Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Qantas Sydney-Santiago  
User currently offlineJamie86 From New Zealand, joined Sep 2007, 96 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 9284 times:

When Qantas starts flying from Sydney to Santiago next year, will the flight path take it over NZ?


JAMIE
43 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 9278 times:

I think it's just a codeshare with LA, isn't it ? The flight stops in AKL en-route.

User currently offlineANstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5244 posts, RR: 6
Reply 2, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 9246 times:



Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 1):
I think it's just a codeshare with LA, isn't it ? The flight stops in AKL en-route.

QF have announced they will fly SYD-SCL from November next year with their own metal.


User currently offlineJamie86 From New Zealand, joined Sep 2007, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 9228 times:

Apparently once we get the a380 and it starts taking over the flights to LAX from MEL and SYD that will free up some 744ERs to fly SYD-SCL direct.


JAMIE
User currently offlineMotorHussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3205 posts, RR: 9
Reply 4, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 9165 times:

So if it's a SYD-SCL non-stop, no it doesn't fly over New Zealand skies:



Regards
MH



come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4830 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 9049 times:



Quoting Jamie86 (Reply 3):
Apparently once we get the a380 and it starts taking over the flights to LAX from MEL and SYD that will free up some 744ERs to fly SYD-SCL direct.

That was the impression that I got... and what makes sense since LA already codeshare with QF SYD-AKL-SCL.

Quoting MotorHussy (Reply 4):
So if it's a SYD-SCL non-stop, no it doesn't fly over New Zealand skies:

Yes and no... sure great circle etc takes it to the South... however for various reasons (no alternates, winds, weather etc etc) the route is likely to be more Northerly than the Great Circle. Also for the SCL-SYD sector due to headwinds it is almost certainly to be more North than the SYD-SCL route. That way if needs be the aircraft can make a splash and dash gas stop in either AKL or CHC...more likely CHC however. The ER is however very capable of flying these sectors year round with good payloads and may only be restricted occasionally (storm/strong headwinds).



56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
User currently offlineTruemanQLD From Australia, joined Feb 2007, 1543 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 8575 times:

Why is QF entering a market that has only one other airline, that is in the same alliance??? Yes I know LAN goes via AKl which is even more likely to kill them off the route. Seems pretty pointless...

User currently offlineVHECA From Australia, joined May 2007, 262 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 8564 times:

Could QF be scheduling these routes for more of a numbers exerise for the newer aircraft in the future?

It is good to see the red tail getting back out internationally and not under codeshare, but it does seem to be an interesting decision.

Any one else?

VHECA



Types Flown on - 312,320,722,732,733,73H,73W,742,743,74C,752,762,AB4,D1C,D28,DHT,F27,L11
User currently offlineNZ107 From New Zealand, joined Jul 2005, 6430 posts, RR: 38
Reply 8, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 8499 times:



Quoting TruemanQLD (Reply 6):

I think that QF's product will be far superior, if they use the 744ER. Remember before the alliances, QF flew there anyway. I think they could have remained flying there but probably left LA to it when the OneWorld alliance was formed. If they didn't have any 744ERs free and had to go through AKL, I'd think LA would cease their SCL-AKL-SYD route. I can't think of any other flights that are provided of two airlines of the same alliance but it could be a move to promote South America to you Aussies, and vice versa. They codeshare at the moment anyway, which could suggest that the QF management believe it would be sufficient to put their own metal on this flight. This way, LA can still pick up the NZ pax until Air NZ fly to South America, which seems quite likely within the next 10 years (probably less).

I wonder if they would try a round the world flight by linking JNB with SCL sometime..



It's all about the destination AND the journey.
User currently offlineMotorHussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3205 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 2 days ago) and read 8319 times:



Quoting NZ107 (Reply 8):
If they didn't have any 744ERs free and had to go through AKL, I'd think LA would cease their SCL-AKL-SYD route.

They don't need 744ER's for this route; standard 744's suffice fine except for in extraordinary circumstances. Guess QF feel they'll have the Ozzie pulling power if they go non-stop rather than via AKL. The AKL and SYD must make it more attractive for South American travellers though.

I wonder what NZ's got up its sleeves with regard to LatAm once the 789's arrive? And how long will they have to have them before they can start flying them unrestricted? The following map shows flights from AKL to SCL, EZE and GRU. The dark shaded area indicates 240minute ETOPS the lighter, 180. Quite a hike around the latter.



