BinMonster From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 215 posts, RR: 0 Posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 6217 times:
Delta is reporting that in less than two weeks their new service to Shanghai, the new service has generated more than $1 million in cargo revenue and posted a revenue record for a single flight. On April 5 they carried nearly $120,000 in cargo revenue.
Delta is looking to increase cargo revenue this year in an effort support the companies financial goals. Looks like the non passenger service division of the company can be the difference between profit or loss. However in light of oil's price these division may not make up losses on the passenger side of the business.
Mayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 7530 posts, RR: 10 Reply 1, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 6139 times:
Certainly couldn't hurt the bottom line. For several years after 9/11, cargo was the only division that turned a profit. Always treated like a poor relation, if the company had promoted cargo like it should have for the past 20 years or so, they might not have had to play catch up in the cargo game. Now, I believe, they are headed in the right direction. I only hope they can promote domestic cargo as much as they do international cargo or even international cargo originating in non-gateway cities, like SLC (soon to change to a gateway). Perhaps they can establish a cargo presence on the SLC-CDG route, although the altitude and temps may have something to say about that.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
SeaBosDca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 3748 posts, RR: 4 Reply 2, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 5926 times:
Quoting Mayor (Reply 1): if the company had promoted cargo like it should have for the past 20 years or so, they might not have had to play catch up in the cargo game.
The acquisition of so many 777-200LRs (i.e. monster cargo carriers) seems to suggest high fuel prices have caused DL to see the light.
Most gorgeous aircraft: Tu-204-300, 757-200, A330-200, 777-200LR, 787-8
Flighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 6721 posts, RR: 3 Reply 3, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 5911 times:
There is no limit to the cargo demand out of PVG. If you want to fly 10x 744Fs, you can fill them up daily.
Mayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 7530 posts, RR: 10 Reply 4, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 5847 times:
Quoting Mayor (Reply 1):
if the company had promoted cargo like it should have for the past 20 years or so, they might not have had to play catch up in the cargo game.
The acquisition of so many 777-200LRs (i.e. monster cargo carriers) seems to suggest high fuel prices have caused DL to see the light.
Actually, the new found promotion of cargo started not long after Anderson took over, when fuel was still at $70 a barrel.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
Dc-9-10 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 583 posts, RR: 0 Reply 5, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 5687 times:
It's just to bad its much harder to find things to put in the holds from the US to China, if that was the case just think of the profit potential.
DALMD88 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2249 posts, RR: 15 Reply 6, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 5614 times:
This can't be true. Ron Allen was sure there was no money in cargo.
ChiGB1973 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1574 posts, RR: 1 Reply 7, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 5564 times:
Isn't this proprietary info? Is there a link?
It's great news, but seemingly something DL would want to keep to themselves.
I realize there is a lot of cargo over there and other airlines know this; just doesn't seem responsible to post this information.
Is this just one of those public company, public knowledge things?
DeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 7671 posts, RR: 8 Reply 8, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 5539 times:
Quoting DALMD88 (Reply 6): This can't be true. Ron Allen was sure there was no money in cargo.
anything that dumba** has to say is most likely wrong.
Quoting BinMonster (Thread starter): However in light of oil's price these division may not make up losses on the passenger side of the business.
ATL-PVG loads are pretty good
PVG-ATL loads are alright..........I think they will get better
way to go Delta!!
"Oh look at the sUGAr falling out of the sky! Look at the sUGAr falling out of the sky!" LM 1922-2011 Go Dawgs! G.A.T.A.
LAXdude1023 From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 6083 posts, RR: 28 Reply 9, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 5476 times:
Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 8): ATL-PVG loads are pretty good
PVG-ATL loads are alright..........I think they will get better
Hey as long they make money on the flight, it doesnt really matter. If the cargo is going to be what drives the flight then thats all good. From what ive gathered, the loads from ATL-PVG are ok and the loads from PVG-ATL are awful, but it doesnt matter as long as they can make money on it. Take DFW-SCL on AA. The loads arent good in low season, but they do very well with the flight because of cargo. ATL-PVG might be in the same boat.
Next flights: DFW-GRU-SDU-EZE-DFW on AA/JJ/EK in J!
