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NWA's Fleet Plan For '08  
User currently offlineNWA757300 From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 299 posts, RR: 2
Posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 11200 times:

TO: All Flight Attendants

FROM: Julie Showers, SVP – Inflight Services

DATE: January 17, 2008

RE: Flying Plan for 2008
As we look ahead to 2008, I’d like to provide you an overview of the flying plan.
The level of planned fleet utilization is based on the marketing plan for 2008. According to that plan, by the end of ’08, Northwest will operate a total mainline fleet of 329 aircraft - 269 narrow body and 60 wide bodies. The following are some specifics with regard to each passenger fleet type.
747-400 – Northwest will operate an additional daily frequency between Detroit and Amsterdam utilizing the 747-400 between June and October.
747-200 - The Charter group currently has one 747-200 passenger configured aircraft dedicated to charter flying (primarily military charters). A second passenger configured aircraft and a freighter will be added to the military charter program effective in October.
A330 – Expanded utilization of the A330 in trans-Atlantic markets continues with the introduction of new flights between Portland, OR and Amsterdam starting in March; new flights between Minneapolis/St. Paul and Paris Charles de Gaulle starting in April and new flights between Seattle and London Heathrow starting in June.
757s - In 2008, Northwest will expand use of the 757 in trans-Atlantic markets. We will be flying double daily from EWR-AMS starting March 29 and will add DTW-LGW starting May 1, in addition to the routes we currently serve. A319s - Northwest will continue to operate 57 Airbus A319s by year’s end (ten more than called for in the plan of reorganization). Northwest is in final discussions with the NBA and has an agreement in principle to re-establish a VIP charter program using seven specially configured aircraft. NBA-designated aircraft will be going through interior modifications starting in late summer for targeted completion by the start of the ‘08 NBA season. NBA specific-charter information will be communicated to Flight Attendants once an agreement is finalized.
DC-9s - The number of DC-9s will be reduced to 68 aircraft over the course of the year, with the largest reduction coming after the summer. We plan to operate a year-end fleet consisting of 34 - 50s, 12 - 40s and 22 - 30s (10 fewer than projected in the plan of reorganization).
787s - We are planning to take our first delivery in April/May of ’09, with the first revenue flying to begin in the summer of ’09. We are waiting for Boeing to accomplish two important milestones. First, to get power on the aircraft. Second, to accomplish the first test flight. Some of this information is subject to change as we move through 2008. We will continue to update you on any significant fleet utilization changes.

[Edited 2008-01-17 19:43:20]

135 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 11185 times:

By the summer of 2009, NW will likely be controlled by another airline so this might be the last summer fleet plan NW publishes.

Still, they are utilizing their fleet fairly well.

What, oh what, will a.netters talk about as the DC9 fleet wounds down, esp. targeting the -30?


User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9358 posts, RR: 14
Reply 2, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 11164 times:



Quoting NWA757300 (Thread starter):

and we will also be getting 77Es,77Ls,764s,763s,more 752s 737s MD-90s MD-88s when Delta buys us

but really glad to see NW is slowly but surely dropping the DC-9s(i hate those planes)..........what is the NBA-A319s (as in what will they be doing to them and how many?)

now if only they could get more 744s

also note no more DC-9s will be painted which means when D-checks come up they shall be sent to the graveyard



yep.
User currently offlineNWA757300 From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 299 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 11135 times:

7 of the 319s will be reconfigured in a VIP layout for NBA charters. They used 727s years ago and once the 727 was retired the charters were handed over to Champion. They were configured with 52 FC type seats and lounge tables. Very roomy and comfortable. Will be glad to see some more flying coming back to us.

User currently offlineCandid76 From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 734 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 10779 times:

Still no flights to MAN then. Looks like I'll be better off going to Marana in 2009 than to Detroit or MSP!

User currently offlineNWAESC From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3386 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 10686 times:



Quoting NWA757300 (Reply 3):
Will be glad to see some more flying coming back to us.

Me too!

I understood the logic of not wanting to have the 727 remain in the fleet *just* for these charters. However, it seemed asinine to let the contract (revenue stream) go.


I'll be curious to see what the VIP 319's look like on the inside.



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7566 posts, RR: 27
Reply 6, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 10528 times:



Quoting NWA757300 (Thread starter):
747-200 - The Charter group currently has one 747-200 passenger configured aircraft dedicated to charter flying (primarily military charters). A second passenger configured aircraft and a freighter will be added to the military charter program effective in October.

