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Who Might Get The AZ 777's If Alitalia Shut Down?  
User currently offlineAcelanzarote From Spain, joined Nov 2005, 821 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 8660 times:

Hi
Reported on another thread is the problems AF-KLM appear to be having with the take over
of Alitalia. If in the end AF-KLM walk away as the deal gets messy and too many try
to have their say, and Alitalia do shut down down which airlines would be looking
to get their hands on some of the B777's?

A lot of 'ifs' but sure one or two airlines might be eyeing the 777's up if Alitalia do close shop
evenmore so with the delay of the 787???


Same could be said for the A319/320/321's and the B767's I guess but doubt there is
much interest in the MD80's

any thoughts?


from the Island with sun and great photo's.. Why not visit Lanzarote
30 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7058 posts, RR: 4
Reply 1, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 8597 times:

DL and CO could need some, maybe an Asian airline as well.


It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineThreepoint From Canada, joined Oct 2005, 2129 posts, RR: 9
Reply 2, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 7969 times:



Quoting Columba (Reply 1):
DL and CO could need some, maybe an Asian airline as well.

What does AZ operate? I doubt any Asian, DL nor CO need the older 772s...77L & W airframes are what's needed.



The nice thing about a mistake is the pleasure it gives others.
User currently offlineMmedford From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 561 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 7628 times:

I could see Delta picking them up for Domestic/Caribbean/South American ops...

Even Air Canada is an option, not to mention Varig...

The frames won't be on the market for very long...



ILS = It'll Land Somewhere
User currently offlineVasu From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 3861 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 7627 times:

I reckon its a very very unlikely argument... but hey who knows?! If the case came about, maybe it would be one of the US airlines... wishing to increase capacity after acquiring LHR slots... ?

Only one idea though!


User currently offlineSXDFC From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 2298 posts, RR: 19
Reply 5, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 7580 times:

Lets hope we can see AZ 777s for sometime to come!  Wink


ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineUnited1 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 5930 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 7507 times:



Quoting Threepoint (Reply 2):
What does AZ operate? I doubt any Asian, DL nor CO need the older 772s...77L & W airframes are what's needed.

10 GE Powered 777-200ER



Semper Fi - PowerPoint makes us stupid.
User currently offlineBP1 From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 593 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 6962 times:

If the AF/KL deal falls apart and then LH and Air One are unsuccessful, here are some of the prized assets:

1. IF and only IF, the 777's are owned and not leased, there are some funds available there.
2. The JFK, ORD and any slots in the United States
3. The LHR slots and Heathrow space.
4. Asian landing slots at high density airports (if sell-able)
5. The Airbus fleet could be ideal for any carrier looking to speed up 737-200, 300, 500 retirements and replace with Airbus aircraft.


But after that, not much more.

BP1



"First To Fly The A-380" / 26 October 2007 SYD-SIN Inaugural
User currently offlineFlynavy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 6946 times:

I can't really comment on whether or not we're looking at them, but there is a desire here at DL to put the 777 on our signature routes again especially now with the newly acquired Heathrow rights (i.e. JFK-LHR/ATL-LHR). Until recently, DL was interested in acquiring the non-ER 777-300s that EK operates for this reason. That deal was mulled when EK decided to renew the leases on those frames. Of course, in a year or so, we'll have 6 more 777-200LRs (for a total of 8) that will undoubtedly free up the 777-200ERs to do more specific missions. Only time will tell.

User currently offlineJAL From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 5083 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 6927 times:

BA I'm sure would be more than willing to take 1 or 2 of AZ's 777.


Work Hard But Play Harder
User currently offlineKrisYYZ From Canada, joined Nov 2004, 1593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 6624 times:



Quoting Mmedford (Reply 3):
Even Air Canada is an option,

I don't think that AC would be interested in used B772s when it still has options for brand new B77Ws from Boeing.

Quoting JAL (Reply 9):
BA I'm sure would be more than willing to take 1 or 2 of AZ's 777.

BA was concerned about not finding a replacement for the B772 that crashed at LHR, so I am sure they would be very interested in those birds.

KrisYYZ


User currently offlineFlyHoss From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 598 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 6353 times:



Quoting Threepoint (Reply 2):
What does AZ operate? I doubt any Asian, DL nor CO need the older 772s...77L & W airframes are what's needed.

Don't forget that at least 2 of the newly ordered 8 CO 777s are 777-200ERs.

Prior to CO's recent order, I'd heard rumors that CO was considering used 777-200ERs and was interested in as many as 5 of AZ's airplanes. Like AZ, CO's 772s are powered by GE-90 engines.

With the order for the new airplanes, I don't believe CO is interested any longer in any of the AZ birds. However, CO starts Newark-Shanghai in about a year and the first new 772s don't arrive by then (IIRC), so I can't help but wonder if CO is still interested in a good deal for 2 used GE powered 772s to help start the Newark-Shanghai route.

Furthermore, the AZ 772s aren't very old; they were delivered from August 2002 to May 2004. Only two of CO's 20 772s are newer than that.



A little bit louder now, a lil bit louder now...
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9295 posts, RR: 14
Reply 12, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 6116 times:



Quoting Mmedford (Reply 3):
I could see Delta picking them up for Domestic/Caribbean/South American ops...

