm but we need that to be updated, it currently stands at 854 through to the end
170 Danny : We will need to wait for their spreadsheet to be updated but roughly and gross: 845 to September + firm orders announced since: Wizz 50 US 92 Tiger 30
171 Post contains images PanAm_DC10 : Preliminary Order (in other words, "we need to finalise it", confirmed as follows: 22 x A320 firm plus 8 Options 20 x A320s to be leased via GECAS Th
172 OA260 : Yes its amazing turn around by Airbus and credit is due to them.
173 PanAm_DC10 : Air Arabia confirm the following with Airbus; 34 x A320 Firm, and 15 x A320 Options Source Airbus and Air Arabia Regards, PanAm_DC10
174 Beaucaire : .now that was the confirmation of a previous LOI ?
175 PanAm_DC10 : No. Air Arabia was expected to make an order and the A320 was favoured. They are the only listed carrier in the Persian Gulf, if IIRC, and when they
176 Post contains images EI321 : Im pretty sure that that number will have to rise to 10/month with the rate at which A330 orders are coming in this year. All year I've been predicti
177 Post contains links EI321 : http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...200-airbus-and-boeing-aircaft.html wow!!!!!
178 Columba : Well the A300 stayed in production although the A330 came out. The A330F is just launched and will stay in production for some years also the A350 is
179 Post contains links PanAm_DC10 : Airbus Targets Record Annual Orders After Dubai Boost Nov. 12 (Bloomberg) -- Airbus SAS, the world's biggest planemaker, forecast record orders this y
180 Revelation : Call me a pessimist, but I don't quite understand the perspective. Nothing wrong at all? A380 is still a huge drag on the balance sheegt and hundreds
181 Post contains images Stitch : Phenomenal work, Airbus. 1100 to 1200 orders is impressive even in the current climate of amazing sales. I do agree Airbus will likely try and boost p
182 OA260 : I wouldnt say ''nothing wrong at all'' either but Its certainly 100% better than the doom and gloom 12 months ago!! So things are looking bright for
183 Moo : It shouldn't be that hard, Airbus has 1021 gross orders to end of October and that doesn't include: EK - 70 A350-XWB EK - 11 A380 NAS - 20 A320 Air A
184 Revelation : No more major issues? Aren't the ones I'm listing enough? IMHO Airbus's crisis mode will not end till it books enough orders for A380 to break even a
185 SandroZRH : True, but they have a comfortable schedule to do so and to be ready when production begins, unlike Boeing with their supplier problems based on their
186 SSTsomeday : Thanks for your post!
187 Stitch : My pleasure.
188 Jdevora : I just saw that Airbus updated the spreadsheet today they list 1021 gross orders til 31st October Cheers JD
189 OA260 : Thats fine we will agree to disagree. Only time will prove either you or me right but I think Airbus will have a bright future and the A380 and A350X
190 Scbriml : Yes, but they do have 99 cancellations this year (mainly due to the way they've handled A350-A350XWB conversions). Interestingly, their net total at
191 FlyingAY : If you're feeling bored you could probably entertain yourself by reading the predictions that a.net readers and writers made here in threads early 20
192 Post contains images Scbriml : You're asking us? The official website shows Airbus has 4 on Wednesday: 10:00, 11:30, 14:00, 15:00 (Dubai time) It also shows one on Thursday (end of
193 OA260 : LOL...its ok there is a wall with some paint on it that I think I will watch it dry LOL.... So what are we expecting in the way of orders for tomorro
194 Post contains images Moo : Isn't it Tuesday tomorrow?
195 Flying-Tiger : Airbus press conference schedule on Tuesday, 13th: 10:00 am 11:30 am 02:00 pm 03:00 pm
196 Thorben : What? Four press conferences? What are going to announce at all those? Maybe another A380 order? Air India or Cathay Pacific? I suspect the A380 orde
197 OA260 : An A320 order by OA would make my day LOL......
198 Post contains images SandroZRH : Hell will freeze over before OA can get enough cash for new planes
199 Anax : well , you never know with us Greeks.....
200 Post contains images SandroZRH : True, you also managed to win the Football Euro without Football skills
201 PADSpot : You don't need football skills, if you have Rehakles.
202 Post contains images OA260 : You keep making the Lindt chocolates and playing the Tennis !!!! The Greeks will stay with the football LOL... If OA do eventually order a few new A/
203 Post contains links PanAm_DC10 : The D.A.E. announcement warrants it's own thread and discussion given the sheer magnitude of their announcents. Feel free to discuss that in the follo
204 Post contains images Astuteman : Congratulations to Airbus, and to TC for finally coming off the pot.. IMO A380 being far from break-even matters not one jot - the money's gone. What
205 Revelation : Let's not go off with A vs B, shall we? As does saying that nothing's wrong at all. I'm glad everyone's happy, but let's not get carried away with th
206 Asiaflyer : Dubai airshows first airbus order on tuesday is an order from Oman Air to buy five A330 aircrafts. More details to follow soon. Source: Reuters
207 Asiaflyer : Next announcement to expect today is from Yemenia. They are expected to firm up their A350XWB commitment. As rumoured they will place a firm order for
208 PanAm_DC10 : Consisting of the following; 2 x A330-200s 3 x A330-300s Oman Air has yet to make an engine selection. Regards, PanAm_DC10
209 SSTsomeday : I would also opine that: 1) The delayed 380, which has morphed into a scaled back delivery schedule for the first few years, still has to pay back a
210 FlyingAY : That is of course true, but considering that their production lines for current models are fully booked currently for couple of years I wouldn't worr
211 PanAm_DC10 : Which is exactly what Yemania and Airbus just did. Regards, PanAm_DC10
212 Post contains links IAD787 : Yemenia Orders 10 A350, 5 A330s for Oman Air DUBAI -- Airbus and Yemenia-Yemen Airways have announced a firm order for 10 A350-800 XWB aircraft. They
