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What's The Matter With Olympic?  
User currently offlineATHYEG333 From Greece, joined Jun 2007, 104 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 1 month 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 9900 times:

Hi,

There is a lot of discussion here in Greece the last couple of weeks about the condition of Olympic's fleet.
More specific three of the four of Olympic's 737 (3 733 & 1 734) leased from the Spanish company Hola airlines
found with major problems. The first incident occurred, according to Greek Daily newspaper "Ethnos", when the B737
(EC-JQX) took off from Milan (bound to Athens) with cabin pressurization problems and returned shortly to Milan and technicians repaired the plane in order to fly back to Athens. It wasn't the first time that the problem took place; the technical base in Athens said that it couldn't fix the problem and requested from Boeing to send a group of technicians to investigate the aircraft. The aircraft is still in the ground since the incident!

After one week, another Greek newspaper "Eleftheros Tipos" revealed that the Olympic's technical base found in a second B737 (EC-KHI), also leased from Spanish Hola, a hole 5x50 mm in the cargo department, just covered with glue and painted accordingly. This problem never mentioned before from Hola, according to the newspaper!

The third incident occurred today with another B737 (also leased from Hola) bound to Athens from Corfu. The glass in one of the captain's window's, probably from a problem again with the pressurization in the cabin, got near to broke and the plane made an emergency landing back to Corfu.

I know nothing about Hola airlines and their aircraft and if anyone know sth pls help! I am flying to Brussels on Sunday with OA and I am a little concerned about all those incidents. My flight is with a 734, I hope not with one of those "birds"! What's happening with OA lately? I am curious how many "incidents" Olympic had with those planes?

191 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 27315 posts, RR: 60
Reply 1, posted (7 years 1 month 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 9836 times:



Quoting ATHYEG333 (Thread starter):
I know nothing about Hola airlines and their aircraft and if anyone know sth pls help! I am flying to Brussels on Sunday with OA and I am a little concerned about all those incidents. My flight is with a 734, I hope not with one of those "birds"! What's happening with OA lately? I am curious how many "incidents" Olympic had with those planes?

They really need to get rid of those planes. OA have a very good safety record if nothing else and they need to maintain that. If something happens then OA will finally go bust. They would be wise to lease better 737's or A320's . Whilst things have gotten better over the last 6-12 months and they are trying to modernise and restructure they still have alot of old baggage that needs to be dumped. Incl the nasty people that work in SKG ( see Fliegers TR ) !!!

There are very well educated people in OA and they are trying their best. I have very good friends in OA in high level positions and it makes me mad to think that they are trying to get things back on target whilst others let them down.

MONO TIN ELLADA !!!!


User currently offlineWolflair From Mexico, joined Sep 2007, 171 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 1 month 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 9682 times:

Jumping in the speculation cart, I wouldn't be surprised that reporting those incidents to the public could be used as a leverage for some sort of "aid" or "public brainwashing" before getting some new birds.

I am not sure how much the government could intervene (I am not familiar with OA ownership structure) but creating such an environment and a couple of "breaking news" in ETN or in Mega to support the case, the public (and some politicians) may not cry out loud if some taxpayers money is put to "good use" as a loan for new a/c....

Just as OA260 said "Mono tin ellada"



JMM -A319,A320,A321,A333,A343,AT45,AT72,B462,B722,B737s from -200 to -800,B744,B752,B762,B763,BE35,DC91,F70,Ju52,MD80,S3
User currently offlineRyanairGuru From Australia, joined Oct 2006, 5940 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (7 years 1 month 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 9563 times:

The Greek government can't do anything. It would contravene EU competiotion laws, being deemed "anti-competitive".

Out of interest, have OA returned their last pay-out to the Greek government, they were ordered to by the EU Competition Authority, but last time I heard they were resolutely refusing to do so.



Worked Hard, Flew Right
User currently offlineFLIEGER67 From UK - England, joined Sep 2003, 5186 posts, RR: 55
Reply 4, posted (7 years 1 month 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 9497 times:

Kalispera, ATHYEG333,

the single Hola 734 is returned to spain, so a 734 seems to be a real OA aircraft.
A HellasJet A320 is also in service for OA nowadays.

For some actual impressions, have a look at my experience Tuesday, last week:

Kalimera Thessaloniki, Olympic Included! (by FLIEGER67 Nov 18 2007 in Trip Reports)

Regards,
Markus (FLIEGER67)



Next: London City connections!.
User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 27315 posts, RR: 60
Reply 5, posted (7 years 1 month 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 9416 times:

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 3):
Out of interest, have OA returned their last pay-out to the Greek government, they were ordered to by the EU Competition Authority, but last time I heard they were resolutely refusing to do so.

The Greek government was ordered to pay back OA for services it screwed out of it so the debt was greatly reduced. The Greek courts finally stood upto the Greek government.


See here :::::

In 2006 OA was thrown a life line, when the courts ordered Greece to repay them almost 564 million euro owed to the airline. The money was owed to OA from legally subsidized routes to Greek islands and costs of the relocation to the new airport. The money will be used to pay back part of the State aid declared illegal by the European Commission in December 2005. Olympic Airlines have re-designed their website to introduce the e-ticket service launched on July 31st 2007 in response to the surge of online booking and online check ins. The e-ticket service introduction by EDS meant Olympic abolished their old "Hermes" booking system which had served the company for more than two decades.


