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How Big Will Alaska Ever Get?  
User currently offlineFlyin5glow From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 66 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6637 times:

hi,

let me first say that this is my first posting, I'm a new member to the forum but I have been reading it for over two years now.

I know i should have title it better, but well here it is, I know Alaska is an international airline since they fly to Mexico and Canada, but that's it. Do they have any plans of growing? Maybe buying long haul planes and flying across the ocean? I would love to see our local airline (for those who live in Western Washington) grow, it would not only better the economy in the state but i will make us look even better in the aviation world, I know we have Boeing, but having a larger airline would sure be cool!  Smile


Go Huskies
53 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSJC4Me From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 373 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6617 times:

I dunno, they seem to do pretty good in their little niche there. I always thought the 757 would look good in AS colors but they arent going to buy any of those and I dont think they have a need for a 787. If/when they retire their Maddogs, they'll have a WN like all 737 fleet.


Unable.
User currently offlineYULYMX From Canada, joined May 2006, 977 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6607 times:

Would ANC-NRT or ANC-LHR work for them??? would they get B767 for that?

User currently offlineAWACSooner From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 1902 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6610 times:

Alaska is currently 663,267 square miles...I don't think it's gonna get any bigger unless a massive volcanic eruption occurs  Wink


Alaska fills a niche in the Pacific northwest...as far as anymore longhaul routes are concerned, they could do some hub-hub routes (ATL, SLC, MSP, DTW), but that's about it. They should've moved into AUS before AA started their daily n/s to SEA...but missed the chance.

I pose another question...would a 73H have the range to make it to say, CTS n/s from ANC? That could be a potential goldmine during summer months.


User currently offlineFlagshipAZ From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3419 posts, RR: 14
Reply 4, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6581 times:

Living here in ANC, and having a few friends working for AS...I can say with reasonable confidence
that AS will be an all-737 airline. The MDs are being retired, probably all gone by the end of this year.
Alaska does not have plans to go global, but rather model themselves after WN, with a bit of more
service & higher prices. Fleet-wise, the 734s are staying until worn-out, the 73Gs fleet around 17-20
ships, the 738s will see at least 50 in the fleet, if not a dozen more on top...and the 12 739s will also
stay put. AS has no use for any wide-bodies...they never had any in the past...too expensive to
purchase & to operate.
Regards.



"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy." --Ben Franklin
User currently offlineCOERJ145 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1421 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6529 times:



Quoting AWACSooner (Reply 3):
I pose another question...would a 73H have the range to make it to say, CTS n/s from ANC? That could be a potential goldmine during summer months.

The distance is 2617nm, within the range of the 73H and the 73G. ANC-IAH is sometimes operated by the 73H on CO and it is 200nm longer.


User currently offlineBayAreaBlue From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 260 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6504 times:



Quoting FlagshipAZ (Reply 4):
The MDs are being retired, probably all gone by the end of this year.

They should be all parked in the desert by Oct. 2008.


User currently offlineYULYMX From Canada, joined May 2006, 977 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6492 times:

ANC-NRT is 2984 nm could it be done with B737 or B739??

[Edited 2008-02-28 12:01:01]

User currently offlineJlbmedia From United States of America, joined Jun 2002, 622 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6492 times:

Is there any truth to the rumor of Alaska starting a SEA-PHL route?


JLB54061
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25137 posts, RR: 85
Reply 9, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6492 times:
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Have things settled down enough in Russia for them to consider re-starting those Far East routes?

Or - were they never a good idea in the first place?

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9607 posts, RR: 52
Reply 10, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6461 times:

AS seems to enjoy slow continued expansion. They haven't deviated from that since the 80s. We saw Mexico slowly develop and then transcons. I wonder what could be next. Regardless nothing out of the ordinary is expected from their conservative management. It is amazing that they were never bought out like every other carrier on the west coast except HP.

Quoting BayAreaBlue (Reply 6):

They should be all parked in the desert by Oct. 2008.

I thought most of them were going second hand to other carriers like Allegiant and not to the desert? Has fuel prices changed that?



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineAWACSooner From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 1902 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6445 times:

I thought one of the caveats for G4 to take em was that they couldn't use them to compete against AS...and G4 wouldn't make that guarantee...so no deal.

User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25169 posts, RR: 22
Reply 12, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 6418 times:



Quoting Flyin5glow (Thread starter):
Do they have any plans of growing? Maybe buying long haul planes and flying across the ocean?



Quoting SJC4Me (Reply 1):
I dunno, they seem to do pretty good in their little niche there.

