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Part 2: DL & UA In Merger Talks!  
User currently offlineLrdc9 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 610 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 1 hour ago) and read 7915 times:

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/071114/delta_united.html?.v=6

I thought it was time for a new thread seeing as almost 250 posts on last thread.

The thread was originally posted by Flydl2atl.
Exciting stuff!

Link to old thread: Delta And UA Now In Merger Talks (by Flydl2atl Nov 14 2007 in Civil Aviation)


Just say NO to scabs.
44 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 3993 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 7808 times:

I think many on these boards enjoy the speculation, but in this instance it really is about a letter that became public a couple of days ago by a large Wall Street Hedge Fund firm that purchased a bunch of UA and DL stock as each carrier came out of Chapter 11 receivership.
For the record on this Part II of the thread, here is the official DL news release:

Quoting delta.com/newsroom:
Company reiterates previously stated positions on industry consolidation
ATLANTA, Nov. 14, 2007 -- Delta Air Lines (NYSE: DAL) CEO Richard Anderson today issued the following statement in response to correspondence from Pardus Capital Management LP advocating that Delta lead industry consolidation:
"We appreciate receiving Pardus' views on the best course for Delta's future. We have been consistent in our public statements that Delta believes that the right consolidation transaction could generate significant value for our shareholders and employees and that strategic options should be evaluated. With oil at over $90 a barrel, this analysis takes on a heightened importance as we factor those prices into our long-term planning process."
Prior to receiving this letter, Delta's Board of Directors had established a special committee of the Board to work with management to review and analyze strategic options to ensure Delta maintains its leadership position in the airline industry, including potential consolidation transactions. The committee is headed by Daniel Carp, Delta's non executive Chairman of the Board. The company had also retained financial and legal advisors to assist in this review and in the development of recommendations to Delta's Board of Directors.

http://news.delta.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=10908

As many analysts have reiterated over the past 2-3 years, if there is any big airline link-up, DL+NW makes the most sense, even though many here will point to fleet and labor incompatibility.



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineYVRUA From Canada, joined Mar 2006, 1 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 7546 times:

I wonder if all those happy southerner DELTOIDS wish they had signed union cards ! Mergers are inevitable and airline employees need the unions to work out the best deal. No Union, No bargaining, No negotiating. As far as pilots go, should be easy as UA has no MD80/90 and DL has no Airbus, Few 777, no 747.

User currently offlineDavescj From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 2292 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 7547 times:

IF (and I stress IF) it happens, it would be an interesting marriage. UA has massive Asia routes, and DL has managed to get some good Europe and Africa footholds/routes.

Dave



Can I have a mojito on this flight?
User currently offlineRyu2 From Taiwan, joined Aug 2002, 487 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 7527 times:



Quote:
IF (and I stress IF) it happens, it would be an interesting marriage. UA has massive Asia routes, and DL has managed to get some good Europe and Africa footholds/routes.

And the perfect name for the merged airline would be... PAN AM!

[Edited 2007-11-15 22:53:28]

User currently offlineCV880 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1097 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 7486 times:

[quote=YVRUA,reply=2]I wonder if all those happy southerner DELTOIDS wish they had signed union cards ! Mergers are inevitable and airline employees need the unions to work out the best deal.[quote]

Those unions at WA & PA sure helped a lot when WA/DL merged and DL absorbed part of PA's operations...Your characterization of "Southerner" is a bit out of place as well. DL has operations in almost all of the 50 states. As having worked there for over 30yrs, I never worked in the South, nor have many others....


User currently offlineLono From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1335 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 7399 times:



Quoting CV880 (Reply 5):
Those unions at WA & PA sure helped a lot when WA/DL merged and DL absorbed part of PA's operations

Understatement...!!!

As I recall WA union was forced out since DL was the surviving carrier.... however some weird things happened with some of the old PA people... some were slotted and some were let go... it was explained that since PA did not merge with DL their employees were SOL... but in a gesture of good will some were slotted.... (?)... never did figure that out I guess I just know some of them showed up in DFW and we were bumped down....since everyone at PA had been working forever...