Does this mean they will be dedicating another pax 742 to military charter? How many pax 742's did they keep active after withdrawling them from scheduled service in Sept.? ( I assume that also means moving over a 742F from NWA Cargo to support this operation.)

Quoting NWA757300 (Thread starter):
A319s - Northwest will continue to operate 57 Airbus A319s by year’s end (ten more than called for in the plan of reorganization). Northwest is in final discussions with the NBA and has an agreement in principle to re-establish a VIP charter program using seven specially configured aircraft. NBA-designated aircraft will be going through interior modifications starting in late summer for targeted completion by the start of the ‘08 NBA season. NBA specific-charter information will be communicated to Flight Attendants once an agreement is finalized.

That is good to hear. NW was planning to sell off some additional A319's over the next year. This is very similar to the 727 Sports Charter program that NWA ran up through 2003 for NBA & NHL teams. It works well from a fleet utilization standpoint too as the NBA season runs through the less-busy time of the year, so NW can dedicate 7 A319's and still fly the fall/winter schedule with the remaining aircraft. Hence why NW made the decision to keep flying the DC-9-50's on routes where they make sense. On shorter routes the -50's are cost competitive with the A319 as a 125 seat aircraft. They are also the newest DC-9's.

Quoting NWA757300 (Thread starter):
DC-9s - The number of DC-9s will be reduced to 68 aircraft over the course of the year, with the largest reduction coming after the summer. We plan to operate a year-end fleet consisting of 34 - 50s, 12 - 40s and 22 - 30s (10 fewer than projected in the plan of reorganization).

That equates to parking 35 DC-9-30's, and 0 -40's & -50's. Not really a surprise here as the DC-9's have been variable capacity based on demand & fuel. Makes sense to keep them around for the summer season and then park them when the demand drops off. By that time, the CR9 & E75 deliveries will be completed, which will essentially replace a lot of that DC-9-30 capacity.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 1):
By the summer of 2009, NW will likely be controlled by another airline so this might be the last summer fleet plan NW publishes.

We shall see. Keep NW my NW.

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 2):
but really glad to see NW is slowly but surely dropping the DC-9s(i hate those planes)..........

Why do you hate these aircraft. They are far superior to CRJ's. Enjoy it while you can as they are a carry-over from a different era of aviation in this country.


User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7062 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 10414 times:

I really like NW and I enjoyed my flight to DTW with them a few weeks ago. They are my favorite US airline. I like their livery especially on the 747 and A330s and the interior of their A330s is very nice !I hope they will stay independent !!

Quoting NWA757300 (Thread starter):
747-200 - The Charter group currently has one 747-200 passenger configured aircraft dedicated to charter flying (primarily military charters). A second passenger configured aircraft and a freighter will be added to the military charter program effective in October.

Great to see a classic 747 return even if it is only as charter aircraft !!

Quoting NWA757300 (Thread starter):
757s - In 2008, Northwest will expand use of the 757 in trans-Atlantic markets.

Does the 757W has the range for DTW-TXL ??

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 2):

and we will also be getting 77Es,77Ls,764s,763s,more 752s 737s MD-90s MD-88s when Delta buys us

Hope not !!

Quoting NWA757300 (Thread starter):
Northwest will continue to operate 57 Airbus A319s by year’s end (ten more than called for in the plan of reorganization). Northwest is in final discussions with the NBA and has an agreement in principle to re-establish a VIP charter program using seven specially configured aircraft. NBA-designated aircraft will be going through interior modifications starting in late summer for targeted completion by the start of the ‘08 NBA season. NBA specific-charter information will be communicated to Flight Attendants once an agreement is finalized.

The aircraft will be painted in NW colors or will they get a special NBA livery or stickers ???



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineAzjubilee From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 3913 posts, RR: 27
Reply 8, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 10389 times:

Why does everyone seem to think DL is doing the buying here? Haven't you ever gone shopping and had someone else pay? Just because DL sent the invitation doesn't mean DL is in control. If it is a MERGER, both parties will NEGOTIATE the consumation of the marriage. NWA could very well be the surviving brand. Everyone thinks that DL is so much stronger and better poised for acquisitions than NWA. Uh... last time I checked DL was also recently in Ch11 and has incredible debt, labor costs and is saddled with the same fuel costs as NWA. Another thing... don't believe everything a CEO says. Funny... NWA made a similar comitment to MN to keep HDQ here. The MAC even gave hundreds of millions of dollars in incentives to remain a MN airline and keep a hub at MSP. What say you now?

