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SAA To Acquire New Fleet  
User currently offlineHaan From South Africa, joined Aug 2004, 289 posts, RR: 1
Posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 14631 times:

From the press reliece

South African Airways makes strides with restructuring, announces new fleet plan
SAA has made huge strides with restructuring and is set to expand and further modernise its fleet to support the renewed focus towards becoming a profitable airline.

In addition, SAA has reached a groundbreaking agreement with trade unions representing cabin crew and ground staff, having agreed to a multi-year wage deal. Management has also reached a similar agreement with the pilot’s representative association (SAAPA), subject to ratification by the pilots.

Adding more aircraft and modernising its fleet will allow the airline to take advantage of expansion opportunities, operate more efficiently and remain competitive.

Going forward, SAA will focus on markets earmarked for international aviation growth such as Africa, South America and Asia. Plans for growth support the airline’s current restructuring process.


1. Restructuring

SAA has made good progress towards achieving its restructuring target. This is an initiative the airline started in March last year as part of an effort to ensure the airline’s survival and that it becomes profitable on a sustainable basis.

Restructuring has to date reduced costs by almost R1bn. The two biggest restructuring initiatives that have been completed successfully are the grounding of the fleet of Boeing 747’s and consultations with labour on standardising and simplifying conditions of employment, with final agreements being put in place.

With these two initiatives together making up more than half of the value of the total restructuring initiatives, the airline is making progress towards achieving sustainable profitability by March 2009.

“We are satisfied that our restructuring efforts have so far shown positive results, even though they were tempered in the past financial year by large restructuring costs,” says Khaya Ngqula, SAA CEO.

“These are once-off costs and the expectation is that once the restructuring is completed in March 2009, we will be on the path to sustainable profitability. We do, however, need to take cognisance of the recent huge rise in the oil price which has placed margins under pressure across the board.

“Given the achievements of the restructuring programme, we are now focused on ensuring that the airline is properly positioned, both financially and operationally, for future growth,” he says.

On the labour side, the organisation has been streamlined and a new, leaner management structuring has been finalized. A total of 963 people took Voluntary Severance Packages and a further 869 people resigned. The focus now is on ensuring that SAA retains the key skills necessary to finish the restructuring, and ensure that operations run smoothly.

As part of the restructuring process, SAA has entered into contracts with a group of managers in an effort to retain the necessary skills and experience to ensure the continuation of core functions within the airline. The retention of these skills is also vital to ensuring the restructuring is successfully completed. SAA has lost many highly skilled people in the past year through resignations which were over and above the Voluntary Severance Packages that were offered. These included resignations in areas such as technical, ground staff, cabin crew and management, with management being the single largest category.

SAA has to date contracted with 127 managers and specialists. Managers have to repay these retention premiums should they opt to leave the company before the contract period expires and they have to satisfy the performance expectation and targets. Payment of a retention premium is normal business practice in companies faced with the potential loss of experienced, skilled, dedicated and knowledgeable individuals while undergoing a process of restructuring. The retention premium will be expanded to include other groupings of employees where skills are scarce.

The grounding of the fleet of Boeing 747-400’s has already brought significant savings to the airline, and will result in a total estimated saving of R600m in the year to end March 2009. Three of the aircraft have been returned to their lessors, one has been wetleased to Angolan airline TAAG and the remaining two aircraft are in the process of being sub-leased through their owners.

SAA has also made considerable progress in negotiations with its partners serving the southern African route network, SA Express and Airlink. This initiative, which will help increase revenue and reduce costs, is expected to be finalised by mid-year.

Negotiations to reduce distribution costs (ticket booking fees) are close to finalisation, which will potentially save the airline R78-million a year.

The recent overhaul of SAA’s website, flysaa.com, has been enhanced with the launch of the Online Check-In service which allows passengers to check-in using the internet.

Regarding operations, the second phase of the One-Stop-Shop, whereby each counter will be able to process Voyager transactions, ticketing and check-in, is under way and should be fully operational by the middle of the financial year.

There is currently a strong focus on improving SAA’s operational performance to reduce delays and improve on-time performance. The change-over of ground handlers to Swissport, effective from 1 February 2008, is expected to assist with the process. SAA has already seen a sharp decline in baggage pilferage and although there was an initial increase in the number of bags being left behind due to equipment shortages, this problem has largely been resolved. SAA is working together with Swissport and the Airports Company of SA to tackle all baggage-related challenges.