Wally Bird Ruled the Skys!
User currently offlineUK_Dispatcher From United Arab Emirates, joined Dec 2001, 2582 posts, RR: 30
Reply 7, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 7396 times:



Quoting Ryu2 (Reply 4):
And the perfect name for the merged airline would be... PAN AM!

Delta United has a ring to it.


User currently offlineDavescj From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 2292 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 7393 times:



Quoting Ryu2 (Reply 4):
And the perfect name for the merged airline would be... PAN AM!

 cloudnine   crossfingers   yes 

I wouldn't obj to that name!! I also like the above idea (Delta United). However, I think the Pan Am name is still owned.

How about -- WorldReach?

Dave



Can I have a mojito on this flight?
User currently offlineUAL777UK From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 3356 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 7310 times:

Am I missing something here, why has this second thread started! They have both come out and said they are not in discussion about any merger. 250 responses later do we really need any thread for further speculation?...i love A.Net, but come on, you have to draw the line somewhere!

User currently offlineUnitedTristar From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 7286 times:



Quoting Davescj (Reply 8):
How about -- WorldReach?

What about TransGlobal...

I can see it now...Dean Martin as a Capitan who gets pissed at a Chicago airport manager after one of his companys aircraft gets stuck in the mud at the airport....


Oh wait...Thats Airport!

no merger will happen but if it does, clearly it will be called United!

-m

 airplane 


User currently offlineDavescj From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 2292 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 7207 times:



Quoting UnitedTristar (Reply 10):
no merger will happen but if it does, clearly it will be called United!

And that's so true you can say it twice over.

So what can I say, but........TRUE

Dave



Can I have a mojito on this flight?
User currently offlineRedTailDTW From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 750 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 7123 times:



Quoting UK_Dispatcher (Reply 7):
Delta United has a ring to it.

I still think DELITED sounds better.  Big grin



Mason



Northwest Airlines. Now you're flying smart! (RIP 1926-2009)
User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4630 posts, RR: 12
Reply 13, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 7032 times:

Im tempted to start a thread on an AA + WN merger, while everyones doing worthless speculation anyways, why not?  Yeah sure


Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineAviationAddict From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 590 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 7005 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!



Quoting Lrdc9 (Thread starter):
Exciting stuff!

How is it exciting? Both airlines have already denied the story numerous times. You all have to give it up, it's not going happen!


User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 3993 posts, RR: 11
Reply 15, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 6854 times:



Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 13):
Im tempted to start a thread on an AA + WN merger, while everyones doing worthless speculation anyways, why not?  sarcastic 

 rotfl   rotfl  That will be the day!  kiss   laughing  I think you'll see a major seismic event in the DFW metro-plex before you see that happen!

Quoting YVRUA (Reply 2):
I wonder if all those happy southerner DELTOIDS wish they had signed union cards ! Mergers are inevitable and airline employees need the unions to work out the best deal. No Union, No bargaining, No negotiating.

Well unlike you Canucks in B.C. the good ole USA doesn't have an NDP that is so wrapped around the finger of organized labour, even though some parts of the Democratic National Committee are.
I really don't think Pardus Capitol Management has the power to force a DL+UA merger. This scare over $90 oil is more of a short term phase the oil futures market is going through. Hopefully by now OPEC is smart enough to know that if the North American economy goes south, the Asian and Latin American economy could shortly follow. I think the fund managers at Pardus are over reacting, and are just trying to bump UA and DL stock up even higher.



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineMasseyBrown From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 5215 posts, RR: 7
Reply 16, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 6824 times:

I have to say I think all this hoo-hah is the result of 1) a strategic leak intended by the nameless, presumably-DL source to head off any merger that threatened to turn out the lights in Atlanta, and 2) a press release from Pardus aimed solely at getting something (even just the stock price) moving.


Consilivm: Cave ne nothi te vexant
User currently offlineNW748i From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 361 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 6802 times:



Quoting UnitedTristar (Reply 10):
clearly it will be called United

 checkmark  - 'United' just has such a nice ring to it, for some reason. I never have understood what's behind the name 'Delta.' Change? Someone might fill me in on that...