Regarding the fleet... good news. Remember one of the last sentences in the memo... this is subject ot change! I was hoping as I read the memo she would talk about a 744/757 cabin refurb program! IMO there is still time to announce more 75A flying for the last remaining a/c.


My question still lies with... where is the SEA-LHR 332 coming from?


AZJ


User currently offlineJano From Slovakia, joined Jan 2004, 827 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 10357 times:



Quoting Columba (Reply 7):
Does the 757W has the range for DTW-TXL ??

I do not think so. DTW-FRA was already a stretch for B752.



The Widget Air Line :)
User currently offlineNWAESC From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3386 posts, RR: 9
Reply 10, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 10280 times:



Quoting NWA757300 (Thread starter):
The aircraft will be painted in NW colors or will they get a special NBA livery or stickers ???

No special livery last time... I would guess that would be the same this time around.



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7062 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 10072 times:



Quoting Jano (Reply 9):
Does the 757W has the range for DTW-TXL ??

I do not think so. DTW-FRA was already a stretch for B752.

Too bad this route would not justify an A330  Smile



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7539 posts, RR: 8
Reply 12, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 9967 times:



Quoting Columba (Reply 7):
The aircraft will be painted in NW colors or will they get a special NBA livery or stickers ???

No, however they will have a special safety card. Take a look about 3/4 the way down the page http://www.aviationpast.com/NWSafe.html

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 6):
We shall see. Keep NW my NW.

I second that.

Quoting Azjubilee (Reply 8):
Why does everyone seem to think DL is doing the buying here?

They said they would be the controlling entity, however, if the name stays NW I will be happy.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineAzjubilee From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 3913 posts, RR: 27
Reply 13, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 9927 times:

They can SAY alot of things Burnsie... didn't you learn anything in bankruptcy? The fact is that the details aren't ironed out yet and NOBODY knows what the end game will be. I think it's far too early to be calling the ink dry on the details.


AZJ


User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4748 posts, RR: 45
Reply 14, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 9919 times:



Quoting Azjubilee (Reply 8):
Why does everyone seem to think DL is doing the buying here? Haven't you ever gone shopping and had someone else pay? Just because DL sent the invitation doesn't mean DL is in control. If it is a MERGER, both parties will NEGOTIATE the consumation of the marriage. NWA could very well be the surviving brand. Everyone thinks that DL is so much stronger and better poised for acquisitions than NWA. Uh... last time I checked DL was also recently in Ch11 and has incredible debt, labor costs and is saddled with the same fuel costs as NWA. Another thing... don't believe everything a CEO says. Funny... NWA made a similar comitment to MN to keep HDQ here. The MAC even gave hundreds of millions of dollars in incentives to remain a MN airline and keep a hub at MSP. What say you now?

If DL merges with NWA, DL is the surviving brand. Widgets on the tail of those 744s.

MSP hub wouldn't be gone. HQ might be reduced, but they could pay out the $245MM requirement and still drive synergies.



Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7566 posts, RR: 27
Reply 15, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 9858 times:

I'd be careful to say anything definitive about anything regarding a potential merger. There are no certainities in anything.

There have been many other times the merger talk has heated up in this industry and very little came out of it. Refer to 1991/1992, 2001, 2007.


On a side note:
Is it me, or does it seem like there is a significant reduction in 757 flying during Feb-March? Are there a number of a/c in for heavy mx, all flying the busy sunbird routes, or is utilization down over that period?


As for the 757 TATL flying, I'm no so sure of anything more for next summer. Only 7 have the TATL interior configuration, with the ability to convert 3 more into the TATL arrangement (10 have ETOPS/winglets). With the projection of the economy, its doubtful at this point.


User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7539 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 9849 times:



Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 14):
If DL merges with NWA, DL is the surviving brand. Widgets on the tail of those 744s.

What makes you think that Delta is the surviving brand, DL has virtually no name in asia, and what they used to have was a horrible name with their dePortland hub. NW has quite a name in Europe thanks to KLM which like in the US anything KLM has nwa plastered next to it.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4748 posts, RR: 45
Reply 17, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 9825 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 16):
NW has quite a name in Europe thanks to KLM which like in the US anything KLM has nwa plastered next to it.