On September 12, 2007, OA won a legal battle with EU Regulators. The Luxembourg-based court ruled that Greece must pay back most, but not all of the money The European Commission had demanded them to repay back. The court found that the Commission failed to prove that some of the funds violated EU state aid rules. Those funds included unpaid taxes on fuel and spare parts, as well as unpaid fees to Athens International Airport. The new amount owed by Olympic is €130 million from the original €160 million.

:::::

So at least things are not as doom and gloom as people said. If they can get a good business plan and funding for 4-6 A320's then they will be ok. They can sell the current OA 737's to Hola !!!lol......

Quoting FLIEGER67 (Reply 4):
A HellasJet A320 is also in service for OA nowadays.

Yes the funny thing is that OA actually state when you book in a CRS system like Galileo if the A/C will be a Hellasjet or a Hola A/C!! At least I can avoid the Hola ones LOL.....

Hola should be renamed ADE!!!!

-------------------------------------

See also here :::

http://news.ert.gr/en/c/11/28706.asp

A crack on the cockpit’s window alarmed the passengers of an Olympic Airlines plane en route from Corfu to Athens, as the pilot had to return to the island’s airport just a few minutes after its takeoff. The airliner is one of the five the Olympic Airlines have leased from Spain-based Hola company. The several occurrences reported on Boeings leased from the same company prompted OA to abort long-term leases.



So OA have aborted the Hola long term leases!!!

[Edited 2007-11-19 12:40:34]

User currently offlineSergioAEE From Greece, joined Jun 2006, 45 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 1 month 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 9277 times:



Quoting OA260 (Reply 1):
Whilst things have gotten better over the last 6-12 months and they are trying to modernise and restructure they still have alot of old baggage that needs to be dumped.

Ah yes, how they got a new CEO and the first things he did was order a new leather chair for his desk, and ask for two "highly skilled" secretarys..

Take this from someone whose entire family worked over 25 years in OA as flight crew or middle management (station managers): Olympic is Greece's "butter-mama". Everyone who has connections to work there does so because they are pretty well paid for greek standards, and have no real threat of getting fired (if they have got a job threw connections). Olympic used to throw out experienced managers because some "politically connected" person wanted a specific chair because it was well paid. What exactly do you mean when you say things have gotten better over the last 6-12 months???? OA260 i know from your previous posts that you are a well and open minded aviation enthusiast... but to believe something like that is beyond me.

If they wanted to they would cut about 2000 useless jobs TOMORROW and increase their profits. They would end this whole "perminant employee" non-sense and make people work their rear end off to keep their jobs.... Instead they lease cheap, old, and battered a/c where they can get them cheap and draw the HISTORIC logo on them! I love this airline so much, that I want it to close, because i cannot stand seeing it like this anymore... The only hope is if one of the known, greek millionairs decide to buy the airline or invest massive amounts of money into it, for the hope of more profit... If OA stays the way it is as we speak.. it will only get worse...

Sergio


User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 27315 posts, RR: 60
Reply 7, posted (7 years 1 month 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 9250 times:



Quoting SergioAEE (Reply 6):
Take this from someone whose entire family worked over 25 years in OA as flight crew or middle management (station managers):

Yep me also . The family has a long history of working in OA in all fields. I grew up with OA and made my first flight when I was in a cot . I also worked for them in various depts. so OA has been part of me from day 1. We also got the jobs on merit and not being the 2nd cousin of Papandreou or Mitsotakis!!!

Quoting SergioAEE (Reply 6):
Olympic used to throw out experienced managers because some "politically connected" person wanted a specific chair because it was well paid

Yes everytime the government changed they got another Pondios in to look pretty. I wont argue there.

Quoting SergioAEE (Reply 6):
OA260 i know from your previous posts that you are a well and open minded aviation enthusiast... but to believe something like that is beyond me.

Thanks lol..... But maybe I love OA for the airline that it could be . It pains me to see people screw everything out of OA and government using it as their private jet . This is Greek culture and its that mentalty that needs changing. Alot of decent people as I said before work in OA and want a good decent airline that runs well and offers good service.

There is a old school that wants to hold everyone else back just like everything else in Greece. It will take another 20 years to bring Greek mentality upto the standards of the rest of Europe and I say that as a half Greek who is very patriotic about my Greek roots.

We need a decent workforce and tough decisions and a good business plan !!! If this does not happen then maybe it is time to shut it down and admit that Greeks have crapped on their own airline.


User currently offlineATHYEG333 From Greece, joined Jun 2007, 104 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 1 month 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 9128 times:



Quoting SergioAEE (Reply 6):
I love this airline so much, that I want it to close, because i cannot stand seeing it like this anymore...

I agree!

Quoting OA260 (Reply 7):
If this does not happen then maybe it is time to shut it down and admit that Greeks have crapped on their own airline.

It should have happened years ago! Because there is not a wise politician to end this mess, it does not mean that everything is OK! The last 17 years, from 1990 onwards, the "governments" tried to restructure the airline 4-5 times!
The company during all these years made its only profit in 1995! 17 years and a single year of profits! Amazing!
As a Greek tax payer I refuse to pay anymore some 2000-3000 excess employees to just sitting in offices in El. Venizelos doing nothing! And the employee unions opinion? We want a "good" state owned airline!!! State owned?
For God's shake! State owned in today's competitive airline industry! It's the Greek f...... mentality, everything owned by the state, so everyone can find a job, paid well and doing nothing!

EPITELOUS AS DOULEPSEI KAPOIOS S' AFTI TI XORA!!!


User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 27315 posts, RR: 60
Reply 9, posted (7 years 1 month 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 9040 times:



Quoting ATHYEG333 (Reply 8):
As a Greek tax payer I refuse to pay anymore some 2000-3000 excess employees to just sitting in offices in El. Venizelos doing nothing! And the employee unions opinion?

