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Why Does ORD Have To Be O'Horror?  
User currently offlineBR715-A1-30 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8408 times:

Hello All you fellow nerds, geeks, and aviation professionals

Recently, I had the displeasure of traveling from STL to ORD. Due to the "Weather" flights were being cancelled and seeing as how I was on STBY, I had to suffer. Granted, I was on STBY, so it is the risk I have to take, but it seems like EVERY SINGLE TIME I go through O'Horror, there are ALWAYS several delays, cancellations, bumps, or just A Million and one IROPS.

Granted, it is one of the busiest airports in the world, but so is ATL, and despite me flying into ATL a LOT, I have never seen such chaos as I have seen at O'Horror (though I have seen plenty).

I'm sure everybody knows of the Ice Storm that recently passed through O'Horror, but I saw Untied cancelling flights left and right, but there were also some taking off. When I asked for explanations, I was told it was the WX. But if that was the case, how come other Untied flights, American flights, and other flights were taking off. 2 flights to IND were cancelled, bumping the other pax to P.S. on the other flights, leaving me stranded.

Granted, like I said, I was on STBY, so that is the risk I take, but even had I been a paying passenger, which I have been, I still probably would have had troubles like before.

I have NEVER been able to use O'Horror without some kind of trouble from Untied.

So, aside from that, and JFK, what is going on here? Are there just some wussy pilots out there who "don't feel like flying through the weather." or are there legitimate cancellations going on for some odd reason or another?

66 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePhatfarmlines From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 1358 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8391 times:

Why does PHL have to be a Phrightfest? ORD is not the only one with these issues. Unlike PHL, ORD is at least doing something about it w/ their master plan of realigning runways to allow for multi-operations.

User currently offlineLN-MOW From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 1908 posts, RR: 13
Reply 2, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8370 times:



Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Thread starter):
Are there just some wussy pilots out there who "don't feel like flying through the weather." or are there legitimate cancellations going on for some odd reason or another?

How about some wuzzy pilots not daring to take off without deicing ...??? Pardon me - but this must 'Ignorant Post of the Day' ....



- I am LN-MOW, and I approve this message.
User currently offlinePITrules From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 3203 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8327 times:



Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Thread starter):
I saw Untied cancelling flights left and right, but there were also some taking off. When I asked for explanations, I was told it was the WX. But if that was the case, how come other Untied flights, American flights, and other flights were taking off.

So because several flights are canceled due to the airport/airspace running at reduced capacity (due to WEATHER), that means all flights should be canceled?



FLYi
User currently offlineBicoastal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8318 times:

Ok, there's perspective. You have two bad experiences so that negates the millions of passengers who successfully transit O'Hare every year. Sorry you beat the odds on bad experiences, but I've flown through O'Hare at least five times this year and was never significantly delayed. We need to base our statements on facts and not our own anecdotal stories.

[Edited 2007-12-16 17:40:50]

User currently offlineTsaord From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8293 times:

Weather effects ORD is a major way and add to the fact it's one of the busiest airports in the worlds just adds to the chaos. But there is more to delays and cancellations that some passengers just don't know. "I think they can do more to get us out" and blah blah blah. If passengers knew how an airport/traffic control was handled some things could go a lot smoother. But thats asking to much.

ORD, just like other major/big airports are delay prone; some more than others. Location, weather, number of airlines, runway configuration, holidays/vacations, there so many things to factor into it.


User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7603 posts, RR: 24
Reply 6, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8267 times:



Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Thread starter):
Granted, it is one of the busiest airports in the world, but so is ATL, and despite me flying into ATL a LOT, I have never seen such chaos as I have seen at O'Horror (though I have seen plenty).

ATL doesnt quite have the problems with weather that ORD has. Chicago's locale is a double edged sword. Its ideally located for travel to Asia and Europe, but its climate is the pits. I tried living there and I lasted 3 months. I couldnt take the sudden shifts in weather. I hated Chicago.

But as for the airport, other than the weather its not all that bad. The problem ive noticed in Chicago is that if a storm comes or a weather related problem occurs, all flights are delayed all day.

Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Thread starter):
So, aside from that, and JFK, what is going on here? Are there just some wussy pilots out there who "don't feel like flying through the weather." or are there legitimate cancellations going on for some odd reason or another?

