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AMR Post $328mil Q1 Loss  
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 24353 posts, RR: 47
Posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 6853 times:

Pretty nasty number, and sign of the pain the industry is experiencing.

Quote:
AMR Corporation Reports a First Quarter 2008 Net Loss of $328 Million as Record Fuel Prices Drove $665 Million in Added Cost Compared to a Year Ago

FORT WORTH, Texas, April 16 -- AMR Corporation, the parent company of American Airlines, Inc., today reported a net loss of $328 million for the first quarter of 2008, or $1.32 per share.

The current quarter results compare to a net profit of $81 million for the first quarter of 2007, or $0.30 per diluted share.

Record jet fuel prices contributed significantly to the Company's loss in the first quarter of 2008. The Company paid $665 million more for fuel in the first quarter of 2008 than it would have paid at prevailing prices from the prior-year period. AMR paid $2.74 per gallon for jet fuel in the first quarter compared to $1.85 a gallon in the first quarter of 2007, a 48 percent increase.

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/080416/law509.html?.v=5


From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
41 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6707 times:

Teh revenue environemtn for AMR is still pretty good. They would have made over $300m in profit versus $81m last year if fuel had stayed thet same even with the MD-80 debacle.

User currently offlineJaysan From India, joined Apr 2008, 99 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6685 times:



Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 1):
even with the MD-80 debacle.

The MD80 debacle will be captured in there Q2 call...


User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21419 posts, RR: 60
Reply 3, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6664 times:



Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 1):
Teh revenue environemtn for AMR is still pretty good. They would have made over $300m in profit versus $81m last year if fuel had stayed thet same even with the MD-80 debacle.

True but Easter is usually in Q2, not Q1 like this year, so it's a tough comparison year over year this time.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineOcracoke From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 676 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6635 times:



Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 1):
Teh revenue environemtn for AMR is still pretty good. They would have made over $300m in profit versus $81m last year if fuel had stayed thet same even with the MD-80 debacle.

Yea, and the Cincinnati Bengals would have won the Super Bowl if they just had good players.
 Yeah sure


Obviously, if you lose $300m, something is not right with the revenue environment. If fuel goes up, then raise fares to cover the cost of fuel. If you cannot raise the fares to cover fuel, then your "revenue environment" is not good.


User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6569 times:



Quoting Jaysan (Reply 2):
The MD80 debacle will be captured in there Q2 call...

yeah, youre right


User currently offlineUnited1 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 5817 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6571 times:



Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 1):
even with the MD-80 debacle.

The MD debacle is going to affect Q2 not Q1, even then it shouldnt be more then 50M.



Semper Fi - PowerPoint makes us stupid.
User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6560 times:



Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 1):
They would have made over $300m in profit versus $81m last year if fuel had stayed thet same even with the MD-80 debacle.

Yeah. And if the dog hadn't stopped to lick his balls, he'd had caught the rabbit.

Translation: If's don't count.


User currently offlineCoronado990 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1593 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6416 times:



Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 7):
And if the dog hadn't stopped to lick his balls

Haha...I thought you were going to talk about the "Mad Dog".



Uncle SAN at your service!
User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7350 posts, RR: 28
Reply 9, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6369 times:

Something that no one has mentioned that was announced today is that AA will be taking delivery of additional 737-800's in 2009 and 2010 to expedite the MD-80 replacement.

The tenative plans if for:
2009: 36 738's
2010: 34 738's


User currently offlineMrSTL From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 468 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6334 times:



Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 9):
The tenative plans if for:
2009: 36 738's
2010: 34 738's

These are really needed on the mid-con flights, I wonder if ORD will finally see the 737 in 2009.


User currently offlineTravelin man From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3422 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6293 times:



Quoting United1 (Reply 6):
The MD debacle is going to affect Q2 not Q1, even then it shouldnt be more then 50M.

Well the FIRST MD80 debacle happened at the end of March, so that one is probably captured in the Q1 numbers.


User currently offlineJaysan From India, joined Apr 2008, 99 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6210 times:



Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 9):
The tenative plans if for:
2009: 36 738's
2010: 34 738's

This would cover about 33% of there current MD80 fleet. The super 80 is still relatively young in comparison to NW's DC9 and new A/C orders will add a strain to the balance sheet. AA's approach has been a cautioned approach to say the least. My opinion is that the Super 80's will be around for some more time.


User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21419 posts, RR: 60
Reply 13, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6166 times:



Quoting Jaysan (Reply 12):
This would cover about 33% of there current MD80 fleet

Not even close to 1/3rd.

They have 330+ MD80s. This is about 20% of them. 1/5th.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently onlineAABB777 From United States of America, joined Oct 2007, 507 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6143 times:
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AA also announced its intention to sell its American Beacon Advisors Inc. unit for about $480 million to Lighthouse Holdings.

User currently offlineJaysan From India, joined Apr 2008, 99 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (6 years 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6127 times:



Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 13):
They have 330+ MD80s. This is about 20% of them. 1/5th.

I stand corrected... Thank You


User currently offlineFleet Service From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 622 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (6 years 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 5914 times:



Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 13):
They have 330+ MD80s.

The Super 80 fleet is 300 active frames, there were 29 retired last December.

Quoting Ocracoke (Reply 4):
Obviously, if you lose $300m, something is not right with the revenue environment. If fuel goes up, then raise fares to cover the cost of fuel. If you cannot raise the fares to cover fuel, then your "revenue environment" is not good.

You know what's "Not right with the revenue environment"? $3.00 a gallon jet fuel.Period.Full Stop.

It's not just AMR that is getting hammered by these sky high fuel prices.Every airline is having their lunch eaten by $3.00+ a gallon jet fuel.


