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Turkish Aviation December 2007  
User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4478 posts, RR: 12
Posted (7 years 3 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 6608 times:

Hi everyone,
I was really looking forward to this months thread but it is sad that we have to start this one with the news of the Atlasjet crash. My heart goes out to the families who have lost loved ones.

-I am happy to let all of you know that this is the first anniversary of Turkish Aviation Threads, just take a look at what we were talking about a year ago:
Turkish Aviation Thread Dec.2006 (by TK787 Dec 3 2006 in Civil Aviation)
-Also I see another couple of pics of A380 Turkey visit in the database:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Irfan Caliskan - AirTeamImages
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Irfan Caliskan - AirTeamImages


-I see some new members, Welcome to a.net Tkfan

Any other news, rumors, predictions?
Thanks to all for participating.

105 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineEmrecan From Turkey, joined Feb 2000, 945 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (7 years 3 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 6591 times:

All our hearts are with the victims of the AtlasJet crash.. May God be with them and their relatives..

User currently offlineAirmaillabel From Turkey, joined Dec 2005, 26 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (7 years 3 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 6543 times:

All deceased shall rest in peace.. Sad

User currently offlineStylo777 From Germany, joined Feb 2006, 3024 posts, RR: 11
Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 6529 times:

I don't know how to write it down in English so I do it my way:

kaybetdigimiz vatandaslari allah rahmet eylesin, ailelerine güc ve sabir versin, hepimisin basi sagolsun...

after such sad tragedy it is very difficult to turn to normal life again. hope the inspectors find out the real reason of this crash very soon to clear up everything.
anyhow it is nice to see that nobody after this crash canceled their flights with KK. this shows that the people are aware of the situation and the role of Atlasjet is this tragedy.


User currently offlineStylo777 From Germany, joined Feb 2006, 3024 posts, RR: 11
Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6525 times:

btw I don't know if this have been discussed before. TK is a 4-star airline now according to Skytrax.

User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4478 posts, RR: 12
Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 6511 times:

Hi Stylo,
Yes the 4* came up several weeks ago. If you remember I raised the question earlier this summer: "What would it take TK to go up to 4 stars?" At the time I was looking at customer ratings at that site, and there were more 4 stars then 3, yet overall TK was rated 3*.
Still I think there is a lot more room to grow within that 4* category. If you look at the group of airlines on that 4* list you will see what I mean.


User currently offlineTKfan From Turkey, joined Oct 2007, 673 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 6487 times:



Quoting TK787 (Thread starter):
-I see some new members, Welcome to a.net Tkfan

Thank you my friend, after reading this forum since years, especially daily now with the Turkish Aviation Threads, it was a matter of time when to join in.

You all are doing a great job, providing precious informations for me (and surely others), thank you all


User currently offlineTKfan From Turkey, joined Oct 2007, 673 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (7 years 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 6456 times:

About the star Ranking, couldn't find the news of Skytrax again, when TK was dropped to a three star Airline.
Its not the first time, as in some news stated. Turkish Airlines had 4-Star-Status some years ago.
They slipped to 3-star, maybe due to cost cuttings.

As for 5-Stars... "They must eat at least 40 ovens bread"  Big grin


User currently offlineTurkishWings From United States of America, joined May 2006, 1453 posts, RR: 8
Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 6445 times:



Quoting TKfan (Reply 7):
"They must eat at least 40 ovens bread"

This really made me laugh.. We had a teacher who once shouted at me "I will multiply you from wall to wall"  Smile Legend has it that he also used the sentence "The door is december" a few times Wink

Not much to comment on the Turkish Aviation right now but after some 5 months, I am flying extensively again in December. I am traveling to Paris on business and then to Miami, NYC, Belgium and Paris (again) on vacation soon. The schedule is as follows:

AF A321 IST-CDG Dec. 16
CO B772 CDG-EWR Dec 20
CO B738 EWR-MIA Dce 20
CO B752 FLL-EWR Dec 26
CO B772 EWR-CDG Dec 29
AF A319 CDG-IST Jan 2



Coffee - Tea or Me?
User currently offlineEmrecan From Turkey, joined Feb 2000, 945 posts, RR: 7
Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 6438 times:



Quoting TurkishWings (Reply 8):
I am traveling to Paris on business and then to Miami, NYC, Belgium and Paris (again) on vacation soon.