If they really want to shake the airline up and bring in new mentality they need to hire Greeks from the Diaspora who have a different mentality when it comes to business. People who work to targets and customer service. When I come back to Greece the customer service is 50/50. You still get the ''den boro'' attitude in alot of Greek companies. One company I have to say I am very impressed with is Vodafone Greece. They really know how to treat the consumer.

The argument is not to just shut down OA , the argument is that the Greeks need to change their mentality. Maybe OA is a representation of the wider problems in Greece itself. I notice that alot of Greeks that have been brought up abroad in USA/Australia/Europe have a high percentage of being in high level jobs and very successful businesses. There are of course exceptions inside Greece itself , my family are all well educated and speak multiple languages and have a different mentality. As I said before its a shame that the rest of the citizens cant raise themselves.

OA have been thrown a lifeline from the EU and the Greek courts so this really is their last chance. Some tough decisions need to be made and they need to get the the staff sorted out.


User currently offlineCornish From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 8187 posts, RR: 54
Reply 10, posted (7 years 1 month 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 9035 times:



Quoting OA260 (Reply 7):
We need a decent workforce and tough decisions and a good business plan !!! If this does not happen then maybe it is time to shut it down and admit that Greeks have crapped on their own airline.

Well the Greek govenrment is currently trying to desperately hawk it around to certain foreign airlines to see if there are any takers. Failing that, it may well finally decay further until it finally collapses.



Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 27315 posts, RR: 60
Reply 11, posted (7 years 1 month 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 9021 times:



Quoting Cornish (Reply 10):
Well the Greek govenrment is currently trying to desperately hawk it around to certain foreign airlines to see if there are any takers. Failing that, it may well finally decay further until it finally collapses.

I would like to see QR get it but QR wont stand for the current work practices and righfully so. They would be the kind of airline that could inject the cash needed to turn it around.


User currently offlineCornish From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 8187 posts, RR: 54
Reply 12, posted (7 years 1 month 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 9010 times:



Quoting OA260 (Reply 11):
I would like to see QR get it but QR wont stand for the current work practices and righfully so. They would be the kind of airline that could inject the cash needed to turn it around.

Exactly. For any airline it would make far more sense just to set up a whole new airline rather than try and rescue and restructure OA.



Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
User currently offlineBP1 From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 593 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (7 years 1 month 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 8877 times:

They are busy looking at ways to buy Alitalia.

Just Kidding.

Cheers,
BP1



"First To Fly The A-380" / 26 October 2007 SYD-SIN Inaugural
User currently offlineOlympic707 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 266 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (7 years 1 month 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 8853 times:



Quoting ATHYEG333 (Thread starter):
There is a lot of discussion here in Greece the last couple of weeks about the condition of Olympic's fleet.
More specific three of the four of Olympic's 737 (3 733 & 1 734) leased from the Spanish company Hola airlines

I flew one of those 737s from SKG - ATH, those planes are in bad shape!  frown 




Quoting ATHYEG333 (Thread starter):
After one week, another Greek newspaper "Eleftheros Tipos" revealed that the Olympic's technical base found in a second B737 (EC-KHI), also leased from Spanish Hola, a hole 5x50 mm in the cargo department, just covered with glue and painted accordingly. This problem never mentioned before from Hola, according to the newspaper!

I noticed what looked like patches with globs of paint on the side of the fuselage on one of those Hola 737 I flew on.  eek 


OA's planes (The ones with SX-*** registrations) are in good shape. The JFK-ATH, ATH-JFK trip I had in September was on the A340, very nice and in like new shape!


Yanni



Fly Olympic - Aviation GREEK STYLE!
User currently offlineOlympic707 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 266 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (7 years 1 month 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 8822 times:



Quoting OA260 (Reply 5):
So OA have aborted the Hola long term leases!!!

Good! Those Hola planes are going to ruin OA's great safety record.

OA management has to wise up and get new planes.

Yanni



Fly Olympic - Aviation GREEK STYLE!
User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 27315 posts, RR: 60
Reply 16, posted (7 years 1 month 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 8809 times:



Quoting Olympic707 (Reply 14):
OA's planes (The ones with SX-*** registrations) are in good shape. The JFK-ATH, ATH-JFK trip I had in September was on the A340, very nice and in like new shape!

Yes I agree the 340's are ingreat shape. A credit to OA engineering dept and mechanics. OA has always had a good maintanance dept thats why they need to get rid of these Hola 737's. Even if it means axing a few more routes. The A300-600 is also in good shape. They would have been better keeping the older A300's than getting these sub standard 737's from Hola.

Anway we pray for better times ........


O THEOS KSERI !!!!


User currently offlineOlympic707 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 266 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (7 years 1 month 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 8712 times:



Quoting OA260 (Reply 16):
The A300-600 is also in good shape. They would have been better keeping the older A300's than getting these sub standard 737's from Hola.

Gia Sou OA260,

OA had 3 A300-600, they sold 2 of them to Iran Air. I herd from a BWI worker close to FedEx says that the last OA A300-600 will be sold to FedEx spring of '08.

OA management does not make sense. Sell good planes you need, lease junk.  Confused


Yanni



Fly Olympic - Aviation GREEK STYLE!
User currently offlineATHYEG333 From Greece, joined Jun 2007, 104 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (7 years 1 month 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 8625 times:



Quoting OA260 (Reply 16):
They would have been better keeping the older A300's than getting these sub standard 737's from Hola.

