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The British Caledonian Days...  
User currently offlineGilesdavies From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 3014 posts, RR: 2
Posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 9768 times:

Hi Guys

I was just reading in another thread that British Caledonian operated flights to Hong Kong and also had 747's which were both a big surprise to me...

British Caledonian were taken over by BA when I was till very young and to this day have never really knew a great deal about this airline...

I do remember seeing some very cheesey advert on YouTube, where the cabin crew are in these aweful tartan uniforms and the passengers are singing some god aweful song!  crazy 

I did however love the livery and remember when BA turned the brand into Caledonian Airlines a chater arm of the business, and thought the aircraft looked stunning. Even to this day, I don't think it can be beaten and those Tristars looked awesome!

What was the airline like to fly on and how did they compare to their rivals of that day?

Also what did their fleet consist of and how large was it? What destinations did they fly to?

Many Thanks
Giles

84 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineNycaross From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 58 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 9739 times:

In 1972 I took British Caledonian from GOA to LGW. It was a BAC-111. It was an ok flight.

User currently offlineBA319-131 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 8535 posts, RR: 54
Reply 2, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 9723 times:
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Quoting Gilesdavies (Thread starter):
Also what did their fleet consist of and how large was it?

- Not sure of the exact numbers, would need to dig into my reference books in the garage, but the fleet at time of BA takeover was:-

Bac 111
DC-10-30
747-200 - GE Engines

On Order:-

A320
MD-11

BCAL had operated 2 A310-200's, but these were sold off prior to BA's purchase.

Hope that is of some interest.

Mark



111,732,3,4,5,7,8,BBJ,741,742,743,744,752,762,763,764,772,77L,773,77W,L15,D10,30,40,AB3,AB6,A312.313,319,320,321,332,333
User currently offlineMainMAN From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 2097 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 9700 times:

If you do a search about BCal there's loads of information knocking around.

I know very little, but they were awarded the route licences from LGW on many routes which BA weren't permitted to fly from LHR - from the top of my head, and possibly not too accurately they flew to Dallas, Houston, Atlanta, Rio, Sao Paulo, Monrovia, Lagos, Kano, Accra initially and later got rights to Hong Kong.

They also flew 1-11s on the main UK domestic routes MAN, GLA, EDI, JER, NCL I think, but I don't remember there being ABZ or BFS flights. They also operated to Paris, Amsterdam, Frankfurt and as Nycaross has indicated, they were the only airline to operate from the UK and Genoa.


User currently offlineDdbonf From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 9686 times:



Quoting Gilesdavies (Thread starter):
What destinations did they fly to?

When I worked for BCAL they had a large network..

For your three letter codes...all from London Gatwick

Africa
NBO/SEZ/EBB/LUN/TIP/CAS/FNA/BJL/ACC/LOS/ROB

Middle East
JED/RUH/DXB/DMM

Far East
HKG

USA
NYC/LAX/IAH/DFW/ATL
and SJU

Europe
AMS/RTM/BRU/PAR/GOA/FRA/LIS/LPA/TCI

UK
EDI/GLA/BFS

South America
REC/RIO/SAO/BUE/SCL

I've propbably missed some


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25191 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 9630 times:

My only longhaul flights on B.Cal were LAX-LGW-LAX soon after they started service to the USA in the mid-1970s, initially using the 707-320C before switching to the DC-10-30 after the first year or two. Service on my two 707 flights was excellent, even in economy class.

User currently offlineScrumpy492003 From Canada, joined Jul 2007, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 9624 times:

British Caledonian was WAY better than BA at the time.

customer service was great,
snacks were better than BA (BA, Amsterdam to heathrow, after a flight on Canadian Pacific from YYC to AMS, was stale sandwiches and orange juice!!) Caledonian served hot drinks!!

Treated me very well from Heathrow to AMS way back in late 70's.

Peter



peter b95 c-ghfu
User currently offlineRleiro From Venezuela, joined Jan 2006, 499 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 9612 times:



Quote:
South America
REC/RIO/SAO/BUE/SCL

I've probably missed some

Add CCS to the list. British Caledonian used to come to CCS in a DC-10.

Saludos,

Roberto.



