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USAirways In Trouble In LAS?  
User currently offlineAlexInWa From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 1155 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 12163 times:

Did a search couldn't find anything, so relax.......

What is up with US in LAS?? Planning my summer trips and they have cut alot of service in/out of LAS!!! SEA-LAS is down from 5 daily to 2. Both are red-eyes LAS-SEA,......won't fly that.

I can figure WN and AS on the SEA-LAS route, but it looks like alot of cuts on all LAS service?!?


You mad Bro???
79 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSurfrider1978 From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 292 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 12163 times:

From what I hear they are pulling LAS from a hub to a focus city, cutting quite a few flights.

User currently offlineA330323X From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 3039 posts, RR: 43
Reply 2, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 12024 times:

US's ASMs at LAS are down 27% year-over-year, which is an insanely huge number.


I'm the expert on here on two things, neither of which I care about much anymore.
User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17827 posts, RR: 46
Reply 3, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 12004 times:

US pulled quite a bit last week I believe. Between the close proximity to its major hub at PHX and WN, I think they're getting killed in LAS.


E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineA330323X From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 3039 posts, RR: 43
Reply 4, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 11963 times:



Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 3):
US pulled quite a bit last week I believe.

Last week they killed LAS-MIA/PBI.



I'm the expert on here on two things, neither of which I care about much anymore.
User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5209 posts, RR: 8
Reply 5, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 11906 times:

Would any other carriers come in to build up LAS or would we just see expansion from Southwest and Allegiant? CO could use a hub out west...but I doubt that will happen.


Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlinePHLBOS From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 7558 posts, RR: 23
Reply 6, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 11888 times:



Quoting Surfrider1978 (Reply 1):
From what I hear they are pulling LAS from a hub to a focus city, cutting quite a few flights.



Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 3):
Between the close proximity to its major hub at PHX and WN, I think they're getting killed in LAS.

That being the case, it looks like LAS' hub status is becoming an unexpected casualty of the HP/US merger.



"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
User currently offlineTango-Bravo From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 3806 posts, RR: 29
Reply 7, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 11828 times:

For as long as I can remember, USAirways at LAS with regard to whether it is a hub, or even a serious focus city, has been a question of "are you in or are you out?" Seems they have dabbled endlessly with the level of their presence at LAS. After years of indecision, perhaps they have finally decided they're "out" as far as LAS being a hub or major focus city and are adjusting their flight schedule accordingly.

User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17827 posts, RR: 46
Reply 8, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 11805 times:



Quoting PHLBOS (Reply 6):
That being the case, it looks like LAS' hub status is becoming an unexpected casualty of the HP/US merger.

I think it's been a long time coming--it's just not worth having two hubs 300 miles apart. And if anyone should know that it should be US with their former SYR/PIT/PHL/CMH/DAY/IND hubs Silly



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineRolo987 From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 293 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 11804 times:

According to the US schedule, MIA is still a daily redeye. PBI has been cut it seems.

[Edited 2008-03-12 10:02:34]

User currently offlineBA744PHX From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 337 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 11754 times:

Where will the a/c go?

User currently offlineSirOmega From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 735 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 11732 times:

All the flights they concede will just be picked up by WN. Next year the bridge between A/B and C concourses should open up and eliminate the shuttle ride between A/B and C. I believe they're also realigning some gate areas near the bridge to add an additional gate or two to the C concourse. I think they're also building a new security checkpoint for C to eliminate the Sunday security lines that stretch to infinity.

User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11979 posts, RR: 62
Reply 12, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 11738 times:

I was in LAS this past weekend - and one thing that I did not expect was all the Allegiant MD80s zipping around the ramp. Wow. I knew G4 was big in LAS - plus Orlando, St. Pete, Mesa, etc. - but because most of their flights in and out of LAS are less than daily, I didn't expect to see quite so much Allegiant activity. There were tons of those MD80s going off to all sorts of places - quite impressive, actually, considering that most of the cities Allegiant serves are rather small.

User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5604 posts, RR: 12
Reply 13, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 11548 times:

Seems to me the LAS-situation is similar to the PIT problem: unnecessary duplication of US hub/focus stations rather close to each other. We know what has happened to PIT; looks like the same is finally being acknowledged and taking place out west.

WN is certainly the big enchilada at McCarran and US has decided to surrender to them; they have another full-time on-going battle with the Canyon Blue down in PHX. I would also expect to see WN increase flights at Vegas to pick up some of the slack that might develop.

As a side-effect of this action, let's hope we will see some additional p-2-p routes materialize with the freed-up a/c from LAS when the dust settles at US.

bb


User currently offlineAlexInWa From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 1155 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 11446 times:

Thanks for the thoughts,.......

I dont like this very much, leaves me with one less choice to LAS from SEA. AS and WN are packed. Hope WN adds a flight or two.

