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Philippine Airlines At SFO  
User currently offlineSlovacek747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 5876 times:

Tonight there are two planes sitting on the ground at SFO. One is a 744 and the other a 340. I thought they only had one daily flight..am I wrong? Is there a reason why there are 2 there tonight? Do they both stop in the same place on the say back to MNL?

Thanks,
Slovacek747

16 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinePRFLYER From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 308 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 5829 times:

There are two flights MNL-SFO on Fridays. PR104 and PR114. And depending on the load, there is a technical stop for the return SFO-MNL in Guam for either A343 or B744.

[Edited 2008-04-04 20:54:12]

[Edited 2008-04-04 20:54:58]

User currently offlineJasp25 From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 615 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 5735 times:

Philippine Airlines flies twice on Fridays and Sundays. PR115, (PR 104 and 114 fly out of LAX) departs at 8:40PM and PR 105 departs at 1030. PR115 is usually serviced by an A340-300 and 105 by a B744.


-peace and chicken grease!
User currently offlineSlovacek747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 5701 times:

How long ahead of time do they know if they are going to make a tech in GUM??

Slovacek747


User currently offlineJasp25 From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 615 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 5686 times:



Quoting Slovacek747 (Reply 3):
How long ahead of time do they know if they are going to make a tech in GUM??

I would speculate that they announce if the flight is making a tech stop a few minutes before departure after they determine the weight of the aircraft and wind factor (and after counting all the balikbayan boxes in the cargo hold. )  Wink

-jasp



-peace and chicken grease!
User currently offlinePRFLYER From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 308 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 5533 times:



Quoting Jasp25 (Reply 2):
(PR 104 and 114 fly out of LAX)

LAX flights are PR102/103 and PR112/113.
From my experience, they will notify you at check-in if there will be no technical stop in Guam. If there is no technical stop in Guam, they will usually push departure an hour or more so the flight will arrive Manila past 4AM. Not sure if there is a curfew at MNL why arrival must be past 4AM.


User currently offlineAS739X From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6161 posts, RR: 24
Reply 6, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 5514 times:



Quoting Jasp25 (Reply 4):

They actually know hours before. It doesn't take much calculating back in PR to know with headwinds and the projected load the plane can not make it. There are some instance were loads don't end up as heavy as thought and they will make last minute changes and go non-stop by adding the needed fuel. Thats rare!

ASSFO



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineJasp25 From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 615 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 5418 times:



Quoting PRFLYER (Reply 5):
LAX flights are PR102/103 and PR112/113.

Oh yes, you're right.

I had a client in the past that swore to me he'd never fly PR because of his experience. He was heading to HKG on Cathay and sitting on a window seat he was observing the PR 744 getting ready for departure out of Tom Bradley. He noticed that PR's crew were having trouble in closing the cabin door and for minutes of trying to close it, one of them pulled out a hammer and hammered the door shut. The plane pushed back and took off. I thought it was hilarious.. but I am not sure if that really happened.

-jasp



-peace and chicken grease!
User currently offlineMarcoPoloWorld From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 645 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 5293 times:

I think the second daily PR flight out of SFO is now operated three times a week rather than two.

Nonetheless, it seems strange to me that they have these flights back-to-back. Why not operate the "secondary" flight as a daytime arrival / departure like Cathay has done since they started their second daily SFO flight to HKG back in October.

PR coverage and schedules seem very erratic. I do think, however, that starting service between Cebu and the US West coast, as what they have stated, is a good idea. Only to read, though, that it wouldn't be a nonstop!  Angry Then, what's the advantage? I can fly Cathay one-stop to Cebu for less, with better service and a superb hub transfer (HKG).

And what's up with no PR flights to Europe? Now that LH is withdrawing, seems like a good opportunity to capture the German market from, say, FRA. Germans tourists are all over the Philippines.


User currently offlinePRFLYER From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 308 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 5263 times:

The second MNL-SFO-MNL and MNL-LAX-MNL flights are still twice a week (Fri & Sun for SFO, Wed & Sun for LAX). Remember, the FAA has downgraded the Philippines to Category II so PR cannot add new flights to their schedule and frankly there are no equipment that they can use. The WBs are being reconfigured to bi-class right now so they are short in A/C for transpac flights. During the last Christmas season, the second flights were increased to 3 times a week but have since gone back to 2 times a week last January.
Flights are back to back because pax are happy to arrive in Manila early in the morning to beat the daytime traffic. PR made a survey before they introduced the 3rd second flight and 85% of those who responded prefers the present schedule. PR wanted to introduce a daytime flight but the idea was not well received by those surveyed.
PAL just emerge from receivership and are slowly building up the Euro routes. The arrival next year of the Triple 7s will definitely help them assuming the Philippines get back their Category I rating from the FAA by then.


User currently offlineVikingA346 From Sweden, joined Oct 2006, 515 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 5053 times:

What do the loads look like on the PR flights out of SFO? Is there really that much demand to go to MNL, especially if it often makes a tech stop in GUM? I would be surprised if they could fill a 340 and a 744 to capacity, even though one of them only operates 2x or 3x per week.

