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F9 Secures Buyer For 2 A318/2 A319  
User currently offlineNZblue From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 638 posts, RR: 3
Posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 6383 times:

Frontier Airlines Secures Buyer for Two Airbus A318 and Two Airbus A319 Aircraft

Frontier Airlines Holdings Inc. said that it entered into a Letter of Agreement with VTB Leasing to sell two of Frontier's 49 Airbus A319 aircraft and two of its 11 Airbus A318 aircraft to VTB Leasing for onwards lease to Rossiya Airlines.

FRNT up 6.1%

Comments? Reactions?


It's an entirely different kind of flying; all together.
47 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25142 posts, RR: 85
Reply 1, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 6365 times:
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Quoting NZblue (Thread starter):
Comments? Reactions?

That'll be pretty on the balance sheet.  Smile

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently onlineHumberside From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2005, 4918 posts, RR: 4
Reply 2, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 6296 times:

New A318 operator then is Rossiya


Visit the Air Humberside Website and Forum
User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6751 posts, RR: 32
Reply 3, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 6238 times:

Well, the performance of the shares today is probably unrelated to the news of the aircraft being sold, given that the announcement was actually made after the markets closed. However, I think it's very good news in that it helps to shore up the balance sheet by bringing in cash (less what might have been owed to lenders if the planes had been mortgaged) and it allows them to put the brakes on capacity growth with a recession apparently looming.

Getting some additional cash in the bank is a very smart move (IMO) given that we're likely to see losses again this quarter and given that Southwest continues to expand at DEN. We may see the pressure ease somewhat from United if they remove capacity from DEN as part of their domestic capacity reduction -- I think this is likely given that DEN is the most domestic of their hubs.


User currently offlineKingCavalier From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 1303 posts, RR: 17
Reply 4, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 6227 times:



Quoting Humberside (Reply 2):
New A318 operator then is Rossiya

2 A318's start, but will they increase that? I've liked the A318's for Frontier, but I don't know if I'd shed a tear if Rossiya took the remaining 9 A318's and F9 increased its A320 fleet.



Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25142 posts, RR: 85
Reply 5, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 6195 times:
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Quoting ScottB (Reply 3):
it helps to shore up the balance sheet by bringing in cash (less what might have been owed to lenders if the planes had been mortgaged)

Frontier originally said that the return to them would be between $20 million and $25 million on each aircraft.

So I guess we should see at least an additional $80 million to cash in hand.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineKingCavalier From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 1303 posts, RR: 17
Reply 6, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 6177 times:



Quoting ScottB (Reply 3):
it allows them to put the brakes on capacity growth

Tapping on the brakes maybe, but not applying full pressure -

Sean Menke commented in the release, “In January we communicated a revised capacity growth plan that was driven primarily by the unprecedented rise in the cost of fuel. Part of that plan was to move forward with the delivery of the larger, 162-seat Airbus A320 aircraft while selling four of our existing aircraft, resulting in revised year-over-year growth of approximately three to five percent in Fiscal Year 2009. I am pleased to say with today’s announcement we have taken another critical step in our cost-savings plan and we are on track to achieve those revised growth numbers.”



Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25142 posts, RR: 85
Reply 7, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 6060 times:
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Quoting KingCavalier (Reply 4):
I don't know if I'd shed a tear if Rossiya took the remaining 9 A318's and F9 increased its A320 fleet.

Just a guess, but - based on what Mr. Menke said at the JP Morgan conference last week - I wouldn't fall over in shock if a couple more A320's turned up in the fleet.

Beyond those A320's already ordered from Airbus, I mean.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineSunking737 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 2040 posts, RR: 8
Reply 8, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 6016 times:



Quoting Mariner (Reply 7):
Beyond those A320's already ordered from Airbus, I mean.

Could these be Blue planes???



Just an MSPAVGEEK
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25142 posts, RR: 85
Reply 9, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 5980 times:
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Quoting Sunking737 (Reply 8):
Could these be Blue planes???

I don't know, but I think they are the wrong engines?

It isn't even definite, and I'd need to listen to it again to get the exact wording, but, from memory and hasty notes, he said he stands ready to acquire bargains - if they should become available in the present circumstances.

He has said it before, so I'm guessing they're just keeping their eyes open. He's also said he's working to a twenty year plan, so nothing needs to happen tomorrow.

