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Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets  
User currently offlinePohakuloa From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 403 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 24075 times:



Quote:
Hawaiian Airlines said today it will invest up to $4.4 billion to acquire 24 new Airbus wide-body jets, in a deal that will allow the company to fly to Europe, Asia and other new long-range routes.
The state's largest airline said the new aircraft will be purchased over the next decade and will replace its existing fleet of 18 Boeing jets, which are used on its transpacific routes.

The snipit also goes on to say they will be getting airframes with Rolls Royce power plants. I knew that they would eventually be wanting to replace their 763ER's but I had no idea that it would come this soon. They don't say which aircraft they will get but even money says its an A330 and with the routes and expention hinted here im guessing they will likely be 332.

I think this was a pretty big shocker for me when I first read the article. It is an update and I am sure there will be more on it in tomorrow's paper, but I wanted to see what the masses here had to say about it.


Honolulu Advertiser Article

Quote:
First thread started and completed! Woo hoo!!

- Craig


Fast cars and 'Jet A' - such a sweet smell!
207 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 24964 posts, RR: 85
Reply 1, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 24089 times:
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Here's some more:

http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/...es/prnewswire/LAW12828112007-1.htm

"Hawaiian has signed Memoranda of Understanding with Airbus and Rolls-Royce to acquire six wide-body A330-200 aircraft and six A350XWB (Extra Wide Body)-800 aircraft, with purchase rights for an additional six A330-200s and six A350XWB-800s"

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineKhobar From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2379 posts, RR: 4
Reply 2, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 24001 times:

6+6=24???

New math?


User currently offlineJetBlueGuy2006 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1647 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 24011 times:

Is this a slap in the face to Boeing? It seems like they are a Boeing customer, and now they are going to the bus.

Just a question



Home Airport: Capital Region International Airport (KLAN)
User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23976 times:



Quoting JetBlueGuy2006 (Reply 3):
Is this a slap in the face to Boeing? It seems like they are a Boeing customer, and now they are going to the bus.

Just a question

well what exactly would they buy from boeing to replace their 767s??? They could stand in line and be #700 for the 787 or they could get the A330 now.


User currently onlinePlanesNTrains From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 5441 posts, RR: 29
Reply 5, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23937 times:

I think this a perfect fit for Hawaiian, as the aircraft would appear to offer the capacity and range that they would be looking for. Not the least bit surprising to me anyways.

And I'm assuming the 24 is "up to 24", including options.

-Dave



Totes my goats!
User currently offlineSkyyMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23938 times:

Quite shocking to me too. I would've assumed the 787 was in HA's future, but with those lines being booked for a few years, I guess the 332 was inevitable although the 350 really is a surprise.

User currently offlineKL808 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 1582 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23940 times:

I always wondered why HA never got the A332 to replace the DC-10's they had instead of getting 763's.

Anyways congrats to both parties.

Drew

EDIT: So this will make HA the second North American A350XWB customer after US. wow thats good.

[Edited 2007-11-28 15:07:46]

[Edited 2007-11-28 15:08:13]


AMS-LAX-MNL
User currently onlinePlanesNTrains From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 5441 posts, RR: 29
Reply 8, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23892 times:



Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 4):
well what exactly would they buy from boeing to replace their 767s??? They could stand in line and be #700 for the 787 or they could get the A330 now.

True, though I think it would have been a great fit anyways. I really never expected them to go 787, as to me it seemed a pinch small - yes, I know that the aircraft are all generally the same size, but the 350XWB just made more sense to this armchair CEO.

-Dave



Totes my goats!
User currently onlinePlanesNTrains From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 5441 posts, RR: 29
Reply 9, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23847 times:



Quoting KL808 (Reply 7):
I always wondered why HA never got the A332 to replace the DC-10's they had instead of getting 763's.

I've always wondered why they didn't get some 757-200's to go along with the 767-300's on the mainland-Hawaii routes. This would have allowed them to go into some of the smaller markets, and with a perhaps lower cost used narrowbody. And, yes, the 332/333 also seemed like a winning combo for them.

-Dave



Totes my goats!
User currently offlineAirnerd From United States of America, joined Oct 2007, 251 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23845 times:

I'm pretty surprised by this. Partly because HA has been a good Boeing customre, but also becase HA has had a difficult time acquiring even used aircraft in the past, and only just purchased its first new longhaul aircraft a few years ago from Boeing. On the other hand, good for them. The 332s are great planes, and the 358? well who knows... I would think they could use A333s pretty effectively to larger west coast destinations (SFO, LAX, SEA), for a better CASM.... Even with six 332s in the near term, I'd have to assume they'll be flying at least some of the 763s for quite a while. Their fleet will be more diverse.