All initiatives at SAA Technical and SAA Cargo are on track.

Going forward the restructuring process will focus on re-engineering the business and improving customer service.

Unbundling the airline into separate business units is also a major focus area for SAA. Following unbundling, seven stand alone subsidiaries will be established, with Air Chefs and Galileo NDC to be sold outright. The seven subsidiaries are the passenger airline, SAA Technical, Voyager, Airport Operations, Mango, SAA Cargo and SA Travel Centre. They will be independent subsidiaries, operating as profit centres. Outside equity partners for some of the business units will be sought where appropriate.

2. Wage Negotiations

Wage negotiations for the year ending March 2009 between SAA management and unions representing the airline’s pilots, ground staff and cabin crew members began earlier this year. This follows an agreement by labour to freeze wages in 2008 when labour gave its commitment to supporting the restructuring process.

Agreement was reached in May on a multi-year wage deal with unions representing cabin crew and ground staff, SATAWU and UASA (AIWU). The agreement involved a 9% wage increase for 2008/09, along with a wage agreement formula of CPIX plus 1% in 2009/10 and CPIX plus 2% in 2010/2011.

The South African Airways Pilots Association (SAAPA) and management also reached a multi-year wage agreement in April, subject to ratification by the membership body. The agreement involved a local market movement formula for salary increases for 2008/09, 2009/10 and 2010/2011. SAAPA also agreed to suspend the Maintenance of Parity (MOP) agreement for three years, and agreed to guarantee a 5% productivity improvement by pilots.

Says Ngqula: “These agreements are an important step for SAA and our employees. It sets the course for stability on the labour relations front until well after 2010, allowing management to focus on consolidating the airline’s deep and fundamental restructuring programme, as well as growing the business in the future.”

3. Fleet Plan

SAA has to replenish and modernise the existing fleet to take advantage of network growth opportunities and to improve operating cost efficiencies.

“We need to remain competitive, to ensure that we operate as efficiently as possible from a cost and fuel efficiency point of view, particularly in light of the soaring oil price. We also need to make preparations which will allow us to take advantage of future growth in travel demand,” says Ngqula.

SAA’s Board has approved a new fleet plan for additional wide and narrow body aircraft, to be rolled out in three phases: the immediate, medium and long term.

As part of the immediate phase, SAA will lease six aircraft (three wide and three narrow bodies), to be delivered in the current financial year (March 08-March 09). The leased aircraft will have an immediate impact on the airline’s growth plans and will be used on existing and start-up routes.

As part of the medium term fleet plan, which spans 2010 to 2014, SAA will conduct an aircraft supply competition for Airbus and Boeing aircraft as soon as possible this year for the acquisition of replacement and additional aircraft. This competition will be undertaken in terms of the Public Finance Management Act (PFMA) as it is deemed to be a material acquisition, and approval will be sought from the shareholder ministry, the Public Enterprises Ministry, and National Treasury.

The supply competition will also cover SAA’s longer term fleet expansion requirements, in line with network requirements and the restructuring plan.

The additional aircraft will enable the airline to add further capacity on existing routes. Capacity will be added this year to Cape Town, Luanda, Dar es Salaam, Entebbe, Victoria Falls, Mauritius, Mumbai, Frankfurt, Munich, Perth and Sao Paulo. Capacity will be added to additional routes over the next five years.

New routes:

Africa remains the focus for SAA in terms of growth, and additional capacity will continue to be placed on new and existing routes into the continent.

Key to the restructuring plan and network strategy is building Johannesburg as the strongest hub in Africa, while adding to an already extensive route network across the continent.

New routes will be added to the regional and international network, beginning initially with Maun in Botswana from October.

Maun, the gateway to the Okavango Delta, will be an excellent fit for SAA’s route network as the Okavango Delta is one of the most significant tourist attractions in Africa, drawing over 30 000 international tourists per year. Adding daily flights to Maun holds huge growth potential for SAA as customers coming from international destinations will be able to connect through Johannesburg to Maun.

SAA’s international flights from O.R. Tambo International are able to capture connecting traffic from domestic and regional Africa to increase the total passenger numbers on these international flights.

To ensure it has sufficient crew to support these growth plans, SAA is also currently in the process of employing more pilots and cabin crew.

“We are confident that our present selection process will result in us finding pilots with the necessary qualifications and experience to complement our current pool of pilots,” says Captain Johnny Woods, SAA’s Head of Flight Operations.