South American I can see but the others? You do know these are 777-200ERs right?
I can see Delta getting them or CO.



yep.
User currently offlineBabybus From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 5886 times:

or maybe they'll be off to the desert?  Wow!

I'm sure some airline has room for these classics.


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 24906 posts, RR: 22
Reply 14, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 5803 times:



Quoting BP1 (Reply 7):
IF and only IF, the 777's are owned and not leased, there are some funds available there.

AZ's 4 newest 777s are leased from GECAS which is why they're registered in Ireland where GECAS manages its non-U.S.-based lease business from their offices in SNN. Not sure what the financial arrangements are for the other 6 AZ 777s with Italian registrations.


User currently offlineBrons2 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3007 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 5772 times:



Quoting Babybus (Reply 13):
I'm sure some airline has room for these classics.

Huh? The oldest 777 in the AZ fleet is 6 years old, the newest is 4.



Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
User currently offlineComeAndGo From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1042 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 5731 times:

The other 6 777 are owned by an Italian leasing firm. Plus, if AZ folds it will morph into a new airline a la Swiss. And no body will get their hands on any AZ assets. The Berlusconi government will kill the AF deal, come up with some resque plan and move the new airline to his hometown Milan.

User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 24906 posts, RR: 22
Reply 17, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 5696 times:



Quoting Brons2 (Reply 15):
Quoting Babybus (Reply 13):
I'm sure some airline has room for these classics.

Huh? The oldest 777 in the AZ fleet is 6 years old, the newest is 4.

Even AZ's oldest 777 is a year younger than BA's newest 777.


User currently offlineNCB From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 5692 times:

Guess who is being pictured in that potential rescue plan?

Berlusconi's daughter, president of Fininvest.


User currently offlineComeAndGo From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1042 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 5571 times:

Berlusconi's doughter is one of the best female CEO in Europe. There's a tremendous amount of respect for her in the business comunity regardless of her relation to Berlusconi.

User currently offlinePlaneHunter From Germany, joined Mar 2006, 6716 posts, RR: 77
Reply 20, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 5444 times:



Quoting Threepoint (Reply 2):
I doubt any Asian, DL nor CO need the older 772s...77L & W airframes are what's needed.

There would be an enormous demand for the birds. Remember that there are hardly any (inferior) A340-300s or -200s available.

Quoting Babybus (Reply 13):
or maybe they'll be off to the desert?

Absolutely unlikely.

Quoting Babybus (Reply 13):
I'm sure some airline has room for these classics.

We aren't talking about 743s or A300s.


PH



Nothing's worse than flying the same reg twice!
User currently offlineBill142 From Australia, joined Aug 2004, 8440 posts, RR: 8
Reply 21, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 4643 times:

What sort of condition are they in? If they're poorly maintained some could go the way of the Varig 777.

User currently offlineFlynavy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 4602 times:



Quoting Babybus (Reply 13):
I'm sure some airline has room for these classics.

 eyepopping  Imagine that, another mis-informed, ignorant comment. These 777s aren't even that old.


User currently offlineLospaziale From Italy, joined Sep 2005, 37 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 4544 times:

Even if Alitalia is in financial trouble, that doesn't mean that the aircraft are in poor conditions!!
The B777-200 ER are new, they were received between 2002 and 2004!
They are fitted with PTV and a really good IFE, so they're not like Varig ones!

Furthermore if Alitalia should bankrupt, I think it will happen something like Swissair with a smaller new airline starting again and in this case the long haul fleet will be made by these 10 B777!



lo spaziale
User currently offlineLockstockNL777 From Netherlands, joined Feb 2008, 99 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (6 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 4371 times:



Quoting SXDFC (Reply 5):

I wouldn´t know why, flew with them for the first time to CCS a few weeks ago. They managed to lose my luggage 2 times, going there and coming back, which cut my 2 week holiday short by 3 days. Had by FAR the worst in flight service ever (F/A were snapping at passengers and disapeared for 4 hours straight), the 767 was beat up and really dirty (and I am still a student, the word "dirty" shouldnt have a meaning to me  Wink and the lost luggage assistance was terrible (they delivered the luggage to a wrong hotel and didnt pick up the phone anymore, Valerio from Alitalia, if you read this, you are an ass!!)

So to be honest, I wouldn´t be too sad if they go down the drain. What goes around comes around....


25 DeltaAVL : There is no chance of these coming to DL for domestic operations. There's just no way, Mr. Armchair CEO.
26 FlyLKU : They will not be allowed to shut down. The unfortunate Italian taxpayer will continue to bear that burden.
27 Jfk777 : Alitalia may be a dead dog, but its 777 fleet has to be among the best available. These are GE powered 777 which would fit well with a Delta or an Asi
28 Threepoint : Thank you gentlemen, the thought that they may be ER versions occurred to me after it was too late to edit. I didn't realize they were all less than
29 Bennett123 : IMO the real issue the MD80, which could go or be reduced anyway.
30 Super80DFW : Just a quick question, Why wouldn't KL or AF take them? I know AF has GE 777-200ER. I don't know about KL though. I think CO could benefit nicely from
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