User currently offlineMoo From Falkland Islands, joined May 2007, 3854 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23806 times:



Quoting Khobar (Reply 2):
6+6=24???

New math?

No, not if you actually read the articles.

Hawaiian will invest $4.4b on 24 new jets, but buy them over the next decade. Their immediate order is for 12 aircraft, and they have taken 12 options. Their statement indicates that they will almost certainly firm those options up at some point in the next 10 years.

Makes perfect sense.


User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4741 posts, RR: 45
Reply 12, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23732 times:

whats interesting is the first A332 won't be delivered until 2012... and the XWB in 2017...


http://investor.hawaiianairlines.com...-newsArticle&ID=1082294&highlight=



Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlineJlbmedia From United States of America, joined Jun 2002, 622 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23654 times:
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Could this order be a combination of A330s and A350s? Just a thought.

Edit: Well it looks like I procrastinated a little before I posted. Better late than never?

[Edited 2007-11-28 15:25:31]


JLB54061
User currently offlineB6FA4ever From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 816 posts, RR: 11
Reply 14, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23625 times:



Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 12):

i like this part of the article...

The first A350XWB-800 will join Hawaiian's fleet in 2017. The wide-body jet will seat 322 passengers in a two-class configuration (First and Coach) and have a range of 69,000 nautical miles, which will give Hawaiian the capability to fly nonstop between Hawaii and Asia, Australasia, the Americas and Europe. The A350 carries 24 percent more passengers and is 20 percent more fuel efficient per seat mile than Hawaiian's current fleet.

69,000 miles, huh?!? i know i know...just a typo.

i can't wait to see Pualani colors on the airbus. tho hopefully they'll add a touch of color to the engines.

congrats to Hawaiian!

~B6FA4ever


User currently offlineHAL From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 2549 posts, RR: 53
Reply 15, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23596 times:

This is great news for us, and I'm looking forward to flying the Airbus (again). From what I can gather from our company news release, we will get some A330's on lease starting in 2009, probably used aircraft. The first new deliveries will be in 2012, and the A350's will start in 2017.

http://investor.hawaiianairlines.com...-newsArticle&ID=1082294&highlight=

In addition, Mark Dunkerley, Hawaiian's president and CEO, said the agreements with Airbus and Rolls-Royce pave the way for the company to lease additional A330 aircraft for introduction into its fleet as early as 2009, providing for growth and replacement of aircraft with leases expiring during this timeframe.


It means growth, new markets, and hopefully good times for all concerned. Aloha hui hou!

HAL

[Edited 2007-11-28 15:37:40]

[Edited 2007-11-28 15:39:26]


One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
User currently offlineYULYMX From Canada, joined May 2006, 977 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 23521 times:

i could see A333, but the A332? range is exceeding there current route? Unless they want to fly To BOS, PHL, EWR, JFK?

User currently onlinePlanesNTrains From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 5441 posts, RR: 29
Reply 17, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 23502 times:



Quoting YULYMX (Reply 16):
i could see A333, but the A332? range is exceeding there current route? Unless they want to fly To BOS, PHL, EWR, JFK?

That may very well be what they want.  Smile

-Dave



Totes my goats!
User currently offlineUAL747-600 From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 577 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 23476 times:

What is up at BCA and how could they let these guys go Airbus? Maybe the bankruptcy experience they weren't through not too long ago could have poisoned the relationship but who knows. I don't understand why they would buy A330-200's in 2012 when used 767's will be plentiful and allow them to wait for 787.

I feel a complete lose of sales momentum at BCA. They need to stop talking about the improved 777 (ala 767-400, 747-500), grow a set of balls, and come out with a new high end 777 sized aircraft. Anybody else feel a sense of deja vu coming on with Boeing?

Congrats Airbus. Great turn-around this year.

UAL747-600


User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 26795 posts, RR: 58
Reply 19, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 23449 times:

Congrats to HA. It really would be great to see them here in Europe. I presume London would be on their list.

User currently offlineAvek00 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4336 posts, RR: 19
Reply 20, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 23454 times:



Quoting YULYMX (Reply 16):
i could see A333, but the A332? range is exceeding there current route? Unless they want to fly To BOS, PHL, EWR, JFK?

Methinks HA finds the capacity of the 332 (220-250 seats) muc hmore manageable than that of the 333 (roughly 300-seater). And yes, the ability to offer nonstop services to the North American East Coast, or most anywhere along the Pacific Rim from Hawaii, is certainly a major plus.