A proud SVZM Spotter!
User currently offlineOceansWorld From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 9609 times:

Quoting BA319-131 (Reply 2):
747-200 - GE Engines

And Pratt & Whitney too.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Tim Rees


Edit:

Quoting BA319-131 (Reply 2):
- Not sure of the exact numbers, would need to dig into my reference books in the garage, but the fleet at time of BA takeover was:-Bac 111DC-10-30747-200 - GE Engines

DC-10-30 : Eight brand new + two second hands (ex. YA-LAS + 9Q-CLT)

B747-2D3B(M) : two - former RJ aircraft.
B747-211B : two - former Wardair aircraft.
B747-230B : one - former N611BN & and D-ABYG

B747-148 : one, leased from EI Oct. 1978 - Feb. 1979.

[Edited 2007-12-15 15:11:03]

User currently offlineEdina From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 743 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 9546 times:



Quoting Scrumpy492003 (Reply 6):
Treated me very well from Heathrow to AMS way back in late 70's.

Only BR flights from LHR were the helicopter shuttles.............all fixed wing flying was from LGW.



Worked on - Caravelle Mercure A300 A320 F27 SD3-60 BAe146 747-100/200/400 DC10-30 767 777 737-400 757 A319 A321
User currently offlineBlueShamu330s From UK - England, joined Sep 2001, 2909 posts, RR: 25
Reply 10, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 9488 times:

Those ads were fantastic, catchy and everyone knew the words, i.e. it was a hugely successful ad campaign, probably as successful as the Cinzano ads aired at roughly the same time (and funnily enough, one of which I think was filmed on a Caly '10, bottom link)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8q9zOUMdtg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gS2Pfnr_3dA

and just the first one on this link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CjfueaRpSg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICmjZXf3lto&NR=1

Shamu



So I drive a 4x4. So what?! Tax the a$$ off me for it...oh, you already have... :-(
User currently offlineQantasHeavy From Australia, joined Jan 2005, 379 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 9395 times:

Used to enjoy watching their DC-10s at DFW. Nice looking aircraft. When they transitioned to BA livery, also became what I thought to be the best looking DC-10s in service.

BCAL ran a wide variety of aircraft. DC-10s, 747s, A-310a, (who got those after BA merger?) and BAC-111s.


User currently offlineUalcsr From United States of America, joined May 2006, 485 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 9390 times:

I flew them in the late 80s from MCO to LGW. Not sure if this was a regularly scheduled flight or charter. We stopped in Bangor, Maine where we were allowed to get off the plane and walk around the tarmac.

User currently offlineOzarkD9S From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5074 posts, RR: 21
Reply 13, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 9319 times:

I remember when they flew to STL for a few years. Ozark had some kind of marketing promotion with BCal for awhile, at least until they went from a STL-LGW to a STL-ATL-LGW routing.

I sure miss seeing those 10's at STL, pretty rare as TWA had the L1011 and the only other 10's were the occasional Sun Country, FedEx and NW MAC charter.



Next Up: STL-LGA-RIC-ATL-STL
User currently offlineScrumpy492003 From Canada, joined Jul 2007, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 9297 times:

Quoting Scrumpy492003 (Reply 6):
Treated me very well from Heathrow to AMS way back in late 70's.

Only BR flights from LHR were the helicopter shuttles.............all fixed wing flying was from LGW.
-------------------
That was 30 years ago, and I was going from London to Amsterdam, to connect with Canadian pacific 747 for the return trip to YYC.

I went to Heathrow, was informed that I was at the wrong airport, though nothing on the ticket said that, and I flew INTO Heathrow a couple of weeks before, Maybe I went to The Caledonian Desk as the ticket said, BUT anyway, I had a staff member race me through whatever security there was at the time, and a plane was delayed just a couple of minutes for me! Perhaps that was a trip of an hour on KLM, I don't remember now, BUT that service was good.

I will always remember the stale sandwiches and orange juice!!

Even on a 1/2 hour flight in those days from YYC to YEG, Hot coffee was served by PWA, BUT not by BA on a 1 hour flight!!

Peter



peter b95 c-ghfu
User currently offlineAndz From South Africa, joined Feb 2004, 8452 posts, RR: 10
Reply 15, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 9264 times:
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Quoting QantasHeavy (Reply 12):
When they transitioned to BA livery, also became what I thought to be the best looking DC-10s in service.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v155/andzz/BADC-10.jpg



After Monday and Tuesday even the calendar says WTF...
User currently offlineAntonovman From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 720 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (6 years 8 months 3 weeks ago) and read 9168 times:



Quoting OzarkD9S (Reply 14):
I sure miss seeing those 10's at STL, pretty rare as TWA had the L1011 and the only other 10's were the occasional Sun Country, FedEx and NW MAC charter.