Pilots always err on the side of caution and I think thats the best way to go. It has nothing to do with the pilots being wussy. Most pilots have a military career behind them and alot of them have flown through some of the worst hell holes on earth. But its different with passenger aircraft. Its good that they are cautious.



Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineRIPCORDD From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 1166 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8253 times:

Dude WTF is a matter with you travling thru ORD in an Ice Storm on STNBY? And most domestic flights that day were canceled after 3pm. They have tried in the past not to cancel anythig and it blows up in there face I don't know if canceling just about every flight is the right answer either. Pilots don't have a say in which flights they cancel due to wx.

User currently offlinePilotpip From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3150 posts, RR: 11
Reply 8, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8154 times:



Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Thread starter):
So, aside from that, and JFK, what is going on here? Are there just some wussy pilots out there who "don't feel like flying through the weather." or are there legitimate cancellations going on for some odd reason or another?

When did you go, and who were you flying on? If it were anytime in the last two days I'll tell you it has absolutely sucked up there.

Furthermore, your comment is an insult. What do you think us "wussy pilots" are doing up there? Would you prefer we take you though severe icing like we've had? Would you prefer we land when braking action is reported as poor to nil as it has a couple times in the last two days? Would you prefer that we make our own rules and just take off when we feel like it versus sitting and waiting for our EDCT for two hours because we don't want to be "wussy pilots" who want to follow the rules?

The weather has been terrible up and down the east coast. We've had planes stuck at outstations, delayed upwards of four hours, etc. When one flight doesn't make it on time it cascades through the entire system. When you have bad weather at just about every hub in the midwest and northeast you're going to have chaos. It's a mess right now. Sorry it had to mess up your nonrev travel. Then again, most people are smart enough to avoid trying to nonrev during the holidays. When everybody elses flights are cancelled and they're trying to go somewhere, they're going before you.



DMI
User currently offlineBR715-A1-30 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8143 times:

So what you guys are trying to tell me is that Flight 1234 is cancelled due to weather, but Flight 5678 can take off in the EXACT SAME WEATHER, and that is perfectly normal? I'm sorry, but I think that has a little more to do with pilots not wanting to fly.

I was on STBY because I was going for an airline interview, and they put me on STBY. And why do I always have problems with Untied overbooking? I know others do it as well, but it seems like...SEEMS LIKE Untied does it more than they should, leaving many passengers stranded.

Yes, these are based on my own personal observations, and I am not looking to get flamed, but am looking for legitimate answers


User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23010 posts, RR: 20
Reply 10, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8140 times:



Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Reply 9):
So what you guys are trying to tell me is that Flight 1234 is cancelled due to weather, but Flight 5678 can take off in the EXACT SAME WEATHER, and that is perfectly normal? I'm sorry, but I think that has a little more to do with pilots not wanting to fly.

When the weather is poor, ORD is scheduled beyond capacity. Some flights go, others don't. It's got everything to do with weather.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineAvek00 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4384 posts, RR: 19
Reply 11, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8110 times:



Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Reply 9):
I was on STBY because I was going for an airline interview, and they put me on STBY.

If your propsective airline really loved you, they would have b ooked you positive space with an adequate level of priority to get you there and back with a minimum of fuss even during an irops period.



Live life to the fullest.
User currently offlineBR715-A1-30 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8108 times:



Quoting Avek00 (Reply 11):
If your propsective airline really loved you, they would have b ooked you positive space with an adequate level of priority to get you there and back with a minimum of fuss even during an irops period.

I was telling myself that long before I left...  Silly


User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6608 posts, RR: 24
Reply 13, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8071 times:



Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Reply 9):
So what you guys are trying to tell me is that Flight 1234 is cancelled due to weather, but Flight 5678 can take off in the EXACT SAME WEATHER, and that is perfectly normal?

If you are going to work for an airline, you might want to learn some of the basics on how airlines and the FAA operate. When the weather is bad, the airport's capacity is frequently restricted.. Sometimes this means flights are just delayed, but other times when things are really bad airlines must cancel some flights because the airport simply cannot handle all the flights that are scheduled. When this happens, airlines have to make some tough decisions about what to cancel and what to still fly.