While NWA's name is plastered next to KLM, most Europeans book through and are ticketed thru KLM so they only see a small "Operated by NWA" or get on an NWA plane. DL's global brand awareness outside of Asia is higher - in Europe, Africa, India, the middle-east, and latin/soAm.

While it would be a win-win-win combination, it would be sad to see a great airline name disappear whether it be the Delta name or the Northwest Airlines name. NWA is my #2 carrier after DL and I fly on NWA's red-jets a few times a year. Nothing but praise for the airline, some great crews on-board (GAs are a different story). Hell, had one of the best FAs I've ever experienced on my last DTW-ALB flight on the late A319 outta DTW.



Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlineJetjack74 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 7408 posts, RR: 50
Reply 18, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 9778 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

NWA757300, you should not be posting internal communications. Centry emails are for internal use only, not to be displayed on a public disscussion forum. Mods, suggest deletion of this thread.


Made from jets!
User currently offline4everRC From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 325 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 9780 times:



Quoting Azjubilee (Reply 8):
Why does everyone seem to think DL is doing the buying here? Haven't you ever gone shopping and had someone else pay? Just because DL sent the invitation doesn't mean DL is in control. If it is a MERGER, both parties will NEGOTIATE the consumation of the marriage. NWA could very well be the surviving brand.

THANK YOU! I've been saying this in pretty much every merger thread out here - I'm glad to see that I am not the lone voice of Big Red in the sea of widgets!

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 14):
If DL merges with NWA, DL is the surviving brand. Widgets on the tail of those 744s.

...and your source to back that up? Unless you are Dougie or Richie, can you really state this as fact?



Nobody served our republic like Republic!
User currently offlineNWAESC From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3386 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 9727 times:



Quoting 4everRC (Reply 19):
I'm glad to see that I am not the lone voice of Big Red in the sea of widgets!

Trust me you're not alone!  Smile




Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 18):
NWA757300, you should not be posting internal communications. Centry emails are for internal use only, not to be displayed on a public disscussion forum. Mods, suggest deletion of this thread.

There's enough moderating on here already... No need for a "thread nanny."



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4748 posts, RR: 45
Reply 21, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 9693 times:



Quoting 4everRC (Reply 19):
...and your source to back that up? Unless you are Dougie or Richie, can you really state this as fact?

Listen, I'm not typing through two-toned widget glasses, I don't even work for or with the Widget.

If a merger consumates between DAL and NWA it will be predicated on the merger path of AF/KLM - who just released they whole-heartedly support a DAL/NWA tie-up. The compass won't fade overnight, KLM hasn't has it?



Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlineYhz From Canada, joined Aug 2007, 26 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 9444 times:

Nicely noted in regard to the posting of internal communications. Most people don't think about the result of posting load factors and operational planning simply because at their level it seems benign. But it is not. This information is given to employees so they know something about the company's future plans etc..., it is not meant to be posted so competitors can have access.

I know this seems a bit extreme, but it is not. Air Canada won a huge settlement vs Westjet just in the last two years because WJ gained illegal access to an Air Canada through an employee number and pin. They were able to adjust load factors on certain routes by seeing exactly how AC was performing.

As to this topic....everyone assumes the following: 1. DL would be the surviving brand 2. It is somehow a done deal (never mind what the govt would have to say 3. that a merger in some form WILL happen. Obviously with fuel continuing to kill the industry, the idea sounds better and better to most shareholders. But, until it happens, it is all backseat CEO quarterbacking. I do agree that for numerous reasons, a NW/DL merger would look good on paper, but ALL mergers are utimately painful and consist of years of labor problems. Remember how bad it was for both FA unions with the Republic/NW merger. Never mind the pilot problems.

I think the surprise to many, if a merger would happen, is that NW will be the brand that continues.


User currently offlineNWA757300 From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 299 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 9411 times:



Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 21):
AF/KLM - who just released they whole-heartedly support a DAL/NWA tie-up

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/stor...1ED%2DA1880009C7E8%7D&siteid=yhoof


User currently offlineJetjack74 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 7408 posts, RR: 50
Reply 24, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 9339 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!



Quoting NWAESC (Reply 20):
There's enough moderating on here already... No need for a "thread nanny."