Live life to the fullest.
User currently onlinePlanesNTrains From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 5441 posts, RR: 29
Reply 21, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 23418 times:



Quoting UAL747-600 (Reply 18):
What is up at BCA and how could they let these guys go Airbus? Maybe the bankruptcy experience they weren't through not too long ago could have poisoned the relationship but who knows. I don't understand why they would buy A330-200's in 2012 when used 767's will be plentiful and allow them to wait for 787.

I feel a complete lose of sales momentum at BCA. They need to stop talking about the improved 777 (ala 767-400, 747-500), grow a set of balls, and come out with a new high end 777 sized aircraft. Anybody else feel a sense of deja vu coming on with Boeing?

Congrats Airbus. Great turn-around this year.

Well, Boeing has sold over 1,000 aircraft this year, so it hasn't slowed too much  Smile. And while the 763 may become more plentiful, fuel won't. As for expansion to longer-haul routes, if the 763 doesn't have the legs, what do they do, wait?

Just my thoughts.

-Dave



Totes my goats!
User currently offlineYULYMX From Canada, joined May 2006, 977 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 23418 times:

HNL-London is reachable with A332? probably

User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 23376 times:

It almost makes you wonder if an order for an A-320 family a/c could be down the pipeline as well. I also wonder if some of the issues between the airline and Boeing Capital during their bankruptcy played a role in this decision. HA did return a few of the 717s they were leasing from Boeing Capital, and there were some issues in regards to lease rates as well during the reorganization. Boeing Capital even went as far as to request a trustee to run HA during the Ch. 11 process. This probably did strain the relationship between the two parties. HA had been a loyal

Quoting KL808 (Reply 7):
I always wondered why HA never got the A332 to replace the DC-10's they had instead of getting 763's.

Mainly because there weren't a lot of A330s on the open market at that time. Some of their fleet came from airlines that had returned 763s to their lessors in the post-9/11 downturn and in some cases, bankruptcy reorganization, and some were new-build a/c that were destined for AN but ended up with HA after Ansett's folding.


User currently offlineBlueShamu330s From UK - England, joined Sep 2001, 2839 posts, RR: 26
Reply 24, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 23348 times:

So with the mention of Europe in the statement, and recent discussion on here regarding Hawaii - Europe, could this be a prelude to them commencing something like a twice weekly HNL-LGW non-stopwith the XWB?