With Olympic's technical base these birds (A300) could fly for ...100 years (!!!) without a problem! Where, did Olympic "discover" this Hola "company"?

Quoting Olympic707 (Reply 17):
OA management does not make sense. Sell good planes you need, lease junk.

It makes sense... Old, typical Greek practises! Spend less taxpayers' money, keep the rest in your OWN bank account!!!


User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 27315 posts, RR: 60
Reply 19, posted (7 years 1 month 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 8485 times:

OA Hola statement::

http://www.eptaoa.gr/announcements/2007-11-21.htm


User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5724 posts, RR: 24
Reply 20, posted (7 years 1 month 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 8397 times:

Thanks for the link OA260, now me you and the rest of the greeks on here know this, but for our other friends, how about a translation?


Check out my blog at fl310travel.blogspot.com!
User currently offlineOlympic707 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 266 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (7 years 1 month 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 8294 times:



Quoting ATHYEG333 (Reply 18):
With Olympic's technical base these birds (A300) could fly for ...100 years (!!!) without a problem!

 checkmark  Agree, That goes for any airplane. That's how good OA mechanics are.

Quoting ATHYEG333 (Reply 18):
Where, did Olympic "discover" this Hola "company"?

Pos Kseri? Who Knows?  Confused

Hola website http://www.holaairlines.com/index2.html


Yanni



Fly Olympic - Aviation GREEK STYLE!
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26150 posts, RR: 50
Reply 22, posted (7 years 1 month 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 8283 times:

Hey guys, I was recently talking with a senior executive at a European airline and the following came up about OA.

Zoom back 20 years to the early 80s.

Olympic -
Global network to the America's, Asia, Australia, 747s, relatively young A300, B732 fleet rounded out with 727s and a few left over 720/707s offering on par service and product with most European national carriers.

Turkish Airlines -
Smallish domestic and European network with older DC-9s, 727s, two unwanted giant DC-10s and a few 707s offering marginal service, and the worst ontime performance of AEA member airlines.

Then fast forward to 2007

OA -
Vastly shrunk network with near complete focus on Europe and domestic market using what today are seen as small and older 737s stuck in a time warp. Operates in a holding pattern due government ineptness.

TK -
Expanding global network from a well developed Eastern Mediterranean hub at IST offering strong connectivity. Profitable operation, on the way to become the 4th largest airline in Europe (after AF/KL, LH, BA) offering one of the best baggage and ontime performance of AEA members and just having joined a global alliance.


Now great kudos to the Turks for developing a strong airline and taking advantage their geography, but everything they managed to accomplish at IST, OA should have been able to do at ATH particularly as it was a few decades ahead as an airline. Instead OA did not even manage to maintain its status quo, but instead actually went backwards as the rest of Europe and the world continued ahead.  banghead 

Seemingly the only good thing OA has experienced in these last 20+ years is a new home at Eleftherios Venizelos airport.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 27315 posts, RR: 60
Reply 23, posted (7 years 1 month 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 8261 times:



Quoting LAXintl (Reply 22):
OA should have been able to do at ATH particularly as it was a few decades ahead as an airline. Instead OA did not even manage to maintain its status quo, but instead actually went backwards as the rest of Europe and the world continued ahead.

True and it really is a sin that they let it get like this. TK is a true example of what can be done. I have to say I love TK as an airline and cant wait for them to join Star Alliance. Your points are very true . It just shows you how tables can turn, but hopefully they can turn again .


User currently offlineRenfnl From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 74 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (7 years 1 month 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 8249 times:



Quoting Olympic707 (Reply 21):
Hola website http://www.holaairlines.com/index2.html

The translated text has spelling errors. Funny!