That's not the point. He's posting a copy of an internal communication, which is a violation of the Privacy Act Statement that he agreed to when he became an FA with NWA. He can synopsize what he's heard or read, but to cut and paste an internal memo on a public forum is a flagrent violation of the Privacy Act. It's in the Code of Conduct. He also failed to recognise that he posted the full name of an employee without her consent, which is an invasion or her privacy. Mods, take it down.

Quoting Yhz (Reply 22):
Nicely noted in regard to the posting of internal communications. Most people don't think about the result of posting load factors and operational planning simply because at their level it seems benign. But it is not. This information is given to employees so they know something about the company's future plans etc..., it is not meant to be posted so competitors can have access.

No ones saying he can't discuss a few things he's heard or read, everyine does that, but posting an exact word for word dictation, is poor use of judgement.



Made from jets!
25 NWAESC : If this was proprietary info, it wouldn't/ shouldn't have been sent to literally thousands of employees.
26 YHZ : I understand that, just pointing out that typically people are fast and furious to put out information which (in this case) may not be proprietary, bu
27 AmtrakGuy : Was discussing this with a NWA employee who left last year -- she told me while working at HQ, many employees from Repubicans and NWA does not get al
28 Isitsafenow : I find that interesting. The merger was OCT of 1986...21 1/2 years ago. A pilot 39 years old or older in 1986 has retired....and thats alot of pilots
29 Admluvs2fly : I have an quarterly fleet information booklet from January 1,2007. In it , it says that there were 412 aircraft total. The internal memo of the fleet
30 Isitsafenow : The really amazing fact is that in 1985 and 86 except for Aeroflot, Eastern carried more pax in world than any other carrier. Five years later, they d
31 Klkla : Uh... last time I checked NWA filed bankruptcy the exact same date as Delta! lol To your other points Delta has lower labor costs than NWA and only h
32 Burnsie28 : Delta pilots make more then NW pilots. Also when comparing ground work Delta employees make more then NW's.
33 Post contains images NWADC9 : That makes me wanna Guess I'll be flying NW and the DC-9 next year to MCI!
34 Post contains links Jano : Per http://home.comcast.net/~red.tails/p...enlandMerrillLynchJun2007FINAL.pdf 2006 mainline figures NW CASM 7.7cent DL CASM 7.4cent NW RASM 10.8cent
35 Sxf24 : Then they should be happy to merge with DL and get a raise.
36 EvilForce : You can't just look at total CASM between airlines and say it's apples to apples. If you look ONLY at labor CASM, NWA has $ .025 costs vs. Delta's $
37 Mohunk : The Burlington Northern Railway merger with the Santa Fe Railway resulted in the Burlington Northern Santa Fe Railway(BNSF), much more cumbersome than
38 EvilForce : Who says EITHER survives. Just as likely an entirely new name is picked.
39 M404 : As for the labor costs at NW. Does DL have the flood of retirees among ground and inflight personnel at NW seems to be experiancing (promoting?)? I wo
40 Columba : Too bad DL does not have the rights for Pan Am anymore. A merged DL / NW would truly be the real successor.
41 NWAESC : Approximately .60 cents/hr is not worth it if it means giving up the scope/work rules we (NW) have left....
42 CV640 : Time will tell, there have been rumors of a million mergers that were about ready to go through that never happened. USAirways is still a disaster wit
43 Cv640 : As for the DC-9, trust me quite a few will be around for a bit. Yes, they are parking quite a few this year, but we'll still have close to 70 of them.
44 Jano : Comparing CASMs is apples to apples. And I did put the whole presentation there and links financial statements for both carriers to give food for tho
45 EvilForce : No, not really. You posted that in response to the assertion NWA had lower labor costs. Total CASM doesn't refute that claim. The operations of each
46 Flighty : Correct. As you say, the "variables are endless." Once you work with these numbers yourself, you realize how true that is. A high CASM carrier can be
47 SNCntry32 : mmhmm. There is going to be a lot of politcal battels to stop a merge. I know Jim Obestar of MN has publicly voiced he is against NW and DL. MAC has