Shamu



So I drive a 4x4. So what?! Tax the a$$ off me for it...oh, you already have... :-(
25 YULYMX : anyone know if Aloha airlines will go Airbus way?
26 UAL747-600 : What city pairs that they fly, or want to fly, can be served only by A330-200 range/payload-wise? I would especially thought the maintenance plus' of
27 Lesismore : Wow, they already know how many passengers the A350XWB will seat! Do they know how many passengers the A332 will accommodate? How long will the curre
28 HAL : Correct. 12 firm, 12 options, and probably more 330's leased starting in 2009. According to our management, the 757 has a higher seat-mile cost than
29 KL808 : I have been thinking this too, BUT I feel that maybe this is a bit too big. What about an ERJ order? ERJ-170 would be a nice replacement for the B717
30 HAL : I just put a 6900nm circle around HNL on the 'great circle mapper', and I got an image that covered everything except Africa and the middle east. Obvi
31 HALFA : So the worst kept secret here at HA is finally out of the bag and now we can discuss it here. Exciting times for all of us at HA, but too bad we have
32 Post contains images PlanesNTrains : I doubt a 763 could do HNL-LGW, or at least not profitably. Join the club. It's called Dementia . I think I read 305, and that is mentioned above thi
33 Koruman : Why are people surprised at the selection of the A350 over the 787? Sure, the 787 is a generation ahead of the 777/A330, but the A350XWB is not only h
34 Aloha73G : Wonderful news for HA!!!! Hopefully they will continue to grow and add new routes beyond the Rocky Mountains, and in Asia. Again, Congrats to HA and a
35 Danny : That is the earliest availability of A330 unless you go and shop around lessors. A big surprise imo and slap in someone's face indeed.
36 PlanesNTrains : I doubt they needed that competition to figure it out. Numbers are numbers. The 763, while a great plane, is simply not up to the future requirements
37 PlanesNTrains : Who's face? Can an order not simply be an order? It seems like there is some sort of required emotional damage that must have been done everytime som
38 UAL747-600 : The A330-200 accounts for 50% or this order. The economic advantages of a 787-8 over the A330-200 will be very similar to the advantage the A330-200
39 Aveugle : Wow I never expected this. This is really surprising to me. Well I'm happy for them, I flew them last November and maybe ill be motivated to fly them
40 Post contains images EI321 : They would still get the 787 before the A350s. Why not order new 767-300s and 787s? And grow a money tree while they are at it? Not only would an all
41 Boeing7E7 : On what do you base this superiority claim?
42 NYC777 : Well just like Boeing converted some Airbus buyers into buying the 787, Airbus has now converted a Boeing buyer into buying the A350 and A330. Shockin
43 HAL : Because we have maxed out on the capabilities of the 763, and need something bigger and with longer range. Since the 332 is available long before the
44 EI321 : The preliminary specs suggest lower costs in most areas, most importantly fuel burn. It wond be a huge difference though, probably similar to the 767
45 Mir : I doubt it. The 358 will have the legs, but the 332 would probably have to take some significant penalties on that route, particulary on the LHR-HNL
46 Post contains images ER757 : Congrats to HA - I must admit I'm a bit surprised by this one, but happy to see HA growing nonetheless. I really love the flying experience on HA's 76
47 PM : Is this the first time we've so explicitly seen RR leverage A330s sales on top of an order for A350s? Boeing (and GE) have been doing this with the 77
48 SandroZRH : Something tells me that this is a nice little win for Airbus, Congrats to them. And why would they do this?
49 NYC777 : Oh you've got to be kidding. Can the same be said for QR purchasing only Airbus until recently or NW or AC?
50 BrianDromey : Congrats to Hawaiian. They will soon be introducing one of the most graceful aircraft in the skies to their fleet. With that huge wing, 2-4-2 in coach
51 Charlipr : But Airbus hasn't even finalized the 350XWB specs!!! How can you honestly say is a more advanced aircraft?
52 AA7295 : Oh matey, the XWB isn't more advanced than the 787, its pretty much copied all the advanced technologies that the 787 has. Where did you get the info
53 Eghansen : I think that it is more likely that Hawaiian is looking at starting service HNL-NRT/KIX/MNL/SYD/TPE/BNS or other pacific destinations. I think it is
54 Bennett123 : AA7295 Given that the design has not been frozen, how can we know how much B787 technology it will will use.
55 FCKC : Very very surprising.I had never think HA would be an Airbus customer one day ! Nice news.
56 PlanesNTrains : I think you know the answer. The 767 is yesterday's aircraft. The A330 is today's. The 787/A350 are tomorrow's. Given the need for new builds with be
57 474218 : Lets see in the last twenty years they flew Lockheed, McDonnell Douglas and Boeing aircraft. What is truly amazing to me is that when they flew L-101
58 Trvlr : Not sure this is the best move for Hawaiian. The A330s will be welcome lift to the mainland, but the A350 might be too big for them. While a split ord
59 XaraB : Do you honestly think that Airbus will design an inferior plane entering service at least 4 years after the 787? Plenty of time to incorporate the sa
60 AA7295 : Because Airbus has made announcements, regarding technologies that it will be using that Boeing had pioneered on the 787, such as the Electronic Wind
