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AI To Place A380 Or B748 Order In Next Six Months  
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 10772 times:

AI to convert all Boeing 747-400s into cargo freighters, and order either A380 or B748 within next six months for deliveries in 2011-2016.

No indication as to how many will be ordered, but recent news report indicate about 12 A388s--if B748, then 16 would be the equivalent number in capacity.

If they go Airbus, I wonder if they would consider the A389 or A388R. A388R would be perfect for BLR-SFO, BOM/DEL-JFK/EWR non-stops.

I am sure Boeing will be extremely aggressive, and could bag the order by offering an attractive package on 748I/748F given AI's decision to enter air cargo business with a dedicated freighter fleet.

http://avindia.blogspot.com/

57 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBlrBird From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 578 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 10756 times:

I think AI will go with 748 but I could be wrong!


from star dust....
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 2, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 10698 times:



Quoting BlrBird (Reply 1):
I think AI will go with 748 but I could be wrong!

I think and hope so too. 748s will most likely have the 787 GenX engines leading to commonality of engines, and therefore lower maintenance costs--AI has 28 787s on order.


User currently offlineScbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12462 posts, RR: 46
Reply 3, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 10699 times:
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Quoting LAXDESI (Thread starter):
I wonder if they would consider the A389 or A388R

Since neither of these planes are offered by Airbus, they'd struggle to buy them.

Quoting LAXDESI (Thread starter):
I am sure Boeing will be extremely aggressive, and could bag the order by offering an attractive package on 748I/748F given AI's decision to enter air cargo business with a dedicated freighter fleet.

Boeing has not been aggressive enough so far to win any additional 748i orders since LH selected it. The piece says nothing about them buying new-build freighters, just converting their existing 744s. They're very unlikely to be buying 748fs, so Boeing will have no leverage there.

Quoting BlrBird (Reply 1):
I think AI will go with 748 but I could be wrong!

Well, that covers all the bases!  wink 

I think AI will be another new A380 customer.



Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana!
User currently offlineThorben From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 10702 times:

I think AI is already preparing some pilots.  Big grin

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User currently offlineWestWing From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 2134 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 10668 times:

So does AI think that they have miraculously shed all the red tape and the oversight of umpteen committees of "empowered groups of ministers" and all the political wrangling so that they can place an order within six months? Optimism at its best! That being said, it may be that Thulasidas is determined, on a personal level, to get this accomplished on his watch - before he retires. Perhaps this may help the process along.


The best time to plant a tree is 40 years ago. The second best time is today.
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12134 posts, RR: 51
Reply 6, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 10592 times:



Quoting LAXDESI (Thread starter):
AI to convert all Boeing 747-400s into cargo freighters, and order either A380 or B748 within next six months for deliveries in 2011-2016.

I thought all the A-380 production slots are taken up to 2013. Is that not true? If it is, then the only logical choice is the B-747-8i.


User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30870 posts, RR: 86
Reply 7, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 10540 times:
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Quoting Scbriml (Reply 3):
I think AI will be another new A380 customer.

Agreed.

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 6):
I thought all the A-380 production slots are taken up to 2013.

Airbus has enough orders to fill every production slot through July 2013, but that does not mean that every production slot is filled through that date. Deferments, planned deliveries post 2013, and such could open up slots in 2011.

ILFC also has 10 on order, though the first one has been deferred until 2013 so it would not be an option prior to that.


User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21502 posts, RR: 60
Reply 8, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 10512 times:



Quoting LAXDESI (Thread starter):
No indication as to how many will be ordered, but recent news report indicate about 12 A388s--if B748, then 16 would be the equivalent number in capacity.

??

That's not true from a passenger or cargo capacity comparison. further, that is making the assumption that AI needs "x" number of seats, not "y" number of VLAs.

I think AI has a good chance at the A380, but by keeping the 744s and buying the GE787s, there is a case for engine and crew commonality with the 748I instead.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineBA319-131 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 8524 posts, RR: 54
Reply 9, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 10423 times:
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Quoting Scbriml (Reply 3):
I think AI will be another new A380 customer.

- I'll agree with that, would make a good choice with they need a VLA.



111,732,3,4,5,7,8,BBJ,741,742,743,744,752,762,763,764,772,77L,773,77W,L15,D10,30,40,AB3,AB6,A312.313,319,320,321,332,333
User currently offlineAlessandro From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 10418 times:

So whats all the problems AI having lately, 5 planes grounded due to mechanic problems?

[Edited 2007-11-18 11:36:42]

User currently offlineDeaphen From India, joined Jul 2005, 1426 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 10332 times:

Its my own information, but i can assure you that there will be an order for ten or more A380'a. Probably timed with Sarkozy'z visit to India early next year.  Wink

You can call it insider information.

regards
nitin



I want every single airport and airplane in India to be on A.net!
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 12, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 10309 times:



Quoting Scbriml (Reply 3):
Quoting LAXDESI (Thread starter):
I wonder if they would consider the A389 or A388R

Since neither of these planes are offered by Airbus, they'd struggle to buy them.