48 Jetjack74 : As far as thrd NW/RC rivalry, I NEVER see it amongst the FA's. Some squabble with eachother, but it's never a red/green tail thing. the pilots I don't
49 Post contains images Bmacleod : Well former CO head Bethune and most of DL BOD think its better for DL to stay solo. In other words let NW die a natural death then pick up the piece
50 Bobnwa : Where are you getting your info. Bethune was all for the US/DL proposed merger and is now recommending the UA/DL merger. As for NW dieing a natural d
51 Jetjack74 : Not to mention has the highest in unrestricted cash, over 4 billion I believe. NW had 3.2 bln when exited banckruptcy alone, DL had 2.4 bln. if anyone
52 Burnsie28 : Yes, they have more money and less debt then DL. Nope, the biggest problem with the pilots was the fact that the Republic's biggest aircraft was a 75
53 AirEMS : Sweet I can still have my New Years prediction that NW will still keep the Diesel 9's till they start to decompose -Carl
54 Yyz717 : Obviously, the drawdown of the DC-9 fleet is the big news here. The NW DC-9 fleet has hovered at 95-105 for several years now. A reduction to 68 (all
55 DeltaL1011man : long sotry i wouldn't question him Afica, Latin Ameica, Europe and the 2nd largest FF base in the world all of this or a big Asia name DL will stay a
56 Sxf24 : I don't think DL pilots have worse work rules... Really... care to support your claim with a link or detailed analysis? FYI - DAL has more analyst "b
57 Post contains images Alitalia744 : Facts mean nothing, c'mon Sxf24....
58 Hjulicher : A merger between NW and DL would work if the combined airline would profit in terms of the increasing returns to scale that a larger airline would all
59 AirRyan : That's been the general consensus but other than Steenland looking for a quick buck to pad his retirement I see absolutely no reason whatsoever why N
60 Post contains links SNCntry32 : Do tell. I think your too young to appreciate the DC-9. As am I. But your still yonger then me. Plans for them? DeltaL1011man, I dont think you know
61 NWAESC : We were talking about ground employees. You think it's funny that so many people lost their jobs? What's wrong with you?!
62 EvilForce : It's amusing to watch your attitude now that it's not Delta on the merger table. You've had 2 posts at a minimum already deleted for gloating over th
63 Post contains links N801NW : Some published stories about the plans NWA cutting back DC-9s but is hiring more pilots Minneapolis Star Tribune Northwest Airlines to Shrink Fleet Pi
64 Post contains images Isitsafenow : Naaawww...Maintenance is there to keep that from happening. safe
65 Sxf24 : A successor would retain current authorities, regardless of the airline name. The entire point of a merger is to gain pricing power and obtain sustai
66 NWAESC : What a fantastically ignorant statement... That lone sentence shows how little you really know about the antagonistic culture at NWA.
67 DeltaL1011man : keep them flying right I'm 16 so I don't know anything...........yet you are the one saying IF NW merges you do really think NW would just sit by and
68 Hjulicher : The difference is that here the figures are in terms of revenue which has no bearing on profit. The two are very different. Profit is the amount of d
69 Post contains images EvilForce : Liar. You posted in the: Topic: RE: Does NW Want To Merge? Name: DeltaL1011man Date: 2008-01-15 17:50:43 "It doesn't matter what the employees want.
70 Post contains images SNCntry32 : Honestly, I could. I could see NW sitting back and letting other carries create new 'super' carries while NW focus' on them selfs and new internation
71 DeltaL1011man : trust me i care but here is the way i look at it DL buys NW or UA people at CVG MEM or SLC lose there jobs or have to move to ATL its better than DL
72 EvilForce : I'd rather lose my job than move to Hicksvile....... errrrr Atlanta, GA. Besides you don't know if they will keep the headquarters in Atlanta anyway.
73 DeltaL1011man : ok try and read it this time I DO NOT WANT DL/NW I WANT DL/UA......as i have said i really think (and hope) DL would keep both HQ buildings but the b
74 EvilForce : Hmmmm..... doesn't sound like too good of a record for keeping their large employers. But who knows? *shrug* Michigan is extremely hard pressed for j
75 DeltaL1011man : tell me about it but they will do all they can for Delta (the Ford plant,BellSouth,Fort Mac is or was out of there hands) agreed i would also like to
