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Republic Airlines And Frontier  
User currently offlineCitrusRSW From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 24 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 3127 times:

Being that Frontier is going through some financial woes, how do you think this will effect the future relationship with Republic and the EMB-170? Is F9 happy with the plane and Republic?

13 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 24325 posts, RR: 47
Reply 1, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 3101 times:

The Frontier-Republic agreement runs until 2019 with additional 8 aircraft scheduled to enter service through late 2008.

Its near impossible to get out of such contracts unless there is a significant material breach by one of the parties including Frontier filing for Ch11. So short of a Ch11 filing, I think Frontier is locked into to the Republic flying even if its becomes a liability or no longer meets Frontier marketing needs at some future date.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 24641 posts, RR: 86
Reply 2, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 3092 times:
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Quoting CitrusRSW (Thread starter):
Being that Frontier is going through some financial woes

I'm guessing you mean the 3Q loss - you can't mean the 2Q profit?

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineFRNT787 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 1315 posts, RR: 15
Reply 3, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 2940 times:



Quoting Mariner (Reply 2):
Quoting CitrusRSW (Thread starter):
Being that Frontier is going through some financial woes

I'm guessing you mean the 3Q loss - you can't mean the 2Q profit?

mariner

People always seem to forget when F9 has profits.  frown 

It also amazes me how despite F9s continued restructuring, many seem to spell their doomsday.
 idea  Give them time to restructure and handle new challenges. And as Mariner points out, dont forget they also post profits, something that airlines in financial woes do not do.



"We have a right to fail, because failure makes us grow" --Glenn Beck
User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 6838 posts, RR: 14
Reply 4, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2820 times:



Quoting LAXintl (Reply 1):
The Frontier-Republic agreement runs until 2019 with additional 8 aircraft scheduled to enter service through late 2008.

While I'm sure the agreement is ironclad, the E170 is in such demand Republic probably would be happy to give them to one of their other partners so they could reduce the deal if they wished. With Calgary and Baton Rouge going away it also would seem they have more than they originally planned hanging around.


User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 24641 posts, RR: 86
Reply 5, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2798 times:
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Quoting Enilria (Reply 4):
With Calgary and Baton Rouge going away it also would seem they have more than they originally planned hanging around.

Or - Frontier assigns them to other routes.

It used to be that Frontier served more cities with low frequency. With Mr. Menke it seems to be fewer cities with more frequency.

I am hearing that at least one Lynx city may - stress "may" - revert to E170 and I'm sure there are cities that might support an additional E170 frequency but not an additional mainline frequency.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9112 posts, RR: 18
Reply 6, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2797 times:



Quoting FRNT787 (Reply 3):
And as Mariner points out, dont forget they also post profits, something that airlines in financial woes do not do.

True that, I have seen them post quarterly profits before. They weren't very big, but they're profits nonetheless!  Smile



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 24641 posts, RR: 86
Reply 7, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2775 times:
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Quoting Mariner (Reply 5):
I am hearing that at least one Lynx city may - stress "may" - revert to E170

And look-ee here - it isn't "may" anymore. It's happened.

DEN-TUL, presently 3 x Lynx, will go to 3 x E170 by summer.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineOuboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4482 posts, RR: 22
Reply 8, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2759 times:

OKC will also drop Lynx and become full mainline (before it was a mix of mainline and RJs before going all Lynx). We'll be going to 3 A319s and 1 A318 here.


Any opinion/comment posted is that of my own and not that of Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineFrontierflyer From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 215 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2659 times:

ELP is dropping the 2 lynx and will have 3, long overdue, republic flights. Nice to fly out early and come back late for a change. Can F9 deffer those 8 or so e jets from Republic? Terminal A seems crowded already with the q400s and E jets.

User currently offlineGentFromAlaska From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 2926 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2505 times:



Quoting LAXintl (Reply 1):
Its near impossible to get out of such contracts unless there is a significant material breach by one of the parties including Frontier filing for Ch11. So short of a Ch11 filing, I think Frontier is locked into to the Republic flying even if its becomes a liability or no longer meets Frontier marketing needs at some future date.

Something tells me they have the T for C (Termination for Convenience) and or T for D (Termination for Default) if they don't shame of them.



Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
User currently offlineF9Animal From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 4947 posts, RR: 28
Reply 11, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2491 times:

Republic was a very smart move to take. The 170's are a great fit, and certainly a great opportunity for both companies. It is a win win situation. I like them, and fully support them. I wish they would add the IFE in the 170's though.


I Am A Different Animal!!
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 24325 posts, RR: 47
Reply 12, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2464 times:

In general most of the fixed fee flying the commuters do for carriers are pretty iron clad contracts. Indeed there are cancellations clauses for cause however those are more for performance issues that Republic must given time to cure, or other breach of contract such as if the contracting airline fails to pay in a timely manner etc.

As such there has really been no US carrier that has been able to dump such regional flying mid contract outside of the BK process. Even Mesa which everyone dumps on so much for being a crappy operation manages to hang on at US, DL and UA(which was recently extended to 2018). So if the day comes prior to 2019 that F9 feels 17 E170s are too much, it cant simply downsize the Republic flying at will without incurring significant financial penalties and subjecting itself to further legal action.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineTripleboom From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 278 posts, RR: 13
Reply 13, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 2411 times:



Quoting F9Animal (Reply 11):
I wish they would add the IFE in the 170's though.

I love the E-170s in terms of passenger comfort and jetway accessibility, but I would hate to set IFE put on board. The a/c always seem to be weight restricted if the passenger counts get high. The moment Frontier announced that Republic had submitted an app to pick up some off-season Mexico flying I shuddered. From the moment the a/c first arrived in OMA I took one look at the bins and said that this a/c would be horrible for leisure destinations. Big Bags + Tiny Pits = Big, Bad Things. But off they went to SJD, ZIH, and the like. I worked a flight to ZIH that I had to removed 10 bags and 10 (yes 10) passengers on an a/c configured to carry 76 passengers. Big Bad Things. It seems F9 has learned their lesson though as the E-170s don't appear to be making return trips to Mexico this summer. *whew*


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