Hi Turkishwings,

Inform FlySSC about your trip. If you will be able to catch him, I am sure he may help you for a cockpit ride  Smile


User currently offlineStylo777 From Germany, joined Feb 2006, 3024 posts, RR: 11
Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 6409 times:



Quoting TK787 (Reply 5):
If you look at the group of airlines on that 4* list you will see what I mean.

yes indeed! just take look here http://www.airlinequality.com/StarRanking/4star.htm and you will find in which league now our national airline is playing/flying... AF, NH, BA, LH, EK, JL, LH, KE, QF, SA, LX and TG are only a few of these players...


User currently offlineTKfan From Turkey, joined Oct 2007, 673 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 6376 times:



Quoting TK787 (Thread starter):
-I am happy to let all of you know that this is the first anniversary of Turkish Aviation Threads, just take a look at what we were talking about a year ago:
Turkish Aviation Thread Dec.2006 (by TK787 Dec 3 2006 in Civil Aviation)

just read it, quite interesting as what is realised and what still not known (i.e. TK's longhaul decision)

What do you think are the chances that Turkish Airlines will order (hopefully some dozens Big grin) narrowbodies when ordering their long-haulers?
I think its not only the ageing 734 to be replaced but also the first delivered 738s. next year they are going to be 10 years in operation, and when the first slots for 320 or 738 are available they might be 15 or older.

or do you think they will be leased also for 20 years  Yeah sure


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4478 posts, RR: 12
Reply 12, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 6368 times:



Quoting TurkishWings (Reply 8):
CO B752 FLL-EWR Dec 26

Oh Boy, you know that you will be flying the day after x-mas in one of the most travelled routes in the US, in one of the most travelled days of the year. Fingers crossed, you will have a great trip and hope for weather to be nice in EWR.
News about TK:
-Next year will add 6x320s, 5x321s, 8x738s, 3x310Fs. Some leased planes and 4x310pax will go.
-Jan 1st-Sept 30th financial numbers are in: 194mil. YTL net profit ($164mil), last year same period 127mil.YTL
-Looks like TK will reach and maybe beat their goal of carrying 20mil. pax in 2007.


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4478 posts, RR: 12
Reply 13, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 6357 times:



Quoting TKfan (Reply 11):
I think its not only the ageing 734 to be replaced

TK just recently extended the leases on most of those 734s, if I am not mistaken all the way into 2010.
About the short haul of TK fleet:
-738s coming in could be 739ERs.
-319s were to be increased in numbers, but what happened? Maybe no need for a 100 seater plane in TKs fleet in the future, but how about some in 5-10years?
Besides leasing for the near future, TK will order the next generation in big numbers when time comes and no more 320/321/738 orders.


User currently offlineTKfan From Turkey, joined Oct 2007, 673 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 6340 times:



Quoting TK787 (Reply 13):
TK just recently extended the leases on most of those 734s, if I am not mistaken all the way into 2010.

I'm afraid they will be in service till 2015 (according to their pressreleases)
And if the management of 2015 is as fast deciding as the current one, we will see them still in 2025 Big grin

Quoting TK787 (Reply 13):
-738s coming in could be 739ERs.

I was thinking of that too when Boeing introduced them, bearing in mind that the A310s will leave and that they might be usefull for daily services to LOS, DEL, BOM, KHI etc.

Quoting TK787 (Reply 12):
News about TK:

the first converted 310 is now in service. additional frequencies to existing ones, and new dedicated cargo flights to CGN, TBS and ZRH


User currently offline777way From Pakistan, joined Dec 2005, 6094 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 6309 times:

Any idea which aircraft flew Abdullah Gul to Islamabad?

User currently offlineLTAC03R From Turkey, joined Dec 2005, 62 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 6304 times:

hello again everyone, news from ESB, SN brussels airlines was here for the first time today. Flight number 1091 coming in. A319 equipment. The tower had no idea of their icao callsign and kept calling them "delta alpha tango 1091"  laughing 


The difference between god and a pilot is that god doesn't think he is a pilot.
User currently offlineBahadir From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 1835 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 6280 times:

Wing,
it's nice to hear your insight on the story.
I already sent an email to a journalist in Milliyet daily when he claimed that the lack of ILS was the reason for the crash. Of course, he didn't reply back  Smile

I am sick and tired of these ILS comments in the media and by so called experts.. Most of the experienced or 'kasarlanmis' people don't know anything about ILS being replaced by some WAAS GPS approaches in the near future. The cost of doing these approaches are much lower compared to ordering ILSs. The airplanes can be upgraded to use these approaches but no one will be interested in doing that.

I really wish that incident will lead to the following in Turkey:
- Better CRM techniques.
- Better crew scheduling. (Your former airline is still using pen and pencil)
- Better rest periods.