Small and profitable is better than big and unprofitable. Too many airlines that made the decision to fly across oceans no longer exist (Braniff, People Express, Air Florida, Laker Airways to name just four that come to mind). And don't forget America West's short-lived service to Japan via HNL and the 3 ex-KL 747-200s they acquired for those routes.

Quoting YULYMX (Reply 2):
Would ANC-NRT or ANC-LHR work for them???

Not enough demand and what traffic there is would be highly seasonal. Those routes are more appropriate for leisure.charter/carriers. Western Airlines is another carrier that had short-lived longhaul international aspirations and operated HNL-ANC-LGW and DEN-LGW with DC-10s in the mid-1980s. I don't think those routes lasted more than two years, if that. They bought one DC-10-30 from NZ for those services, although they sometimes also used their own DC-10-10s on the HNL-ANC-LGW route.


User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6372 posts, RR: 3
Reply 13, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 6391 times:



Quoting Mariner (Reply 9):
Have things settled down enough in Russia for them to consider re-starting those Far East routes?

Or - were they never a good idea in the first place?

mariner

I was going to ask the same thing...my one experience flying AS was when the original carrier I was booked on (HP) had to re-accomidate me, and I distinctly remember the seatback safety card (on an MD-80  Wink ) featuring both English and Russian writing...this was in 1999.



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently onlineOzarkD9S From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5069 posts, RR: 21
Reply 14, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 6377 times:

If AS doesn't get bought out I would love to see them buy AQ, send some Horizon Q-400's south for Inter-Island, join oneworld and start some South Pacific flights out of HNL.

Not saying it's gonna happen or even being considered but it's a pretty good way for AS to expand their...Horizons. (Bad pun, couldn't resist)



Next Up: STL-LGA-RIC-ATL-STL
User currently offlineTdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 15, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 6181 times:



Quoting Flyin5glow (Thread starter):
let me first say that this is my first posting, I'm a new member to the forum but I have been reading it for over two years now.

Welcome!

Quoting Flyin5glow (Thread starter):
I know Alaska is an international airline since they fly to Mexico and Canada, but that's it. Do they have any plans of growing?

They're big addition in the recent past was Hawaii.

Quoting YULYMX (Reply 2):
Would ANC-NRT or ANC-LHR work for them???

I can't see the demand from ANC, so you'd be connecting, and who wants to connect through ANC when you can fly direct?

With their partnership airlines you can get pretty much where you want to go internationally through codeshares with Alaska, so they've got full service covered without taking on the cost themselves. Personally, I hope they just keep up the slow and steady growth in their home area.

Tom.


User currently offlineHNL-Jack From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 819 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 6014 times:

[

Quoting OzarkD9S (Reply 14):
If AS doesn't get bought out I would love to see them buy AQ, send some Horizon Q-400's south for Inter-Island, join oneworld and start some South Pacific flights out of HNL.

Not saying it's gonna happen or even being considered but it's a pretty good way for AS to expand their...Horizons. (Bad pun, couldn't resist)

Not much point in AS acquiring AQ. AS could initiate mainland service to Hawaii from all the points served by AQ without the cost and headaches that would come about through acquisition. And frankly, I doubt that any mainland carrier would want to acquire the inter-island routes, particularly with the old 737-200's that will soon require replacing. And, the AQ's 737-700's are too small to generate the revenue needed on their low-yield mainland routes to support themselves .

While they don't have fleet commonality, perhaps a merger with HA might be interesting, although it too brings along the inter-island baggage. However, HA has successfully established themselves as an O&D airline between Hawaii, several points on the mainland and an ever expanding network in the Pacific. It's planes,767-300's and soon A-330-200's, are large enough to produce significant revenue and the airline has a similar O&D route strategy in Hawaii, to that which AS employs in SEA. Their routes are complementary and their management philosophy is similar.

[Edited 2008-02-28 17:01:53]


Grew up in the business and continued the family tradition.
User currently offlineChugach From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 1041 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 5885 times:



Quoting YULYMX (Reply 2):
Would ANC-NRT or ANC-LHR work for them??? would they get B767 for that?

No and nope. If anybody ever does ANC-NRT again on a scheduled basis it'll be either JL or NW.

Quoting AWACSooner (Reply 3):
I pose another question...would a 73H have the range to make it to say, CTS n/s from ANC? That could be a potential goldmine during summer months.

Funny enough, I've heard rumors that they've looked at doing a seasonal ANC-CTS route with the 738. It would a stretch for the aircraft, but talk about an interesting route. However, AS is all about containing costs these days, and going into the unknown in Japan would be pretty risky.