SAA’s current fleet:

Existing fleet of 49 aircraft, made up of:
9 x A340-600s
11 x A319s
6 x A340-300s
6 x A340-200s
17 x Boeing 737-800s (four leased to Mango)

Restructuring Background:

SAA officially launched its deep and fundamental restructuring process, with the objective of rightsizing, re-skilling and incentivising the business, in March 2007.

A board sub-committee, chaired by the Chairperson of the Finance, Risk and Investment sub-committee of the Board, Louisa Mojela was formed and the process to develop a business plan for SAA was approved.

SAA appointed well-acclaimed US based airline specialists, Seabury, to guide the process. Seabury has been instrumental in the successful turnarounds of eight of the world’s ten airlines which have undergone restructuring, including US Airways and Air Canada. Seabury has completed its contract and is no longer consulting for the airline.

In May 2007, the completed business plan was approved by the SAA Board. The General Managers of the airline began implementing the plan immediately.

68 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7058 posts, RR: 4
Reply 1, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 14618 times:



Quoting Haan (Thread starter):
As part of the immediate phase, SAA will lease six aircraft (three wide and three narrow bodies), to be delivered in the current financial year (March 08-March 09). The leased aircraft will have an immediate impact on the airline’s growth plans and will be used on existing and start-up routes.

A320 family and A330/A340s are likely on this one.

Quoting Haan (Thread starter):
As part of the medium term fleet plan, which spans 2010 to 2014, SAA will conduct an aircraft supply competition for Airbus and Boeing aircraft as soon as possible this year for the acquisition of replacement and additional aircraft. This competition will be undertaken in terms of the Public Finance Management Act (PFMA) as it is deemed to be a material acquisition, and approval will be sought from the shareholder ministry, the Public Enterprises Ministry, and National Treasury.

A380s, A346s, A333s or 777Ws ? I doubt that they would get 787s or A350s by that. 747-8Is would be a dream as they would look stunning in SA livery  Smile



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineJoFMO From Germany, joined Jul 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 14387 times:

I wonder if they will come up with their recently postponed expansions again. They were planning to serve MUC and EZE some time ago.

User currently offlineDavescj From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 2305 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 14193 times:

Based on their current fleet, should be an easy sale to Airbus. Though, as posted above, I think SAA livery would look great on the 748i.

Long term, I think they will look to either 787 or A350. It would be a good bird for the aging planes (by then) and also have the range for Europe and South America both, no?

Dave



Can I have a mojito on this flight?
User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 62
Reply 4, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 14155 times:

I have a feeling this one will go to the 777.


What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 5, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 14155 times:

I am happy to see that SA is making progress in its restructuring plan.

Quoting JoFMO (Reply 2):
I wonder if they will come up with their recently postponed expansions again. They were planning to serve MUC and EZE some time ago.

GIG is also in their plans and would make sense with the World Cup coming up and the continue strong performance of GRU.

Rgs,


User currently offlineJoFMO From Germany, joined Jul 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 14110 times:



Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 5):
GIG is also in their plans and would make sense with the World Cup coming up and the continue strong performance of GRU.

Have they signed a codeshare with TAM yet?


User currently offlineJfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8291 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 13981 times:
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Given the way the world feel about A340's now, 777 seem to be the way to go, especially 777-300ER's with more seats then the A346.

User currently offlineMyk From Canada, joined Jul 1999, 455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 13940 times:

They closed CDG last year in October. Heard Rumors that they want to start CDG again in 2009, before the World CUp in South Africa.

What are the possible routes that they will open ? One year ago they announced EZE but the flights were removed from the GDS before they started.


User currently offlinePgtravel From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 446 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 13940 times:

Given that it's SAA, I'd think that it'll end up with Boeing. These guys seem to prefer flipping back and forth as much as possible. If this is for 2010 to 2014, we'll see them go back to Airbus again by 2016. If it ain't restructuring, it ain't SAA!

User currently offlineJoKeR From Serbia, joined Nov 2004, 2235 posts, RR: 9
Reply 10, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 13855 times:



Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 8):
Given the way the world feel about A340's now, 777 seem to be the way to go, especially 777-300ER's with more seats then the A346.

Given the way 777s seem to have engine failures, A340 seem to be the way to go, especially since they already operate the type and will unlikely have to divert to some forsaken African strip in case of a shutdown.  devil 



Kafa, čaj, šraf?
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 13743 times:



Quoting Columba (Reply 1):
as they would look stunning in SA livery

...as would any aircraft  Wink


User currently offlineSpeedbird128 From Pitcairn Islands, joined Oct 2003, 1648 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 13395 times:

I don't see the 777 being taken on... I think either A340/A330.