76 EvilForce : They have to keep the NWA hub in MSP, since NWA has 100 gates leased thru 2020. In addition if they move the headquarters out of MN then they have to
77 Post contains links EvilForce : Here's the link for the $ 260 million requirement: http://minnesota.publicradio.org/display/web/2008/01/10/nwamerger2/
78 DeltaL1011man : thanks i will read over it i new about the gate leases but never heard of the HQ agreement
79 WorldTraveler : Acquirer vs acquiree is most often determined by who has the largest market captilization - which is DL. no, DL is looking for a merger because they
80 Alitalia744 : If it is NWA that is acquired by Delta then MSP will get a $260 payout...and then it is no longer an issue as the airline will still have a substanti
81 NwAflyer07 : lol Yea, id say those are pretty important milestones.... That combined with the culture ive grown up with my entire life as the son of an NW employe
82 Post contains images EvilForce : Ever stop to think why there's so many flights to other cities around the world? Lots of others are trying to get out of Hicksville too. I really don
83 NwAflyer07 : Exactly. And where does the ex ceo of NW get off saying "DL will remain DL if we merge" a short time after he becomes C.E.O. of delta? lol sounds a l
84 PSU.DTW.SCE : Man, you can't have a discussion anywhere on A.net these days about anything without the Deltoids hijacking every thread and turning into a DL will me
85 NorthwestEWR : Amen! Back on topic... it's very sad to see the DC9s slowly being retired but they'll be around for a little while longer. Anyone know if the EMBs or
86 PSU.DTW.SCE : BOS is starting to see the 175 now from MSP & MEM. DCA sees the CR9 from DSM & MSN. PHL-MEM will likely transition to either the CR9 or 175 later on
87 SNCntry32 : I heard from a Compass friend that EWR will infact see the E70..
88 DeltaL1011man : how many orders/options for the CR9 and E75 does NWA have?
89 SNCntry32 : I want to say 36 of each.
90 SNCntry32 : However, they can not be excesised until mainline grows I belive. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I think we hit that magic number in the pilot
91 DeltaL1011man : also besides DTW-PVG what routes will the 788s be on? i have heard JFK-NRT and BOS-NRT anyone think we will see SEA-Asia and MSP/DTW-HKG with them?
92 Post contains images SNCntry32 : MEM-NRT Nah wishful thinking. More routes out of MSP-Asia.
93 DeltaL1011man : it could happen as it is a NW hub.......with talk of DL doing JFK-NRT with there new 77Ls would NW still do JFK-NRT or just put a code on the Delta f
94 Isitsafenow : You are correct....both birds with 12 F and 64 Y seating. safe
95 Sxf24 : Many airlines function much more effectively without militant, organized labor. At NW, the 'antagonistic' culture has effectively led to the loss of
96 Cv640 : EWR has been served by Mesaba and Pinnacle in the past, out of MEM I believe, so it will probably see some Embs. With less and less -9s, some routes w
97 NWAESC : Besides DL, name one. You have it dead wrong (again). Actually, despite the losses suffered (way too many, IMO) the unions on the property *saved* th
98 WorldTraveler : but unless the flights are operating at a maximum 50% load factor (which they are not based on DOT data), there are people coming to ATL as well as l
99 Post contains links and images EvilForce : Glad to see humor wasn't lost on you. Are you nuts? You couldn't pay me enough to come to work for the airlines. In college I worked a summer for an
100 Sxf24 : There are several airlines, including CO, DL and WN, that have productive relationships with employees. Perhaps there'd be less outsourcing if labor
101 NWAESC : WN is an anomaly (sp?), but don't think for a minute that they're not heavily unionized. The CBA for the ramp isn't exactly a pamphlet, either. CO has
102 Burnsie28 : Who knows since XJ used to serve a couple of the daily EWR flights with the Avro's. I disagree, thousands more would have been lost, likely it would
103 Post contains links DeltaL1011man : ok this was in the AJC "He reiterated to me the commitment he made in my office shortly after he became CEO," Isakson said. "That is, if Delta does a
104 NWAESC : Anderson's painted himself into a nice 200+ million dollar corner. Good for him.
105 Gigneil : The merged airline will need them. What special plans are you interested in? The only person talking about that is you. NS
106 SNCntry32 : I heard Compass will be doing one from MSP.