Quoting COERJ145 (Reply 5):

The distance is 2617nm, within the range of the 73H and the 73G. ANC-IAH is sometimes operated by the 73H on CO and it is 200nm longer.

ANC-NRT requires ETOPS. ANC-IAH doesn't. That has a big effect on aircraft range; ETOPS routes require considerably more fuel in case of a diversion to the nearest airport.

Quoting Jlbmedia (Reply 8):
Is there any truth to the rumor of Alaska starting a SEA-PHL route?

Supposedly on their short list. I wouldn't be surprised to see Chester touch down there in 2008 or 2009.

Quoting Jlbmedia (Reply 8):
Have things settled down enough in Russia for them to consider re-starting those Far East routes?

I wish they would! One of the Russian far east carriers is starting ANC-PKC this summer; it will be interesting to see how it goes.

If AS ever does return to Russia, I'd put my money on Yuzhno-Sakhalinsk to tap in on the massive amount of oil traffic there that otherwise has to be routed through Korea. But like I said earlier, AS is all about keeping costs down, and going back to Russia would be a high-cost move.

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 10):
AS seems to enjoy slow continued expansion.

Correct; I think 2008 will be more about connecting the dots than new city expansion. I'd say one more east coast (probably PHL) is likely, along with beefing up SEA/PDX-California and maybe adding some Hawaii flights.



GO ROCKETS
User currently offlineReality From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 485 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 5787 times:



Quoting Flyin5glow (Thread starter):
let me first say that this is my first posting, I'm a new member to the forum but I have been reading it for over two years now.

Thanks for posting. This is an interesting thread.


User currently offlineWifiinthesky From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 49 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5749 times:



Quoting Flyin5glow (Thread starter):
I know we have Boeing, but having a larger airline would sure be cool!

AS has a great niche now, you can be proud of that. Wouldn't make sense to open a mid-con hub to capture 10-20% of come city pair already served by NW, YX, UA etc. And they're also further along with their wi-fi plans than most legacies, another fact you can be proud of.


User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5173 posts, RR: 8
Reply 20, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5691 times:

The biggest missing hole in the AS network is SEA-IAH. CO has a monopoly on this one. Twice daily on a 738/73G would work.


Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineBCAInfoSys From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5672 times:



Quoting Drerx7 (Reply 20):
The biggest missing hole in the AS network is SEA-IAH. CO has a monopoly on this one. Twice daily on a 738/73G would work.

That would be a good route. And for the life of me, I can't understand why AS isn't in the SEA-SLC market. They cover the west pretty damn well, but that is a route that DL and WN have to themselves. If AS got on, I would fly them over either of the 2 competing airlines in a heartbeat...


User currently offlineReality From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 485 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5644 times:



Quoting BCAInfoSys (Reply 21):
Quoting Drerx7 (Reply 20):
The biggest missing hole in the AS network is SEA-IAH. CO has a monopoly on this one. Twice daily on a 738/73G would work.

That would be a good route. And for the life of me, I can't understand why AS isn't in the SEA-SLC market. They cover the west pretty damn well, but that is a route that DL and WN have to themselves. If AS got on, I would fly them over either of the 2 competing airlines in a heartbeat...

Why compete with CO to their HUB in IAH and all those connecting flights? And why go to Delta's HUB in SLC and where WN has a lot of connecting flights? Am I missing something?


User currently offlineRwSEA From Netherlands, joined Jan 2005, 3093 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5621 times:



Quoting Reality (Reply 22):
Why compete with CO to their HUB in IAH and all those connecting flights? And why go to Delta's HUB in SLC and where WN has a lot of connecting flights? Am I missing something?

Because both are major O&D markets from SEA, and the "hometown hub carrier" could serve them well. AS started both ORD and DFW even though they're AA hubs, and that service is doing well. DEN also does well for them, despite the competition from UA and F9 (and now WN).

I think PHL, IAH, and increased frequencies to MIA would be my wish list. I think if AS ever had the gumption, they could do well with a small long-haul network from SEA (think NRT, HKG, LHR) but that doesn't fit their business model, and probably wouldn't justify the expenditures.


User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5173 posts, RR: 8
Reply 24, posted (6 years 6 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 5606 times:



Quoting Reality (Reply 22):
Why compete with CO to their HUB in IAH and all those connecting flights? And why go to Delta's HUB in SLC and where WN has a lot of connecting flights? Am I missing something?