61 Legoguy : To be honest, I doubt Airbus can improve the A350XWB much over the 787 despite the 5 to 6 year gap between aircraft design. The 737NG entered the mar
62 AndesSMF : OK, answer this question: Here is SMF we often get two 767s leaving within less than an hour apart. I'd take it that with the tourism market, getting
63 Corsair1107 : HA will still have a sizable 717 fleet so they won't be completely out of Boeing's fold. I can't say I'm surprised at this order, having stood in the
64 Bok269 : With regards to the East coast flights, aren't they similar in length to the HNL-SYD flights? Do those flights go out weight restricted?
65 Koruman : Unless Airbus has made a proposal to replace them with more efficient A318 or A319 aircraft, which I would presume they have.
66 SANFan : Wonderful news out of HNL! It will be great seeing Pualani on new metal in new and exotic destinations. bb
67 EI321 : The A318 and A319 have different economics to the 717. Im sure the A318 and possibly the A319 also have higher fuel burn per passenger.
68 WesternA318 : Sweet news, cant WAIT to see yet another US registered A330-200
69 Bok269 : Also remember that the nature of inter-island flights is very hard on aircraft. AQ expiremented with some 734s a while back, but they were not up to
70 Post contains images ER757 : Please put her on the winglets as well as the tail....
71 CALPSAFltSkeds : I've got nothing against HA and think they have a good product for their market niche. However, this surprises me, especially with the delivery dates
72 PlanesNTrains : I too would be curious to know how they could be more "efficient" on the inter-island jaunts? Not criticizing your idea, but rather questioning wheth
73 Post contains images Khobar : I thought the title read that they had bought 24 - my mistake.
74 Kohflot : Well, they already fly to SYD and they've announced MNL. HA is in an interesting conundrum. Where to expand? Japan? The US carriers haven't exactly b
75 HA_DC9 : This is great news for my hometown airline. While I would have preferred the HA colors on a 787, i'm still excited. Congrats to HA and Airbus. I wonde
76 Caljn : Dumping product generally increases sales/revenue. Who do they think their kidding?
77 Koruman : This depends upon how they want to use their geographical location, doesn't it? Emirates and Singapore Airlines are both far better businesses than a
78 DL767captain : I find it extremely surprising that they ordered new A350s, where is that money coming from? I also find it strange that they are looking into flights
79 Cschleic : They haven't been a great Boeing customer at all. Didn't they start with the 717 when it was still an MD with McDonnell Douglas? Prior to that they h
80 Socalfive : Well I'm sure the Airbus order is more to HA's needs and fit, but I do remember there being a hell of a contentious relationship with Boeing before a
81 Pohakuloa : absolutely! also the turnaround times are far less then they are on mainland us or possibly euro routes (cant say for sure on euro routes). A lot of
82 Aloha73G : The turnarounds are usually 25 minutes on neighbor islands and 35 minutes in Honolulu (for both AQ and HA). 45 minutes would be a pretty long turn fo
83 Sxf24 : All true. Plus, this order is more about being a RR customer than loyalty to an airframe manufacturer.
84 Hellogorgeous : Wonderful news Hawaiian! The arrival of A330 in 2009 will provide a great platform to prepare crews for the A350. Any news on HA using MNL as a hub to
85 WarRI1 : I'm with both of you.
86 TZTriStar500 : Why hasn't anyone asked how they are going to pay for this and actually carry it out? I thought that HA was still not consistently profitable and is H
87 HNL-Jack : I find it interesting that Airbus, who generally doesn't hold back on announcing orders, has no mention of this on their web site.
88 HAL : HNL-JFK is very close to the distance of HNL-SYD. No, we really aren't weight restricted. I've flown a lot of the SYD flights in the past year, and l
89 Post contains images Jacobin777 : How do you come up with that comment...... ..congratulations to Airbus....though I'll be sad to no longer see the B763ER here at SJC.. ..what do you
90 LHboyatDTW : I never guessed this coming. After waking up from a peaceful nap and I seriously believed for the first 45 minutes that I woke up in a parallel univer
91 COA735 : Anybody know how Aloha is reacting to this? This could hurt them.
92 UA2162 : Wow. Talk about coming in from left field. I never saw it coming. Who knows what this is going to lead to. Kinda sad that Boeing lost out but glad the
93 Pohakuloa : Mahalo Aloha73G!! I knew it was short. Thanks for the info! I think many may agree with you saying it is not "consistantly" profitable, but i think t
94 Aloha73G : Probably not. HA does very well with the Dig-E-Players. This allows them to make "extra" money from the passengers who want a PTV, instead of giving
95 Koruman : I call that a model, with no interior. It was a gimmick to unveil it on 7/8/7, but that bird couldn't take off and fly that day any more than the Spr
96 Gigneil : The A318 and 319 are absolutely not more efficient than the 717, nor do they have the high-cycle construction. The 717 is irreplaceable in their netw
97 Post contains images Pohakuloa : i dont think they will respond. they have used the 737 for years and years and no matter the change in aircraft HA has used, they have stayed with th