British Caledonian did not have L1011's. Youre confusing British Caledonian with Caledonian
BCAL was a seperate private company operating out of LGW, running BAC1-11's, DC10 and B747
They were bought out by BA and the aircraft painted in BA colours. BA then changed the name of their own charter
arm from British Airtours to Caledonian and eventually the L1011's from BA made their way to Caledonian
The 1-11's were due to be replaced by A320 but were delivered after the "merger" or buy-out and were painted in BA colours, I donbt think they ever flew with BCAL colours on but I may be mistaken.
BCAL at the time were a very good airline the tartan uniforms were a classic


User currently offlineMainMAN From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 2097 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (6 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 9112 times:



Quoting Antonovman (Reply 17):
The 1-11's were due to be replaced by A320 but were delivered after the "merger" or buy-out and were painted in BA colours, I donbt think they ever flew with BCAL colours on but I may be mistaken.

I can't find one on here, but you can find a picture of a B Cal 320 on google images. It can't have flown for very long before being either returned to Airbus or re-painted in BA colours.


User currently offlineLASOctoberB6 From Japan, joined Nov 2006, 2380 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (6 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 9074 times:



Quoting OceansWorld (Reply 8):
DC-10-30 : Eight brand new + two second hands (ex. YA-LAS + 9Q-CLT)

Those are cool tail #s..



[NOT IN SERVICE] {WEStJet}
User currently offlineSIBILLE From Belgium, joined Jun 2005, 480 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (6 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 9075 times:



Quoting BA319-131 (Reply 2):
- Not sure of the exact numbers, would need to dig into my reference books in the garage, but the fleet at time of BA takeover was:-

Bac 111
DC-10-30
747-200 - GE Engines

On Order:-

A320
MD-11

BCAL had operated 2 A310-200's, but these were sold off prior to BA's purchase

What about the VC-10?


User currently offlineOzarkD9S From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5074 posts, RR: 21
Reply 20, posted (6 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 8993 times:



Quoting Antonovman (Reply 16):


British Caledonian did not have L1011's. Youre confusing British Caledonian with Caledonian
BCAL was a seperate private company operating out of LGW, running BAC1-11's, DC10 and B747
They were bought out by BA and the aircraft painted in BA colours. BA then changed the name of their own charter
arm from British Airtours to Caledonian and eventually the L1011's from BA made their way to Caledonian
The 1-11's were due to be replaced by A320 but were delivered after the "merger" or buy-out and were painted in BA colours, I donbt think they ever flew with BCAL colours on but I may be mistaken.
BCAL at the time were a very good airline the tartan uniforms were a classic

Perhaps I should have typed out DC-10 instead of "10". I could have saved you alot of typing.



Next Up: STL-LGA-RIC-ATL-STL
User currently offlineVanguard From Solomon Islands, joined Feb 2004, 104 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (6 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 8945 times:
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Don't forget they also used to fly to NYANDLA.....  wink 

User currently offlineVC10 From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2001, 1408 posts, RR: 16
Reply 22, posted (6 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 8922 times:



Quoting SIBILLE (Reply 19):
What about the VC-10?

They had I believe 4 VC-10s which were inherited from BUA , and they operated them up to about 1974.

When people comment about BA only operating out of London and ignoring the rest of the UK as far as long routes go , there was never any comment that this so called Scottish airline operated also from London, all be it from Gatwick .

littlevc10


User currently offlineVC-10 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 1999, 3701 posts, RR: 34
Reply 23, posted (6 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8869 times:
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Quoting BA319-131 (Reply 2):


BCAL had operated 2 A310-200's, but these were sold off prior to BA's purchase.

They were never operated by BCAL and were in BA colours when delivered.

If you looked carefully, with the light at the right angle, you could see the outline of the BCAL lion on the Vert stab under the BA paint scheme.



For the record, in their time BCAL also operated 4 VC10's, about 11 B707's & 2 Navajo Chieftans.


User currently offlineAApilot2b From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 572 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (6 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8816 times:

B CAL was a great airline with service that spanned the globe. We were sad to see her washed away in to BA.