For the short haul I expect it would be A319/A320. Which they would have needed if some nitwit hadn't dumped the 7 A320's they already had.



A306, A313, A319, A320, A321, A332, A343, A345, A346 A388, AC90, B06, B722, B732, B733, B735, B738, B744, B762, B772, B7
User currently offlineHaan From South Africa, joined Aug 2004, 289 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 13368 times:

Here are my suggestions and some of what I heard from a good source.

SAA is looking at doing the following.
Taking back the 4 Mango B738's who have a high take off weight and give them 4-5 A319's.
Leasing 4-6 B737-800's (leasing current 800 models)
Leasing either 3 A343's or 3 A330's (A343's are nowhere to be found)
Inviting Boeing and Airbus over to Joburg and let them make proposals on new fleet.
Looking at the B787 and A350's for future past 2013

Cheers


User currently offlineKennyK From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 482 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 13338 times:

Word a year or so ago was SAA was looking at maybe 4 or so A380s mainly for the UK route, now the 747s have gone I don't see any chance of the A380 being in the frame for a long time. Stuck with A340s the 777 looks like a very good option for the short/mid term maybe on lease with the A350 later. As for not going for twins they would be one of the very few airlines that don't.

User currently offlinePoint8six From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2008, 94 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 13301 times:

So will this turn SAA - once a very proud and well-thought of airline, into a profitable one?

User currently offlineShankly From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2000, 1541 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 13038 times:



Quoting Point8six (Reply 16):
So will this turn SAA - once a very proud and well-thought of airline, into a profitable one?

Only if they get it right, which they haven't in the past

They have a relatively young fleet and need to avoid knee jerk (777) and concentrate on sweeping in the 787/A350 generation aircraft.

In saying this I remain certain that the graceful SAA tail will also one day adorn the A380



L1011 - P F M
User currently offlineQantas744ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1286 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 11849 times:



Quoting JoFMO (Reply 2):
I wonder if they will come up with their recently postponed expansions again. They were planning to serve MUC and EZE some time ago.

Daily SA JNB-MUC-JNB with A342 already operating  Smile

Leo



Happiness is V1 in Lagos
User currently offlineMrBrightSide From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 202 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 11708 times:



Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 7):
Given the way the world feel about A340's now, 777 seem to be the way to go, especially 777-300ER's with more seats then the A346.

You mean "Given the way the a.nutters feel about A340's now.."...

In some cases, we preach about fleet commonality, in other cases we say to abandon current ship and ditch to the new one... it all depends on how volatile will the market be. A380 should not be a surprise for LHR route, since LH will fly A380 from FRA in 2010 (summer schedule, due to WC2010).



There's no better way to travel than fly (shameless rip of LH's slogan ;-)
User currently offlineYVRLTN From Canada, joined Oct 2006, 2445 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 11276 times:



Quoting Shankly (Reply 16):
They have a relatively young fleet and need to avoid knee jerk (777) and concentrate on sweeping in the 787/A350 generation aircraft.

 checkmark Even the A343's are only 3-4 years old and the A346's are only a year or two older. A330's as interim lift until A350's arrive would seem the most logical way to go as they have not had 777's up to this point. It remains to be seen if anything larger than an A346 / A3510 will be needed. Historically the 747 has had such a place in their fleet, but they are gone for a reason and I dont know if the A380, and 748I even, being that much larger will cause them the same problems, simply as there are so many more seats to fill in order to be efficient.



Follow me on twitter for YVR movements @vernonYVR
User currently offlineJoFMO From Germany, joined Jul 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 10884 times:



Quoting YVRLTN (Reply 19):
Even the A343's are only 3-4 years old and the A346's are only a year or two older. A330's as interim lift until A350's arrive would seem the most logical way to go as they have not had 777's up to this point. It remains to be seen if anything larger than an A346 / A3510 will be needed. Historically the 747 has had such a place in their fleet, but they are gone for a reason and I dont know if the A380, and 748I even, being that much larger will cause them the same problems, simply as there are so many more seats to fill in order to be efficient.

The reason why the 747 are gone is purely related to the fact that they paid radiculous leasing fees. Filling them nor yield was any problem. It was reported at that time that even with 100% loads there was not way to operate them profitable.