I think Airbus is considering A389 with an EIS of 2015(there is a thread about it). AI's desired delivery schedule runs from 2011 to 2016, which makes consideration of A389 likely--if Airbus offers it.


User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 26909 posts, RR: 58
Reply 13, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 10290 times:



Quoting Deaphen (Reply 11):
Its my own information, but i can assure you that there will be an order for ten or more A380'a. Probably timed with Sarkozy'z visit to India early next year.

You can call it insider information.

regards
nitin

Brilliant !! Will be cool to see all those ''Palace'' windows. Cant wait to see that cabin interior !! It will really be like an Indian palace .
 bigthumbsup 


User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 14, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 10207 times:

From a post on Indian Aviation thread:
big Boeing presntation planned at AI CMD's office for 747-8 and addtional 20 777s.....


User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30870 posts, RR: 86
Reply 15, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 10165 times:
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Quoting Deaphen (Reply 11):
Its my own information, but i can assure you that there will be an order for ten or more A380's.



Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 14):
From a post on Indian Aviation thread: big Boeing presentation planned at AI CMD's office for 747-8 and additional 20 777s...

Maybe AI is going to do a split-order?

Pick up five 747-8Is to replace their three 747-300s and one 747-400M and then order 10 A380s to replace their 747-400s?

Or 15 747-8's to replace their existing 747 fleet and then 10 A380-800s to launch new routes? AI could schedule the A388 deliveries for the tail end of the 2010s.

But with 12 77Ws and 3 77Ls left to deliver, if they add another 20, would they need the 747-8 or A380-800? They could replace their 747 fleet with those plus have extras...

Plus Wiki says the 77Ws will replace the 747-300s and AI is refurbishing the 747-400s, which sounds like they tend to keep them...

[Edited 2007-11-18 12:55:33]

User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31679 posts, RR: 56
Reply 16, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 10155 times:

I feel the B748i would get the nos unless The Infrastructure catches up to consider the A380.
regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlineJFK787NYC From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 812 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 10129 times:

Where can AI take a380s? and where do they currently take their current 747s could it be possible they are gearing up for expansion?

User currently offlineDavescj From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 2305 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 10111 times:

I hope for a 748i order, but I suspect it will be an A380 order. Just a guess based on the massive expansion in Indian aviation generally.


Dave



Can I have a mojito on this flight?
User currently offlineMk777 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 1195 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 10088 times:

I think AI needs to launch new routes, first, with their LR's and 77W's which they have begun inducting in their fleet. So far, besides the NY region in N. America, i haven't seen them announce any new routes with their new equipment.

I guess they could replace B744 with A388 on LAX, ORD and EWR (does EWR now see the 777?) but where else are they going to fly besides remaining stuck to the NY region???

All i am saying is there has to be strategy before just buying 20 or so planes!!!!



come fly with me
User currently offlineDavescj From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 2305 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 10045 times:

I could see them flying A380 to SIN, SYD, LHR at least.

Dave



Can I have a mojito on this flight?
User currently offlineKennyK From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 482 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 10004 times:

Don't Kingfisher have 5 A380s on order ? So why would AI go for second fiddle with 748s especially with Emirates soon to be flying in and out of many major Indian cities within the next couple of years ?

User currently offlineScbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12462 posts, RR: 46
Reply 22, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 9968 times:
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Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 12):
I think Airbus is considering A389 with an EIS of 2015(there is a thread about it).

Yes, but Leahy was talking about project go-ahead in 2010. So if AI wants to place an order in early 2008, the -900 is not an option.



Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana!
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21502 posts, RR: 60
Reply 23, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 9948 times:



Quoting Stitch (Reply 15):
Pick up five 747-8Is to replace their three 747-300s and one 747-400M and then order 10 A380s to replace their 747-400s?

??

AI only flies 9 747s as capacity aircraft right now.

The other 3 are combies, with under 300 seats. Their 772s hold more pax. The 77Ws hold way more.

Thus they only need to replace 9 VLAs here. Yes, they want to grow, but the idea that they would buy 16 748I or even 12 A380 all at once makes no sense to me, not when they have a bunch of 77Ws on order with more cargo space than either, and which they are outfitting to hold 340+ pax, already their second largest plane.

I could see them with an initial order of 6 A380s or 6 748I and some additional other planes like 787-9 or 77W (or even A350, but it seems their timeframe is to start deliveries pre-A350 EIS).



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 60
Reply 24, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 9947 times:



Quoting KennyK (Reply 21):
Don't Kingfisher have 5 A380s on order ? So why would AI go for second fiddle with 748s especially with Emirates soon to be flying in and out of many major Indian cities within the next couple of years ?

