Quote: Plane Slide-off at Idaho Falls Airport; Airport to Re-open
Allegiant Air flight 515 slid off the runway at the Idaho Falls Airport Monday around noon. It was en route from Las Vegas, Nevada to Idaho Falls.
Due to weather-related conditions on the runway, the aircraft's nose wheel ran off the end of the runway. No injuries are reported out of the 143 passengers that were onboard.
No injuries, thankfully.
Formula 1 Grand Prix Trips: YUL '08, MEL '09, BCN '10, SIN '11, and LGW '12
Flyf15 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 1, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 4322 times:
Airport surface condition reports are sketchy and hit-or-miss at best at these smaller outstation airports such as the ones Allegiant, or any regional, flies into. It can be like pulling teeth to get an accurate up to date one and often its obvious that the report is flat-out made up.
Its unfortunate that the people on the ground do this... in the least it causes bent metal, and at most, is risking lives.
MtnWest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2122 posts, RR: 1 Reply 2, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3959 times:
Off subject, but what amazes me is the load factor on this flight. IDA must be doing OK for G4. Glad no one was hurt.
Alias1024 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 2644 posts, RR: 2 Reply 3, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3931 times:
Just found out one of my good friends from work was holding short #1, and saw the maddog go off the runway. I'll try to find out more from him if I can.
Quoting Flyf15 (Reply 1): It can be like pulling teeth to get an accurate up to date one and often its obvious that the report is flat-out made up.
I love it when dispatch gives me a six hour old braking action report while flying through a blizzard.
It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems with just potatoes.
FlagshipAZ From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3419 posts, RR: 15 Reply 4, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 3832 times:
Thank God no one was hurt.
Anyone know which ship was involved here?
Regards.
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy." --Ben Franklin
TazzrassinIDA From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 38 posts, RR: 2 Reply 5, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3693 times:
Hi,
I was there. Here are some pictures of it, not just the nose went off, the whole plane was in the grass. It was tail N883GA. Made for a highly interesting day at work... Truly glad no one was hurt. After we got it pulled back on the cement (with an 8 wheeled farm tractor) and towed back to the terminal, (I did the towing!) the mechanics thoroughly inspected it. After replacing one of the nose wheel lights and a ton of paperwork, the plane was cleared to go and took the people to Vegas. Things could have been so much worse, but were not, and for that I am grateful.
Georgebush From New Zealand, joined Jul 2006, 679 posts, RR: 0 Reply 6, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 3660 times:
Nice work Tazz. Always great when we can get a first hand report. Great photos as well. I used to work for G4 in FWA and these things DO indeed make for an interesting day at work. I broke a tow bar once during push back... oops! I do indeed miss Allegiant ops.
TazzrassinIDA From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 38 posts, RR: 2 Reply 7, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 3648 times:
You can't really prove it by the pics, but when the bird touched down we had pretty heavy snow and 1 mile visibility. Not too long there after it cleared... go figure. It was pretty amazing to me when this happened, all of the different entities on the field came together and helped out as one team. Really made things easier.
Georgebush From New Zealand, joined Jul 2006, 679 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 3620 times:
Quoting TazzrassinIDA (Reply 8): go figure. It was pretty amazing to me when this happened, all of the different entities on the field came together and helped out as one team. Really made things easier.
Were you watching her when this happened?? I know we used to sit on the ramp and watch the arrival, but if it was a blizzard you prolly wouldn't see me out there.
If you were watchin it as it happend, what was your original thoughts/coworkers thoughts words?>
Goldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 5441 posts, RR: 12 Reply 9, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 3455 times:
Quoting Alias1024 (Reply 3): I love it when dispatch gives me a six hour old braking action report while flying through a blizzard.
Unfortunately, that's often the only information we can get. Reports from 121 flights are great. Reports from braking tests are okay, but don't tell the whole story., and there are few airports that will proactively go and measure the runways on an hourly basis.
Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
TazzrassinIDA From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 38 posts, RR: 2 Reply 10, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 3246 times:
First, I want to address the comments about lack of field conditions/made up conditions. Our Airport Ops/LEO's are normally very good at keeping up on condition reporting. When weather is bad they are normally either driving the runway (they have a tapley device in their truck), or in writing up the new condition. Our maintnance crew also does a wonderful job responding to the weather. In fact, there were 2 plows out plowing and sanding the runway 15 min before Allegiant landed. After they were done the runway was "tested" it tested fine. Then the tower told everyone to clear the runway so Allegiant could shoot the approach and land. That is how fast conditions were changing. Granted I will give you I was not in the trucks or the cockpit. I just know from almost 7 years here, and what I saw, how things happened.
Now, off my soap box and on to the rest! At first it was snowing hard enough that you really could not see the plane at the end of the runway at all. In fact the only person I know of that was close enough and saw them run off was one of the plow drivers. Not even the tower could see them. When Allegiant called the tower to tell them they were off, the tower was asking them if they could see this or that to try to establish how far off they were. The station's first indication of problems was when they radioed in saying they would need a bus because they went off the runway. Kind of shocking really. Then everyone went into response mode, we had agents that tried to take care of our passengers, off of Allegiant and our Horizon flight that had to return to the gate, they were waiting at the end of the runway to take off... Then there were some of us that went out to the plane to help out there and do what we could. Our station manager, poor guy, had a million people that wanted his attention and wanted him to do stuff. Our airport manager was fantastic at being out there providing what he could and making arrangements. The rest of the airport maintenance staff were right there. Our FBO staff were out there providing what help they could. Everyone I am probably forgetting a bunch of people here, the point is, I can not possibly begin to say what went wrong. It all looked to be running the way it should have. When things did go down hill, everyone responded in a great way. In the end no one was hurt, the plane still flew (by deffinition making that a great landing i think! ), a good turn out for what could have been.
Alias1024 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 2644 posts, RR: 2 Reply 11, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 3009 times:
Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 9): Unfortunately, that's often the only information we can get. Reports from 121 flights are great. Reports from braking tests are okay, but don't tell the whole story., and there are few airports that will proactively go and measure the runways on an hourly basis.
True. But I've had instances where dispatch has failed to SELCAL well after a new report was issued. Old report was bare and dry. New report was for poor braking action with 2-3 inches of snow on the runway and taxiways. I got the report on the in-range call from the station, when they asked if dispatch had passed on the braking report they had made 45 minutes earlier.
It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems with just potatoes.
National757 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 717 posts, RR: 1 Reply 12, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 3009 times:
Thanks for the update Tazz! Really appreciate all the pictures and the excellent reporting.
Quote:
Idaho Falls Airport Director Len Nelson says proper protocol was followed as far as the amount of snow plowing and sand on the runway during snowy weather.
He says they may need to focus more on clearing the ends of the runway, where the plane slid off, and the airport may look into using de-icing liquids on the runway to prevent this from happening again.
If proper protocol was followed, how does the plane end up off the runway? Is he indirectly blaming the pilot or acknowledging the airport's protocol should be changed to prevent this type of thing from happening in the future?
Formula 1 Grand Prix Trips: YUL '08, MEL '09, BCN '10, SIN '11, and LGW '12
PropilotJW From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 585 posts, RR: 7 Reply 13, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 2975 times:
I must admit... the second to last picture of the aircraft looks great... I can see the ad now... They can use that picture and a picture of one of their planes on the Beach... "From snow to sand - fly Allegiant" hahahahahaha
A340Spotter From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1973 posts, RR: 26 Reply 14, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 2881 times:
Quoting TazzrassinIDA (Reply 7): You can't really prove it by the pics, but when the bird touched down we had pretty heavy snow and 1 mile visibility. Not too long there after it cleared... go figure. It was pretty amazing to me when this happened, all of the different entities on the field came together and helped out as one team. Really made things easier.
Tazz,
Thanks for all of the updates you gave, including the fine pics. Must have been quite interesting to push an MD-80 through snowy grass back onto the concrete. Did they lay anything down ahead of the push? Good job!
JSD
"Irregardless, it's a Cat III airplane, we don't need an alternate!"