I will not fly US due to the late night bank. Good for the security lines,...bad for my hangover.....



You mad Bro???
User currently offlineFUN2FLY From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 1091 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 11257 times:

Alex,

Dually noted: I was suprised at the US cut in service for LAS>SEA until I booked my prime 6PM flight on AS for $88 one way. LAS is a market that has strong demand, but lower yeilds. Maybe some a.netter can share avg RASM ex-PHX vs. ex-LAS. Realizing it's just one route point, but I fly to both quite often and find PHX (shorter flight by 100 miles) to be consistently $40-50 more RT than LAS.

As for US, I also notice that many cities get a daytime PHX run and a red-eye LAS run going East. Trend? Seems similar to SEA.


User currently offlineCongaboy From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 352 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 11221 times:

Interesting that the poster uses the word "trouble"...I would say as US evolves, as others have said, the notion of two hubs being very close is probably not optimizing routes/aircraft. I think it is a logical and intelligent move, seeing that WN is hard to compete with, LAS is primarily and O & D market (so de-HUB), and aircraft used elsewhere (like Caribbean/Latin America/Mexico) get better yields. Let's not forget about the economy and where the demand will be in the next 2-3 years.


"Joey, you like movies about gladiators?"
User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 11167 times:

One main thing is the stiff competition on flights to LAS, especially in the west. Some good examples are DEN-LAS, LAX-LAS and SFO-LAS. There are multiple airlines flying these routes.

I was just reading about how the overall gaming revenues for Nevada (Including Las Vegas) were down nearly 5% for the month of January, meanwhile the gaming revenues in Atlantic City were up 10% for the same month. What should be really interesting is when the February numbers for Las Vegas come out, especially in the wake of the hit the sportsbooks took on the Super Bowl. The drop in Nevada is said to be due to the ongoing economic uncertainty. What this probably means is that folks who typically flew to Las Vegas to go gamble are now sticking closer to home and going to places like A.C. For US, this could be a good thing, as many folks that fly in order to go to A.C. fly into PHL, as service into ACY is limited to a handful of Southern cities served by NK (MYR, MCO, TPA, FLL, RSW, and PBI) and DL (By way of EV service from ATL).


User currently offlineDesertJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7811 posts, RR: 16
Reply 18, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 11110 times:

Some numbers on what the LAS operation has looked like over the years would be useful. My foggy recollection has been that much of HP's service up to the merger had been more strongly biased to the late night operation. With only major regional cities seeing a significant number of daytime frequencies.

Honestly like the other posters I am not too shocked here. Too close to a larger hub at PHX, and while it is a high demand market yields are weaker. In an environment of higher fuel costs this is further complicated. I am not sure how radical the pull down might be, maybe not as extreme as at PIT. Ideally US should redeploy the aircraft to some of its more congested operations to replace flights operated by the 50 seat RJs.



Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6826 posts, RR: 32
Reply 19, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 11071 times:



Quoting Rolo987 (Reply 9):
According to the US schedule, MIA is still a daily redeye. PBI has been cut it seems.

I think he's referring to the fact that LAS-MIA appears to end around April 5.

Quoting A330323X (Reply 2):
US's ASMs at LAS are down 27% year-over-year, which is an insanely huge number.

I don't think it's terribly surprising, though, given that competing with WN at LAS in a time of $100/bbl oil is probably a losing proposition. I'd be more surprised if the night hub weren't bleeding a lot of money right now given fuel prices.


User currently offlineOuboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4616 posts, RR: 23
Reply 20, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 10943 times:

Eh US isn't done changing. Rolling out the new co-HQ in PHL and other changes...this airline will looking nothing like it does today in about 5 years.

User currently offlineNational757 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 720 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 10938 times:



Quoting Ouboy79 (Reply 20):
Eh US isn't done changing. Rolling out the new co-HQ in PHL and other changes...this airline will looking nothing like it does today in about 5 years.

Can you expand on that? How do you think US will look like in 5 years? More international flights out of CLT perhaps?



Formula 1 Grand Prix Trips: YUL '08, MEL '09, BCN '10, SIN '11, and LGW '12
User currently offlinePhxmkeflyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 10647 times:



Quoting Ouboy79 (Reply 20):
Eh US isn't done changing. Rolling out the new co-HQ in PHL and other changes...this airline will looking nothing like it does today in about 5 years.

Whoa...US HQ is moving from PHX to PHL?!?! Can anyone confirm this for me? I knew about their SOC/OCC ops being based in PIT but have never heard anything about their HQ moving to PHL. I must say that if this is true I am quite surprised they would pick PHL over PHX. Currently their HQ is on PRIME real estate in Tempe, PHX is growing much faster than PHL, and quite frankly the climate/desirablity of living in PHX outweighs that in PHL.