As far as the landing in Poland incident I have known the f/o since 2001 and I think she has been flying in Sky since then..

Take care..

Bahadir



Earthbound misfit I
User currently offlineTurkishWings From United States of America, joined May 2006, 1453 posts, RR: 8
Reply 18, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 6272 times:



Quoting ThereAndBack (Reply 20):
Quoting TurkishWings (Reply 8):
CO B738 EWR-MIA Dce 20

Good luck with that flight...

Why?  Smile



Coffee - Tea or Me?
User currently offlinePilotaydin From Turkey, joined Sep 2004, 2539 posts, RR: 51
Reply 19, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 6238 times:

Degerli arkadaslar, bugun 3 Aralik, askerlik sinavina girdim, officially, asker oldum, ucuslarim durdu, artik yazin bi ara gorusmek uzere, 12 aralikta teslim olcam, hepinize saygilar, gokyuzune iyi bakin benim icin  Smile

aydin



The only time there is too much fuel onboard, is when you're on fire!
User currently offlineEmrecan From Turkey, joined Feb 2000, 945 posts, RR: 7
Reply 20, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 6235 times:



Quoting Pilotaydin (Reply 23):

Aydin, hayirli teskereler kardesim... Allah sabir versin..

We would like to see you soon back..


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4478 posts, RR: 12
Reply 21, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 6217 times:

Pilotaydin,
Good luck, it will be over before you know it. Drop us a line once in a while please.


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4478 posts, RR: 12
Reply 22, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 6344 times:

http://www.thy.com/tr-TR/services/ca...ces/cargo_flight/new_aircraft.aspx
2nd TK 310F first flight Dec.1st.
Next one to be completed in March.


User currently offlineTKfan From Turkey, joined Oct 2007, 673 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 6326 times:



Quoting Pilotaydin (Reply 23):

Hayirli Teskereler, hope you will have a pleasant time. I m still escaping from this duty  Big grin


User currently offlineTKfan From Turkey, joined Oct 2007, 673 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 6325 times:

to TK787

you wrote in the November thread, that the two 332 will arrive in 2009, but other than that there are two more 332 and a 343 to arrive until the end of this year (I think Wing said that in the same thread)


Another question of me is, when Air China is going to fly daily to IST next summer, will Turkish Airlines codeshare on this flight? And do they keep the routing PEK-PVG or just fly nonstop to PVG?

Anyone has infomations on that?