Pnwtraveler From Canada, joined Jun 2007, 1891 posts, RR: 9 Reply 11, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 5233 times:
I believe this is true also for AC's flights out of China as well. The 777's are flying with good loads but stacked with cargo. Can anyone confirm the status of the leased D10 or MD11 service from China to Calgary is no longer needed?
Mayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 7530 posts, RR: 10 Reply 12, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 5205 times:
Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 10): Quoting Mayor (Reply 1):
soon to change to a gateway
...did so a while back, just not intercon.
I was referring to the upcoming service SLC-CDG. Seems we used to have pretty good amounts of cargo going to Paris...of course we had to send it via ATL, JFK or CVG.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
OOer From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1290 posts, RR: 2 Reply 13, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 5191 times:
The ATL-PVG for the remainder of the month average about a 90% load factor....some even oversold in coach!!!!
The PVG-ATL flights are about 50% full for the next week or so...then they pick up for the rest of the month and average a 75% to 80% load factor out of there....seems like pretty good loads to me...especially for April, just wait for May and the rest of the summer...you wont even be able to step foot on one of these flights unless you book 1 month in advance!!!
Ptcflyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 97 posts, RR: 0 Reply 14, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 5086 times:
Glad that we did ATL-PVG at the get-go. On DL 018 almost everyone in coach had an empty row of 3 seats on Thursday of this week.! Great flight flying horizontally for $580 return.
Looks like the flights will be more full moving forward.
WorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 15, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 4852 times:
Quoting Mayor (Reply 1): For several years after 9/11, cargo was the only division that turned a profit. Always treated like a poor relation, if the company had promoted cargo like it should have for the past 20 years or so, they might not have had to play catch up in the cargo game.
if you look at DL's DOT reports, its cargo revenues and percent of int'l capacity used are proportional to what other carriers report. DL hasn't been squandering cargo.
It does have huge new opportunities because of the many new international cities it is opening, many of which are not served by other US carriers as well as the cargo lifting capability of the 764ERs and the 777LRs. The 764 can easily carry 30 or 40K lb of cargo on the 4000 to 4500 mile routes DL uses the plane on. DL's Latin America routes also do very well, as do most carriers. BOM is carrying cargo for the first time since it went nonstop, thanks to the capabilities of the LR, despite there being runway restrictions in place due to cargo. I doubt if CO is carrying a full passenger load, let alone cargo from BOM.
Mayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 7530 posts, RR: 10 Reply 16, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 4755 times:
Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 15): if you look at DL's DOT reports, its cargo revenues and percent of int'l capacity used are proportional to what other carriers report. DL hasn't been squandering cargo.
Considering what the potential has been over the years, yes they have. I lived it. Whenever we tried to push cargo, they always came back with the statement "well, we're a passenger airline". That's all well and good but we never tried to push cargo over passengers, just get recognition and support for the cargo end. Only lately, has Delta really seemed like they want to promote cargo. Even before 9/11 when we were a separate division, it seemed like it was all for show. After 9/11 we went back under the ACS umbrella until recently when it was made a separate division, once again.
When I hired on in '71 until about 2000, cargo was virtually run by the marketing department. Not an entirely bad thing but there were no actual people that had worked cargo in charge.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
Jetdeltamsy From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 2982 posts, RR: 9 Reply 17, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4559 times:
Quoting BinMonster (Thread starter): Looks like the non passenger service division of the company can be the difference between profit or loss.
Every cubic inch of space on today's airliners must be used to generate revenue.
It's just smart business to seel every available inch of space.
Worked for too many airlines to list. Banktupcy after bankruptcy after bankruptcy.
DeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 7671 posts, RR: 8 Reply 18, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4435 times:
I would say ATL-PVG at about 85%-90% loads is about right
PVG-ATL is around 60% but will go up
also read what OOer said:
Quoting OOer (Reply 13): The ATL-PVG for the remainder of the month average about a 90% load factor....some even oversold in coach!!!!
The PVG-ATL flights are about 50% full for the next week or so...then they pick up for the rest of the month and average a 75% to 80% load factor out of there....seems like pretty good loads to me...especially for April, just wait for May and the rest of the summer...you wont even be able to step foot on one of these flights unless you book 1 month in advance!!!