So sometimes, you will see some flights still flying while others are cancelled despite the fact that the weather is the same for all.


User currently offlineSeattle Ops From United States of America, joined Aug 1999, 202 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8064 times:

Dude, the weather reduces the arrival rate so that of the 95 airplanes scheduled to arrive at ORD only 72 can get a slot. all of the flights get backed up substantially. If this continues all day the operation at ORD back up and last until 3 or 4 in the morning. Crews will time out, employees can only be held over so long, add to that the possibility of deicing and you will cancel eventually. Airlines would rather pick which flights to cancel rather than be forced to cancel full flights at midnight.

User currently offlineIsitsafenow From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4984 posts, RR: 23
Reply 15, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 7989 times:



Quoting Seattle Ops (Reply 14):

You mean the 30 % rule the FAA imposes on the airlines at ORD when the weather pukes?
The folks that work there can tell us all about it. Thats why there are so many xcled trips and pax
screwed up on traveling.

Quoting Bicoastal (Reply 4):
Ok, there's perspective. You have two bad experiences so that negates the millions of passengers who successfully transit O'Hare every yea

To be fair, don't forget the millions last year who got screwed around when things went sour.
safe



If two people agree on EVERYTHING, then one isn't necessary.
User currently offlineEghansen From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 7828 times:



Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Reply 9):
So what you guys are trying to tell me is that Flight 1234 is cancelled due to weather, but Flight 5678 can take off in the EXACT SAME WEATHER, and that is perfectly normal? I'm sorry, but I think that has a little more to do with pilots not wanting to fly.



Quoting Seattle Ops (Reply 14):
Dude, the weather reduces the arrival rate so that of the 95 airplanes scheduled to arrive at ORD only 72 can get a slot. all of the flights get backed up substantially. If this continues all day the operation at ORD back up and last until 3 or 4 in the morning. Crews will time out, employees can only be held over so long, add to that the possibility of deicing and you will cancel eventually. Airlines would rather pick which flights to cancel rather than be forced to cancel full flights at midnight.

Airports basically have a "clear weather capacity" and a "inclement weather capacity". In most cases, the "inclement weather capacity" is less than the "clear weather capacity". In some airports, (DEN or MCI are good examples), the inclement capacity is very close to the clear capacity. This is usually because they have parallel runways spaced far apart which permit simultaneous landing on both runways with instrument landings.

Other runways with poor runway layouts (SFO and ORD are probably the two best examples) the inclement capacity is widely divergent from the clear weather capacity. At SFO, for example, if the weather is clear, the FAA will allow landings on the two parallel runways 28L and 28R simultaneously. I believe this allows about 80 landings per hour. If the weather is inclement (usually fog in SFO), the FAA allows only 40 landings per hour. ORD has basically the same problem.

There are worse airports in bad weather. In SAN, for example, if there is late night fog, the airport closes and planes are diverted to LAX. The airline then provides bus service back to SAN which takes two hours (It has happened to me). In addition to this inconvenience, the morning flights out of SAN that were supposed to use the diverted aircraft are often canceled because the aircraft is sitting at LAX, not SAN. Fortunately, we don't have much late fog.

Hope this helps.


User currently offlineEbs757 From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 758 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 7794 times:

Travel through O'hare at least 6 times a year and never have had a problem worth complaining about.


Viva la Vida
User currently offlineJetBlueJackets From United States of America, joined Oct 2007, 175 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 7781 times:

You have some nerve coming on these boards talking like average passenger idiot guy. I know at B6, we cancel flights just to piss people off and make life miserable for as many people as possible (sarcasm of course).

Don't like it? Take the AMTRAK or drive. People like you make working at the airport HELL.

especially flying standby, I would have told you to your face to sit down and shut up, and if you didn't like what I have to say you could go home.

[Edited 2007-12-16 21:16:41]

User currently offlineEbs757 From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 758 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 7765 times:



Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Reply 9):

take off in the EXACT SAME WEATHER, and that is perfectly normal? I'm sorry, but I think that has a little more to do with pilots not wanting to fly.