In general SAA's route network is perfect for very large aircrafts. Their European routes can only be served in a very small time frame and frequency is a non-issue for them (well, lets say only daily is required, but not more).


User currently offlineAirnerd From United States of America, joined Oct 2007, 253 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 10501 times:



Quoting Haan (Thread starter):
SAA’s current fleet:

Existing fleet of 49 aircraft, made up of:
9 x A340-600s
11 x A319s
6 x A340-300s
6 x A340-200s
17 x Boeing 737-800s (four leased to Mango)

Does anyone else operate such a large fleet of 342s? That's got to be one of the least efficient/least popular widebodies available... Sure does look like Airbus is would have the edge though in any new orders...


User currently offlineDavescj From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 2305 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 10240 times:



Quoting JoFMO (Reply 20):
The reason why the 747 are gone is purely related to the fact that they paid radiculous leasing fees. Filling them nor yield was any problem. It was reported at that time that even with 100% loads there was not way to operate them profitable.

In general SAA's route network is perfect for very large aircrafts. Their European routes can only be served in a very small time frame and frequency is a non-issue for them (well, lets say only daily is required, but not more).

Could they be the next customer for the 748i market? If they didn't want A380s on markets to Europe that were a bit smaller, or for IAD for example, perhaps we'll see some Boeing wide body in SAA livery after all?

Dave



Can I have a mojito on this flight?
User currently offlineOmoo From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 9939 times:

How will the 748i perform if takeoff is from Jo'bur ?

User currently offlineT7ils13latjfk From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 84 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 9795 times:

Well having spoken to SA's Head of Operations in North America, I gathered that SA will go with the 77W's (777-300ER's). When they acquire this bird, I strongly believe that it will be used on the JFK-DKR-JNB route; Possibly removing the DKR visit both ways. Do I ever wish for this to be the conclusion as there is simply nothing like the triple seven. Well maybe the 744. ; )