I would also like to note PVG is doing much better than what most of a.net said it would (also note not talking about LAXdude)
There was also talk that ATL-PVG would have 77Es with the lie-flats.....is this true? also it was going to have the new c/s that true?
"Oh look at the sUGAr falling out of the sky! Look at the sUGAr falling out of the sky!" LM 1922-2011 Go Dawgs! G.A.T.A.
RJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 19, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4358 times:
Good to hear...But just out of curiousity, what kind of cargo is Delta flying? I'm just trying to think what goods from China would necessitate air shipping rather than boat such that Delta could be making such a killing on cargo immediately...
Jetdeltamsy From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 2982 posts, RR: 9 Reply 21, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4040 times:
Gatechae From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 76 posts, RR: 0 Reply 22, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 3717 times:
Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 21): Where are they reporting this? Do you have a source you could share with us?
I find it very unusal that a company would break out the financials in less than a month.
Just curious.
Well the airline industry isnt doing to well lately...so the more positive news to investors the better. I'm sure the accounting dept at DL analyzes new routes on a very short term, frequent basis, just to see where the trends are going.
What are these?Pancakes?*gets force fed one*Oh oh, these are delectable.Good news Flappy, I've decided not to kill you!
Ualcsr From United States of America, joined May 2006, 482 posts, RR: 1 Reply 23, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 2841 times:
How is this different than any other US airline serving China? Yippee, DL is making all this money from cargo to/from China; so is every one else. Why all the hoopla? All sounds a little self-serving to me.
JohnClipper From Hong Kong, joined Aug 2005, 691 posts, RR: 0 Reply 24, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2705 times:
I agree Ualcsr, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. I would be suprised if DL did NOT got out full x/PVG. There is more demand then supply in this market.
Absimilliard From Canada, joined Nov 2007, 29 posts, RR: 0 Reply 25, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2633 times:
Maybe DL and AC success with the 77L regarding its amazing cargo capacity (and not ultra long range capacity!) will open AA and CO eyes when they order new 777?
Supposedly, the AC cargo division was overjoyed when AC announced YUL-FRA was going to be operated by a 77W this summer...
Mayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 7530 posts, RR: 10 Reply 26, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 2461 times:
Quoting BinMonster (Thread starter):
Delta is reporting
Where are they reporting this? Do you have a source you could share with us?
I find it very unusal that a company would break out the financials in less than a month.
Just curious.
Quoting Ualcsr (Reply 23): How is this different than any other US airline serving China? Yippee, DL is making all this money from cargo to/from China; so is every one else. Why all the hoopla? All sounds a little self-serving to me.
Quoting JohnClipper (Reply 24): I agree Ualcsr, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. I would be suprised if DL did NOT got out full x/PVG. There is more demand then supply in this market.
This was reported on the Delta employee website. I couldn't find it anywhere else although they might release it to the general public on Monday.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
LAXdude1023 From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 6083 posts, RR: 28 Reply 27, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 2399 times:
Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 18): I would also like to note PVG is doing much better than what most of a.net said it would (also note not talking about LAXdude)
Hey dude, I never said that it would be a failure. I did say it might take a while to get off the ground in terms of loads. And on the PVG-ATL leg, im not wrong.
Im glad that its doing well. Certainly other carriers need to get in on PVG when they can, its a good high yeilding biz market!
Next flights: DFW-GRU-SDU-EZE-DFW on AA/JJ/EK in J!
Avianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5643 posts, RR: 47 Reply 28, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2311 times:
Quoting Ualcsr (Reply 23): Yippee, DL is making all this money from cargo to/from China; so is every one else. Why all the hoopla? All sounds a little self-serving to me.
all carriere on the trans-pacific route are making a hell of money (of course if they used the correct aircraft with decent payloads).
Pilottim747 From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 1607 posts, RR: 6 Reply 29, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2293 times:
Quoting ChiGB1973 (Reply 7): Isn't this proprietary info? Is there a link?
It's great news, but seemingly something DL would want to keep to themselves.