Please tell me your not serious. Thats the most arrogant thing ive heard all day



Viva la Vida
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23010 posts, RR: 20
Reply 20, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 7741 times:



Quoting Ebs757 (Reply 17):
Travel through O'hare at least 6 times a year and never have had a problem worth complaining about.

Let me know who I need to bribe...



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineJustlump From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 156 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 7731 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!



Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Reply 9):
I was on STBY because I was going for an airline interview, and they put me on STBY. And why do I always have problems with Untied overbooking? I know others do it as well, but it seems like...SEEMS LIKE Untied does it more than they should, leaving many passengers stranded.

Gee...I hope your interview was not with "Untied". I don't think they would be very impressed with that attitude. Also, please remember that we are in the middle of the holiday season. Planes are packed. No airline would cancel a flight unless it is absolutely necessary. Every noncompleted flight costs the airline thousands of dollars in related costs and negative perception. Believe me, it is not by choice that flights are cancelled.


User currently offlineEghansen From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 7714 times:



Quoting JetBlueJackets (Reply 18):
You have some nerve coming on these boards talking like average passenger idiot guy. I know at B6, we cancel flights just to piss people off and make life miserable for as many people as possible (sarcasm of course).

Actually, when airlines cancel flights they try to make strategic choices for which flights to cancel. For example, if you have one flight per day ORD to Grand Cayman and 8 flights per day ORD to EWR, you will try to cancel one of the ORD-EWR flights because there is a much better chance of rebooking than on service out of Cayman.


User currently offlineUadc8contrail From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1782 posts, RR: 9
Reply 23, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 7708 times:

So what you guys are trying to tell me is that Flight 1234 is cancelled due to weather, but Flight 5678 can take off in the EXACT SAME WEATHER, and that is perfectly normal? I'm sorry, but I think that has a little more to do with pilots not wanting to fly.

I was on STBY because I was going for an airline interview, and they put me on STBY. And why do I always have problems with Untied overbooking? I know others do it as well, but it seems like...SEEMS LIKE Untied does it more than they should, leaving many passengers stranded.

Yes, these are based on my own personal observations, and I am not looking to get flamed, but am looking for legitimate answers



BR,
first good luck with the job interview, second, i hope if you are interviewing for a job at republic that you do not have to work the ual side, you already have a slanted view on ual and thats not good. had you been interviewing at ual you would have been booked POSITIVE SPACE. the airline you are interviewing with chooses to book you non rev stby, as others have posted that when the weather goes south so does the a.a.r. at ord. ual AND aal picks and chooses which flights are cncld, im surprised ual xcld a mainline and not a express flight, as the express flights usually get the ax before a mainline flight. over booking has nothing to do with your situation unless there is irregular ops, which in your case was the problem. i have seen 1 uax carrier book interviewees positive space and when they have misconnected in denver i have even seen uax get them a confirmed seat on the very next flight, it all depends on the carrier, not ual. again good luck but ual is not the villan here.



bus driver.......move that bus:)
User currently offlineSailorOrion From Germany, joined Feb 2001, 2058 posts, RR: 6
Reply 24, posted (6 years 9 months 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 7577 times:

We have to look at two points here, none of which have to do with incompetent crews (be it in the flight deck or the tower):

1)
As others have mentioned it before, ORD (along with PHL, SFO and other so-called major airports) has an extremely poor layout. Don't get me wrong, I'm not blaming those people who have built ORD, because it has grown organically from the old Orchard Field into what it is today, but this doesn't solve the problem. Have a look at this shot from SFO:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Matthew Wallman



What do we see?
1) Closely-spaced runway not permitting any kind of independent approaches in CAT I conditions
2) no less than FOUR runway crossings
3) Taxiways all over the place. Many of them can only take aircraft up to a certain size/weight/wingspan. Some of those taxiways can clearly not be used in CATII conditions
4) No de-icing facility at the end of any runway (ok it's California, but sometimes you see <0°C in KSFO)

All in all, I think it's incredible what number of operations the ATC staff (and pilots) can get through a crappy layout like this, on a fair weather day. As soon as conditions drop to CAT I, all hell breaks loose: You lose 50% arrival capacity, You lose 50% departure capacity. When things drop to CAT II, things get even worse: Not only do you lose more capacity (because more separation is required), but many taxiways get closed down because they are situated in the Localized Critical Area or in the Glideslope Critical Area, where aircraft may not taxi while an aircraft is on approach to the runway in question.
Long story short, arrival rate drops from 60 to 30 in CAT I, departure rate too.

