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Virgin America's Future Growth  
User currently offlineSAN787 From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 616 posts, RR: 1
Posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 8991 times:

Virgin America has identified the following as likely cities for future growth...

Atlanta
Austin
Baltimore
Boston
Charlotte
Chicago
Cincinnati
Cleveland
Dallas
Denver
Detroit
Fort Lauderdale
Fort Myers
Indianapolis
Jacksonville
Kansas City
Miami
Milwaukee
Minneapolis
Nashville
Newark
New Orleans
Orlando
Philadelphia
Phoenix
Pittsburgh
Providence
Portland
Raleigh-Durham
Sacramento
Salt Lake City
San Antonio
San Jose
Sarasota
St. Louis
Tampa
West Palm Beach

Now the question is which cities are most likely to be added once SAN and SEA are started? I choose ORD, MIA and MSP.

Any information out there on delivery dates for new aircraft? Are the Skybus Airbii being turned over to Virgin America? How soon can we speculate before VA announces new destinations?


those who don't get carried away should be.
77 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineRJNUT From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 1213 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 8947 times:

seems to me that some on the list that are not so obvious might fare better than the obvious large markets like ORD and MIA since the competition would be substantially less! just my 2cents

User currently offlineGARUDAROD From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 1516 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 8930 times:

Virgin America has stated that their expansion may/will be delayed due to delays in new aircraft as well
as current fuel prices. MIA, ORD and BOS are due to be the next cities, but not necessarily in
that order. MIA may be postponed to later this year. They arent real keen to add any trans-cons
at this point, except for BOS, but no date has been announced for that.



Cargo doesn't whine, moan, or complain
User currently offlineDL767captain From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2539 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 8934 times:

Adding ATL would be interesting, then operating something like LAX/SAN-ATL to give DL and Air Tran some more competition would be very intersting. I love DL but i would definately choose one flight on Virgin America to see what it's like

User currently offlineGARUDAROD From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 1516 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 8904 times:

ATL is not on any short term list, at least for this year.


Cargo doesn't whine, moan, or complain
User currently offlineMKE22 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1129 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 8883 times:



Quoting RJNUT (Reply 1):
seems to me that some on the list that are not so obvious might fare better than the obvious large markets like ORD and MIA since the competition would be substantially less! just my 2cents

Indeed, MKE has fared well for low-cost carriers in terms of FL so far. MKE just added Skybus not too long ago, and load factors seem relatively decent. People in MKE have been pushing for B6 as well, but who knows if that will happen anytime soon, but I hope it will. Talks are that some of these destinations may be 3-5 years down the road still, but MKE I'm sure would welcome VX with open arms.



If Your not pissed, your not trying
User currently offlinePITops From United States of America, joined May 2007, 1442 posts, RR: 4
Reply 6, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 8883 times:

Bring them on to PIT. We need some new service. Yinzers love LCCs.


Ground Ops, Southwest Airlines, CMH
User currently offlineThomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3922 posts, RR: 23
Reply 7, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 8872 times:

What........no Houston? What does VA have against H-Town?

Thomas



"Show me the Braniffs"
User currently offlineMKE22 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1129 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 8852 times:



Quoting PITops (Reply 6):
Bring them on to PIT. We need some new service. Yinzers love LCCs.

I'll pray for you guys.  crossfingers 

Quoting Thomasphoto60 (Reply 7):
What........no Houston? What does VA have against H-Town?

CO is what hey have against H-Town, no offense. They could try HOU if not IAH if they were to come.



If Your not pissed, your not trying
User currently offlinePITops From United States of America, joined May 2007, 1442 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 8821 times:



Quoting MKE22 (Reply 8):
I'll pray for you guys.

Thanks. We definately need it! More ways then just this one.



Ground Ops, Southwest Airlines, CMH
User currently offlineMKE22 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1129 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 8794 times:



Quoting PITops (Reply 9):
Thanks. We definately need it! More ways then just this one.

Definitely. You guys lost a lot of your hometown airline's service. In a way, that would be like YX pulling out of MKE for me. That I couldn't bear to witness, just because we do have so much loyalty to them. There is a reason they are called "The Best Care in the Air" but US isn't too bad either.



If Your not pissed, your not trying
User currently offlineThomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3922 posts, RR: 23
Reply 11, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 8784 times:



Quoting MKE22 (Reply 8):
CO is what hey have against H-Town, no offense.

Then by that reasoning, Dallas, Chicago, Minneapolis, Atlanta and other major hub airports should not be listed.

Thomas



"Show me the Braniffs"
User currently offlineMKE22 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1129 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 8706 times:



Quoting Thomasphoto60 (Reply 11):
Then by that reasoning, Dallas, Chicago, Minneapolis, Atlanta and other major hub airports should not be listed.