25 Post contains images OA260 : Didnt notice that before LOL......... That text doesnt really live up to the experience OA has had with them !!! And they say ''beware of Greeks bear
26 Kaneporta1 : I had pretty much the same conversation with an OA f/a on the way back to LHR recently. I was the one that mentioned the TK (and EK and QR) case, and
27 WesternA318 : Personally, I think OA should see itself as the premier airline to Greece, and for a more leisure air about it, much like a Spirit Air or Air Jamaica
28 Alitis : apo tin diaolou tin mana, esti fenete Got on to one after just deplaning off one of the A340's (Marathon) from JFK. What a let down, run down and dow
29 WesternA318 : LMAO, I'm going to have to agree after seeing one for myself last time sthn patrida. Agreed, took one from IST-ATH last time in Greece and found it a
30 Kaneporta1 : With European open skies coming into effect soon, what chance does OA stand competing U2, FR, LH and any other airline that decides to operate routes
31 Post contains images Olympic707 : The MOST important thing to me is OA safety record, something TK and other airlines can't touch! All this "bad" and "den boro" attitude from OA emplo
32 OA260 : I have to agree. 90% of all my experiences over the years have been very good. Yes you get the odd one at check in or ticket desk whos having a bad d
33 Post contains images Olympic707 : I seen a lot of foreign travelers in SKG, maybe that is why some OA employees get frustrated due to language barriers. My cousin works at SKG, she is
34 OA260 : LOL....well even I had a bad experience at SKG !!! I find the best staff work at Swiss check in but they were Swissport I think .
35 VinnieWinnie : As far as I'm aware the european open sky you talk about has already been in existence for many years now! I suppose no-one has ever been interested
36 WesternA318 : Good point, but TK also has a stellar reputation with their new fleet, do they not? Also, how do carriers such as Cyprus Air, Egypt Air and MEA compa
37 Post contains images OA260 : Dimitra's and not Dimitris I hope LOL.....
38 WesternA318 : Heh...just talked to her last night even, and her names Afroditi...although much more rettier than the fabled greek goddess...
39 OA260 : LOL..... you will be racking up those Icarus miles in future then maybe ??? I have to say the LHR service is the flagship service as its the A340 and
40 WesternA318 : Or let her rack up the OnePass miles, lol.
41 OA260 : You know what Ellinidas are like !!! Not to mention an OA one ....I wouldnt be telling her to do anything LOL....
42 WesternA318 : LMAO, I got her hooked on CO when we did FCO-EWR-SLC in BizFirst, then Domestic First
43 Post contains images OA260 : Haha ....tempt her with your big seat On another note 7 days and I will be in Greece again , cant wait . I smell the Tyropittas already !!! Id love t
44 WesternA318 : STOP! Youre making me hungry, lol. If youve ever been to Thessalia, or Trikala in General, theres an orangeade there called Kliafa, GOOD stuff....
45 Rolfen : MEA used to be like this, even much worse. It was about to disappear. It got restructured, renewed its fleet, fired a bunch of people (not withtout p
46 WesternA318 : That would probably be the best example, as from what Ive heard, MEA is profitable, and has been for a while I think the Bank of lebanon is a private
47 ATHYEG333 : Where did you read that? Only in your dreams,sorry! OA's estimated LOSS for the current year is 150 million euros (!) with an accumulated loss of 600
48 OA260 : The A3 and the OA fares are the same . I was looking at Business class by the way but Y class is the same also. I would like to fly OA up and then A3
49 ATHYEG333 : Sorry, but what's the point to pay for Business class in a half an hour domestic flight?
50 OA260 : The lounge access is nice and the flexability to change the ticket . I just prefer it. A Y class is EUR100 so theres not alot of difference .
51 Olympic707 : I don't know or do I care, I will never fly them. OA does have a better safety record period. I don't think they are better. The reason that old 747
52 Post contains images Olympic707 : I don't think they serve hot or cold food or the time to serve it. The seats are the same except there isn't a middle seat on business class. Economy
53 OA260 : TK is a brilliant airline . I have flown them to Cyprus Via IST a few times. The service was great and the food and drink was nice. The catering remi
54 ATHYEG333 : I agree! I mentioned it (the safety record) in my first thread (back in July) and none agreed with me, equating the safety record of the two airlines
55 OA260 : Yes ...why do you doubt that ??? Did you fly TK recently ??? Have you transited through IST ??? Its TK joining Star Alliance you know . They have nic
56 Semsem : Sounds similar to Helios the Cypriot airline. It's a shame as Olympic is a good airline. However it seems that Aegean is the growing Greek airline now
57 OA260 : What exactly is similar to Helios and OA??? Helios was cutting costs and were cowboys !!! OA has always had safety first policy and top of the range
58 Post contains links LAXintl : Hope this is not an anti-Turkish bias. Give TK a try. I think you will be mildly surprised at their offerings combined with a good network and modern
59 Post contains images OA260 : No its maybe a perception. I have been to Turkey and Northern Cyprus a few times and have always been very well looked after. When I was in Istanbul
60 ATHYEG333 : to LAXintl I agree that TK's fleet and especially its Airbus part of it, it's superior from OA's aged B737 (the biggest part of OA's fleet). I said be
61 OA260 : I had brilliant flights personally on TK !!! So I would use the word Brilliant because that was my experience. If you dont think so then that is for
62 Post contains links and images ATHYEG333 : To OA260 (and everyone who can read Greek) http://www.ethnos.gr/article.asp?catid=11378&subid=2&pubid=147537 It's an article about Qatar's interestin
63 Post contains images TKfan : Noticed this thread before, i had to read it again when Turkish Airlines was mentioned It is really sad for me seeing Olympic Airlines struggling and
64 LAXintl : Agree totally its rather sad to see Olympic in the shape it is these days. Getting THY involved in the conversations was my fault, however as in my Re
65 Kaneporta1 : I did not read it anywhere, a OA f/a told me. As I don't have access to OA's accounts, I took his word for it... Same f/a also mentioned about the QR