213 Ikramerica : Was that an order in 2006, or an LOI/MOU?
214 Moo : LoI/MoU as far as I know - for 6 aircraft. Thus this is a full order for 10 aircraft and no conversions from the old type.
215 Post contains images WINGS : Maybe you would like to edit that small typo. It should read 2006 and not 2008. Regards, Wings
216 Post contains images OA260 : Yep were happy Congrats to Airbus and Oman Air , great to see WY get the A330. Nice to see IY get the A350. Will they use it on the LHR-SAH route???
217 Post contains images PanAm_DC10 : Bloomberg reports Airblue of Pakistan confirm an order for 8 x A320s and that they are in talks with Airbus and Boeing for "4 to 8" A350s or B787s and
218 WINGS : I suspect that it would be for the A380 Flying Palace? Regards, Wings
219 Flying-tiger : Actually these are reported as A318 Elites, not ACJs.
220 Scbriml : Yes, the A318 is the Elite. The A319 is the ACJ (Airbus Corporate Jet).
221 Post contains links and images WINGS : Well this order has now been confirmed by Airbus. It also states that CFM International is the powerplant chosen, leaving the PW6000 out in the dark
222 OA260 : Air Blue will really become popular if they get A350/B787 A/C. They may knock PIA off some routes.
223 Post contains images SandroZRH : Wow, I was just out for my medical class 1 check and when i get back there are another two orders announced, very nice
224 Post contains images WINGS : Just in case anyone is interested. AIRBUS A380 ORDERS/COMMITMENTS. Al Jaber Group x 2 (*pending) Air France x 12 British Airways x 12 (*pending) China
225 Columba : Will these be VIP aircraft ?? I have no idea what Al Jaber Group is.
226 Post contains images LifelinerOne : Take a look at aljaber.com. There is some info about what the Group is doing. I think these A380's will be Flying Palaces, or maybe they just need to
227 Post contains images Chiad : [quote=WINGS,reply=224]Just in case anyone is interested. AIRBUS A380 ORDERS/COMMITMENTS. WINGS .. A.net without you would have been so ... dull ... a
228 Post contains images Basefly : Man... All this is really a sign of good time for Airbus, they are really getting some well deserved wind in their sails. The order books are really b
229 Post contains links SandroZRH : Gulf Air to decided "in the next weeks" GF's Charmain said in Dubai that GF is in "advanced talks" with both Airbus and Boeing about an order of 35 ne
230 Vfw614 : What is the point in operating a VVIP A380 given the very limited number of airports able to handle the aircraft (I mean, other than the "mine-is-bigg
231 Post contains images OA260 : Brilliant Wings thanks for that its very useful.
232 Beaucaire : top destinatios for wealthy Arabs doing shopping in Europe are Londo,Geneva and Nice- all are A380 capable. I would assume Malaga is rather capable to
233 Revelation : Maybe you were not around for the years before the Euro existed and GWB was US president? In that time, there were so many different currencies, and
234 Post contains images A389 : There are plenty of airports that can handle the A380... basically any airport where a 747 or A346/77W operates... and for a VVIP A380... well maybe
235 Post contains images LifelinerOne : The A380-800 can land where a B747-400 can land. At some airports there might be a problem with taxiway width, but I think these can be overcome. Nic
236 Stitch : Worst case, you land it at one airport and transfer to your BBJ/ACJ/GSV and move on while your staff boards the luxo-bus and drives.
237 Basefly : Every airport that can handle an 747 could in principle handle an A380, naturally with slight modifications to runway width. And i would also assume
238 Post contains images Scbriml : I'm obviously moving in the wrong circles - my last flight was on a LET 410 landing on a dirt strip in the middle of the Sahara! I don't escape till
239 BlueSky1976 : I'm drooling... Beats the hell out of any trip on GV or BBJ!!!
240 Thorben : Glad to see they are taking both versions. Will be nice-looking planes. I guess 200 could be passed this year.