I guess carriers which order the B748 will be "second fiddle'" and if carriers don't order either will be "third fiddle"... sarcastic 



"Up the Irons!"
25 LAXDESI : It's not clear to me if A388s(or B748s) will be primarily used to operate non-stop India-NA or India-MUC-NA one-stop flights. Non-stops to SFO and LA
26 Post contains images A350 : You mean, it will be a flying indian palace Only, will the have palace windows on the upper deck, too? Cheers A350
27 FRNT787 : I highly doubt the majority of passengers care what type of aircraft they are on. AI could very well go for either aircraft, but I doubt they will ch
28 Brilondon : How would you know this unless you are in on the negotiations? You are probably right though. I could see the A380 being the leading freighter in the
29 Stitch : Which, alas, they cannot. The A380-800F will likely fly and will likely find a home with non-package cargo carriers, but it might not be until the la
30 PM : The tide is currently running behind the A380 and not the 748i. Of course, that could be a good reason for Boeing to make AI an offer they can't refus
31 Flyguy1 : What is the status of DEL-JFK. Will it still be going nonstop in 2/08? Will LHR-JFK remaing, giving AI 3 daily flights at JFK?
32 Post contains images JRDC930 : It will be the A380 hands down, the 748i just doesn't offer any advantage for AI that the A380 would, especially in terms of capacity for future growt
33 Scottieprecord : This should help alleviate Boeing's timetables for 748 production, considering they delayed it 6 months (IIRC) to finish out 744 production.
34 Sammyk : They put the palace windows on the upper deck of the 744 so I guess they would on the A380. Consider yourself lucky if you don't get a chance to trav
35 Post contains images Behramjee : Great idea To make it more attractive, Boeing should offer AI a package which includes buying back their B 744s as part of AI's order for B 748Is and
36 Scbriml : I don't "know" and I'm certainly not "in on the negotiations", but it can be reasonably surmised given the lack of success of the 748i vs. A380 when
37 Post contains images Gr8Circle : AI have only 2 owned 743 combis.....in addition, they have one leased 744 combi..that makes three combis in all....
38 Flighty : The A380 is mainly seen battling out the premium markets. For AI to order the A380 would signal the beginning of the A380 developing-country phenomeno
39 Davescj : While I think this is true beyond doubt, the SQ is 12/60/399. I can see AI filling a A380, but remember with nothing like a FSuite that SQ offers. Wi
40 Jfk777 : Air India will buy the A380 since every major Asian and European airline is buying them. At some point most of these airline will fly them to India si
41 Jtdieffen : While it's impossible to refute that the 748i isn't pulling in orders left and right, it's also not a real argument to say that it's losing out big-t
42 Flighty : Very true. All right, I admit, the A380 has the upper hand given that AI is a 773ER operator. Instead of a 748 they could just get more 773ERs.
43 Gr8Circle : Hasn't TG ordered the 380? I would classify Thailand as a 'developing country' ......
44 LAXDESI : Boeing's scheduled presentation to AI is for 748I and 20 777s, for deliveries in 2011-2016. AI should hold off on ordering A380 or B748 until they ha
45 Scbriml : I'm not scoring points, just responding to the often written claim "Boeing will make them an offer they can't refuse!" or words to that effect (see o
46 JRDC930 : An excellent point. Many airlines have been evaluating the 748i and the A380 head on, and while no decisions have been made, one can see that they ar
47 Jtdieffen : We're talking about the 748, not the 744. The 748i has been on offer since November 2005. In that time the only non-top up order for the A380 has bee
48 Post contains images Scbriml : I'm just pointing out that against the A380, Boeing is struggling to sell planes, whether it's the old 744 or the new 748i. British Airways (12), Gru
49 Jtdieffen : I guess I just don't see the 744 as relevant to the the discussion. It makes it sound like it's a new aircraft. The 744's demise was brought on by a
50 Post contains images Aarbee : Hmm! Do you actually think that AI fleet planners keep that in mind (commonality factor) ..
51 MotorHussy : Not to mention China and CZ. Regards MH
52 MotorHussy : BTW, I think this order is Airbus's to lose! With the incredible growth of the economy and population of the sub-Continent, AI needs the A380. This na
53 Post contains images OA260 : I knows its the old livery but gives an idea....sure does look good.
54 Post contains images KC135TopBoom : What would be the business case to justify introducing two new models to do that? If AI wants to replace their VLAs, and do it as cheaply as possible
55 ERAUgrad02 : OOOOOO!!! I have to admit that is PRETTY. Do one of 747-8i PLEASE.
56 Post contains images Gr8Circle : And in the new colors please.....once we have all the pics side by side, we can take a decision on whether AI should go for the 380 or the 748i....
57 Stitch : There likely isn't. Frankly, I think if anything, AI is going to place an MoU for the A380-800 with a nebulous EIS date. That way, if traffic grows t
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