25 LTBEWR : I believe B-Cal operated from LGW to EWR in the early to mid-1980's, using limited rights under agreements for UK service to/from EWR. These rights we
26 VC-10 : No, BCAL flew to JFK. Laker Airways Skytrain flew to EWR, it was this service VS took over
27 Post contains links AApilot2b : Here you go: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuuwGPxV18w
28 Ddbonf : Quoting BA319-131 (Reply 2): BCAL had operated 2 A310-200's, but these were sold off prior to BA's purchase. They were never operated by BCAL and were
29 Post contains images OceansWorld : Sorry VC-10, but on this one you are wrong. Both aircraft were with BCal between March 1984 and May 1986. [Edited 2007-12-16 06:02:20]
30 Post contains images OceansWorld : Really ?
31 Post contains links and images AApilot2b : Here is the answer to the "tri-jet question:" B CAL operated DC-10s; BA operated L1011s. When B CAL and BA became one entity, the Caledonian name was
32 Post contains links and images CV990 : Hi! First of all, my tribute to BCAL showing you the first, last and only flight I did: Date: 1980/09/29 Flight: LGW/AMS Airline: BR Airplane: Bac 1-1
33 Door5Right : Fabulous airline. Fabulous,. fabulous, fabulous and greatly missed! They were a joy to fly on their BAC 1-11s between LGW and BFS, GLA, EDI with super
34 David L : Though, like many others, I did the 1-11 flights between GLA and LGW a few times in the 70s, I'm afraid my memory extends back further. My first flig
35 BY738 : He meant A320
36 Post contains links and images Viscount724 : Except for this one which was written off after a heavy landing at LGW on a ferry flight from LHR in 1972. It was the first VC-10 built (apart from t
37 Ddbonf : Except for this one which was written off after a heavy landing at LGW on a ferry flight from LHR in 1972. It was the first VC-10 built (apart from tw
38 Post contains links Aircellist : I found this: http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=297693 which includes 2 pictures in post #3. This plane was the second A320, and, from me
39 OtnySASLHR : Laker definitely flew to JFK. - Now there was a low cost carrier!! LGW-JFK UKL49.00 Dinner UKL1.50 Tea UKL0.50. BCAL operated to Jersey They also ope
40 Viscount724 : Both Laker and BCAL operated LGW-JFK. As I recall, neither carrier ever served EWR.
41 BA319-131 : - These were not operated by BCAL when BA took them over. - Wrong, they were delivered in BCAL c/s. - This is not what I said, when quoting please us
42 Post contains links and images AA1818 : I remember seeing them in TAB but I don't know whether it was pre or post BA involvement. I believe they flew DC-10s and L10-11s into TAB. View Large
43 David_itl : and in 1974, operated a 4 weekly LGW-MAN-JFK service with the 707. Got converted into a 2 daily LGW-MAN 1-11 schedule by the following year due to lo
44 BCAL : In the days of BCal route licences were handed out by the UK Government and BA, then being state-owned, had all the lucrative routes. In the 1960s BA
45 BA319-131 : - BCAL, I know they operated the A310, I have been miss quouted by A.NET member Ddbonf with the stupid "They were never operated by BCAL and were in
46 USADreamliner : BCal used to fly to Buenos Aires until 1982 (Falklands War). Flights were resumed ten years later, this time by British Airways.
47 BCAL : From memory the BCal fleet in the mid 1980s consisted of 22 x BAC1-11 in various configurations8 x DC10-30 + an additional two models that were acquir
48 Post contains links and images OceansWorld : The two ex Laker Airways were DC-10-10s and registered G-GFAL and G-GSKY with GK, before becoming G-BJZD... View Large View MediumPhoto © Bill S
49 VC-10 : Quite correct, I miss read it as A320's. I know they had 310's as I certified them!
50 Ddbonf : BA319-131 My appologies for miss quoting. I cut and pasted incorrectly regards
51 BA319-131 : That's fine Ddbonf, thanks for the note. The whole miss quote got picked up several times and I looked like an idiot for saying there were A310's oper
52 STRATHpeffer : I read some where (Airways I think) that, just prior to the buyout, BCal had a new livery in the pipeline. The Lion Rampant was to be dropped in favou
53 BCAL : That seems very strange. The Golden Lions were synomous with British Caledonian and Adam Thompson (BCal Chief Executive) said they would never get ri
54 B707forever : Correct, BCal never flew to EWR, only JFK. I remember watching their birds at the old Eastern Airlines terminal and then later, after the merge, at T7
55 Cornish : I look across my office here and see two rather nice big models of BCAL aircraft that never were - MD90 in BCAL colours and a Bae 146-300. Both aircra