AirTran737 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3639 posts, RR: 12 Reply 15, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 2842 times:
Quoting National757 (Reply 12): If proper protocol was followed, how does the plane end up off the runway? Is he indirectly blaming the pilot or acknowledging the airport's protocol should be changed to prevent this type of thing from happening in the future?
We won't know who is at fault until all the information is released. Maybe the crew landed long and didn't have enough distance to slow down, maybe there was an issue with the autobrakes, who knows.
Nice Trip Report!!! Great Pics, thanks for posting!!!! B747Forever
BlueSkys From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 16, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 2790 times:
Quoting TazzrassinIDA (Reply 5): Hi,
I was there. Here are some pictures of it, not just the nose went off, the whole plane was in the grass. It was tail N883GA. Made for a highly interesting day at work... Truly glad no one was hurt. After we got it pulled back on the cement (with an 8 wheeled farm tractor) and towed back to the terminal, (I did the towing!) the mechanics thoroughly inspected it. After replacing one of the nose wheel lights and a ton of paperwork, the plane was cleared to go and took the people to Vegas. Things could have been so much worse, but were not, and for that I am grateful.
Thanks for the pics... That is what I love about A.net, it is full of insiders...
One thing is amazing though. This thread has been good, but I have heard on others where people have said about an incident similar like this "What is the big deal about? It just barely ran off the concrete". But it really could have been so much worse... Many runways have no forgiveness for a slight overrun...
TazzrassinIDA From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 38 posts, RR: 2 Reply 17, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 2679 times:
Quoting A340Spotter (Reply 14): Did they lay anything down ahead of the push?
No, the ground was frozen enough that it was not a problem, you can see in the pics that the mains did not bog in hardly at all. The only problem we had was right where the dirt meet the cement. It took about 5 tries and a couple applications of sand before the tractor got enough grip to pull it over that lip.
I don't think I explained the extraction very well. We hooked up large rope loops to the main gear struts, then attached those to a rather large chain, finally onto another large rope (to act as a shock absorber) on the tractor and pulled it out backwards onto the runway. As a side note, the last time this happened 10-11 or so years ago with another plane, the same farmer saw that one too and was the one to pull it out!
Quoting National757 (Reply 12): Is he indirectly blaming the pilot or acknowledging the airport's protocol should be changed to prevent this type of thing from happening in the future?
If I may, Our director is fairly new. He seems to me to be the type of guy who is pro-active. He sees a problem or potential problem and tries to stay ahead of it. I don't think he was trying to assign blame at all, just acknowledge something happened and we need to fix it from happening again. My personal feelings are that it was not just one thing or person, as far as I can tell and as far as my knowledge goes, proper protocols were followed. I don't know exactly what happened in the cockpit, or out on the runway. We do need to find out so we can prevent it though.
RW717 From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 283 posts, RR: 0 Reply 18, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 2580 times:
Quoting TazzrassinIDA (Reply 5): Hi,
I was there. Here are some pictures of it, not just the nose went off, the whole plane was in the grass. It was tail N883GA. Made for a highly interesting day at work... Truly glad no one was hurt. After we got it pulled back on the cement (with an 8 wheeled farm tractor) and towed back to the terminal, (I did the towing!) the mechanics thoroughly inspected it. After replacing one of the nose wheel lights and a ton of paperwork, the plane was cleared to go and took the people to Vegas. Things could have been so much worse, but were not, and for that I am grateful.
Tazz
Why can't I see the picture? All I see are 5 dots.
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Brenintw From Taiwan, joined Jul 2006, 1449 posts, RR: 1 Reply 19, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 2554 times:
Quoting RW717 (Reply 18): Why can't I see the picture? All I see are 5 dots.
Quoting myself from another thread:
Quote: It's an incompatibility between airliners.net and IE 7 that Demand Media appears to be refusing to address at this point (the solution in "Site Related" has been "use Firefox").
The images appear just fine in Opera as well ... but not IE 7.
I'm tired of the A vs. B sniping. Neither make planes that shed wings randomly!
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), a good turn out for what could have been.
Is he indirectly blaming the pilot or acknowledging the airport's protocol should be changed to prevent this type of thing from happening in the future?
From , joined Dec 1969, posts, 
From Taiwan, joined Jul 2006, 1449 posts, 
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