"You Know Dam Right!! & - Winds are 060 at 8, 4 Left, cleared to go."
25 Reggaebird : This is clearly the death nell for some of the Airbus A340's in their fleet. I am going back and forth between thinking the -600's will be gone or the
26 Gigneil : There were some pretty significant advantages to the A340-600 in SA's ops, especially from Jo'burg. I don't believe the 777-300ER has developed any ad
27 Columba : Especially their flights to London could easily fill an A380 or 747-8I, I hope they decide for one of these two although I am bit partial on the 747-
28 Davescj : Think it would help if we wrote petitioning the 748i to be in SAA livery? Kidding, aside, I think that mix of 748i and A380 may not be all bad for SA
29 BrianDromey : Bingo. If people remember correctly SA actually ordered the 777 and later took the A346 instead. At the time SAA described the 777 as "an excellent a
30 CHRISBA777ER : The 77L cannot do JFK non-stop out of JNB so if even if they do buy it they would have to stop at DKR i think. I am not 100% convinced the 748i has t
31 Davescj : Range of 748i is 14,815-km (8,000-nmi) range (according to Boeing website). The distance between JNG and JFK is 6925 nm according to "Great Circle Map
32 CV990Coronado : This is a wonderful piece of PR speak if you talk to people on the ground at the airline and in the travel industry the story is somewhat different. H
33 CV990Coronado : I see my post crossed with Davescj/ChrisBA777er and Brian Dromey. Sorry I am new at this and I now see you have raised some of the points re the 777 o
34 A390 : Well said CV990Coronado! I could not have put it better. Conditions at SAA will not improve only get worse, in my humble opinion
35 Africawings : Quoting Davescj " Range of 748i is 14,815-km (8,000-nmi) range (according to Boeing website). The distance between JNG and JFK is 6925 nm according to
36 LifelinerOne : I always thought that SAA would become a customer for some of the ILFC A380's... I still do. Cheers!
37 DavidYYC : The really worrying thing are desicions that are made which are not purely economical. That leads to a disorganised fleet, odd routing, and management
38 Signol : If JNB were at sea level, then yes. But as it's at a very high altitude, the aircraft cannot take off fully loaded bound for the USA. Incoming aircra
39 Jfk777 : Given all the 777 operations at JNB by foreign airlines, I don't believe 777 would have a problem with JNB's 6000 feet altitude.
40 Shankly : Ah well, if that happens, that will be me putting my future business reluctantly with BA on the LHR-CPT route. I want four engines under my seat at n
41 Davescj : How far could they go without a fuel stop? Would MIA be possible? Or IAD? I would think if it were possible the non stop to IAD would be better, to c
42 Gigneil : Not at its max payload, and that's the thing. When it is hot at JNB, there are a host of problems, and they're generally related to engine-out, not t
43 Speedbird128 : Currently only two airlines operate from JNB with B77W's. EK and AF. Only the AF route is of reasonable length (10 or 11 hrs), and I don't know what
44 SA7700 : As well as SV...
45 YVRLTN : Im not sure thats entirely correct. While probably a factor, they were full, yes, but I thought the yield was terrible. I cant remember the source wh
46 Umfolozi : Air Austral operates the B737-300 on it's RUN - JNB flights, so maybe this was for maintenance. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
47 Speedbird128 : Indeed. I have only seen their 737 this year. They may sub it on occassion, but I cannot recall last time it happened.
48 Speedbird128 : And TAAG also operate thier new B772's to JNB every once in a while... Like today.
49 YULWinterSkies : Depends how far in the future they target. Short term, yes, long term, A350 has the best chances. Their A340 fleet is very young, i can understand th
50 Post contains links and images Andz :
51 EXAAUADL : there is nothign wrong with their existing fleet..and I'd like ot know how they plan on financing the replacements?
52 Umfolozi : Andz, do you know something we don't? Is this true?
53 Gigneil : Its a model. One comes with every proposal. I have no doubt they have 777-200ER models as well as 777-300ER ones at SAA as well. NS
54 Columba : Even Southwest has a A320 model
55 Kappel : The wing to the left (our left) of the model looks like a 77W wing if I'm not mistaken.
56 Umfolozi : I just thought maybe Andz was trying to tell us something......
57 Jfk777 : Considering how many 744 take-off from JNB every day, the performance of a 747 is well established. A 748 would have more performance then 747 classi
58 Andz : This one is in the chief pilot's office, no 777s
59 Warren747sp : Now they had their experience with Airbus aircrafts to play with, they decided it is time to come back to Boeing's fold. First with the narrow bodies
60 SA7700 : With all due respect, could you please provide a source with all relevant stats which implicitly link the “discomfort” of SA’s Y-class seats to
61 Warren747sp : I travel to sa about 4-5 times a year. There is nothing but negative comments from associates and colleagues complaning about the y class comfort on t
62 Trex8 : thats SAAs choice of seats, its not a function of the manufacturers! . I do ORD-HKG or PEK several times a year and the one time I flew CX from JFK t
63 SA7700 : Unreal. You see, although I'm a die-hard Boeing fan and openly admit it, I still find "NOTHING but negative comments" about the cabin comfort on SA's
64 SA7700 : And IIRC those Y-class seats were SR's choice. SA received A340's that were intended for SR, shortly after their demise.
65 Warren747sp : U also feel more claustrophobic in a long tube as opposed to a wider cabin. The comments I get are from SAA flyer in Y class not something made up but
66 Post contains images SA7700 : My sincerest apologies then. What in the world is wrong with SA's A340's?? Is it perceived as unsafe or just plain undesirable due to personal taste?
67 Andz : I bow you your superior knowledge! I asked my wife to check and it is indeed a 777, but in Boeing house colours. What narrow bodies are you on about?
68 Jfk777 : Having just taken delivery of A340-600 and A320 in the last 5 years post Coleman Andrews, why would SAA need a new fleet. The fleet they have is fairl
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Airblue To Decide Oin New Fleet Within "2 Months" posted Thu Aug 16 2007 11:44:28 by Flying-Tiger
New Spirit CEO To Guide Air Fleet Transition posted Thu May 25 2006 22:55:51 by KarlB737
A-I Wants To Sport A New Look With Bigger Fleet posted Mon Oct 18 2004 18:20:37 by Karan69
New Fleet Types To ROC. posted Mon Dec 2 2002 00:16:36 by United_Fan
SAA New Fleet Training And Sim. Question posted Thu Oct 17 2002 00:09:25 by SA-JET
SAA To Make A Fleet Choice In Two Weeks posted Sat Feb 9 2002 23:47:45 by SAA201
Qantas In Talks To Aquire Air New Zealand posted Sun Apr 8 2001 00:54:39 by BA
SAA's New Fleet: Strange posted Sun Dec 31 2000 00:00:17 by Manuel
SAA To Make A Fleet Choice In Two Weeks posted Sat Feb 9 2002 23:47:45 by SAA201
Qantas In Talks To Aquire Air New Zealand posted Sun Apr 8 2001 00:54:39 by BA