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Cabin Crew Rest Between Asia And Australia  
User currently offlineAnsett767 From Australia, joined May 1999, 1021 posts, RR: 2
Posted (6 years 5 months 6 days ago) and read 8768 times:

Hi All

This topic prompted me to start a new one:
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo...eneral_aviation/read.main/3947477/

It was about how Delta crews to Rio have only 10 hours layover during the DAY - arrive in morning, rest 10 hours and leave at night.

I was wondering if any Asian crews into Oz, or vice versa did this? Seeing as the trip is the same - 7-10 hours.

I don't know of any that do - e.g. I know SIngapore overnight here in Sydney after their flight (even the morning arrival)

But some insights would be good! thanks in advance

37 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineZeke From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2006, 9109 posts, RR: 75
Reply 1, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 8739 times:

CX has crews overnight in CNS, BNE, SYD, MEL, ADL, and PER, as well as pilots based in BNE, SYD, MEL, ADL, and PER, normally min layover is 24 hrs, some trips it is 48 hrs or more.


We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
User currently offlineBAStew From Australia, joined Sep 2006, 1028 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 8621 times:

BA - flights from SIN and BKK to SYD we arrive early morning in SYD then depart the followng afternoon to return to SIN or BKK.

We then have 50 hours rest in either BKK/SIN in both directions to/from LHR.

The total trip length is 9 days.

I do remember when we used to fly to PER though, SIN/PER/SIN was operate as a return sector.


User currently offlineAnsett767 From Australia, joined May 1999, 1021 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 8522 times:



Quoting BAStew (Reply 2):
BA - flights from SIN and BKK to SYD we arrive early morning in SYD then depart the followng afternoon to return to SIN or BKK.

Now that sounds a lot fairer than being given 8-10 hours to sleep and made to work the return  Smile

Quoting BAStew (Reply 2):
I do remember when we used to fly to PER though, SIN/PER/SIN was operate as a return sector.

I guess that's fair as it's only a 5 +/- hour trip....so probably an 11-12 hour shift which is reasonable given no jetlag


User currently offlineTonystan From Ireland, joined Jan 2006, 1437 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 8500 times:

QANTAS crew have just 16 hours in HKG very often.


My views are my own and do not reflect any other person or organisation.
User currently offlineSW733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6324 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 8394 times:

I stayed in the same hotel as a China Southern 777 crew overnighting in SYD back in February...

User currently offlineETA Unknown From Comoros, joined Jun 2001, 2077 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 8323 times:

When EK started SYD services (DXB-SIN-SYD) the crew operated SIN-SYD-SIN arriving SYD at 07:00 and departing around 21:00 staying at the Airport Stamford. As they were on minimum crew rest it was decided to not transport them to a city hotel- we looked at a few properties that were positioned right next to the airport motorway entrance around Macquarie Street, but came to the conclusion it was too risky if an inbound flight was delayed. FYI the Rydges Wentworth failed the inspection so miserably we laughed about it, but the Renaissance (Marriott Harbourside now) did come very close to winning the business.

User currently offlineBALHRWWCC From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 8248 times:



Quoting Ansett767 (Reply 3):
Now that sounds a lot fairer than being given 8-10 hours to sleep and made to work the return Smile

That is thanks to a strong union who continuely fight for our agreements. If we did only get 10 hours rest in SYD I don't think that many of the crew would feel suitably rested to operate back to SIN or BKK


User currently offlineSingaporeBoy From Singapore, joined May 2005, 141 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 8175 times:

I think its a matter of where we fly to more importantly than how long we fly....
For example...if we fly to Sydney on the morning flight from Singapore and get in in the evening and leave the next afternoon...thats ok because we get a decent nights sleep though its less than 24hrs.However..if we do the night flight out of SIN and get into SYD in the early morning..we sleep upon checkin..wakeup..eat....and then we have to try to sleep early which is almost impossible due to the the time difference between SYD and SIN.Our flight leaves at 8am SYD time which means its a 5am wakeup call...and thats 3am in SIN.If we tried to sleep at 10pm SYD time..thats only 8pm SIN time...so most of us would only get 2-3 hours of sleep before the flight.

[Edited 2008-04-21 12:52:16]

User currently offlineSkytroll From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2008, 77 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 8152 times:

VS Sydney base gets just 16 hours rest in HKG. not at all nice for the poor cobbers


"Oh the glamour"
User currently offlineN104UA From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 915 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 8144 times:

UA's crews arrive in SYD from LAX or SFO on Monday morning and leave on Wednesday afternoon. And in NRT they arrive in NRT on Monday afternoon and leave on Tuesday afternoon


"Learn the rules, so you know how to break them properly." -H.H. The Dalai Lama
User currently offlineAzncsa4qf744er From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 692 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 8056 times:



Quoting N104UA (Reply 10):
UA's crews arrive in SYD from LAX or SFO on Monday morning and leave on Wednesday afternoon. And in NRT they arrive in NRT on Monday afternoon and leave on Tuesday afternoon

You forget to mention the 6 days trip for LAX based crew on the MEL turn. I take if you're SFO based crew?