User currently offlineMkirch72 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 198 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 10593 times:



Quoting Srbmod (Reply 17):
What this probably means is that folks who typically flew to Las Vegas to go gamble are now sticking closer to home and going to places like A.C. For US, this could be a good thing, as many folks that fly in order to go to A.C. fly into PHL, as service into ACY is limited to a handful of Southern cities served by NK (MYR, MCO, TPA, FLL, RSW, and PBI) and DL (By way of EV service from ATL).

Funny you should say this ---- I keep an eye on the arrivals and departures out of St. Pete/Clearwater (PIE) right across the bay from TPA and I've noticed Pace Airlines flights to Atlantic City from PIE over the last several weeks. I'm assuming they were charters.

In fact, Pace Airlines flight #322 is scheduled to leave from PIE to ACY at 11:00am tomorrow morning. Anyone have any info on these flights?


User currently offlineBicoastal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (6 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 10525 times:



Quoting Phxmkeflyer (Reply 22):
Whoa...US HQ is moving from PHX to PHL?!?! Can anyone confirm this for me? I

They want stronger management focus on PHL and have stationed a VP there. Despite the problems at PHL, it's an important hub for US Airways. But HQ will stay in the PHX area.


25 Vega : If I knew the answer, I wouldn't be wasting my time posting on a-net. Anyway, here are some of their stated plans: International route extensive expa
26 PHXMKEflyer : Okay, thanks for the clarification! I believe PHL is US largest revenue producer and it certainly is important to have emphasis on PHL, I just couldn
27 IRelayer : I see this with US all the time, even PRE merger. They pull in and pull out of cities at random and its hard to keep track of where and when they fly
28 Vctony : Some of these cuts could be seasonal. The weather in LAS is dreadful in the summer (yeah, I know, I live in TUS which is almost the same) and I am sur
29 Vega : There's a little more to it than that. They'll be opening a Satellite Headquarters operation in Philadelphia and hiring 200 additional employees to s
30 A330323X : They're not. The number I cited above (ASMs down 27%) was year-over-year, comparing apples to apples.
31 AlexInWa : I have to agree with A330323X............ The LAS market out of SEA is one of the fastest growing. 15 years ago you had about 3 n/s a day. 10 years a
32 SirOmega : The Las Vegas Strip was only down 1.33%. Downtown was down 6%, which to me is more indicative of the tough times Las Vegas is going through right now
33 WESTERN737800 : I hope its not going to be AA & STL all over again.
34 Wn676 : Actually, he said "rolling out the new co-HQ in PHL" not "HQ moving from PHX to PHL."
35 AirCop : As a passenger, what I have noticed, that a couple of years ago at PHX, HP's side of T4 was empty after about 8pm, now its the opposite with numerous
36 Vctony : Yeah, I was surprised with how busy T4 was a few weeks ago when I connected from a US SNA-PHX flight to a US Express (Mesa) PHX-TUS flight around 9-10
37 EA CO AS : This seems incredibly inefficient. Why make a costly move that will perpetuate the "East vs. West" mentality you're trying to eliminate in the first
38 Post contains images Ouboy79 : I'm glad someone can read here. Vega, thanks for filling in the rest for me. I didn't have the exact numbers of positions opening up in PHL. PHXMKEFl
39 Iowaman : They recently added a fourth daily SEA-LAS non-stop to help pick up for the US losses. LAS will have a huge upswing in air travel soon with about 30,
40 Tockeyhockey : living in phoenix is a never-ending waking nightmare of 110 degree days with no shade and no hope of relief. it is, simply put, the worst city i have
41 Micstatic : I love PHL and PHX. However, I think more people around this country would rather live in Phoenix, than Philly. Just my 2 cents.
42 EXAAUADL : that's a good point....there is an attitude around here and in the media also that if an airline makes changes, it must be because they are "in troub
43 Post contains images A330323X : Actually, most of the LAS capacity is going to CLT (SAT/AUS/DAB/PFN/VPS/GPT/SMF/TUS) and to a much lesser extent PHL (SMF/YVR).
44 Crjflyer35 : Haha, I agree with Micstatic, you can keep your feet of snow and antartic temperatures. I was born and raised in Michigan, and while it's a gorgeous
45 ScottB : So what happens to the Hawai'i flying out of PHX? PHL offered to build the expansion to the international terminal back when US management was making
46 A330323X : Well, the EMB-190 certainly is in-house; it's just the EMB-170/175 that are outsourced.
47 BP1 : Let us get to some fundamental basics - air fares and yields. This is a fantastic move for USAirways for a few reasons. 1. With such low fares from LA
48 PHXMKEflyer : The proof is in the pudding, PHX recently surpassed PHL as the fifth most populated metropolitan area in the U.S. Those 110 degree days you speak of