98 CALPSAFltSkeds : Are we not thinking of how the loads would be balanced on the 5000 mile SouthPac-HNL and 7200 mile HNL-LON/MAN legs? You'd have to use some unique yi
99 AirlineBrat : You have a good point. Since most of those traveling on the Kangaroo Routes fly on one-stops with layovers in SIN or BKK, I checked Great Circle Mapp
100 Koruman : I wouldn't think that it would be rocket science. You'd want to have a much higher-yield configuration to make this work. Instead of the current 18J
101 Post contains images Jacobin777 : ..until recently, the A380 didn't have an interiour either...it still flew...the B787 will be flying in a few months..the A350 still hasn't left some
102 PlanesNTrains : I doubt it has any real meaning to them. Not much difference in 767 vs 737 and A330 vs 737. Actually, it will make it tougher for HA to go into secon
103 Hiloboy1 : Lets stir it up; A little early to try and spend the monies they think they're going to get from JO. Can't be hurting to much to be able to purchase n
104 Alangirvan : Except that Jetstar will be replacing A332s with 787-8s as soon as the delay is over. So, from 2009 HA 332s will be competing against JQ 787-8s, unti
105 Leskova : I'm completely surprised, pleasantly, and amazed at this order - somehow, in my mind, HA was going to order Airbus planes about 5 years after AA and C
106 Kalakaua : My heart just sank when I heard this... But oh well. I really doubt that HA wants to wait that long.
107 Gigneil : Yes. Continental. NS
108 Bennett123 : Jacobin777 Sorry, I should have said that the B787 has not flown yet.
109 AirTranTUS : And thus remain with an inferior type of IFE that is beaten by some mainland counterparts.
110 JetMech : And I guess there would be a few more, but that still leaves the majority of "blue chips" with a mix of A and B equipment. Regards, JetMech
111 HAL : Cheer up Kalakaua, in the big scheme of life it's really not such a big deal. We'll get the planes, and keep the service and people we're famous for.
112 Post contains images Scbriml : Do you think Boeing didn't have an offer for HA? I expect Airbus put a better deal to HA, or maybe, here's a wild suggestion, the A330/A350 combo was
113 Post contains links and images BR715-A1-30 : They could always go for one of these gas guzzlers... LOL!!
114 Post contains images Scbriml : Quite a surprise I have to say, but those Airbus planes will look very nice in HA's colours. We obviously don't see HA in this part of the World (we h
115 Slz396 : WOW Just imagine, a US airline ordering the XWB and in the -800 version! Some people will have to be taken to hospital after reading the report I thin
116 Post contains images EA CO AS : If you call IFE that's portable, easy to update and repair and doesn't add a significant weight penalty to each airframe "inferior," then I guess you
117 Post contains images Columba : Wow this order came as a total surprise. Never expected HA in the market for new aircraft and I expected them to order the 787 in a few years. I am ve
118 Post contains images WINGS : Indeed very surprised. Regards, Wings
119 Ha763 : I'm actually disappointed that HA went with the A358. Not that I don't like Airbus, but that I think the A358 may be too big for HA. Demand from the m
120 Post contains links and images AutoThrust : What a surprise! Congrats to HA, it will be great to see this planes come to Europe. The 787 could have been for sure the same good choice as the A350
121 Columba : Thanks I guess HA has evaluated both the A350-800 and the 787-8/-9 and that they came to the conclusion that the Airbus planes fit their requirements
122 Worldrider : good point, that sounds more like an exotic stopover on their way.. i'm sure London has a very profitable market for Hawaii.
123 Post contains images SANFan : I don't think anyone has yet posted anything along this line of thinking but in a few years, could we not perhaps see HA start some routes that overfl
124 EI321 : Thats quite interesting, particularly because this basic engine family (BR715-58) is found on Gulfstreams, Global express's and RAF Nimrods - all are
125 Zeke : This one was left field, did not expect Airbus would have a look in with this one.
126 Post contains images Chiad : Now we wont be so surprised when DL, AA and UA goes A350XWB. Heck .... maybe even Southwest will go A320NG.
127 Chiad : He he. I hear now that Airbus sell their aircraft in their webshop: webshop.airbus.com Remember to mark for "Delivery to Airport of choice." It's fre
128 Post contains links and images Scbriml : It seems they're awake now. http://www.airbus.com/en/presscentre...s/07_11_29_hawaiian_a350_a330.html
129 Burkhard : But you are no longer allowed to send your maintenance crew to do final engine tests. A real surprise - congrats to both sides.
130 Columba : " target=_blank>http://www.airbus.com/en/presscentre....html Too bad that they no pictures yet on how the aircraft will look like.
131 Post contains images SandroZRH : Let's see your photoshop skills
132 Pohakuloa : id be interested to see that as well...dont forget the wingtip design *hint: pualani*
133 Ikramerica : I doubt the planes will ever be delivered in HA colors, because I don't see HA lasting until 2012. Either they will go chapter 7 or be acquired in tha
134 EI321 : If they are in a precarious financial situation how can they afford to order new planes?
135 Mir : Several things that could throw a wrench in that: 1) Hawaii is the long way around for pretty much all destinations in Asia from Europe except for Ne