66 ATHYEG333 : I think Karamanlis is in difficult position right now because he has to "open" several other issues like the country's Insurance policy and the futur
67 TKfan : to LAXintl agree to most of your observations and suggestions, but why not, it works well with SK, LH, LO, LX, OS all neighbouring countries although
68 TKfan : sorry, double posting[Edited 2007-11-25 15:04:26]
69 Kaneporta1 : You pretty much nailed it there. OA's long term strategy is until the next election... I somewhat disagree. I would say keep the A340s for 10 or so m
70 OA260 : Totally agree the A340's are fine. Maybe a cabin refit but the A/C is good for years yet. A320 is good idea and fits OA well. A350 is the way to go a
71 Semsem : >>What exactly is similar to Helios and OA?>> What I meant were the pressurisation problems. I am not blaming OA for the bad condition of the aircraft
72 OA260 : Oh ok lol....yeah they are similar from that point of view. Another reason that OA needs to get these out of the fleet.
73 TKfan : ok, agree, the A340 are very young theres no urgent need to replace them. when I made my OA-future-fleet plan the 350XWB was not available, nor any d
74 Kaitak : Or better still, E-jets - E-195s, lighter and more economical? I was very interested in the comparison, earlier in the thread, between the developmen
75 Elven : A340 are fine planes to serve existing long distance Olympic destinations. 734's need to be replaced as they date back to 1991. My opinion is that Oly
76 Post contains images ATHYEG333 : I totally agree, with the addition of some CRJ's maybe for the islands! Now, about the A340's I think it should stay in the fleet for another 6-7 yea
77 OA260 : I wouldn't care if it was Boeing or Airbus as long as the aircraft are NEW. Maybe it doesn't help the crew morale to be on crap old aircraft. New airc
78 VinnieWinnie : well apart from a few airline enthusiast perspective I agree the A340 should carry on flying to LHR. But for Mr Doo the average business traveller it
79 TKfan : I understand your idea to keep the A340 as a flagship, but A330 is also a decent and gorgeous looking aircraft. And sufficient for their current netwo
80 Post contains images OA260 : I know and I have told the mate I have in the web design dept and I think they will revamp in 2008!!! The problem is that the budget for the website
81 ATHYEG333 : A330 is one of my two favorite airplanes (the other is the 777). I 'd really like to see A330 in OA's some day, I really do. But let's phase out the
82 VinnieWinnie : yeah but for these services OA gets a big fat subsidy which probably accounts for most of its profits other than traffic to LHR, FRA and BRU!. So bet
83 LHRBlueSkies : What's the matter with OA? Simple, like many other state-supported airlines, AZ for example, they are c@*p and should be shut down, or made to operate
84 ATHYEG333 : C O R R E C T ! ! !
85 Post contains images TKfan : dont agree, just its brand and logo is worth keeping it alive. As I mentioned before, OA is a classic for me as is AZ. I d rather shut down the union
86 OA260 : Well my reasons are not only for cheaper tickets!!! LX have a special Business class fare DUB-SKG for €270 All in and double miles !!! It will add
87 OA260 : BRAVO!!!! You are 100% correct........ I totally agree. Put staff on performance targets !!! The Greeks will get a shock of their life ......but its
88 ATHYEG333 : Greeks and performance targets? What's this? It's like Indians ever trying to eat a cow! Lol....
89 LHRBlueSkies : Both are living off an IV, and need to be allowed to rest in peace! Neither has a wonderful history, both being mismanaged by managers and unions ali
90 VinnieWinnie : Bring back the diaspora and a lot of things can happen! Greek people are very clever people just that in Greece at least they have that very laid bac
91 Post contains links OA260 : Never say never there are alot of Greek companies who operate on par if not better than alot of Western European ones. They are all private, so it ca
92 ATHYEG333 : I could not find more appropriate words and phrases from yours to describe the situation here! For everything that works or does not is this f......
93 Olympic707 : Being a Greek, why not fly OA, Aegean or Cyprus airways? Yanni
94 Olympic707 : I'm not going to answer. I travel to Greece. Why would I want to try TK? I'm Greek, I fly a Greek airline. OA gets me there and back safely and comfo
95 LHRBlueSkies : Because they are all friends and family, and friends of family - on cheap ID tickets!!!!
96 Post contains images Olympic707 : Can't blame everything on the unions. With out unions there will be slave labor and people working for nothing with no benefits. Why should management
97 VinnieWinnie : Add capacity and fly a half empty 380 seater! That is plain madness! Not even including yields which would be atrocious! I believe OA used to have 74
98 OA260 : Theres nothing that says because your Greek or Half Greek in my case that I have to fly a Greek airline. That would be a bit stupid for someone such
99 ATHYEG333 : Sorry but OA is already over-over-over-staffed! There are people sitting in OA's offices (even pilots) doing nothing for months and paid very well an
100 Post contains images Olympic707 : Who said anything about a A380? I said A340-600 and yes it will get filled in the summer months. That is management problem, not a UNION problem. I s
101 Olympic707 : Sorry, again management problem. How about the overpaid STUPID management that is ruing OA? Again can't blame unions on EVERY problem. Yanni
102 Olympic707 : An A332 has a smaller capacity than the A343. JFK-ATH, ATH-JFK flights are full. A346 will work better. Call me old school, but I like 4 engined airc
103 OA260 : Thats very true but if a airline like QR takes over but retains the OA brand which is what I would expect then Im sure maintenance will not suffer. I
104 LAXintl : During summers maybe, but bleed even more money the rest of the year. As you know Greece is an extremely seasonal market. And an opportunity for Gree
105 Post contains images ATHYEG333 : I think you missed the point here, sorry! The MANAGEMENT in OA is actually the unions! I do not blame them for everything, I simply consider their "m
106 Post contains images Laxintl : Sounds about right. Afterall Athens being the birthplace of democracy, they have taken it to an all new level -- corporate paralysis With some well u
107 OA260 : Yes but I hope that they can do it in a way that they will make voluntary redundancies and that good staff can be retained in any new operation. Its