The airlines have been raising the fares to keep up with the cost of fuel, or haven't you been paying attention to the pundits on TV and in the print media? The cost of fuel, year over year is up over 48% while the average airfare hasn't risen anywhere near that level.



Yes, I actually *do* work for an airline,how about you?
User currently offlineRolo987 From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 293 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (6 years 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 5894 times:

Anyone know when they are going to complete the sale of American Eagle?

User currently offlineAirNZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (6 years 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 5807 times:



Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 1):
They would have made over $300m in profit versus $81m last year if fuel had stayed thet same

Sorry, but what's the point in this analogy? Using that 'logic' I could equally claim that if I could buy petrol (gas) for my car, or any other item for that matter at the price it was in, say 1980, I'd be pretty well off too!


User currently offlineLMP737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (6 years 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 5793 times:



Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 13):
Not even close to 1/3rd.

They have 330+ MD80s. This is about 20% of them. 1/5th.

That's assuming of course if AA repalaces those MD-80's one for one with 737's.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 24353 posts, RR: 47
Reply 20, posted (6 years 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 5785 times:



Quoting Rolo987 (Reply 17):
Anyone know when they are going to complete the sale of American Eagle?

It was mentioned on the conference call only along the lines that such a sale was moving forward. No timeline was given, however I suspect with the ever murkier state of airlines such a sale to monetize assets would gain in importance.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently onlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7329 posts, RR: 24
Reply 21, posted (6 years 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 5767 times:

The bottom line is that all the airlines are hurting. This isnt somthing thats going to be exclusive to AA.


Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineYellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 5889 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (6 years 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 5618 times:



Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 21):
The bottom line is that all the airlines are hurting. This isnt somthing thats going to be exclusive to AA.

any bets on who will have the largest loss? My bet US or UA



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11365 posts, RR: 59
Reply 23, posted (6 years 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 5525 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR



Quoting Fleet Service (Reply 16):
You know what's "Not right with the revenue environment"? $3.00 a gallon jet fuel.Period.Full Stop.

It's not just AMR that is getting hammered by these sky high fuel prices.Every airline is having their lunch eaten by $3.00+ a gallon jet fuel.

Fuel is more expensive in US only, with the fact the EUR and other currencies are stronger, in the end oil prices for Europe, Asia or South America is almost the same. By Dec 31 EUR was 1.46 while Oil US$ 94. Now EUR hit 1.596 and Oil US$ 112 so, no major change for European or Asian Players. Of course US Airlines can't runway as mostly revenue is in US$, so they can't runway and need to face the more expensive oil prices. But look for AF, LH, BA...
So i don't think every airline is having their lunch eaten.

Felipe



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineANstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5081 posts, RR: 6
Reply 24, posted (6 years 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 5443 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 23):
Fuel is more expensive in US only, with the fact the EUR and other currencies are stronger, in the end oil prices for Europe, Asia or South America is almost the same

Fuel is still higher in comparison for everyone. 12 months ago fuel was down again to about $70-80. The dollare has devalued in the past month, but not enough to cover oil at $114a barrel.

Even your example shows that the Euro gained about 11-12% but in the same time oil rose by 20%


25 LipeGIG : 1.46 - 1.595 = 20 % ? I believe 0.135 = aprox. 9%
26 LAXintl : You are right - the global airline scene is far from being anywhere close to as bleak as the US. Matter of fact some foreign airlines are setting ear
27 LipeGIG : Right and considering the change on currency market and oil, probably will continue to show strong results. May be because of a small decline on US m
28 United1 : Here are the current analyst estimate for the rest of the year... Airline, Q1, 08 AA -334, -1006 (obviously -328 was the actual number) UA -406, -582
29 LAXDESI : From the article linked: Record jet fuel prices contributed significantly to the Company's loss in the first quarter of 2008. The Company paid $665 mi
30 ANstar : I said Oil had gone up around 20%.... and the Euro 11-12%... My point still stands.... oil is going up faster than the dollar is declining so all air
31 Commavia : Remember: profit and loss figures in no way equate to cash inflows or outflows. Profit and loss is a paper number generated from accounting - it ofte
32 LAXDESI : Absolutely correct. Non cash expenses(mostly depreciation) for AMR for 2007 were around $1.2 billion. This figure has been stable for the last few ye
33 Justloveplanes : Is there a convenient source for all of this? Did you just use yahoo.com?
34 United1 : Yahoo.com, just multiply the analyst average estimate with shares outstanding.
35 Swissy : Good some numbers (just to play with it) but is shows the trend, what or who should "we" blame for it?? I just can not get my head around why things
36 United1 : Someone mentioned positive vs negative cash flow, here are 07s numbers. Airline, Cash flow UA, 2.1B AA, 1.9B NW, 1.4B DL, 1.4B CO, 1.1B WN, 1.0B US, 4
37 YWG747 : All I can say is ouch... how can any company deal with such a huge hit, and that is just one quarter... Mean while the oil company Exxon can make 20 b
38 Boston92 : Ouch. Their numbers are due (I believe) on April 22. EDIT- Wrong month.[Edited 2008-04-16 19:35:47]
39 United1 : Q1 traditionally is UAs weakest quarter, its not at all unexpected given the fuel costs and given that Q1 07 UA lost 152M with significantly lower fu
40 Jetdeltamsy : The "revenue envrionment" fell nearly $400 million short of needs. I wouldn't call that "pretty good." You can't compare one year to another based on
41 BE77 : Not completely correct I admit, but $115 oil is a US$ problem for the most part. Think macro-economics. If the fiscal policy of a nation sets up a mas
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