Also, in the admittedly unlikely chance that this comes to pass, I think the management (whoever it is) should be in Chicago. Airtran will quickly grow to fill in the void in Atlanta.



Hail! to the victors valiant, Hail! to the conqu'ring heroes, Hail! Hail! to Michigan the leaders and best! Go Blue!
User currently offlineFlyingcat From United States of America, joined May 2007, 527 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 6796 times:



Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 15):
I really don't think Pardus Capitol Management has the power to force a DL+UA merger.

A hedge fund under Kirk Kerkorian (Tracinda) forced GM to make moves it did not want. Carl Icahn and his group foreced Time Warner to buy back $20 billion in stock and appoint independent board members. In exchange they agrred to stop their drive to break up the company. Pardus was able to buy into the Ballys

And this just in Pardus,

with Gordon Bethune attending,

is presenting their plan to other investors at today's Merrill Lynch conference. The ramifications are obvious Delta and United after bankruptcy are less under control of their own destiny. The creditors/shareholders call the shots not Tilton or Anderson.


User currently offlineDavescj From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 2292 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 6781 times:

While oil prices will go back down, they won't go back to where they were. If you think not, only look at gas prices -- low -- spike -- lower, but not former prices (at least in my experience). I think a merger is going to happen or someone (even if a smaller carrier) will go out of biz. Granted TWA/AA or HW/US size mergers aren't common, but more I will happen IMHO. Look at the drama over Midwest as a case in point.

What I'll be interested to see is if Skybus is able to make a go of it. At the cost of gas, I can't see the hassles of the smaller airports being worth it -- not only in gas you spend, but also the time getting to the airport, + all the "extras" they charge for.

Just my thoughts.

Dave



Can I have a mojito on this flight?
User currently offlineCV880 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1097 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 6730 times:



Quoting Lono (Reply 6):
As I recall WA union was forced out since DL was the surviving carrier.... however some weird things happened with some of the old PA people... some were slotted and some were let go... it was explained that since PA did not merge with DL their employees were SOL... but in a gesture of good will some were slotted.... (?)... never did figure that out I guess I just know some of them showed up in DFW and we were bumped down....since everyone at PA had been working forever...

Both WA/PA employees at DL were given their full seniority for bidding, vacations & pay after being with DL for about a 3yr period. The one thing that did hurt was their pension from DL started from the date of the mergers. Some WA, ex-Teamster Union Members actually did ok as they received pensions from both DL & the Union.


User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 3993 posts, RR: 11
Reply 21, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 6591 times:



Quoting Flyingcat (Reply 18):
A hedge fund under Kirk Kerkorian (Tracinda) forced GM to make moves it did not want. Carl Icahn and his group foreced Time Warner to buy back $20 billion in stock and appoint independent board members. In exchange they agrred to stop their drive to break up the company. Pardus was able to buy into the Ballys

It all depends upon the percentage of control they have, as well as what board members they have in their hip pockets. Correct me if I'm wrong, but GM divesting Delphi was about the best thing that could happen to GM, perhaps not for rank-n-file workers. I think the DL board knows a merger is in the cards for them, and that's why most of them are there. I think they'll explore it, but there will be too big a mess, especially with the DOJ, no matter what Republican or Democratic administration is in power in the executive or legislative branch in Washington. Where I think the DOJ is more open to mergers is larger carriers taking over the smaller ones. For example if UA went after US now, I think they would let that one go through. DL+NW makes much more sense and could pan out to be the best possible Wall Street money maker even with the labor and fleet compatibility issues. I see Boeing licking their collective chops on this one.

Quoting Flyingcat (Reply 18):
The ramifications are obvious Delta and United after bankruptcy are less under control of their own destiny. The creditors/shareholders call the shots not Tilton or Anderson.

No one will deny forthcoming consolidation, but I think Tilton restructured UA to be sold off piece by piece if needs be, and Grinstein took a position of holding DL together and emerge more in a leadership position. I think Richard Anderson was brought in largely to facilitate an eventual merger in the acquisition position, and Glenn Tilton is just a puppet looking for the best suitor. Keep in mind DL has retained Gerry Grinstein as a consultant, and he has been the architect of two mergers; the DL+Western Merger two decades ago, as well as the Burlington Northern+ATSF R.R. Merger in the early 1990s.