Wonder why someone would choose to connect in MNL over HKG, especially since PR often make that tech stop.



...you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you shall return
User currently offlineAS739X From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6161 posts, RR: 24
Reply 11, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5003 times:

Quoting VikingA346 (Reply 10):

San Francisco Bay Area has the highest population of Filipinos outside of their country, SFO defiantly warrants the service. Loads are very good. If they were not, which occasional they can be, then they wouldn't do the GUM stop.

ASSFO

[Edited 2008-04-07 12:25:51]


"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineLegacyins From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2090 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 4991 times:



Quoting VikingA346 (Reply 10):
What do the loads look like on the PR flights out of SFO? Is there really that much demand to go to MNL, especially if it often makes a tech stop in GUM? I would be surprised if they could fill a 340 and a 744 to capacity, even though one of them only operates 2x or 3x per week.

The Bay Area, speciffically Daly City, has one of the larget concentration of Phillipeno populations in the Coutry. They have no problem filling a 744 on a daliy basis. The extra A340 picks up the slack. To give you an idea of flight counts the past few days.

Friday April 4th. PR 104- 436 paxs and PR 114- 272 paxs
Saturday April 5th. PR 104 - 436 paxs
Sunday April 6th. PR 104 - 437 paxs
Monday, April 7th. Pr 104 - 435 paxs.



John@SFO
User currently offlineCityAirline From Sweden, joined Nov 2005, 704 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4918 times:



Quoting VikingA346 (Reply 10):
Is there really that much demand to go to MNL, especially if it often makes a tech stop in GUM? I would be surprised if they could fill a 340 and a 744 to capacity, even though one of them only operates 2x or 3x per week.

Yes, the first thing PR wants to do when they receive the 77W's is to go doubly daily to SFO and LAX. Those two routes are the airlines' moneymakers.

Quoting Legacyins (Reply 12):
The Bay Area, speciffically Daly City, has one of the larget concentration of Phillipeno


[quote=Legacyins,reply=12]The Bay Area, speciffically Daly City, has one of the larget concentration of Phillipeno populations in the Coutry. They have no problem filling a 744 on a daliy basis. The extra A340 picks up the slack. To give you an idea of flight counts the past few days.

Yes, I think there are about a half million filipinos in the bay area, and about as many in the LA area. Every day almost 2000 people fly from the US to the Philippines.



Quoting Legacyins (Reply 12):
Friday April 4th. PR 104- 436 paxs and PR 114- 272 paxs
Saturday April 5th. PR 104 - 436 paxs
Sunday April 6th. PR 104 - 437 paxs
Monday, April 7th. Pr 104 - 435 paxs.

Oh, thats impressive. But the PR A340s only seat 264 passengers, so are 8 like infants or something?

//Alex



I don't fly to live, I live to fly...
User currently offlineLegacyins From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2090 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4872 times:



Quoting CityAirline (Reply 13):
Oh, thats impressive. But the PR A340s only seat 264 passengers, so are 8 like infants or something?

You are correct.



John@SFO
User currently offlineMarcoPoloWorld From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 645 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 4725 times:



Quoting PRFLYER (Reply 9):
Flights are back to back because pax are happy to arrive in Manila early in the morning to beat the daytime traffic. PR made a survey before they introduced the 3rd second flight and 85% of those who responded prefers the present schedule. PR wanted to introduce a daytime flight but the idea was not well received by those surveyed.

Thanks Prflyer and also Legacyins for the added information - that is very relevant and informative indeed.

Although, Prflyer, if you think about it, wouldn't operating the second-daily, twice-a-week flight as a daytime flight roughly correspond with the 85%-to-15% percent preference that this survey might seem to imply? If the second flight is operated as its current A340 but daytime instead - and assuming the numbers above as the 747 and 340 capacity, then that would yield approximately 14.9% percent of weekly seating capacity! This then almost exactly corresponds with the general time preferences of the survey respondents.


User currently offlinePRFLYER From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 308 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 4681 times:



Quoting MarcoPoloWorld (Reply 15):

Many factors come into play why a daytime 2nd flight works against PR.

1. As pointed out on another thread, arrival in MNL of the transpac flights coincide with the schedule of the domestic and regional connecting flights which are mostly in the morning. The A/Cs which came in are then utilize to do the regional flights.

2. Counter and Ground personnel in the West Coast are from a contract company so a back to back will save PR some money, otherwide they have to contract a second set of personnel (and counter space) for the daytime flight.

3. Early AM arrival in MNL is very convenient to avoid the infamous Manila traffic.

4. For the Business travelers, it is nice to have a full day to do work here, go to the airport to catch your flight and get to Manila ready for a full day of work. If the departure from the West Coast is on the daytime, you lose a day of work here then get to Manila in the afternoon or evening basically losing 2 days of work.


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