Dallas everyone is in or going for in some way. They didn't say ORD or MDW though in Chicago. MSP, they have Sun Country and WN proving low-cost carriers can compete there. For ATL it's like FL vs. DL compared to MSP. IAH is kind of like a fortress hub for CO because their aren't many low-cost carriers there (F9, but they just classify themselves as that). Thats why I said maybe HOU.



If Your not pissed, your not trying
User currently offlineGecmd11 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 111 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 8617 times:



Quoting DL767captain (Reply 3):
Adding ATL would be interesting, then operating something like LAX/SAN-ATL to give DL and Air Tran some more competition would be very intersting. I love DL but i would definately choose one flight on Virgin America to see what it's like

 checkmark  i'd second that...!!


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32604 posts, RR: 72
Reply 14, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 8537 times:

As GARUDAROD explained, expansion is going to slow at current fuel prices. They've already started doing some early hiring at MIA, but MIA might be delayed because trans-cons and high fuel prices don't go well together.


a.
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22722 posts, RR: 20
Reply 15, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 8500 times:



Quoting MKE22 (Reply 12):
They didn't say ORD or MDW though in Chicago.

This is an interesting question. There's a serious gate space shortage at ORD, so even though arrival authorizations will not be an issue (VX can get 8 for free, and there should be many available later this year), it's not clear that they'd be able to find a gate. CO essentially gave DH gate E10, so that might be an option, but CO has a lease on that gate and doesn't like VX so much. DL and NW might also be options.

The problem with MDW is that yields are traditionally lower than at ORD. If you're not trying to capture a lot of Chicago-originating traffic, this isn't so much of a problem. By all measures, DL does reasonably well with LGA-MDW by concentrating on the NYC-originating traffic. Can VX make that sort of model work? Good question.

Another issue with Chicago is that, while VX obviously won't be flying transcons, there aren't many opportunities that are less than about 700 miles either. High fuel prices don't have the same effect on these medium-hauls as they do on transcons, but the opportunities for regional flying are more limited than along the coasts.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineFreequentFlier From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 893 posts, RR: 12
Reply 16, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 8341 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 14):
As GARUDAROD explained, expansion is going to slow at current fuel prices. They've already started doing some early hiring at MIA, but MIA might be delayed because trans-cons and high fuel prices don't go well together.

Generally it's a bad thing when a brand new airline doesn't know where to expand next. Perhaps Branson isn't the genius he and many on this forum think he is.


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32604 posts, RR: 72
Reply 17, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 8308 times:

Quoting FreequentFlier (Reply 16):
Generally it's a bad thing when a brand new airline doesn't know where to expand next. Perhaps Branson isn't the genius he and many on this forum think he is.

They know exactly where to expand to next - Boston, Chicago, and Miami.

Quoting Thomasphoto60 (Reply 11):

Then by that reasoning, Dallas, Chicago, Minneapolis, Atlanta and other major hub airports should not be listed.

Thomas

The list should not at all be taken seriously. People read far to into this list. They essentially selected a lot of large/medium markets, put them in dozens of PRs, so that everytime a PR is out, local newspapers run articles about how Virgin America is considering their city. It's free, national publicity, and if you notice how many articles are published by media outlets in Austin, Raleigh, Sarasota and the like just because their respective cities our on the list, it's no surprise Virgin America does this. JetBlue also did this at launch, and as you can clearly see by comparing that list to what cities they served now, it largely means zilch.

[Edited 2008-01-15 18:17:59]


a.
User currently offlinePhilly65 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 57 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 8119 times:

How about we add VA to the list of potential airlines to file for bankruptcy in 2008?

User currently offlineSAN787 From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 616 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 8079 times:



Quoting Philly65 (Reply 18):
How about we add VA to the list of potential airlines to file for bankruptcy in 2008?

...not sure I'd go that far. However, I am surprised Skybus has lasted this long.



those who don't get carried away should be.
User currently offlineApodino From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 4234 posts, RR: 6
Reply 20, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 8026 times:



Quoting MKE22 (Reply 12):
MSP, they have Sun Country and WN proving low-cost carriers can compete there

since when did WN start serving MSP? That's news to me. Would be big news if it actually happened.


User currently offlineNational757 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 720 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 8027 times:



Quoting SAN787 (Reply 19):
However, I am surprised Skybus has lasted this long.

Don't be surprised. Skybus is well capitalized and they should have enough cash to get through their first year of operations, at least. They are not a fly-by-nite operation like the latest incarnation of Western or SkyValue.

Read about the Skybus experience first hand in this recent TR
Commuting On The SkyBus To CMH(Pics) (by AirWillie6475 Jan 15 2008 in Trip Reports)

Quoting Philly65 (Reply 18):
How about we add VA to the list of potential airlines to file for bankruptcy in 2008?