If you take a look at ORD, you'll see many of these problems as well: Additionally, you only have 2 parallel runways in any direction, so one arrival runway is lost.

Have another look at this:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Mario Nonaka



Probably the most efficient layout you can have. In VFR (good weather) this layout has only slightly lower arrival and departures rates with 2 runways than SFO has with four. In IFR, it is far superior. It is also way more capable in IFR conditions than JFK (even tho JFK has an apparently similar layout PLUS two runways). Why?

1) Two runways with about 7500ft separation allow fully independent operations of those runways in whatever conditions
2) Taxiways are all (well except those around the General Aviation terminal) capable of taking all aircraft up to an An-225 or A380.
3) Taxiways have ample spacing to adjacent runways to allow usage in all weather conditions.
4) Every runway end has three de-icing pads for aircraft up to an An-225 or A380 EACH. This allows aircraft to be de-iced just prior to take-off roll and removes the necessity to de-ice them again and again should taxi take too long.
5) Every runway has the full length of 13123ft and allows any kind of departures (weight restrictions might apply, but are not dependent on runway)
6) Every runway has dual taxiways to speed up operations and allow bi-directional traffic flow. Spacing is sufficient for dual A380 operations as well.
7) High-speed turnoffs expedite movements and minimize runway occupancy times.
8) Localizer Critical Areas and Glideslope Critical Areas are clear of taxiways, runways and obstructions of any kind.

Result: CAT I capacity is almost identical to "fair-weather capacity". Even in CAT II/III, capacity drops are at least manageable. Problems only occur when a runway needs to be closed due to contamination (i.e. heavy snowfall), which happens, on the average about 30 hours per year.

2)
The second problem is that most US airports state their "capacity" for VFR conditions. European airports state their capacity in IFR (CAT I) conditions, thus do not take any penalties during these operations. If you have a look at the example above, you also see why LHR takes such a big hit to capacity once conditions get to CAT II: Taxiway-runway separation is too little, so things are snafu'ed.

As soon as ORD opens its new north runway (November 20, 2008), delays due to be bad weather will be greatly reduced. As soon as the whole Master Plan is completed, ORD will offer a very efficient facility once again. Let's hope this doesn't take too long.