In view of the way DEN-DCA has been absorbing the extra capacity of the A320's, a couple more could certainly be useful to Frontier at least on some routes.

mariner

[Edited 2008-03-20 15:40:25]


aeternum nauta
User currently offlineSunking737 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 2040 posts, RR: 8
Reply 10, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 5912 times:

Maybe I missed something on this thread, but is this deal with F9, are they keeping the planes, lease back or getting rid of them like Jetblue.


Just an MSPAVGEEK
User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6751 posts, RR: 32
Reply 11, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 5869 times:



Quoting Sunking737 (Reply 10):
Maybe I missed something on this thread

You did.

Quoting NZblue (Thread starter):
sell two of Frontier's 49 Airbus A319 aircraft and two of its 11 Airbus A318 aircraft to VTB Leasing for onwards lease to Rossiya Airlines.



Quoting Mariner (Reply 9):
I think they are the wrong engines?

I think you are correct.

Quoting KingCavalier (Reply 6):
Tapping on the brakes maybe, but not applying full pressure

True, but capacity in calendar 2007 was up by about 14% over calendar 2006; dropping that to 4% (plus or minus one) is a significant shift in strategy. Actually, I think we may even see a slight decrease in the number of plane-miles flown by Frontier since they're adding four seats to each Airbus and will be flying two of the larger A320's. That will help to keep costs under control.


User currently offlineSunking737 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 2040 posts, RR: 8
Reply 12, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5809 times:



Quoting ScottB (Reply 11):

Quoting Sunking737 (Reply 10):
Maybe I missed something on this thread

You did.

Oh thank you.



Just an MSPAVGEEK
User currently offlineTripleboom From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 278 posts, RR: 13
Reply 13, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 5698 times:



Quoting Sunking737 (Reply 12):
Oh thank you.

Hardly helpful huh? Oh well.. there's one in every thread. Frontier is selling the a/c off entirely so they will no longer be part of the F9 fleet. They are not selling them to a leasing company only to turn around and lease them right back into the fleet as has been a common practice.


User currently offlineIvo From Belgium, joined Sep 2000, 470 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 5277 times:

Which ones are going?

Reg?

Ivo


User currently offlineF9Animal From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 5027 posts, RR: 28
Reply 15, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 5105 times:

Sorry to see the fleet shrinking a bit, but glad to see F9 getting some needed cash. With the 320's coming in, in reality, the fleet is not shrinking much. In fact, I doubt this will have any effect on the airline. How many aircraft does F9 outright own? Mariner??? LOL!


I Am A Different Animal!!
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25142 posts, RR: 85
Reply 16, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 5070 times:
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Quoting F9Animal (Reply 15):
How many aircraft does F9 outright own? Mariner??? LOL!

It was 24. These four going makes it 20. But - they are buying the 2 x A320's.

Sp the short answer is - will be 22.

Until the next A320's arrive. They plan to have 9 x A320 in the fleet within three years. I don't know if they will buy all of them, or lease.

Could I make this any more complicated?  Smile

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25142 posts, RR: 85
Reply 17, posted (6 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 5001 times:
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Quoting Mariner (Reply 5):
So I guess we should see at least an additional $80 million to cash in hand.

I need to correct myself. The $20 - $25 million was gross to the sale, after the mortgages, etc. It does not include such things as any fees or commissions payable to Skyways, eg.

So the improvement to cash in hand will be less than that figure. But still - pretty.  Smile

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineGlobalDreams From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 43 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (6 years 5 months 22 hours ago) and read 4354 times:

Anyone know where the 2 A319's are going?

User currently offlineYtib From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 571 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (6 years 5 months 22 hours ago) and read 4331 times:



Quoting GlobalDreams (Reply 18):
Anyone know where the 2 A319's are going?

It is in the original post, to a leasing company and then onward to an airline in Russia.


User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 6422 posts, RR: 17
Reply 20, posted (6 years 5 months 21 hours ago) and read 4304 times:

What is that website w/ all the tails? Is that F9's site? Which ones are being sold?


Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
User currently offlineGlobalDreams From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 43 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (6 years 5 months 21 hours ago) and read 4279 times:



Quoting Ytib (Reply 19):
t is in the original post, to a leasing company and then onward to an airline in Russia.

I know that is where the 318's are going, but are the 319's going to the Russian airline as well?