Regards
MH



come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineMendaero From Australia, joined Jul 2006, 62 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 2 days ago) and read 8278 times:



Quoting TruemanQLD (Reply 6):
Why is QF entering a market that has only one other airline, that is in the same alliance??? Yes I know LAN goes via AKl which is even more likely to kill them off the route. Seems pretty pointless...

I think you will find that the LA A340 will be replaced by the QF 744.


User currently offlineMotorHussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3205 posts, RR: 9
Reply 11, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 2 days ago) and read 8231 times:



Quoting Mendaero (Reply 10):
I think you will find that the LA A340 will be replaced by the QF 744.

No this is not the case.



come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineNZ107 From New Zealand, joined Jul 2005, 6430 posts, RR: 38
Reply 12, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 8189 times:



Quoting MotorHussy (Reply 9):
They don't need 744ER's for this route; standard 744's suffice fine except for in extraordinary circumstances. Guess QF feel they'll have the Ozzie pulling power if they go non-stop rather than via AKL. The AKL and SYD must make it more attractive for South American travellers though.

Haha yeah I figured it out after I had posted it..

Where are VARIG's hubs? That would me one of my first picks (GIG/GRU?) unless they want to take on AR and LA/QF to EZE and SCL.



It's all about the destination AND the journey.
User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5664 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 8166 times:



Quoting MotorHussy (Reply 9):
I wonder what NZ's got up its sleeves with regard to LatAm once the 789's arrive? And how long will they have to have them before they can start flying them unrestricted? The following map shows flights from AKL to SCL, EZE and GRU. The dark shaded area indicates 240minute ETOPS the lighter, 180. Quite a hike around the latter.

Will the NZ civil aviation authority approve ETOPS 240 or even ETOPS 180 this far south? Does NZ have any special restrictions south of 55S?

Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineDavidByrne From New Zealand, joined Sep 2007, 1650 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 8109 times:

I had been under the impression that the LA A340 service to SCL would stay at daily, and that the new QF service was also going to be via AKL, 3x weekly. However, checking the airline's press releases for 28 May they merely mention "direct" services between SYD and SCL, and don't mention frequency. Maybe I've constructed my "memory" in my head! In airline parlance, however, "direct" does not equate to "nonstop", but usually means a same-plane stopping service. It might be that the service is non-stop but they were being imprecise. Or it may mean that they do intend to have a stop en route - and AKL would be the logical point if they did. Can anyone provide a definite source from the airline as to what their intentions are?

The service is due to start in November 2008, and the Qantas timetable currently runs as far as 3 November 2008 - but there's no sign yet of these new flights. Maybe in a couple of weeks the answer will be clear?



This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife
User currently offlineRichardJF From New Zealand, joined Mar 2001, 792 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 8098 times:

Let the existing business go after the vote. It's what he'll do imo. set up a new business gets all the costs out of it. You can pick out what you want and don't want.

User currently offlineAerorobNZ From Rwanda, joined Feb 2001, 7189 posts, RR: 13
Reply 16, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 7979 times:



Quoting Jamie86 (Thread starter):
When Qantas starts flying from Sydney to Santiago next year, will the flight path take it over NZ?

There are about 5 routes across AKL-SCL, and I have personally flown on about 3 of those trajectories ex AKL so I expect there to be a Northerly route somewhere over WLG/Manawatu, a couple of middle routes over the South Island, and then a couple of really transpolar routings as per the Great circle mapper.


User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4830 posts, RR: 9
Reply 17, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 7937 times:



Quoting TruemanQLD (Reply 6):
Why is QF entering a market that has only one other airline, that is in the same alliance??? Yes I know LAN goes via AKl which is even more likely to kill them off the route. Seems pretty pointless...

Because QF is looking at SYD-SCL direct rather than LAs SYD-AKL-SCL. QF has previously flown to SA via AKL and only pulled out to give LA a go at it (traffic has since grown significantly) and because QF needed to metal for other routes. The introduction of the A380 changes this however as the 744ERs will no longer be needed for the long LAX-MEL route freeing them up.

Quoting MotorHussy (Reply 9):
They don't need 744ER's for this route; standard 744's suffice fine except for in extraordinary circumstances. Guess QF feel they'll have the Ozzie pulling power if they go non-stop rather than via AKL. The AKL and SYD must make it more attractive for South American travellers though.