49 Post contains links MAH4546 : No, it didn't. Philadelphia is the 5th largest; Phoenix is the 13th largest. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_metropolitan_areas
50 Hondah35 : In case anyone on this board is in denial, Arizona and Nevada have been the fastest growing states in the nation for 15-20 years now. AIRLINES HAVE T
51 Flighty : No they don't. WN makes less RASM than US any day of the year. And does WN have cheaper operations, that really depends on who is doing the analysis.
52 Post contains links and images PHXMKEflyer : ack, my bad, thx for the correction MAH4546. I meant to say that the population of the city of PHX itself NOT the metro area surpassed the city popul
53 A330323X : US lost a bunch of money at LAS in 2007, and they lost a little bit of money in PHX as well. All of the profits came from the East side of the operat
54 Hondah35 : You are right on most counts, fuel prices may change everything, but doesn't WN's incredibly uninterrupted string of profitable quarters count for so
55 Post contains images Barney Captain : Sorry, but that's just not accurate. I was born and raised there and it's an oft-repeated misconception. According to Wilkipedia, there are 5 months
56 BA744PHX : A330323X I am curious where you got that information from. Not that I think your wrong just wondering where I can find info thnxs
57 ScottB : Even with WN paying near top-of-the-industry wages, their labor CASM in 2007 was 3.22 cents, as compared to 3.03 cents at US. US actually did reap be
58 A330323X : They slipped and mentioned it in one of their recent 10-K's or 10-Q's. It's the first (and probably last) time they'll make that mistake. Sorry, but
59 Srbmod : Still not good. Since the Fall, gaming revenues Las Vegas has been down. The real tell will be when the February numbers come out, as the sports book
60 PHXMKEflyer : I also live in the "Valley of the Sun" and I guess it just comes down to what each person thinks is "hot".
61 Ouboy79 : There are other business making decisions that don't fall under control of the new OCC that'll be in PIT. Many of those have already been outlined ab
62 Jlbmedia : PHL is their "Bread & Butter" right now, which to me makes PHL USAirways PRESENT, not the past. I tend to think in simple terms. I see the legacies m
63 ConcordeBoy : ...which is an even more ridiculous comparison than your first attempt, considering that population of cities-proper mean absolutely nothing to airli
64 WorldTraveler : and also has one of the highest levels of mortgage delinquencies and defaults in the country. WN also has a significant cost advantage due to its fue
65 PHXMKEflyer : ...huh, so population of cities-proper mean nothing to the industry, interesting. To reitterate, the point of the populations of PHL and PHX came up
66 MAH4546 : Absolutely correct. Go look at how small the city proper of places like Miami and Atlanta are, and how huge they are for Jacksonville and El Paso. Or
67 Jlbmedia : Thats a little like saying.....If I have a 1 gallon jug (Philadelphia) thats full, and a 2 gallon jug (Phoenix) that has 1 gallon of fluid in it. The
68 DTWAGENT : I thought WN was big in PHX too. So why are they not getting their butt kicked their. Also, if you want an airline to build up in LAS. Look at Alligia
69 Post contains images Ouboy79 : Sprawling is right...gotta love urban sprawl. Nice case of that here in OKC...sitting at just under 610 square miles for the city itself. A lot of pe
70 Iowaman : Won't happen. Allegiant can in no way shape or form compete against Southwest. It is why they do not overlap destinations what so ever out of anywher
71 Vctony : WN is big in Phoenix but their operation really hasn't grown in PHX over the past 5 years or so. 5 years ago PHX was their largest station, now it's
72 SirOmega : Yea, when City Center opens late next year, I think that will be the point when things really turn around. 5,000 hotel rooms, 12,000 jobs, etc. Its a
73 LACA773 : #s @ & 3. Please accept my apologies, but isn't US now an LCC?? Their image suffers throughout their entire system. Cutting back in LAS isn't going t
74 A330323X : Well you're mistaken. US flight attendants clean the cabin all by themselves on most legs, as per the AFA contract.
75 Mariner : Cutting unprofitable routes will help them considerably. As reported in many newspapers, Southwest was not profitable from its airline operations las
76 RIOJANEIRO : "Well you're mistaken. US flight attendants clean the cabin all by themselves on most legs, as per the AFA contract." A330 - Just to clarify, 'West' F
77 Observer : I haven't read through 76 replies, so pardon if this answer has been covered. Doogie Parker was asked about the Vegas pull down at its media day. He s
78 BA744PHX : Does anyone know which cities from LAS will be effected by the downsize?
79 Atmx2000 : It's not worth having to hubs 300 miles apart if neither has huge O&D, particularly premium O&D over leisure traffic. PHX, while not a PHL, has more
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