107 Post contains links DeltaL1011man : not the only one http://atlanta.bizjournals.com/atlan...ries/2007/04/30/daily3.html?page=3 routes to HKG,LHR,SIN,SYD and one more NRT slot plus the f
108 PSU.DTW.SCE : Actually, you are right. MEM-EWR goes from 2x daily A319 to 2x daily Compass E175 in April. And 3 of the 5 MSP-EWR flights become Compass 175's. More
109 Post contains images SNCntry32 : Dont seem so suprized MSP will be CP biggest base, followed by MEM then DTW I believe. I think MEM should be the biggest base taking some of the long
110 PSU.DTW.SCE : The CR9 / 175 allocation is supposed to be something like this: CRJ-900: DTW: 18 MSP: 8 MEM: 8 floating / spare: 2 EMB-175: MSP: 20 MEM: 8 DTW: 6 floa
111 AirRyan : Dl is absolutely no posistion to purchase a new aircraft let alone another airline - remember NW went into Ch11 at the same time as DL did but for di
112 Gigneil : That article is about Atlanta. Not New York. There are way better places to fly the 777-200LR than Tokyo. NS
113 Alitalia744 : Interesting given DL's planned capex spend on new aircraft over the next five years. Agree completely. Not sure where the NRT fantasy is coming from.
114 Sxf24 : WTF cares if its an anomaly. WN is proof that management and labor can work together in developing a practical and productive structure the benefits
115 Post contains links DeltaL1011man : why would they want one more NRT slot? ATL-NRT 2x daily? then it would be a 77L anyways First Picture Of DL's New 772LR (by B777ER Jan 21 2008 in Civ
116 Gigneil : Tokyo isn't the answer. They could put it on TLV. The second ATL-NRT would rotate in 777-200ERs with other routes. PVG will give them the opportunity
117 DeltaL1011man : ok so JFK-TLV-JFK can be done with 1 77L? i never said it would be forever and i could see ATL-PVG going to a 77L and those 77Es being put on JFK-NRT
118 Alitalia744 : Not sure where your info is coming from but here's the sked for delivery: Feb 08 Mar 08 Dec 08 Jan 09 x 3
119 Gigneil : JFK-BOM-JFK-TLV-JFK can be done with 3, is my guess, someone with more experience in scheduling can say for sure. NS
120 WorldTraveler : I hope you realize no one who matters in the industry is listening to you. They all believe DL is more than capable of buying an airline. Except that
121 Jetjack74 : Not always, It appears to look that way, becuase usually the larger guy is one with the most money and better finacial base. In the case of the HP/US
122 Post contains images EvilForce : As if anyone is listening to your mental masturbations. Link?
123 NWAESC : I'm still waiting for your specific examples of what NWA's unions should have done/offered to NWA mgmt. I'd also take WN's CBA in a heartbeat, as it
124 Bobnwa : Does not say DL is looking at JFK-NRT anywhere i read.
125 Sxf24 : This is the first time you've asked for specific examples. Unfortunately you're out of luck as I'm not going to pull out a CBA and go through it line
126 Gigneil : Yes, but is it needed there vs. somewhere else? If neither United nor NWA could make JFK-NRT work, NW especially, DL doesn't stand a chance right now
127 Post contains images EvilForce : I miss the days of NWAs JFK - NRT. I'd get upgraded to Business First 85% of the time. To me that was worth flying into LGA on my connection and take
128 NWAESC : Nope. It's the third. Here's one. And another.. And another.. Which is webspeak for, "I don't have facts to back up my rhetoric." Like I metioned pre
129 FlyguyPBI : True! But MAN oh MAN is that one scary sentence! To put it into perspective.... the first line I ever held was on a DC8 doing FLL-EWR trips. UGGGH! 1
130 Flighty : No, it does happen. For example look at Gate Gourmet, with CEO David Siegel, of US Airways fame. When he joined, he demanded a new HQ in Virginia, mo
131 Gigneil : It absolutely happens. I fully agree that NW with a 787 will work GREAT, or NorthDelta can make it work with a 777. But right now, Delta on JFK-NRT w
132 Coronado : What is the speculation on when the CRJ-200's will start a rapid exit from the fleet. They have such high CASM's under the current fuel environment an
133 PSU.DTW.SCE : NW is in an interesting situation regarding their CRJ-200 fleet. NW holds the leases on all of the 139 CRJ-200 aircraft, Pinnacle operating 122, and
134 WorldTraveler : because DL is and has been a much larger carrier in NYC than NW ever has been or UA has been for years. Also, NYC-NRT is more about the NYC market th
135 Post contains images DeltaL1011man : yea because I'm sure they will make ATL-NRT 2x daily
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