Yes, this is proprietary information. An employee posting this information risks disciplinary action, up to and including termination or employment.
Aviation Photographers & Enthusiasts--Coordinate your life.
DeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 7671 posts, RR: 8 Reply 30, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 2188 times:
Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 27): Hey dude, I never said that it would be a failure. I did say it might take a while to get off the ground in terms of loads. And on the PVG-ATL leg, im not wrong.
Rwy04LGA From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 1359 posts, RR: 4 Reply 31, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 2119 times:
Quoting Ualcsr (Reply 23): How is this different than any other US airline serving China? Yippee, DL is making all this money from cargo to/from China; so is every one else. Why all the hoopla? All sounds a little self-serving to me.
Quoting JohnClipper (Reply 24): I agree Ualcsr, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. I would be suprised if DL did NOT got out full x/PVG. There is more demand then supply in this market.
Since the thread says it all, why did you bother to read further?
I was quite happy to see that we're making money on the route. It helps boost morale a bit when you see your company doing something well. And since all we've been hearing of late is BKs and oil prices and concerns about the economy, why not a little good news for a change? Additionally, with the prospects of merger on the horizon, good news can't help but sound nice to investors. Wouldn't you feel the same as I if United just started a new route and was doing well with it?
Sure, you've 'been there, done that'...but we haven't. And now that we're in the game, we're letting people know. Wouldn't United do that, or would they keep it all to themselves?
And, just between you and I...have you never done anything self-serving before?
The early bird gets the worm, BUT...the second mouse gets the cheese!
Jetdeltamsy From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 2982 posts, RR: 9 Reply 32, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1991 times:
Quoting Gatechae (Reply 22): I'm sure the accounting dept at DL analyzes new routes on a very short term, frequent basis, just to see where the trends are going.
Accounting departments never, ever make information like this public.
Quoting Mayor (Reply 26): This was reported on the Delta employee website. I couldn't find it anywhere else although they might release it to the general public on Monday.
Cut and paste. Cut a paste.
Worked for too many airlines to list. Banktupcy after bankruptcy after bankruptcy.
JohnClipper From Hong Kong, joined Aug 2005, 691 posts, RR: 0 Reply 33, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 1860 times:
Quoting Rwy04LGA (Reply 31): I was quite happy to see that we're making money on the route. It helps boost morale a bit when you see your company doing something well. And since all we've been hearing of late is BKs and oil prices and concerns about the economy, why not a little good news for a change? Additionally, with the prospects of merger on the horizon, good news can't help but sound nice to investors. Wouldn't you feel the same as I if United just started a new route and was doing well with it?
Sure, you've 'been there, done that'...but we haven't. And now that we're in the game, we're letting people know. Wouldn't United do that, or would they keep it all to themselves?
And, just between you and I...have you never done anything self-serving before?
All that I am saying is that this is not a spectacular "Delta only" occurrence oweing to wonderful Delta "Georgia" leadership and planning. Any idiot with a widebody plane and a route authority can make a killing on a route from China to the US moving cargo.
Also, don't automatically assume I work for UA, because I don't...
Rwy04LGA From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 1359 posts, RR: 4 Reply 34, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 1838 times:
Quoting JohnClipper (Reply 33): Also, don't automatically assume I work for UA, because I don't...
Don't automatically assume I did, because I didn't.
The early bird gets the worm, BUT...the second mouse gets the cheese!
LAXdude1023 From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 6083 posts, RR: 28 Reply 35, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 1826 times:
Mayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 7530 posts, RR: 10 Reply 36, posted (4 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1600 times:
Quoting Pilottim747 (Reply 29): Quoting ChiGB1973 (Reply 7):
Isn't this proprietary info? Is there a link?
It's great news, but seemingly something DL would want to keep to themselves.
Yes, this is proprietary information. An employee posting this information risks disciplinary action, up to and including termination or employment.
Maybe in the strictest sense of the word but the article is actually pretty vague, it's not likely a competitor could actually gain anything from it. No actual customers or customer accounts are named, just amounts of cargo and revenues, rounded off, no doubt. Nothing that could be damaging to DL if a competitor got ahold of it.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
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anything that dumba** has to say is most likely wrong.
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