25 TK787 : I didn't put that down since it is not confirmed.
26 TKfan : me neither, but Bahadir talked about an agreement with a middle eastern leasing company. thats why I also asked for the serial numbers. The two 332 c
27 TK787 : I think it is getting a bit confusing but I will try to clear this: -2x332s coming in early 2009 from Celestial -2x332s and a 340 to arrive this month
28 Wing : Aydýn all I have to say is there is nothing to worry about.I am sure once you get used to the conditions and the commanders you will see everything i
29 Bahadir : I just saw a TV news brief , another reporter crying faul for not having ILS in Sulu Airport. I want to puke.. Aydin, close your eyes, ears and nose a
30 Post contains images Bozo : 739ER?!
31 Bahadir : TK787 sorry to burst your bubble but TK doesn't have any orders for 739ERs. The only Turkish carrier that has order for that equipment is Sky Airline
32 Post contains images LTAC03R : Aydin, i'm guessing you're in Ankara till the 12th. We should meet up before you go. En büyük asker bizim asker diye omuzlara almak gere
33 TKfan : What are the chances TK may switch the remaining 738 into 739ER? I think the 739ER is not in direct competition to the 321, they can do LOS, DEL, BOM
34 Bahadir : TKFan, 737-900ER or -900 would have been a great airplane for the routes that TK is using A321 for. The airplane can pack pax when you need more pax t
35 Post contains images TurkishWings : Hayirli tezkereler olsun Aydin... I too went last year at the very same time.... It will be a hard time but you just need to take it easy... You are
36 TKfan : Thank you very much for your informations. Are you sure about 3000 nm? That is much more than a 738 (TK: 4755 km)? My thoughts were based on the info
37 Post contains links Bahadir : Lion Air took the delivery of the first airplane. http://www.lionair.co.id/promonews_archives.htm http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/2006/q3/060717b
38 TKfan : think there was a confusion, i was talking about the future, not when the routes were inaugurated. my thought were the 739ER as an substitute for the
39 Bozo :
40 Post contains links and images TK787 : Here is TC-JCV at the paint shop. I think this is the first 310 that was converted at Dresden. So first they got converted then they get a paint job i
41 Stylo777 : most probably they have no paint-shop facalities at DRS
42 Bahadir : I am sick of TK's website's booking system. Was shopping around for some IST-SEA-IST tickets but the booking engine doesn't even consider the IST-JFK
43 Post contains links and images Bahadir : Interesting report on a TK 737-800 that almost kissed the ground leaving STN. http://www.aaib.dft.gov.uk/cms_resou...ng%20737-800,%20TC-JGR%2011-07.pd
44 Laxintl : Mention it to the person whom I had given you contact for. I'm sure he'd be happy to get input.
45 Post contains links Bahadir : Interesting article about TK's India service. There may not be that much of a O&D traffic but there are many connecting opportunities. http://www.prop
46 777way : Read at another forum TK interested in flying to Bangalore and Chennai, latter will be cargo only.
47 Post contains images Wing : I have read the report it is quite interesting.STN was my last flight before I went to military so its been a while that I went there.I was about to
48 LTAC03R : If you ask me, the greater the number of eyes looking after one another the safer the flying environment. The TK flight may not have been alerted so
49 TK787 : Latest news from ch-aviation; lots of wet-leasing: -Inter Airlines (6K/Antalya) has wet-leased two of its three A321-200s to Saudi Arabian Airlines (S
50 TK787 : I tried to look up some fares for May 2008, between IST and DLM, and as usual disappointed. TK has the monopoly on this route, with 4 flights a day an
51 Laxintl : IzAir operates some Pegasus flights. And 3rd one was leased to TK for the Hadj and will be kept around as an operational spare remainder of the winte
52 TK787 : Of course, keep forgetting that they even existed. Again, how come no other carrier wants to do DLM flights in off season, where TK can do 4 flights
53 Wing : I agree with you if someone reports "look something leaking from the engine or a part of the wing is broken" and continues to do his job.But after ca
54 LTAC03R : Umm... they only called the ground controller actually. It was the ground controller who called everyone else. and they did not use it to pinpoint th
55 Post contains images Pilotaydin : Arkadaslar, yarin gidiyorum....peace to all of you and a happy new year KARA KV 5'iNCi ZH. TUG. K.LIÄžI GAZiANTEP - PIYADE, ER hakkiniz helal edinnn
56 Emrecan : Hayirli tezkereler, kolay gele kardeþim ........ See you ASAP....
57 Post contains images LTAC03R : helal ossuun! poÅŸet seni
58 TK787 : Pilotaydin, Best of luck to you, we will miss you here.
59 Post contains images Bahadir : Aydin, kolay gelsin kardesim. Send us postcards from Erbil we should be there soon..
60 LAXintl : With THY attending the Star alliance meeting in China this week, TK's official alliance induction date of March 18, 2008 has been announced. In additi
61 TK787 : March 08 for Star is great news. Time to start getting some UA miles on TK flights. TK wanted those extra frequencies for sometime, what seems to be t
62 LAXintl : Even if it does not use the frequencies right away having them available is important. Today TK has maxed out its allotted China frequencies (7 only)
63 TKfan : Great news and much more details as the news on airporthaber. Maybe TK can codeshare on CAs Flights to PEK and use its own rights to serve PVG and CA
64 777way : Have Saudia stopped serving Ankara?
65 LAXintl : I believe while some countries can indeed be reluctant to offer liberal bilateral, much of the problem goes back to the Turkish CAA whom historically