They went to ORD with AA and UA as well as DFW...granted the O&D may be slightly larger in the metroplex and Chicago - but AS hub in SEA would open up smaller markets as well as onward connections to Alaska. I think a twice daily SEA-IAH run could do well. Not sure how the AS/CO partnership works - but AS could codeshare on CO routes from IAH too.



Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
25 Chugach : I think if WN wasn't in the SEA-SLC market, AS would have started Salt Lake a long time ago. While the demand for SLC service is probably there, I wo
26 Chugach : Not trying to flame you by any means, but all of those PNW towns, plus Alaska, are already available thanks to the CO/AS codeshare. CO has its code o
27 Post contains images Drerx7 : I didn't say that I would fly AS if they flew the route but they could find enough people that would that would get on a couple of 737s.
28 Post contains images Chugach : Provided CO doesn't snap up whatever gate and ramp space at IAH to keep AS out
29 BayAreaBlue : Most, all but 4 I believe, have been sold to another holding company and were leased back. When those aircraft are done with AS service, they are fer
30 MCOflyer : Well, if AS goes to HOU, I think CO will cool its jets off as long as AS keeps its code share agreement on the IAH-SEA part but I could see two probl
31 DLPhoenix : Alaska was never bought out because they are a well run (i.e. cinsistently profitable) company. As such they were very expensive to acquire. They gro
32 Flysherwood : PDX - IAH as well. Those flights seem to be quite full.
33 Planespotting : The 73G probably could - but as others have said, I don't see much demand for Tokyo - Anchorage traffic, even on a 130 seat aircraft. Alaska does pre
34 Socalatc : I agree.. Would be a good fit. They could deploy the Q-400 to the islands, park AQ's 737-200 and move AQ's 73G's to mainland flying. I think we will
35 FUN2FLY : Why doesn't CO just buy AS then? Would certainly fit their network "hole" in the NW real well.
36 Post contains links Vega : ALASKA AIRLINES (MAY) START PHL.... http://www.bizjournals.com/seattle/stories/2008/02/18/tidbits1.html
37 Tdscanuck : They codeshare with Delta on that route. You can book SEA-SLC via Alaska, it's just on Delta metal. Tom.
38 Lhpdx : It would be cool to know what Alaska's future plans are for PDX..More east coast? Hawaii? Additional California flights? At least 5 flights to Anchora
39 Chugach : Probably all of the above at some point. Funny thing is, they could probably fill up 4 or 5 PDX-ANC flights a day if they weren't so determined to ma
40 ERJ170 : Uhmm.. how about most of the east coast? Anything east of the Mississippi is pretty much left out.. they do hit the majors.. but there's a lot of sta
41 ThreeIfByAir : Alaska has a few opportunities for incremental growth from SEA, some better than others: PHL - US is the only carrier on the route (and not an AS part
42 MCOflyer : I think they could get away with 2x daily 738 if they do not serve that route already. I know they serve MCO via PDX, and SEA with 738 service. Kingh
43 Baron95 : Alaska will get very, very big...... When they get acquired by AA. Best airline to merge with AA is UA, but since the DoJ/DoT will never let that happ
44 EA CO AS : I've been hearing that rumor for the last 16 years. There's no reason for it to happen though - AA has a poor history of buying West Coast carriers a
45 HNL-Jack : Besides, there is a great difference between the operating cost structure of AS & AA. If AA were to acquire AS those lower costs associated with AS w
46 GentFromAlaska : I would think a ANC-IAH nonstop would be a better choice. Oil vs. big oil.
47 HikesWithEyes : My thoughts: AS will continue to grow at a modest rate (3% per year versus the 10% that the company would like to grow at). This is due to the havoc c
48 MCOflyer : I think AS could make TPA and PHL work being that they are major ports and have major companies based there. You are correct for TPA, it is poorly un
49 Baron95 : AA needs 737NGs in a hurry to park the oldest MD80s ASAP. the cost differences are not that bad. many routes already have AA code share flight number
50 TOLtommy : AS has ETOPS aircraft for Hawaii flying. Hawaii, especially from the West Coast, is not high yield flying. The 73G could use the shorter runway (fewe
51 EA CO AS : However, far more of Alaska's Mileage Plan members redeem miles to go to Hawaii than to Japan - and before starting their own service to HNL and LIH,
52 LACA773 : Oh please NO NO NO !!! This would be the biggest nightmare considering what AA did to Air Cal and Reno Air then moving eastward to TWA! They dismantl
53 EA CO AS : And again, DL gets most of what they'd need from a merger already via the codeshares and partnership they have with AS currently. A merger just makes
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