241 Post contains links DEVILFISH : Suggest comments regarding the Prince's Flying Palace be posted in the other thread to keep this one manageable and on track..... The Mysterious A380
242 United787 : Congrats to everyone at Airbus. The order book for them for this year looks great, as does Boeings. Every year for the past 3 years I have said this b
243 Post contains images Jacobin777 : ..I certainly was interested Wings.. Thanks.... Great to see the order book fill. Personally, the more A380's and B748I's flying around the better it
244 JayinKitsap : Is that BBJ towed behind the 380 like the RV'ers do with their Honda? LOL
245 Thorben : Indeed, I'm happy about every four-hauler that I see in times of boring twins dominating the skies.
246 Nzrich : Mind you US did do a big airbus order but i agree it would be nice to see some of the other big American carriers update their fleets .. The problem
247 Revelation : Maybe they could mount it on top, ala the Space Shuttle on it's 747 transporter....
248 Baroque : Do they only offer quotations in USD these days or are there multiple currencies. I can see where the USD price might be higher (at current exchange
249 Post contains images Jacobin777 : ...it's a nice problem to have for both Boeing and Airbus... That being said, Leahy recently stated he believes there is the possibility of up to 30%
250 Ikramerica : I think that's a low ball, really. There are so many startup carriers with huge A320 and 737 orders, and A330s as well now, and I can't see all of th
251 PanAm_DC10 : Nile Air order 9 x A321s from Airbus. A good day for NBs orders. Regards, PanAm_DC10
252 Beaucaire : Who are "Nile Air "? can't find any info about the company
253 Post contains links PanAm_DC10 : Nile Air are an Cairo based Egyptian startup. They intend to commence operations in 2008 using interim leases, they will serve to serve Riyadh, Jedda
254 Beaucaire : Shukran ,and a big "mabrouk " for your reporting !
255 PanAm_DC10 : C-JET Of Hong Kong have confirmed via Airbus an order for the first A350-XWB VIP Variant! Regards, PanAm_DC10 P.S. You're welcome Beaucaire
256 Post contains images LifelinerOne : Well, I didn't know they were offering the A350XWB as VIP plane already! Good for them! Cheers!
257 Post contains images Jacobin777 : ....of course a lot depends in the world economy, a majour world-wide recession would certainly spell trouble for aviation....however, given the shee
258 Stitch : A high Yuan makes Chinese exports more expensive. As China is an export-driven economy, that would be bad.
259 Zeke : It was available at the Asian Aerospace in HKG, saw the specs on the Airbus Aircraft Family CD they gave me.
260 Post contains images Revelation : If the A380 is the Flying Palace, shouldn't the A318 be the Flying Garden Shed? Good point. Given the rate at which China is accumulating wealth, it
261 Post contains images Flysherwood : No, that would be the CRJ VIP aircraft. The A318 would be the servants quarters!
262 Post contains images Acheron : So, Carls, no V0 A330 order so far
263 Ikramerica : But all these LCCs and uber expanding new carries aren't replacing jets. They are buying new planes for new service. And any LCC that fails will floo
264 Post contains images Baroque : Only if the US was systematically buying Euros, or Yen, but that hardly seems likely. I guess the odd LCC will indeed fail, but it is likely that for
265 Burkhard : Nothing new today, it isn't over, yet, or did I sleep too long?
266 Stitch : I believe the show is over. And interesting enough, while Middle Eastern carriers accounted for 30% of Airbus' 2007 orders, they only represent 11% o
267 Burkhard : Middle Eastern aviation market will develop like the oil price. So it will double in a foreseeable future and get stuck than, since at 180$/barrel bio
268 Post contains images DEVILFISH : Now, if there's an aircraft fit for a monarch this would be it. Neither puny nor gargantuan, long-ranged and RR powered. I wonder if the lease for a
269 AerospaceFan : The idea that the Middle East will be a hub for the entire world is said to be the basis for much of the business models of some of these airlines. Th
270 Post contains images PEET7G : I hope this will never happen, but I think 50 A320s will not offset the loss on not having to build 50 A380s However I say it again: I hope this will
271 PADSpot : So what's the gross/net total order volume of Airbus for this year now?
272 Ikramerica : M/E carriers own over 1/3 the backlog on A350X and A380 programs. A collapse in that region would cripple airbus. If EK were to have to dump 20 A380s
273 AerospaceFan : I've got to hand it to Airbus. They did well during Dubai. There's no reason in my mind not to congratulate them. Boeing, on the other hand, has dropp
274 Post contains images Scbriml : At the end of October the numbers were 1,021/922* (incidentally, 922 being exactly the same as Boeing!) Dubai added (by my reckoning) 163 firm. Since
275 Moo : I think at this particular point in time, the A380 program is a moot point in my opinion - the money is gone, there's no way to recover it other than
276 Post contains images LAXDESI : You fully comprehend the concept of sunk costs. This is not to say that Airbus stock currently does not incorporate expected profits from A380 progra
277 Stitch : Around $100 million per information leaked by/gleaned from Airbus.
278 Post contains links Scbriml : I haven't read that anywhere, do you have a source? The Qantas PR makes no mention of any lease, but does state the order is firm. http://www.qantas.
279 Post contains links Moo : Sure: http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...orders-up-to-188-narrowbodies.html
280 Scbriml : " target=_blank>http://www.flightglobal.com/articles....html Thanks. That does also says it's a firm order, so that cuts Airbus's net for the year by
281 Revelation : I guess you are bearish on JetBlue? That would seem to say that all airlines have the same business model, which doesn't seem right to me.
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