Correct for an AKL-SCL however QF is aparently looking at a direct SYD-SCL... an ordinary 744 can do it with payload restriction but for the SCL-SYD leg it would be severely restricted making it unviable. This is where the 744ER comes in as it can fly the route year round with good payload. On the odd occasion where it will suffer from particularly strong headwinds or other weather then it can either leave behind some payload in SCL (freight/pax) or it can land at CHC or AKL for a splash n dash gas stop.

With QF re-entering the market and with it likely to be operating direct rather than via AKL, it looks as if LA will likely drop its AKL-SYD-AKL tag flight and simply let pax transfer to one of QFs multiple AKL-SYD-AKL flights (or travel direct on QF) a lot of those pax do travel to other destinations such as MEL anyway and a lot do stay in AKL so there are several options there. The only other competition is of course AR which flies EZE-AKL-SYD-AKL-EZE. They will probably continue this flight although they may reduce the incidence of the AKL-SYD-AKL tag flight to 3x weekly and just sit the a/c on the ground in AKL the other days (maybe get NZ to do day to day mx on them).



56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
User currently offlineMotorHussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3205 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 7871 times:



Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 17):
t looks as if LA will likely drop its AKL-SYD-AKL



Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 17):
The only other competition is of course AR which flies EZE-AKL-SYD-AKL-EZE. They will probably continue this flight although they may reduce the incidence of the AKL-SYD-AKL tag flight to 3x weekly

And both of these airlines are allowed to operate in a fully unrestricted and competitive manner across the Tasman. SYD is more important to LA than AKL, can't see them giving it up for QF.

Regards
MH



come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineAA767400 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 2363 posts, RR: 26
Reply 19, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 7847 times:



Quoting TruemanQLD (Reply 6):
Why is QF entering a market that has only one other airline, that is in the same alliance??? Yes I know LAN goes via AKl which is even more likely to kill them off the route. Seems pretty pointless...

QF knows that the market has grown and now want to get in on the action. It is a win win situation for both as both are Oneworld and share market with hubs at both ends.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 8):


I think that QF's product will be far superior, if they use the 744ER. Remember before the alliances, QF flew there anyway. I think they could have remained flying there but probably left LA to it when the OneWorld alliance was formed.

I don't know what airline you think LA is but they are right up there with QF in terms of many aspects. Maybe you are thinking of RG are something? LA has a modern fleet, great service, and great IFE. And QF dropped SCL way before Oneworld, but they did fly SYD-EZE via AKL or non-stop is what I don't remember.



"The low fares airline."
User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4830 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 7819 times:



Quoting MotorHussy (Reply 18):
And both of these airlines are allowed to operate in a fully unrestricted and competitive manner across the Tasman. SYD is more important to LA than AKL, can't see them giving it up for QF.

Yes they can do, but it doesn't mean they need to. SYD is not a big $ earner for them... in fact most pax are not transits but are local traffic on cheap airfares. LA codeshares with QF so they would still get revenue from putting their pax on a QF flight. The AKL-SCL flight is often delayed due to it arriving late into AKL (from either SCL then being late AKL-SYD-AKL) or just delayed out of SYD making the AKL-SCL departure also late (this is due to various issues but usually mx). They could have a flight that leaves SCL later stays on the ground in AKL (have light mx done by ANZES) then leave AKL back to SCL earlier than they currently do if they wanted. It would mean they would only need the 2 aircraft to operate the route rather than the 2 (+ standby capacity/delays).



56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
User currently offlineANstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5244 posts, RR: 6
Reply 21, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 7736 times:



Quoting AA767400 (Reply 19):
I don't know what airline you think LA is but they are right up there with QF in terms of many aspects

you obviously haven't been on an LA AKL-SYD flight... they are pretty rubbish on this leg and their product on long haul is no where near the QF product


User currently offlineOzGlobal From France, joined Nov 2004, 2721 posts, RR: 4
Reply 22, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 7559 times:

I did SYD-AKL-SCL on LA in Jan. I thought to myself, looking at the AirShow, that we must be, at that moement, the most isolated passenger aircraft in the world as we passed close to Antartica on the map. Is this the case?


When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
User currently offlineLH459 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 886 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 7385 times:



Quoting ANstar (Reply 21):
their product on long haul is no where near the QF product

I can't speak for the product on their A340s, but I've found their long haul service on the 763s to be absolutely exemplary. Certainly comparable with QF or any other major international carrier.