136 AirTranTUS : They don't have enough for everybody and they make you pay for it. Many airlines have moved away from making you pay for IFE, it's a thing of the pas
137 Koruman : With regard to the first point, as I showed earlier it is a comparable distance and flight time for flights between both Australia and New Zealand an
138 Gilesdavies : Great news, but was not expecting this order... Another new customer to add to this aircraft type that refuses to die and be replaced by the A350! Tho
139 DIA : I don't understand all the "HA was loyal to Boeing" talk is regarding HA. They have had L1011s, DC-8s, DC-9s, DC-10s...and probably more than I can re
140 Post contains images Scbriml : Maybe loyalty has a much shorter time-span these days?
141 JAAlbert : This is a surprise. But, really I have always hated the fact that so few US airlines fly airbus widebodies, especially here on the west coast. I would
142 LHPDX : Wow! Pdx will see 4-5 A330-200 with Hawaiian and Northwest in the future........
143 Post contains images Jacobin777 : ..no need to apologise..I only wanted to make sure we were on the same wavelength.. ..no need to get your panties in twist...there was eventually goi
144 Boeing7E7 : The A350 is so lacking in definition that there are no cost benchmarks, nor are there any objective fuel estimates. It is a larger aircraft than the
145 EBJ1248650 : 12 + 12 options.
146 EBJ1248650 : And you have to know that Boeing knows full well its airplanes don't fit everyone's needs, and that some customers will go to Airbus. Bet you a burge
147 474218 : Yes. [quote=Gigneil,reply=96]The A318 and 319 are absolutely not more efficient than the 717, nor do they have the high-cycle construction. A318/A319
148 Ikramerica : the market is changing, and when there is another downturn, HA will perish. that's just my prediction. they nearly perished last time, they are still
149 PlanesNTrains : If you get any more excited, it might be you. Does it really matter? The point was it's not a paper airplane. Why do we get off on these tangents???
150 EA CO AS : Obviously they - and many other airlines - have opted not to move away from this, as it's still a revenue-generator. Besides, the marketplace is movi
151 Post contains links XaraB : Quoting 474218 (Reply 149): [quote=Gigneil,reply=96]The A318 and 319 are absolutely not more efficient than the 717, nor do they have the high-cycle c
152 Jacobin777 : ..of course, you are certainly entitled to your opinion..but the fact they "nearly perished" last time and still are around goes to show their "stayi
153 Mir : I don't doubt that the 717 is better than the 319/320 for some missions. If it was as much better overall as some in this thread claim, however, it w
154 Kaneporta1 : I'm sure the -800 will have more range than this, even with HA high density config. Improved aerodynamics, more advanced engines will do the trick I
155 Ikramerica : No it doesn't. It just shows they didn't perish last time, not that they are now somehow bullet proof. There will be consolidation in the market in t
156 Lesismore : Yeah, I don't know where Koruman is coming from. By the time the A330's start flying for HA, they will be a generation behind the 787. If HA is waiti
157 Je89_w : Wow, never saw this coming either! Great news for HA and Airbus, and it will be nice to see HA expand their route network to more destinations. Yup, A
158 Burnsie28 : They could get 777's too for now.
159 DxBrian : I doubt HA will go to an International First Class product, as UAL and AA are the only US based airlines currently offer this class of service. They c
160 Post contains images A342 : From what I know, the PW6000 was specifically designed with a high-cycle and low-maintenance environment in mind. I don't see why the A319 should bur
161 HALFA : You have made these same predictions in several other threads involving HA. Fact is, you don't seem to have a very good grasp about HA at all. HA is
162 Mariner : Wall Street likes the deal. Hawaiian shares (HA) are one of the very few airline stocks up today. I think it is an important move, laying the ground w
163 San747 : I think its pretty likely. And I totally share your desire to see it at SAN too!
164 Post contains images Jacobin777 : ...I was calling out the fact the poster stated it was a "paper" airplane when indeed it isn't.... .....funny, but I'm not the one making ignorant co
165 Post contains images Scbriml : The very low $ is a considerable help in that respect. It's enough of a help to overcome the sometimes painful hoops that us "goddam forners" have to
166 Scbriml : Yes, we know. Unfortunately, given what we subsequently learned about the plane, your open-ended comment invited the inevitable responses. Not that I
167 Gigneil : I was in no way referring to their technologies. In every way, the 717 is a technologically inferior device. It is, however, more efficient in the Ha
168 Post contains images MBJ2000 : Yay! I can't wait for the MUC-HNL connection! I know, wishful thinking, but I'd be one of the first pax to book the route...
169 MaverickM11 : Of all the things that don't matter in life, whether an airline has IFE provided by Digiplayer or in-seat monitor has zero effect on demand or fare.
170 Pohakuloa : I am going to make a bold connection and possible "conspiracy theory" here. HA is an airline partner with Virgin Atlantic. SRB had saif he would like
171 Post contains images Jacobin777 : ..and it certainly pains me when I come to your side of the pond... ..some supposed Goldman Sachs maven stated today that he expects to see an apprec