108 Olympic707 : Extremely seasonal??? I've been on a full JFK-ATH and back flights in October. OA can alternate between the 343 for off peak and 346 in the summer "e
109 LAXintl : Sure is. Here are the facts. 2006 monthly stats for OA's ATH-JFK-ATH route. Total monthly roundtrip passenger boardings and load factor. JAN- 7763 /
110 ATHYEG333 : I do not know why you insist too much!!! A346 is BIG for OA!!! I 've been in half empty flights ATH-YYZ last December! Greece is pretty much a "summe
111 Post contains images Olympic707 : September & October is when I fly to visit family. On the average I counted 10 empty seats in economy. That is an added plus to fly OA. I guess I was
112 Post contains images OA260 : LOL..... ...If the QR deal goes thru it will be Dionyssios from Doha !!! Well one thing you cant argue with is OA has far superior meals in Y class o
113 Post contains images TKfan : thanks might be radical and not feasible, but should do half of the work its my very own opinion, other than that cant get used to air berlin, easyje
114 OA260 : I have to say if I was going to fly ATH-JFK I would always choose OA A340 with PTV's over others. US Airways get me miles but I would never fly them
115 LAXintl : Ask and you shall get. 2006 IST-JFK-IST Total monthly roundtrip passenger boardings and load factor JAN- 13359 / 79.5% FEB- Data Missing - but I'd gu
116 OA260 : Would you say TK get alot of Middle East based clients transiting in IST??? Say THR-IST-JFK???
117 Laxintl : About 20% of TKs overall IST traffic is hub connections. One of the most significant connection point off the US flights besides domestic Turkish dest
118 OA260 : Doesnt surprise me , also alot of Europeans use IST. The fares from DUB to SIN and BKK are amazing value. Thats why I cant wait for them to join Star
119 ATHYEG333 : Because I don't know much of these things: Do u think TK will rise the price of tickets in certain routes after the STAR Alliance membership takes pl
120 OA260 : Yes maybe they will but I dont think it will happen right away. I think they will have to be in Star for a year at least before we see major prices r
121 Post contains links VinnieWinnie : From the Airbus website: An A340-600 in a 3 class configuration: 380 seats An A340-600 in a 2 class configuration: 416 seats http://www.airbus.com/en
122 ATHYEG333 : This is the book I was referring to in one of my answers! Together with another of his books, The Airline Business, both are MUST READS!!! Doganis is
123 TKfan : Thanks very much LAXintl, quite impressive figures. remarkable, in some month OA is carrying more passangers while having a lower LF. Guess has to do
124 Laxintl : They might have more flight frequencies also. Double flights some days?
125 Olympic707 : Unions are for worker's rights, fair wages and benefits so workers could provide better for their families. What is wrong with that? Why should manag
126 Kaneporta1 : I don't think so, I'm doing the LHR-ATH-LHR run about once a month, both on BA and OA, and BA have consistently better prices and better onboard prod
127 Post contains links Olympic707 : As a paying passenger all that means nothing to me or the average passenger. Safety record, incidents and fatalities. OA: going back since 1948 20 in
128 OA260 : I disagree, I think OA have a better product on the LHR route and I have done them all. I have over the last few years done LH/LX/LO/AZ/OS/BA/OA and
129 Post contains images TurkishWings : I think this is like the 20th time you have said this You really are looking forward to it aren't you? Me too actually. I think it will be great. The
130 Post contains images OA260 : I would like to see A330 . It would look nice . Your right LOL....i always say it . I feel as happy on TK as I do on OA. Being Star Gold I will have
131 Kaneporta1 : I just cannot see how the OA product is better. IFE: BA have overhead screens on their 767s and A320s and do actually play movies. Even though the OA
132 OA260 : I have always got a few channels and not just a map . My Uncle flies the route every few weeks so I will ask him what he gets also. Agreed. I agree i
133 Post contains links and images OA260 : BTW guys there is a young guy from the USA who loves OA and Greece and is hopefully going to join Anet soon. He always enjoys these threads on OA and
134 Kaneporta1 : I buy my tickets from the airline websites. I'm flying in December with BA, J class and I paid £475. OA were over £600. I also booked for February,
135 WesternA318 : Very nice indeed...Anyone know if the new 737NG';s are coming sometime before I grow gray?
136 Post contains links OA260 : Whilst Y class is not much difference . J class should be able to get a better fare :::: Try :::: http://www.allsun.co.uk/Contactus.aspx This is the
137 VinnieWinnie : Classic Left wing argument: Greedy management and poor workers! Well your view my view and that of many others especially concerning OA no need to co
138 OA260 : Sorry dont get your point !! You have mis understood !! The point was made I clarified it . Please RE read below as to what I was replying to !!!! Th
139 VinnieWinnie : Mistake corrected didn't express myself clearly! Sorry!!!
140 Post contains images OA260 : No probs .... dont want to get on the wrong side of Greeks lol....as Im sure you will know by your girlfriend LOL.... A few Anutters have Greek girlf
141 Wolflair : I've only heard about a "travel agency not far from Regent Street" for getting cheap tickets. But what sense does it make if you don't get good deals
142 ATHYEG333 : What I really enjoy being a member in A.net is that from my original thread about OA's leased planes from Hola, we are now talking about Wolfair (fro
143 Post contains images OA260 : The A346 is way tooooo big for OA !!! The A330 or current A340 is enough. Some people probably think OA should get the A380 LOL.......The flying Tave
144 Kaneporta1 : The man knows what he's talking about!!!
145 Post contains images OA260 : Why does A3 not start a London service???? Is it on the cards for the future???
146 ATHYEG333 : I was wondering the same thing. Does anyone have some info because I saw sth in a newspaper about Aegean's new routes in the 1st quarter of 2008 but
147 OA260 : I did read on here a while back that A3 wouldnt go head to head with OA on major routes other than Germany for some reason. Paris and London spring t
148 Post contains images ATHYEG333 : I 'd really like to see that happening... Maybe Toronto or Montreal would be good routes to start.... ...or maybe they could get an A346 for the extra
