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Did ValuJet 597 Improve THY Maintenance?  
User currently offlineSirDeath From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 88 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 2686 times:

Seeing as how the ValuJet 597 fire was a direct result of shoddy mx practices by THY, did THY ever overhaul the way they do their heavy mx? That is to say, was there a big shake-up and real changes made or was just a "patch" put in place so this specific problem wouldn't happen again. Did they follow the same mx procedures for planes sent to them by other carriers (in the early 90's) or did they use one in-house to save money and a higher level of service for contract mx?

13 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineSCXmechanic From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 534 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 2616 times:

I knew/worked with the guy who was sent to Turkey to borescope those engines for ValuJet before they agreed to buy those DC-9's... I don't think he is in aviation anymore... And thats all I got to say about that...

User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2494 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2542 times:

I didn't know maintainence had anything to do with it. Wasn't it the fact that some type of oxygen device was placed on the plane as cargo and it caught fire?

User currently offlineDl_mech From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 1968 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2533 times:



Quoting Quickmover (Reply 2):
I didn't know maintainence had anything to do with it. Wasn't it the fact that some type of oxygen device was placed on the plane as cargo and it caught fire?

I think you have your Valujet incidents confused....

http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/1996/aar9603.pdf



This plane is built to withstand anything... except a bad pilot.
User currently offlineRW170 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 430 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2531 times:



Quoting Quickmover (Reply 2):
I didn't know maintainence had anything to do with it. Wasn't it the fact that some type of oxygen device was placed on the plane as cargo and it caught fire?

That was the crash of ValuJet flight 592. ValuJet 597 was a DC-9 that had an aborted take-off from ATL after an engine failure. Shrapnel broke through the fuselage and caused a fire.



319/320/321/712/733/734/735/73G/738/752/753/763/CR2/CR9/DH8/135/145/170/175/190/D9S/D94/D95/M82/M83/M88
User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2526 times:



Quoting Quickmover (Reply 2):
I didn't know maintainence had anything to do with it. Wasn't it the fact that some type of oxygen device was placed on the plane as cargo and it caught fire?

Wrong incident. That was flight 592. This was an incident about 11 months earlier @ ATL.

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001207X03623&key=1


User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2494 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2526 times:



Quoting RW170 (Reply 4):
That was the crash of ValuJet flight 592. ValuJet 597 was a DC-9 that had an aborted take-off from ATL after an engine failure. Shrapnel broke through the fuselage and caused a fire.

Sorry for the mix up. Didn't that same type of accident happen with a Delta md80 a few years back?


User currently offlineRW170 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 430 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2515 times:

Yes, Delta had an uncontained engine failure during take-off from PNS in 1996. I'm no expert so I'm not so sure that the incidents were exactly the same, but both were engine failures on take-off. In Delta's case, a few passengers died. The passengers on ValuJet 597 made it out.

http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/1998/AAR9801.pdf

* Edited for grammar.

[Edited 2007-12-11 17:42:08]


319/320/321/712/733/734/735/73G/738/752/753/763/CR2/CR9/DH8/135/145/170/175/190/D9S/D94/D95/M82/M83/M88
User currently offlineLaxintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25736 posts, RR: 50
Reply 8, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2506 times:

While THY might have not caught the damage, ValuJet had opportunities both pre and post purchase of the engine involved to also avoid the incident.


From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2494 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 2446 times:

Didn't the late dc9s and early md80s use the same jt8D engine?

User currently offlineSirDeath From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 88 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 2436 times:



Quoting Laxintl (Reply 8):
While THY might have not caught the damage, ValuJet had opportunities

While this may be true, the official NTSB finding implicates THY mx and mx procedures as the proximate cause (quote from NTSB report is as follows):

The National Transportation Safety Board determines that the probable cause of this
accident was the failure of Turk Hava Yollari maintenance and inspection personnel to perform a
proper inspection of a 7th stage high compressor disk, thus allowing the detectable crack to grow
to a length at which the disk ruptured, under normal operating conditions, propelling engine
fragments into the fuselage; the fragments severed the right engine main fuel line, which resulted
in a fire that rapidly engulfed the cabin area. The lack of an adequate recordkeeping system and
the failure to use "process sheets" to document the step-by-step overhaul/inspection procedures
contributed to the failure to detect the crack and, thus, to the accident.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25736 posts, RR: 50
Reply 11, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 2406 times:

Yes an its also highlights the failure of Valujet and its vendors.

As with most accidents several layers of safety all failed with this incident. TK with propable overhaul inspection failure, Valujet thru is agents in pre-delivery inspections (including boroscope) followed by ValuJets US overhaul vendors inspections which also lead to some questionable tagging and certification documentation.

Its also important to note, TK was never involved in any litigation nor had to pay any settlement as a result of this incident, while ValuJet was party to several lawsuits.

So at the end of the day, I dont see why you are solely questioning maintenance abilities of a overseas carrier when a US airline and its vendors also failed to catch the compressor disk weakness in follow up inspections.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineBahadir From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 1803 posts, RR: 11
Reply 12, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2297 times:

To the OP,
THY is a FAA and JAA part 145 mx facilty. At the time of the accident the country was placed in a Cat II level where due to mx malpractices. This didn't allow any airlines from the country to add additional flights to US but allowed them to keep the existing ones. Later in 90s this ban was lifted.

THY separated its mx division from the airline last year and signed a major MRO agreements with Boeing, P&W and if i am not mistaken with GE as well. I am sure these major players wouldn't sign an agreement with THY mx if they didn't trust their work..



Earthbound misfit I
User currently offlineSirDeath From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 88 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (6 years 10 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 2178 times:



Quoting Bahadir (Reply 12):
Later in 90s this ban was lifted



Quoting Bahadir (Reply 12):
major MRO agreements with Boeing, P&W and if i am not mistaken with GE as well

I had figured that the THY mx operation had gotten its act together but was not sure. THY as a carrier has a stellar reputation in my wife's industry (oil) for being excellent with respect to service and reliability and being one of the most preferred carriers (with respect to destinations and quality to those destinations). Having flown on THY a few times with her I must agree! I was wondering if their mx caught up to their carrier service. I thought it had... now I have verification... thanks Bahadir!

Besides only on THY can you have (well most likely to have) a real-life situation that sounds like the beginning of a bad joke:
"A Coptic a Muslim and a Jew are sitting next to each other on an airplane..."


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