172 Dl767captain : Thats a good idea because i didn't really understand where they would be getting landing slots from, if into LHR it would have to be pretty expensive
173 Kaneporta1 : The question wasn't open ended, I just couldn't resist... All in good spirit of course.
174 474218 : I don't think I mentioned anything about their technology, just the design life goals.
175 Gigneil : The 787 is an ultra long range aircraft. Its meant for 767 sized routes, but not their range or payload. The 787 is ideal for SRB to launch HNL if he
176 Post contains images ScarletHarlot : Geez! That's one heck of a plane! With a 69,000 nm range, you betcha it will mean growth and new markets! Heck, you could fly from HNL to OGG the LON
177 Post contains images Jacobin777 : ...got it ..too many people get and take A.net a bit too personal sometimes....sometimes not enough fun amongst aviation friends..
178 DL767captain : Yes i'm pretty sure the order is for 787-9s, but those could eventually be converted to the 787-10 variant
179 Lokey123 : Some hundred and something odd posts i finally get time to jump in and congratulate Airbus. Although this is a small order i think that it is a great
180 Gigneil : I would think both to be too big for SRB to op LHR-HNL profitably. A 787-8 would be right sized, at least at first. A 787-9 would be good growth for
181 PlanesNTrains : Is this actual inside info, or are you speculating? I ask because it would seem strange for Airbus to have this attitude when history has shown HA be
182 Scbriml : Indeed. I think the 767 is the only Boeing designed plane they've ever operated. In their history they've operated: DC-3 CV-340/440 DC-6 YS-11 Viscou
183 Columba : Would you please stop this A vs B nonsense. The A350 is an aircraft that is currently designed by Airbus and offered for sale. No parts have been bui
184 Lokey123 : I usually don't speculate without stating as such.
185 PlanesNTrains : Well, then I guess I'm surprised that Airbus felt that way. -Dave
186 Boeing7E7 : Well, if the 210-foot wingspan is any indication I wouldn't hold my breath on this claim. Engines are the same, so you miss there as well. Maybe bett
187 A342 : To make it short, no. I'm not saying they'll be better on the A350, but they aren't the same.
188 Rjm717 : Remember that Hawaiian was the first (and only I believe) US carrier to emerge from Ch 11 while repaying 100 cents in the dollar to investors. The Ai
189 Astuteman : Are you inferring that the A350's 64m wingspan is indicative of inferior aerodynamics? Greater span of itself almost certainly improves aerodynamic p
190 AirTranTUS : 1. I don't work for Mesa. So "we all" are wrong. 2. I don't hate any airline. What I hate is arrogance. The arrogance that some people from highly-ra
191 RayChuang : My guess is that Hawaiian Airlines may have gotten a deal to have another airline with a large A330 fleet to service the planes (maybe Northwest, whic
192 Don81603 : Not really. The government uses these same formulae to figure out your payable income tax.
193 Moo : A greater wing area, which Airbus is achieving through both a larger wingspan and a greater chord, improves aerodynamic efficiency significantly thou
194 Post contains images Flipdewaf : Its still held together with paper clips though isn't it? Well done to airbus with this one, looks like A330 now and A350 later is a real winning com
195 Hloutweg : Nice observation. Makes a lot of sense to me. It was indeed surprising to hear Hawaiian would go for the A350. But strong negotiations and earlier av
196 Post contains images HAL : Scarlet, I think it does, and just reconfirms my decision to come back here. Considering the strife going on over at AWA/US, I think I'm at the right
197 Khobar : If it still uses bleed air, then it's not even a generation ahead of current engines. LOL. Yeah, that's about right. So if this is a given, why do ma
198 Slz396 : Better inform the engine manufacturers then, because according to them, the bleedless concept -which is far from bleedless BTW, but rather a misleadi
199 Kalakaua : Even the B717-200 doesn't count, huh?
200 Gemuser : As a "Boeing designed" plane? Definately does NOT count! It's an updated DC9! Gemuser
201 Post contains images Scbriml : No, it's an MD designed and built plane that Boeing gave a number to. I chose my words carefully.
202 Post contains images Aloha717200 : Not a bad looking aircraft. Glad that it meets hawaiian's needs. I too was surprised to see this news appear in the USA Today. A few years back I tho
203 Post contains images Astuteman : Despite having a better SFC, lower emissions, and being quieter, than any other engine in development, or in service, including the GEnx? Constrainin
204 Post contains images Teme82 : It will be when you update the nose to the newest version.... Anyway I do hope that A will change it again so that it would look much cooler and bett
205 Moo : The concept behind bleed air and non bleed air is less an efficiency gain and more a reduction of ongoing maintenance costs through removal of the pn
206 Vfw614 : It has not been brought up on this thread, but I was wondering if the cargo capacity might have come into play - I would assume that cargo is a major
207 Post contains images Pilotdude09 : Wow only just saw this thread!, what great news for HA and everyone at HA. Hopefully they can create a great new economy product for the a/c being use
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