149 Post contains images OA260 : Stamata Vre !!!!! LOL.........
150 ATHYEG333 : Nice pic. I made sth with the A380 and Pasok as you said and I 'd like to post it here. It's a modified pic from A.net's database. Should be a proble
151 OA260 : No probs ....please post..... Did you notice the mistake on the OA rings logo ??? Behind every ''cycle'' instead of ''circle'' LOL.......It was a mis
152 Post contains images ATHYEG333 : The pic is small when I save it and I can see what is behind every circle. Do you a bigger one? I love to see what u have! Btw yesterday was the inaug
153 ATHYEG333 : I don't know if the picture uploaded correctly...
154 OA260 : Cool thats great news. Doesnt OA have a codeshare on it??? Haha too funny I must email my cousin that.....it will make them laugh.... You know that A
155 Post contains links and images OA260 : This has been supplied by Bobby Catone !!! Its very good I think .....even if it is just a dream ..... They could put a Souvlaki shop and Zaharaplasti
156 Post contains images Wolflair : Getting back on the conversation about OA. What looks interesting is the large number of similarities with the situation in Mexican aviation a few yea
157 Post contains images OA260 : The lounges in general in ATH are very good. I love the Swissport lounge and the OA lounge is very good.
158 TK787 : Good one 260, made me laugh so hard. I would agree with keeping the 340s, till 350 arrives. If more capacity needed to get some 332s in the meantime.
159 Olympic707 : Yes he does, he e-mailed me a couple of times asking about OA and Greece in general and wanted me to send pictures (I did). I asked him to do a Lockh
160 WesternA318 : If A3 goes up against OA, they can only throw their 737's and A320s where OA can possibly throw in an A300 or A340. The capacity dump would be akin t
161 OA260 : Did anyone see Sundays ''kyriakatiki'' ??? Big article on the state of OA !!!
162 Post contains links Olympic707 : TA NEA OA article. (In Greek) http://www.tanea.gr/default.aspx?d=20071204 Kathimerini OA article (In English) http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w...s
163 FLYYUL : Will Olympic cancel long-haul? from what i've heard, and this is purely heresay, that longhaul is actually profitable onm a year-round basis.
164 Post contains links OA260 : No OA will still mantain links to LHR/JFK and some other vital international routes but will be scaled down . They may grow again depending on perfor
165 WesternA318 : Can someone fill me in on OA's current fleet? Exact numbers are needed, and I cant find them anywhere.
166 Post contains links Baexecutive : Try www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olympic_Airlines#Fleet hope this helps
167 OA260 : 42 - the 4 that belong to Hola . They have/will be given back.
168 LHRBlueSkies : From Flight today... Olympic Airlines will be prepared for liquidation. Greek Minister of Transport Kostis Hadzidakis is planning the closure of the l
169 Post contains images OA260 : Do you have a link to this article ??? Some of the things are correct and some are wrong. The Greek government want to retain the name. So it would b
170 LAXintl : I say this is great news, and might finally signal some movement on this long saga and the realization the status que cannot continue.
171 Post contains links LHRBlueSkies : ta-daaaaaaa http://www.atwonline.com/news/other.html?issueDate=12/7/2007 and it was ATW not flight, sorry!
172 Post contains links OA260 : I agree that the status quo cant go on but they need to keep the name and the famous rings logo which is what is being proposed. They need to scrap t
173 Post contains links LAXintl : I guess the unions did not think much of Transport Minister Hadzidakis plans http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/071207/greec...olympic_airlines_protest.html?.v=1
174 OA260 : It was expected ,, its a hot topic in Greece and will stir many emotions. The country is split on this issue. The government need to be strong but be
175 Olympic707 : Anybody knows if the JFK - ATH - JFK route will be retained? Reducing the fleet to 20 aircraft, I would think the ATRs & Dash-8s would be kept for the
176 OA260 : Too early to tell but I would think they would want to keep the A340s as thats all they have for any kind of longhaul. LHR/CDG/FRA and JFK would be mo
177 Post contains images Olympic707 : That's good, I will still have my ride to Greece! Yanni
178 OA260 : Einai mono yia Sena pedi mou !!!! I spoke to the Government and told them if they axed JFK you would have to change your username to DL 767 LOL......
179 Post contains images Olympic707 : Efharisto! I hate to change my user name to that Yanni
180 OA260 : Parakalo... I would hate to see you do that also LOL...
181 OA260 : Does anyone know whats still parked at Hellenikon (if anything)???? I was thinking of getting the tram there to take a look.
182 Post contains links and images SXDFC : Thank you for posting my works Dellas! Hey I would however love to see the 787 with Olympic, maybe the 788 for long haul and the 783 for medium -shor
183 Post contains images OA260 : Kalos stin Anet!!!! Welcome to Anet ....finally . Great to see you here !!!
184 WesternA318 : It's kinda funny the article mentions this. In my groups bid (alongside AirOne/Aegean and Homeric Tours from NY), we recommended 1100 job cuts. The p
185 Kaneporta1 : If you can wa till till around 22nd-23rd, I can give you a lift there. Not much to see though, just a 747 and a 727. Can't remember if there's also a
186 SXDFC : Kaneporta1: Are people actually allowed inside the airport its self, as I am sure theres some interesting stuff in there. Anyone know if there is sti
187 OA260 : Hi there and thanks very much for the offer but I fly back on Tuesday. I maybe will go Sunday morning. I was thinking of getting the tram to outside
188 Post contains links and images Kaneporta1 : I don't know if people are allowed in, but I do know that they do hold various events there from time to time, concerts, exhibitions etc. There isn't
189 OA260 : Ok thats cool will try to make it over the other side to see the A/C. Thanks also for the brilliant map. Its years since I was that side of the airpo
190 Olympic707 : Welcome SXDFC Yes there is a 737-200 and a BAC 1-11, I think the BAC 1-11 is a Air Greece aircraft. Yanni
191 Bennett123 : The BAC 111 was MSN 096 of Hellenanic Air. It was N1130J and due to become SX-BAR, (ntu).
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