"I object to violence because when it appears to do good, the good is temporary; the evil it does is permanent" - Ghandi
User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4830 posts, RR: 9
Reply 24, posted (6 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7231 times:



Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 22):
I did SYD-AKL-SCL on LA in Jan. I thought to myself, looking at the AirShow, that we must be, at that moement, the most isolated passenger aircraft in the world as we passed close to Antartica on the map. Is this the case?

Apart from an AR A340 going SYD-AKL-EZE then yes I'd say so.



56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
25 Threepoint : LH and AC both serve YYZ-FRA. LH will also join AC on the YYC-FRA route.
26 TruemanQLD : QF/CX=BNE/SYD/MEL-HKG-LHR QF/BA=SYD-BKK/SIN-LHR QF/JL=SYD-NRT.... I'll miss seeing the LA A340 in SYD if it happens
27 ANstar : there is the issue then. This route is flown by the A340 which is old style cradle seats. QF's 744er aircraft have lie flat seats and imho better cat
28 PanAm747 : What is the routing of LAN's SYD-SCL flight? What stops does it make enroute besides Auckland? I know this route could be done with an A340 or 747 non
29 DavidByrne : I know how you feel. I once took an AR 747 from Ushaia bound for Auckland. I was one of only five pax to join there (it was essentially only a tech s
30 NZ107 : Oh, I was meaning a monopoly of the alliance: so TG would also fly SYD-BKK and SQ the SIN-LHR route.. Damn one interesting flight.. USH-AKL..
31 DavidByrne : Oh such embarrassment - of course it wasn't Ushaia, but Rio Gallegos (RGL)! I had been in Ushaia and flew to RGL in a Cessna twin - great flight over
32 JetSetter629 : Is this route strictly used by a 744ER? Do regular 744 fly the route? Also, where else in the network are the -ERs deployed? Rob
33 AA767LOVER : Well, it's really hard to make that comparison, because you have an old establishment flying the route vs. a newbie. AKL-SYD has long been traversed
34 VHVXB : with payload restrictions I believe predominately LAX
35 AA767LOVER : When will the 380s be deployed to LAX? That will be a wonder to see! QF should soon get their own remote terminal at LAX? Will that ever happen?
36 NZ107 : Yes. I'm pretty sure that the ER only flies SYD/MEL/(BNE?)-LAX, while the 744 does MEL-AKL-LAX. To my knowldedge, the ER is not weight restricted for
37 AA767400 : I just love assumptions! I have traveled to Oz by way of many routes including this one. That is your opinion. I will give you that QF's cradle seat
38 Skyhigh : Why SCL and not EZE instead? It was my understanding that QF pulled out of Buenos Aires purely because it was short of planes. The only reason that I
39 AerorobNZ : LA are certainly up to the standard of the QF product through AKL, and they currently have 3 classes.
40 ANstar : And you think they provide great catering and service on the SYD-AKL leg? QF would not be operating a Cradle Seat to SCL with the 744er, it would be
41 Post contains images Zkpilot : AKL only. QF will either fly direct or via AKL but most likely direct and not just for business... saves at least 2 hours. pretty much... they are us
42 NZ107 : Well, considering QF has no current service to South America and will only have one after this, it makes sense going to the hub of an alliance member
43 OzGlobal : Well AA even have three classes, and that does remdeem their dingy cabins and lousy service on the whole. I've done SYD-SCL on LA which is A340 with
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Qantas To Fly Santiago Route And More posted Mon May 28 2007 03:22:06 by QF744
Qantas Emergency Landing In Sydney (photo) posted Tue Feb 6 2007 22:31:05 by Airfoilsguy
Qantas Jumbo - Engine Explosion Over Sydney? posted Sat Feb 3 2007 02:17:04 by KiwiTEAL
Qantas Seeks Range For Sydney-Dallas posted Thu Mar 25 2004 16:29:09 by Wirraway
Qantas Jet Base In Sydney posted Wed Aug 27 2003 08:10:20 by Ted747
Qantas Or United To Sydney? posted Wed Dec 19 2001 02:41:21 by MSYtristar
Qantas Or Cathay In F Class To Sydney? posted Tue Dec 4 2001 01:12:44 by Djcrooks
Qantas Launches Sydney-Melbourne Every Half Hour posted Tue Jun 19 2001 08:05:40 by QantasAirways
Brisbane-Sydney... Qantas Or Ansett? posted Tue May 22 2001 07:42:52 by QantasAirways
Qantas Prepared To Give Up Sydney Slots posted Mon May 7 2001 10:53:43 by United Airline