66 TurkishSky : TK's DXB flights go double daily as of late January. Earlier, they added a second flight 3 days a week now it is now daily.
67 Stylo777 : the newest addition to TK fleet: TC-JPM / A320-200
68 TKfan : ok, didn' t thought about the Turkish CAA itself. I think you mentioned some time ago the problem with the HKG CAA, when TK wanted to increase its fi
69 Laxintl : That again was a Turkish CAA fault in reality. Hong Kong and CX indeed very much wanted additional traffic rights and proposed daily frequencies by b
70 TK787 : Hey guys, Since we are only couple of weeks from the end of this year this comes to mind. By this time next year, if nothing else changes, TKs single
71 Post contains images TKfan : Exactly, thats what you have explained when the issue was discussed here. But is this the only problem?? Afaik TK has (had) fifth freedom rights betw
72 Post contains images Virgin744 : Does anyone have any clues as to when the TK announcement will be made regarding the Airbus or Boeing orders supposedly in early 2008? Early 08 could
73 TK787 : I was expecting before the end of this year, but doesn't look good so far. Q1 or Q2 seems like it. Hopefully sooner than later before all the slots ar
74 Post contains links TKfan : talking about CAA and bilaterals, according to a turkish aviation site, a new agreement is signed with UAE, for up to 5 flights to AUH and up to 18 f
75 TK787 : I was kinda surprised to find out today ( Dec.18) that, only the TK20 Beijing flight is operated by a 332. No other 332 flights today. I have never se
76 TKfan : maybe they are on the return flight? Did you check also the arrivals?
77 TK787 : I usually don't. But I did, and TK 1980 from LHR is a 332. There must be a mistake, since that plane didn't overnight in LHR. Still, where are all the
78 TK787 : Tomorrows (Dec 19) schedule is more like it: 332s to AMS, LHR, JFK, PEK, JNB, BKK. So it is really weird that today only a single flight, it must be a
79 Stylo777 : according to flightstats.com these are todays flights opt by 332 TK1951 to AMS TK1979 to LHR TK1186 to TLV TK020 to PEK TK021 from PEK TK067 from SIN
80 TK787 : Thanks Stylo, That makes sense, don't know what was wrong with TK's website.
81 TKfan : seems they are extra flights for the upcoming Bayram.
82 Post contains links TK787 : Here is something new; Turkey's 4th largest airport to be built near Kutahya: http://www.airporthaber.com/hb/detay.php?id=22784 (in Turkish only) I do
83 Wing : Umm...No,they didn't.If it was like that I wouldn't call them to be carried away,infact "as it is written on the report page 3" "Copilot informed the
84 TKfan : are you sure of that? read yesterday in a Turkish aviation site that they end their talks without any result. A.Sabanci is looking to acquire another
85 TKfan : nice topic, read that too yesterday and thought about another dead-investment. which city they want to serve from AKU (AfyonKutahyaUsak). I think the
86 Wing : Well I don't know,my father is a captain in Onurair and these were what I heard from him a few days ago.The words inside the company were even specul
87 TK787 : It all sounds confusing, with 320s to go PGT colors, and MDs to remain Onur colors. Wing thanks for the insider info, maybe Bahadir can give us the in
88 Post contains links TKfan : I wanted to confirm this as sometimes insider informations are better than in any news, especially if they make some news to say nothing. Found the n
89 Post contains links and images Debonair : Flight Global is reporting, that 3 Turkish airlines were grounded after inspection by their Civial Aviation Authority. These carriers are GOLDEN AIRLI
90 TK787 : The article, dated Dec. 17th, says Turkish CAA wanted to inspect World Focus after the holidays in Turkey since finding some problems during the Nov.
91 Gokmengs : I can only speak for GOLDEN as I have a family friend in the ownership, they were actually making lots of money leasing and chartering, but what they
92 Firiko : Is this the financial effect of the recent crash ? Was it planned before the crash?
93 Laxintl : Turkish CAA has a minimum fleet requirement (IIRC 3 aircraft) for air carriers. The law was instituted in the mid 1990s result of the many fly by-nigh
94 Wing : The A320's were wet leased to Saudia Arabia airlines for 5 years contract which was very good "hot cash" to save the company from bankruptcy.But the
95 Post contains images TKfan : I totally agree to your comments. Its now time for consolidations. theres no need for 20 Airlines with just one aircraft flying!!! Thats exactly the
96 Firiko : So how many aircraft aircraft do they have left for the domestic market ?
97 LTAC03R : 2 A319s and 3 CRJs.
98 Bahadir : I have been dealing with so many different things that I haven't even had a chance to come online: - Mom is taking chemo well, hopefully she will kick
99 Firiko : What would you consider a turn around ?
100 Post contains images Stylo777 : if this comes true, for sure my favorite airline for the domestic market with always new aircraft, friendly crew and really good service will shut do
101 Wing : Bahadýr, Best wishes about your mother,I hope she gets well soon. Yesterday I was with my dad's for dinner.He said in was announced in Onur air that
102 TK787 : Bahadir, Greetings and best of luck to you and your mother, since I am in the same boat. I am spending the holidays in Seattle with my father in law d
103 Stylo777 : just got an email from TK that you can earn miles on Asiana (OZ) flights.
104 Post contains images Bahadir : TK787, I will be back in Seattle on the 9th. If you are around let' s get together and save the Turkish aviation
105 TK787 : Bahadir, Thanks for the offer, too bad I just got back to nyc last night. Next time for sure.
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