LAX based crew (F/O and F/A) have line for a 6 day trips which include a SYDMELSYD turn. Otherwise it's 5 days trip total.


User currently offlineN104UA From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 915 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 8016 times:



Quoting Azncsa4qf744er (Reply 11):
LAX based crew (F/O and F/A) have line for a 6 day trips which include a SYDMELSYD turn. Otherwise it's 5 days trip total.

I have also been told that some crews pick it up on Tuesday.



"Learn the rules, so you know how to break them properly." -H.H. The Dalai Lama
User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4833 posts, RR: 9
Reply 13, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 7819 times:



Quoting Tonystan (Reply 4):
QANTAS crew have just 16 hours in HKG very often.

Actually until very recently it was 13 hours... and that was often less than that due to late arrivals etc...
It has now changed to generally 24/25 hour slips.



56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
User currently offlineLufthansa From Christmas Island, joined May 1999, 3213 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 7747 times:



Quoting Skytroll (Reply 9):
VS Sydney base gets just 16 hours rest in HKG. not at all nice for the poor cobbers

VS has a SYD base? That's news to me.. I'm interested tell me more? seriously wow, they're really dedicated to this route in that case.


User currently offline9MMPD From Australia, joined Oct 2005, 286 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 7662 times:



Quoting BAStew (Reply 2):
I do remember when we used to fly to PER though, SIN/PER/SIN was operate as a return sector.

Is that true for all the BA SIN/PER flights. I remember waiting in arrivals for my Aunt to get off a BA11 flight from SIN in 2000 and I saw the BA cabin come out of arrivals. The last few years of BA11/12 SIN-PER-SIN flights would arrive at 14:30 and leave at 17:00 which would mean with an on gound time of 2.5hrs. So that with about 5 hours each way means it it close to 13 hrs duty time which is the same as a SIN - LHR flight. So for that flight would they have the extra flight crew they would have traveled with on the LHR - SIN leg or would the 2.5 ground time in Perth be counted as rest break

I know that TG and MH and SQ crews overnight here in Perth as I have seen them walk through the terminal and the SQ and MH ones turn heads. Quick few other questions though.

1) With the MH and SQ crews overnighting does that mean earlier that day they might have completed a regional ( KUL/SIN, or CGK /SIN, or SIN/KUL or PEN/KUL sector before working their Perth flight as it is only 4:50 SIN - PER and about 5.5 hrs from KUL - PER

2) What is the rotation of SQ cabin crew to Perth. If if they arrive at midnight do they leave on the 1am flight the next day, do the 6:30am cabin crew leave on the 7:30 the next day (or the next one if they are not daily) and does 14:30 crew leave on the 16:00 the next day. With SYD, MEL and BNE also having multiple SQ flights a day do those cities have the same system as PER

3) With the GA flights with about a 1 hour turnaorund time in PER do the cabin crew stay onboard the aircraft and go back with it to Indoneisa.

4) Does the 8:00 am GA727 flight from PER - DPS crew continue working on the aircraft when it continues to CGK after its arrival in DPS.

5) If MK only has one flight a week from MRU to PER does that mean their crew are here for 6 nights. (yes I know Mauritius is not in Asia but I thought while we are on the subject.)


User currently offlineFly2CHC From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days ago) and read 7649 times:

Unless it has changed in the last few years, outside Australia and South Pacific Air NZ cabin crew have one overnight in all ports except LAX where they have two nights (unless of course less than daily frequency requires longer stays).

User currently offlineANstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5245 posts, RR: 6
Reply 17, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days ago) and read 7636 times:



Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 14):
VS has a SYD base? That's news to me.. I'm interested tell me more? seriously wow, they're really dedicated to this route in that case.

Yes - not sure how big the crew base is, but I had SYD based crew on both my fligths to HKG (from SYD)


User currently offlineAussiestu From Australia, joined Mar 2001, 780 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (6 years 5 months 5 days ago) and read 7636 times:



Quoting BAStew (Reply 2):
do remember when we used to fly to PER though, SIN/PER/SIN was operate as a return sector.

I am BA crew too and we always stayed in PER on the flight from SIN. I am sure Crew Ops would have loved us to do the return flight but we would have been very close to hours etc. Did you ever do it as a return?