56 Bogota : BCAL also flew to BOG on a DC-10 and even had Cabin Crew based here, of which some of the girls still flew until the closure of the route by BA a few
57 UK_Dispatcher : The picture you posted was of a Caledonian Airways DC-10. They were the charter arm of BA, and were formerly British Airtours. BA renamed British Air
58 Post contains links and images BCAL : Caledonian Airways (the original) took over all aircraft, operations and the majority of staff of BUA. It was not a merger in the true sense. Apart f
59 VC-10 : I went to Kabul to do the final inspection and engine acceptance tests before BCal bought it. After wards toteam who went there were presented with a
60 Pinhammond : I have just been looking over some old BCAL documents. The company came into effect on St Andrews Day, 1970. It was formed by Caledonian buying BUA fo
61 BCAL : BCal had never been "the largest package holiday airline in Britain". They did operate charter flights and had their own inclusive tour company - Blu
62 Cornish : The BCal "mafia" is still very active in high profile aviation positions (as I well know!!). Certainly far more than most of the equivelent BA staff
63 Pinhammond : Not so B CAL.. BUA had been the first user of Jets on package holidays in 1965. Their main customer had been Horizon Holidays which was then by far th
64 WA707atMSP : Anyone who wants to learn more about BCal should buy a copy of "High Risk", the autobiography of BCal chairman Adam Thomson. Thomson was one of the fo
65 BCAL : My apologies Pinhammond. I had to check and you are right that British Caledonian was one of Horizon's main charter operators. Horizon's collapse in
66 Post contains images BCAL : I'll second that. It clearly reveals a different civil aviation world that then existed when politics of the air dictated how airlines were run. Used
67 BA757 : This has been a nice informative thread to read - thanks. Back in about 1993-1994 I flew on a Caledonian 757 from MAN which was some kind of charter o
68 Edina : And boys too! There were 16 BOG based crew at the end of the base, 3 of the ladies being ex BCal.
69 Africawings : I flew them a few times between LGW and LOS, first on their 707's and then their DC10's and eventually their 747s They used to call the airline "Schoo
70 Andz : My first long haul flight was in July 1971 on Caledonina/BUA London-Entebbe-Lusaka. When we stopped at Entebbe we were all kept on board, my 8 year ol
71 LHRBFSTrident : going back to the 747s - I believe they were operated in combi configuration by BR and may have been converted to main deck all-pax by BA. I was taken
72 BCAL : BA sold Caledonian Airways in March 1990 to the Carlson Group which rebranded the airline simply as 'Caledonian'. The airline became part of the JMC
73 Jmc777 : When BA sold Caledonian Airways to the Carlson group, there was no name change, it remained as Caledonian Airways. It was later sold to the Thomas Coo
74 Post contains images N174UA : Had the pleasure of flying with them between LAX and LGW in August 1982. I was only 9 back then, and wasn't documenting in detail my thoughts on fligh
75 BA757 : Thank you - very informative.
76 BAViscount : Unfortunately I only got to fly BCal twice, and that was on a package charter LGW-IBZ-LGW back in 1984 on one of their DC10s, but I do remember them b
77 ZuluTime : Only one of the BCal 747s was a combi, which was G-HUGE. It was an ex Royal Jordanian aircraft which I think was named "Mungo Park - The Scottish Exp
78 ZuluTime : The re-brand of British Airtours (as then was) to become Caledonian actually took place right after the BA/BCal merger when Caledonian was still very
79 JohnClipper : The B747 (G-BMGS) was named "Loch Ness"...
80 Jmc777 : Charter Airline Caledonian Airways operated a number of DC10s: G-BHDH G-BWIN G-NIUK G-LYON G-GOKT OO-LRM I think that's all of them, pls feel free to
81 BHXFAOTIPYYC : I flew BCal many times as an UnMin in the 80's between LGW and TIP on the 707's and laterly the 310. Ended when the UK halted flights to Libya after P
82 LHRBFSTrident : Thanks for the info - so it was G-HUGE i saw at under maintenance at LHR and subsequently flew on to HKG. Now that you are talking about the BA combi
83 Post contains images Cornish : Funnily enough I'm looking up from my desk at a huge model of BCAL's "Mungo Park" in between the Bcal MD90 and 146-300 models
84 YVRLTN : My grandfather was instrumental in the setting up of Datapost and the carriage of the Royal Mail by air. I know he personally 'set up' the GLA & EDI
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