User currently offlineViasa From Switzerland, joined Jun 2005, 1874 posts, RR: 6
Reply 22, posted (6 years 5 months 21 hours ago) and read 4238 times:


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Photo © Tom Turner
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Photo © John R. Beckman




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Photo © Michael Carter
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Photo © Chris Burns



This four planes will leave the fleet.


User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25142 posts, RR: 85
Reply 23, posted (6 years 5 months 21 hours ago) and read 4204 times:
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Quoting Viasa (Reply 22):
This four planes will leave the fleet.

N801FR is leaving - Griswald?

Hmmmm. I have to think that tail will get recycled. I believe that part of Frontier's is planning a future campaign with Griswald - which would be a bit odd if Griswald is no longer in the feet.

N201FR, perhaps?

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineCberflyer From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 134 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (6 years 5 months 19 hours ago) and read 4059 times:



Quoting Mariner (Reply 23):
N201FR, perhaps?

N201FR has a caribou (so far unnamed, ASAIK), and N202FR has a ram (also unnamed). Perhaps Griz, Doc (the snowy owl, one of my faves), Lucy (the Canada goose), and the fox pups will show up first on the next 320s?  hyper 

Seeing the Doc (N917FR) is one of those leaving, that might why it was sitting off to the side of the A concourse idle last week?


25 ChicagoFlyer : Not a Frontier hater, please forgive and be gentle... however, I have to chime in from the financial point of view. On the other hand, it is great ne
26 Richierich : What engines will the A320s have, does anybody know? Just curious.
27 Mariner : Which "unsecured creditors" did you have in mind? Apart from the aircraft mortgages, secured by the aircraft, Frontier has no debt. Zero. I disagree.
28 ScottB : Oh, there are several weaker players in the US market; at least four of them have an "X" in their code. Well, giving cash to the shareholders and/or
29 ScottB : Well, of course, I agree with most of what you said aside from this. I think that the share price is somewhat justified by the simple facts that (1)
30 PlanesNTrains : It's getting to the point where some hick who wins the next Powerball could end up buying a major airline - just for fun. Wierd. -Dave
31 Post contains images Mariner : That was really my point. On a day when oil fell, and almost the entire sector went up, FRNT was knocked by 16% (more intraday). It did, of course, g
32 ADMAN737 : does any1 have pics of a F9 A318
33 Post contains links ChicagoFlyer : I think ScottB has a reasonable position on the issue--we seem to agree on what's important, and can agree to disagree how dire the prospects are. How
34 Mariner : Ah, the old shoot the messenger? Well - as in the subject of this thread: They've just sold four aircraft. So, with respect, anything that was report
35 Post contains images FreequentFlier : The problem with this assessment is it ignores the larger macro and micro-economy assessment and its implications for F9. If we're having a debate on
36 Mariner : You've said this several times before, and I have disagreed before. As I see it, their future is entirely in their own hands. I've explained why, and
37 NASCARAirforce : They can't get rid of Griswald!!! He is popular in their advertisements. I think they should put him on one of the new A320s. When is Frontier going t
38 F9Animal : To be honest, I think now might be the time to buy it up. What a price to buy, and what a gamble. You are right on in your remark about WN. Those tha
39 KingCavalier : Has Frontier announced which tails are leaving? Did I miss something about Griz being one of the tails being sold? If true, I'm sure F9 will bring hi
40 ScottB : Well, my speculation (because I've seen it reported at other carriers) is that some of the "cash & short term investments" on the balance sheet are t
41 Post contains images Mariner : That may be. There was one particularly curious quarter when Frontier managed to lose money on their fuel hedges. But it is, at this stage of the gam
42 ScottB : Well, as you know, RASM improvements are often a better measure; if revenue is up by 5% while ASM's are up by 20%, RASM will be down over 12% -- whic
43 Mariner : That's fair. To add another perspective to it, I don't have a very high opinion of that particular analyst. On the other hand, Jamie Baker, at JP Mor
44 Post contains links ADent : There is a post here: http://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo...3896014&searchid=3913511#ID3913511 . Not sure where that info came from though.
45 Post contains links Mariner : Here's why I find it difficult to believe Griswald is going away. Frontier is going to start selling snacks as part of "Griswald's Gournet Cafe": htt
46 Post contains links NZblue : Looks like the sale of the 4 aircraft will net Frontier an additional $37.5M if/when their bankruptcy judge approves this transaction: Plane Sale Boos
47 LAXintl : Good deal -- money can go cover the expectant Jan-Mar quarter loss, or provide cash towards covering CCP hold backs.
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