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21416 posts, RR: 60
Reply 22, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 6576 times:

As to why this topic won't die?

Because when presented with clear evidence to the contrary, a.net still likes to believe rumors and doubt facts. That's why...  Wink

There have been a bunch of threads recently where they began on a rumor, the rumor was proven false, but it didn't stop people from continuing to propagate it.

But hey, that's how Vampire mythology began, and plenty of people believe that is true now...  scared 

Quoting UnitedTristar (Reply 10):
What about TransGlobal...

How about Pan Universe.

Quoting Davescj (Reply 19):
If you think not, only look at gas prices -- low -- spike -- lower, but not former prices (at least in my experience).

They did in the late 80s. They were 70 cents a gallon in some parts of the USA, and adjusted for inflation, that was lower than before the gas crunch of the 70s/early 80s.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 60
Reply 23, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 6342 times:

.........this would lead to some conflict of interest...as UA revenue shares TATL flights with LH and DL will be revenue sharing TATL flights with AF/KL....not to mention, AF sharing those coveted LHR slots with DL...


"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineMEACEDAR From Lebanon, joined Oct 2006, 753 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 6261 times:

Finally, my dream is coming true........well almost.....hopefully.

MEACEDAR


25 MasseyBrown : This is a common arrangement for outgoing senior officers. How often do you suppose he will be consulted? I'd guess once a year on his birthday.
26 IliriBDL : What do you guys think of the possibility of US and DL merging? (I know it didn't work the first time they tried)
27 Post contains images Platinumfoota : Good one. Reminds me of this time my friend sent me a text saying Delta and AeroMexico are merging and are going to be called DelTaCO
28 Davescj : I didn't realize that. Good reality injection. Dave
29 NDSchu777 : The idea of a Delta-United merger sounds intreguing and has its pluses and minuses. One of the biggest pluses I see is that the route maps mesh very w
30 Haggis79 : well, if DL acquires UA, Channel 9 is gonna be gone... I think there was a thread about a year or something ago that said that most airlines have a c
31 United787 : I believe the Delta name came from the Mississippi River Delta.
32 Rwy04LGA : Delta, as in Mississippi River delta, from New Orleans, where Delta got it's start in 1928.
33 Rwy04LGA : As a new name...how about a combination of their respective initials? DAL + UAL = DUAL And since it's a pairing, the wordplay on 'dual' is appropriate
34 Bobnwa : If your source is a thread you read about a year, then I would say positively it is not true. Logically, why would it be true.
35 Post contains images Haggis79 : well, if your only source is your distrust in my memory, you might want to explain why UA is the only airline in the US (and even in the world, if me
36 Bobnwa : I have no idea why United has Channel 9 and others don't. But I am quite sure it doesn't have anything to do with pilot contracts. As for Delta getti
37 Cubsrule : UA is also the only carrier in the U.S. to have audio entertainment on every mainline flight. (They may also be unique in the world here; certainly e
38 NW748i : Interestingly enough, on Thursday during his visit with some congressmen Anderson pointed out to Rep. Westmoreland that Delta has a "legacy that goes
39 Alitalia744 : The point had nothing to do with saying DL is fine without or outside of ATL. The point being DL's roots are in the South...
40 Post contains images NW748i : Consider Westmoreland's statement to which Anderson was responding: "We want to keep the family in Atlanta."
41 Alitalia744 : Was considered. But thanks for the quote.
42 SNCntry32 : This UA+DL merger rumor seems to have more fuel then the NW+DL merger rumors. We have hedge funds and people with money wanting this merger.
43 LawnDart : Well, I can't believe I'm actually replying to this thread...both DL and UA have denied any talks. However, many hedge funds have money invested in m
44 Ikramerica : Which is not to say that gas prices will ever go lower than they were in the late 90s again, or as low as they were in the late 80s, but this idea th
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