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S3 Grounding ATR's  
User currently offlineUPPERDECKFAN From Spain, joined Jun 2007, 992 posts, RR: 1
Posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 2312 times:

Due to the recent crash of one of S3's ATR it's reported they are undefinitely grounding all their ATR.

In spanish:

http://www.eluniversal.com/2008/02/2...ta-barbara-suspen_26A1388203.shtml

This decision seems really odd since it's well known that the accident happened due to weather conditions/human error instead of mechanical failure.


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8 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinePrebennorholm From Denmark, joined Mar 2000, 6389 posts, RR: 54
Reply 1, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 2187 times:

Sorry, I can't read the Spanish text. Doesn't it tell anything about the reason for the grounding?

Could make one speculation: It was a 20 years old aircraft, a -300 model. Maybe it has not been updated with the most modern navigation systems, or ground proximity warning system. Maybe the authorities have requested such updates before operation can be resumed.

Could also be airline operating procedures for the ATR-42 which the authorities demands reviewed before resumed operation.

No distress call, and flying into a mountain, that at least makes it hard to blame ATR-metal. But the combination of high mountains and bad weather, that calls for both healthy procedures and state of the art avionics.



Always keep your number of landings equal to your number of take-offs, Preben Norholm
User currently offlineBWE320 From Germany, joined Aug 2007, 88 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 1996 times:



Quoting Prebennorholm (Reply 1):
reason for the grounding?

They say that the airline wants to show that it cares emotionally and spiritually . A kind of respect for pilots and flight attendants worhing on their fleet of ATR.


User currently offlineRleiro From Venezuela, joined Jan 2006, 498 posts, RR: 7
Reply 3, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1854 times:

The reasons for grounding are not clear yet. The ATR routes of S3 (except Merida) are being made by R7 (DC-9-30). This might be the end of ATR operations for Santa Barbara and a step more into a full merge with Aserca Airlines.

Saludos,

Roberto.



A proud SVZM Spotter!
User currently offlineChiguire From Venezuela, joined Sep 2004, 2004 posts, RR: 16
Reply 4, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1823 times:



Quoting Rleiro (Reply 3):
This might be the end of ATR operations for Santa Barbara and a step more into a full merge with Aserca Airlines.

Do you really think so ? They would have to give up a lot of routes, e.g. Merida. And the ATR is a "cash cow" for them, just as the Beech-Operations for Avior. I don't think they will stop them.


User currently offlineRleiro From Venezuela, joined Jan 2006, 498 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 1652 times:



Quote:
Do you really think so ? They would have to give up a lot of routes, e.g. Merida. And the ATR is a "cash cow" for them, just as the Beech-Operations for Avior. I don't think they will stop them.

I am very sure that commercial operations in Merida will cease and all traffic will be redirected to El Vigia. I do not know if it will be the same for General Aviation.

Saludos,

Roberto.



A proud SVZM Spotter!
User currently offlineAF1624 From France, joined Jul 2006, 654 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 1577 times:



Quoting BWE320 (Reply 2):
They say that the airline wants to show that it cares emotionally and spiritually . A kind of respect for pilots and flight attendants worhing on their fleet of ATR.

I've never seen a rational airline do that ...



Cheers
User currently offlinePrebennorholm From Denmark, joined Mar 2000, 6389 posts, RR: 54
Reply 7, posted (6 years 5 months 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 1454 times:



Quoting AF1624 (Reply 6):
Quoting BWE320 (Reply 2):
They say that the airline wants to show that it cares emotionally and spiritually . A kind of respect for pilots and flight attendants worhing on their fleet of ATR.

I've never seen a rational airline do that ...

I agree with you AF1624. It looks like a cover for something else.

If the crews are confident that they have what they need, properly equipped and maintained planes, proper ATC support etc, and the airline management is confident that everything is in good order, and the authorities are happy, then they would fly all they could to save their business and their jobs.

Only one thing is pretty sure about this accident: The flight crew did not know where they were. And ATC did not tell them that they were off track.

That's something which was normal to US mail pilots in the 20'es. And something which shall not happen today.



Always keep your number of landings equal to your number of take-offs, Preben Norholm
User currently offlineCivilav From Mexico, joined Oct 2004, 391 posts, RR: 12
Reply 8, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 1300 times:



Quoting Rleiro (Reply 5):
am very sure that commercial operations in Merida will cease and all traffic will be redirected to El Vigia.

Roberto,

For anyone who has lived in Merida (like I did for over 9 years), closing the airport is suicide. It is politically unacceptable and the option of El Vigia is no option at all. Traffic is generated in Merida not El Vigia, thus, though a good airport with a long runway was opened as far back as 1991, it has been another white elephant because the road from Merida to El Vigia is not only dangerous but unreliable in terms of landslides and blockages.

If Santa Barbara wishes to stop flying to Merida on the orders of its new owners (Aserca) then Conviasa will be only more than happy to step in with its own ATRs (both 42 and 72) and provide the air links Merida deserves. Merida is a cash cow for Santa Barbara and Avior. Its planes are always full.

For your information, in the years when 727-200 and DC-9-30 (with uprated engines) operations were allowed into Merida, there were up to 4 daily flights to Caracas (2 Avensa, 1 Servivensa and 1 LAV). Average payloads were over 85% year round.

Avensa was the first airline to start operations out of El Vigia in 1991 and lasted till 1997 when it pulled out owing to lack of traffic. By then, LAV had disappeared from the radar, Aeropostal Alas de Venezuela had been formed and newcomers Air Venezuela (with ancient Convair 580 prop planes), LAI with brand-new ATR 42 and 72 planes, Santa Barbara (newish ATR 42) and Avior (Beechcraft) were all competing vs. Avensa 727 service taking chunks of the traffic away with good service and lower fares. El Vigia saw Aeropostal 6 weekly service for a while in 2001 but that lasted no longer than 5 months.

In short, I am at a loss to explain the reason behind the grounding of the fleet other than the fact that they are in parlous state and staff forced management to suspend services or face embarrassing press disclosures. The ATR is the most suitable plane for many of the routes in Venezuela and it is a very reliable plane indeed with an impressive safety record.
As a matter of fact, it would make a lot of sense for Aserca to avail itself of these routes which it could not fly anyway with current jet equipment (jurassic DC-9-30s) either because of operation limitations (Merida and its runway) or passenger yields.

Greetings from Cancun.


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