With fuel prices the way they are, you can add just about any American airline to the list of potential airlines to file for bankruptcy this year. Sorry to burst your bubble.



Formula 1 Grand Prix Trips: YUL '08, MEL '09, BCN '10, SIN '11, and LGW '12
User currently offlineRetrolivery From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 204 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 7941 times:

Does anybody know if MIA would be started as a transcon from SFO/LAX or as a short-haul from IAD/JFK? Personally I'd love to see VA flying to MIA and possibly TPA/MCO as a short-haul from their IAD and JFK stations


A3, AA, AC, AI, AK, AM, AP, AZ, B6, BA, CO, DL, EK, FL, FR, KL, KM, LH, MA, MH, MS, OA, OK, OS, SR, TA, U2, UA, US, XG
User currently offlinePhilly65 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 57 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 7877 times:



Quoting National757 (Reply 21):
With fuel prices the way they are, you can add just about any American airline to the list of potential airlines to file for bankruptcy this year. Sorry to burst your bubble.

Bubble not bursted. I would put VA at the top of the list including Frontier, Skybus, VA, and potentially jetBlue before the legacies.


User currently offlineBreaker1011 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 938 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 7843 times:

It's not just fuel prices hurting the airlines...

Over the next few months, you will understand just how tight things are right now in corporate America and in the average US household. Spending on business trips is on the decline, regardless of the fare in many cases (especially the well-traveled financial sector). Spending on vacations is going to slow quite a bit as well - again, regardless of the airfare. The US is about to hit a point where no airfare is low enough to get many traditional passengers on board, so it won't matter what fuel prices are.

The recession's hand is playing out now. 2008 is going to hurt corporate and consumer pocketbooks bigtime. Read the news and watch the earnings reports carefully over the coming weeks, for once ignoring the airline sector (haha). You'll see what I mean. We are about to hit a slump in passenger growth and there are some saying already that 2008 may indeed be the first year of negative growth in domestic traffic for the US airline industry.

Im normally not a doomsayer, but the signs are there. Gonna be a rocky ride fellas.