User currently offlineBAStew From Australia, joined Sep 2006, 1028 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (6 years 5 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 7505 times:



Quoting Aussiestu (Reply 18):


Quoting BAStew (Reply 2):
do remember when we used to fly to PER though, SIN/PER/SIN was operate as a return sector.

I am BA crew too and we always stayed in PER on the flight from SIN. I am sure Crew Ops would have loved us to do the return flight but we would have been very close to hours etc. Did you ever do it as a return?

Sorry, I was thinking many many moons ago. It was a Jakarta-Perth return, not SIN/PER.
 boggled 


User currently offlineAussiestu From Australia, joined Mar 2001, 780 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (6 years 5 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 7499 times:



Quoting BAStew (Reply 19):
Sorry, I was thinking many many moons ago. It was a Jakarta-Perth return, not SIN/PER

That was many moons ago!!  Big grin Remember SIN/PER/AKL? Thankfully we dont have that any more. They were hard work.......


User currently offlineSmi0006 From Australia, joined Jan 2008, 1534 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (6 years 5 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 7487 times:

What about JQ and their Melbourne Bali returns up and back no rest, not sure if they do the same from syd aswell. That must be pretty close to the max hours surly? Do the techies do this too?

User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4833 posts, RR: 9
Reply 22, posted (6 years 5 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 7404 times:



Quoting Fly2CHC (Reply 16):
Unless it has changed in the last few years, outside Australia and South Pacific Air NZ cabin crew have one overnight in all ports except LAX where they have two nights (unless of course less than daily frequency requires longer stays).

SFO is often more than 1 night. YVR is often 3 nights. HKG can be 1 night or 3. NRT/KIX can be up to 3.



56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
User currently offlineSkytroll From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2008, 77 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (6 years 5 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 7325 times:



Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 14):
VS has a SYD base? That's news to me.. I'm interested tell me more? seriously wow, they're really dedicated to this route in that case.

Yes it does! It has been in place since June 2005. it was only a small base of around 31 F/A's. 17 were seconded from Virgin Blue for an 18 month contract (now finished) and 14 seconded from VS mainline who had dual nationality. Its purely a trial thing with the hopeful emphasis on making the base permananet. The current secondment is in place until October and I guess we shall see what happens after V Australia has poached most of the crew. Currently you will find 3 Sydney based flighties on each departure from SYD. They only do the SYD-HKG-SYD sector.



"Oh the glamour"
User currently offlineMr AirNZ From New Zealand, joined Feb 2002, 867 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (6 years 5 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 7168 times:



Quoting Ansett767 (Reply 3):
Now that sounds a lot fairer than being given 8-10 hours to sleep and made to work the return

I'm going to guss this post was inspired by the Delta Rio post? One thing to remember (as was pointed out in that particular thread) the crews on those services all chose to be there; very Senior crew, minimum time away from base.
Just thought I'd throw that in  Wink


25 Ansett767 : HAHA yup, as said in my topic post I would love to hear some answers to 9MMPD's questions if anyone has any insights
26 QANTAS077 : there was a SIN-PER-AKL-CHC too if my memory serves my correctly?
27 EK413 : It's interesting there hasn't been any mention of the crew rest period if a flight is DELAYED for example.... Hmmm Let's pick SYD-LAX 15 hour flight..
28 Zkpilot : Which will often go to 19 hours even 20 hours... happened just 2 days ago due fog in MEL...diverted to SYD, took up did another service and landed in
29 Mr AirNZ : Bit of a blonde moment on my behalf.
30 EK413 : This wasn't the QF94 by any chance... EK413
31 Airnewzealand : Yep it would of been the QF94. I operated a sector which was 21 hrs 30mins TOD MEL-LAX...man that was a VERY long day! Landed into LAX at 12 or 1pm an
32 Ditzyboy : Short Haul crew are regularly blocked 14 hours rest in HKG. Ops the QF67/QF97 up and the QF188 out the next morning.
33 DocPepz : I understand that QF crew who do QF71/72 SIN-PER-SIN (leaves SIN 0905, arrives Perth 1405, leaves Perth 1530, arrives SIN 2050) are usually SYD-based
34 Post contains images SingaporeBoy : Yeah...i remember that pattern...it was operated by the A310...the Perth turnaround.It didnt last very long...i think less than 6 months..not sure.Tha
35 ANstar : I was on a QF ADL-SIN flight at Christmas and half the cabin crew were turning around and doing SIN-PER that evening.
36 Airnewzealand : Thats correct ANstar...the patterns out of ADL are not great...avoid like the plague! Also we used to do a pattern that went...SYD-SIN (20hours) SIN-
37 Zkpilot : Who'd you p*ss off to get that trip? lol not nice mate. You done the Scarebus up to LAX yet? MEL-HKG last week had to divert to MNL due to the typhoo
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