SailorOrion


25 Post contains images MBJ2000 : Wow, this was one of the most interesting and informative posts I've read for a long time... Welcome to my RU list!
26 Post contains images ORDagent : Absolute B.S. Pilots don't cancel flights. The schedulers decide what flights to cancel. Loads and percentige of connecting pax, the next leg the air
27 B777A340Fan : What else do you expect when you go to ORD in the winter? Unless ORD is your destination, I would never try to bypass those airports (ORD, JFK, EWR, B
28 Kanebear : You want to work for an airline, yet you have no clue how airlines work... wow. God help you should you ever fly through LHR or NRT when either are ha
29 BR715-A1-30 : I would like to thank the few who came on here, and answered my question with some legitimate answers without flaming me. As for wussy pilots... I am
30 AirframeAS : Just out of curiosity, BR715.... who in the heck were you interviewing with?! When I have gone for my interviews in a different city, the airline I ha
31 FlyPNS1 : This is a common misconception. People assume that because the weather at their departure and arrival airport is smooth, there shouldn't be any delay
32 Wingnut767 : Bingo
33 Glacote : Well have you seen what has fallen over the last few days? Do you prefer your flight canceled or crashed? I know airlines to their best to ensure tha
34 SkyTeamTriStar : Nothing in life has to be difficult only if you make it that way.... Thats life. Some things are out of your control.
35 Davescj : If you're merely stuck in ORD, there is a DL CRL that is quite nice. Sit back. Relax. Read the paper. Be glad you're not outside de-icing planes. Dave
36 Post contains images Seabosdca : Are you serious? What are the two quotes above if not bashing? Think for a minute about airline ops before you make wild accusations. Aircraft fly mu
37 RFields5421 : Never plan to fly through Chicago or New York/Newark/Philly during the winter without delays. Never plan to fly through Dallas or Atlanta in the sprin
38 MPDPilot : I would say that you are definately bashing pilots. You yourself even admitt that the number of pilots who do what you call avoiding flying is less t
39 JayDub : You really need to educate yourself in the area of airline operations before you come on A.net, where there are plenty of airline professionals, and
40 Airplanenut : Don't forget that some aircraft are going to locales with better weather, and they can get a landing slot. BWI's weather was poor yesterday, but some
41 Post contains images LMP737 : Only the strong survive. The weak die or go to LA.
42 Ssides : I would add the general caveat to never plan on flying through the New York area -- during any time of year -- without delays.
43 Post contains images Bennett123 : I think that if BR715 really works in the airline industry then he would be wise to keep some of his views to himself at work. I do not want an exciti
44 ORDagent : When I worked for AA the stats at ORD showed that more flights were usually cancelled in JUL-AUG than NOV-FEB. Snow slows down ground ops due to clea
45 Dispatchguy : As I told one pissy passenger once with a 4 hour flow delay due to severe thunderstorms at ORD, "it is better to be safe here in South Bend, than a C
46 Cubsrule : Actually, MSP is delightful in the winter (as is DTW). NW does a remarkable job...
47 Post contains images Cygnuschicago : Nice. Airline customer service at it's best.
48 Christiaan : (So, aside from that, and JFK, what is going on here? Are there just some wussy pilots out there who "don't feel like flying through the weather." or
49 Caspian27 : I am based at ORD and I can categorically say that we pilots are not arbitrarily canceling flights just to to make people angry. In case you don't kn
50 Caspian27 : I see what you do from the pilot seat every day, and believe me it is appreciated. You guys do a fantastic job!
51 Indy : I avoid ORD like a bad case of the crabs. But traveling through ORD in the winter and standby? Wow. That was just asking for it. Maybe you didn't have
52 Copter808 : Yes! A weather cancellation is not always because of the wx at the airport you're sitting at. It could be because of a delayed arriving flight, wx at
53 BR715-A1-30 : Thank you for your knowledgeable reply Uh.. Why do you think I CAME ON A.NET?!?!? To read the comics? I am here to get educated on stuff like this, F
54 Post contains links and images Boeing4ever : There are old pilots, there are bold pilots. There are no old bold pilots. Perhaps this flight crew would have been more up your alley: http://en.wik
55 Post contains links Crjflyer35 : Maybe cause you call them Untied all the time, they like to "un tie" their operation when you're in town....lol sorry, couldn't resist. Yes, Non-revi
56 Post contains images Seabosdca : And that's a terrific reason to be on a.net. Thank you for your willingness to listen. But you'll find people are much more willing to help you if yo
57 Post contains images JayDub : Sometimes this is exactly what the passenger needs to hear. Many pax forget that flying is still a pretty delicate thing and, no matter how advanced
58 HAMAD : you know! every time i have flown through chicago whether from or to phoenix, the flights are always over booked on ted, and volunteers are always wa
59 Post contains links DiscoverCSG : If you're interested in seeing why O'Hare capacity goes down in certain conditions, visit http://www.bigairport.com/bigair_content.php That site is fa
60 Post contains images Dispatchguy : So YOURE the one I remember the season when I was working at SBN, Christmas Notre Dame Univ exodus from South Bend. All flights have been overbooked
61 B777A340Fan : I'm not saying MSP is not delightful.... I'm saying it's more prone to weather delays during the winter. So if you can, try to fly through the south,
62 Cubsrule : MSP and ORD aren't even in the same league in terms of w/x delays in the winter.
63 CygnusChicago : What the passengers need to hear is the truth, and quickly. I realize that there will always be unreasonable passengers. That however is no excuse to
64 JayDub : And what I'm telling them is not the truth? I never said I was rude about it. Just very honest about why we can't go at that moment.
65 Post contains images CygnusChicago : I think the term would be "sarcasm", which in my opinion is not great customer service. But, hey, what do I know? I'm just the average American consu
66 JayDub : I have an extensive customer service background. I know how to take care of the customer. I'm never sarcastic when I explain these things to pax. I w
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