Life's tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid. J. Wayne
25 LoneStarMike : I agree. Another way to say it is fuel prices aren't just hurting the airlines. It hurts everyone. People are paying more to gas up their cars and he
26 Breaker1011 : And dont' leave out - we have BARELY begun to feel the effects of the mortage crisis. BARELY. Folks like Citigroup, Chase, BofA, and AMEX already know
27 Af773atmsp : I hope Virgin America will serve MSP this year, but since the Humphrey Terminal is full VX would probably have to fly out of the Lindbergh Terminal. W
28 BNinMSY : Paging Southwest Airlines ... please report to MSP ... you are absent! VA should do: SFO-MSY-BOS-SFO, SFO-MSY-MIA-JFK-SFO MSY would welcome them with
29 Dallasnewark : And we tell them, they are not going to believe us. Both Boeing and Airbus should brace themselves for a few soft years ahead. Why do you think Delta
30 Post contains links Asuflyer05 : Looks like Alaska is trying to put them to bed. Alaska Airlines Announces Major California Schedule Upgrades With More Frequent Flights, Departures on
31 MSYtristar : I get the feeling that UA has decided to abandon MSY-SFO permanently and instead route all connecting pax though LAX/DEN/ORD. If they were going to r
32 LHPDX : PDX-LAX and SFO would be interesting..............................
33 Georgiabill : Just my 2 cents but Virgin America should consider the same stratedgy as Southwest when considering the northeast (Boston area) and choose to serve PV
34 ORDagent : I can't agree with that. Remember VX is going for higher yield passengers with there high service levels like B6. B6 gets enough flak for using JFK.
35 INNflight : All airports VA currently serves are also served by VS............same goes for future destinations MIA BOS and ORD!!! Can you actually book on connec
36 A380US : how about hawaii or the carribean?
37 F9Animal : All AS is going to do is hurt itself by doing such a move. The only one going to bed would be AS. Billy Boy Ayers and his team have slept too long. C
38 Buck3y3nut : Cincy & Cleveland??? CMH gets snubbed again!!! Sucks...
39 EA CO AS : Far superior frequency, far superior Mileage Plan, far superior employees, and pretty soon far superior inflight internet access. Check, and mate. AS
40 Steeler83 : True, having one measily A319/A320 to LAX and SFO (In this case, SFO...) is not adequate service at all for transcon PIT service. Demand is there for
41 AirEMS : Would it be stupid to go into DEN right now?? I mean with Frontier, Southwest, and United all there could they even make a decent run? Or with the who
42 Aerofan : I wish they would fly JFK BGI
43 PDXBJV : Actually, VS doesn't serve SEA.....yet.......
44 SANFan : But this will change very soon as VX starts SAN (February) and SEA (March), neither of which is served by VS; I've wondered about the tie-in since th
45 Cubsrule : Interestingly, too, there's not really any hope of VS serving SEA in the near future; 2 carriers on SEA-LHR may even be more than the market can hand
46 Post contains images MKE22 : Woops sorry. They don't serve MSP, my fault. Don't torch me too bad.
47 MKE22 : Skybus is there BIG TIME. Maybe they just don't want to compete there. Plus most of Skybus' west coast routes haven't been too popular from CMH, (mea
48 EVA777SEA : They were referring to a press release sent out by VS a couple of months ago relating to their 787-9s including in it a small section that included p
49 SAN787 : Over time, Virgin America is going to have to have some sort of network in the midwest or east... IND? (new terminal) IAD? (although not on the list)
50 MAH4546 : Perhaps the most overserved market in the U.S. They already fly there. There's been rumours about VX establishing some sort of base at MIA and going
51 MKE22 : Next 3 markets are probably: MIA, BOS, and maybe another Florida city?
52 Goodmanr : Hmmm....Everytime I've flown VA (about 5 times now) from LAX-JFK and JFK-LAX the planes are pretty full. I usually fly United or CO, but for ex. this
53 GARUDAROD : Absolutely not! Will most likely be BOS, ORD and MIA maybe. As stated above they are hesitant to add MIA right now, there is no way there are going t
54 MAH4546 : They have no plans for Florida outside of Miami. Orlando is not even in their short-term plans. They are aiming to be business flyer's airline. Of co
55 EVA777SEA : SFO-Florida is not a very large market. Actually, West Coast-Florida in general is not a very large market (with the exception of LAX, but of course,
56 MKE22 : Didn't say they were in order. I think BOS is the most likely next 1 though. I hope that if they go to Chicago, they will give MKE a chance too thoug
57 MAH4546 : The original plan as of the fall was to have Miami by around March, Chicago by June, Boston by August. That's all on hold for now and the order might
58 SAN787 : ...(kindly) in what regard? I agree IND probably does not need a third airline flying IND-SFO if your comment was specific to this route. I guess wha
59 SANFan : I think (and hope) there are a couple of opportunities yet for VX growth among their existing cities -- just in case they have a plane or 2 available
60 Scouseflyer : Are those delays in delivery or because they have leased out their birds whilst they were waiting for thier license and they have to wait for those l
61 GARUDAROD : They are experiencing delays in getting the aircraft's inflight entertainment systems installed. As far as I know, the leased out aircraft can be rec
62 Post contains images EA CO AS : More like suicidal on their part. AS is going to the mattresses on this. VX is in for one rough ride.
63 Indy : Yeah I don't quite see where his comment was coming from. On a national level there is absolutely no basis for it. But for IND-SFO in general it is w
64 ERJ170 : Why should their next move to move into an established and recently pumped route? Just so they can dilute their profits by sharing the pax with AS? I
65 787EWR : Two words: Continental and Southwest. No need to challenge the giants, yet...
66 Post contains images F9Animal : Virgin will also have internet access. Each seat has a port already, plus a charger. Much better inflight entertainment. You can order food and drink
67 EVA777SEA : Well if they will continue to expand the West and not the East as some have speculated due to high fuel costs, wherever they go, they will face lot o
68 SAN787 : I like Alaska's product, especially the juices they offer on board! However, I am very eager to fly Virgin America when they hit SAN. Also, I am very
69 Post contains images MKE22 : I hope you don't judge an airline just on their types of juices.
70 FreequentFlier : Which is precisely why VX was a poorly conceived airline from the get go and will likely run out of cash in a year or so.
71 SANFan : "More like suicidal on their part. AS is going to the mattresses on this. VX is in for one rough ride." (EA CO AS) "Why should their next move to move
72 Post contains links and images EA CO AS : Yes, but internet access on AS will actually BE the internet - not a watered-down version of it. Unless I'm mistaken their system will only support Y
73 SAN787 : I think you are on the right track. I haven't flown VA yet, but from what I understand they field the internet service from cell phone towers below v
74 Steeler83 : I know that I made one of the posts about why they're not expanding to the East Coast, and not to sound biased, but I would think PIT would be a good
75 MKE22 : I wouldn't get impatient too fast here. VX doesn't have the aircraft to start any new cities other than the SEA and SAN right now. Just be patient, a
76 Sflaflight : Here is one question you fellow A.netters can help me out with (since I'm an outside looking in). Why does VA have to connect the west coast to MIA? I
77 Wifiinthesky : VX plans to use Aircell, which bought Airfone's old spectrum, and uses 92 cell phone towers on the ground, so no satellites for them. AS and WN are u
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