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AirTran Loads At RIC  
User currently offlineRICBWI From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 86 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2518 times:

I found the thread on Jet Blue in Richmond to be quite interesting. Any word on how Air-Tran is doing in Richmond?

I fly them quite a bit out of both RIC and BWI, and the RIC loads appear to be improving over several years ago. I've never flown on Jet Blue as usually within the Northeast I do Amtrak instead of flying but have become a pretty big AirTran fan.

Anyone know of how RIC is doing?

11 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineL1011 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 1674 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 2438 times:
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I fly out of RIC quite a lot since I live here, and AirTran flights to and from ATL are usually pretty full. I also recently flew on a Delta 757 from RIC to ATL and back, and those flights were completely full also, at least in coach. So it looks to me like AirTran is doing very well. I guess a lot of capacity is needed on that route.

Bob Bradley
Richmond, VA



Fly Eastern's Golden Falcon DC-7B
User currently offlineB6fll From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 2275 times:

DL and FL can have RIC...Hopefully Jetblue will pullout since its not working ouut for us there...

User currently offlineMOBflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 1209 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 2206 times:

Here are the loads from January of last year through February of this year.

January 2007
ATL RIC 55.2%
RIC ATL 52.5%

February 2007
ATL RIC 59.6%
MCO RIC 74.7%
RIC ATL 63.7%
RIC MCO 70.9%

March 2007
ATL RIC 62.7%
MCO RIC 70.1%
RIC ATL 63.9%
RIC MCO 74.0%

April 2007
ATL RIC 64.6%
MCO RIC 68.8%
RIC ATL 66.7%
RIC MCO 65.2%

May 2007
ATL RIC 71.2%
MCO RIC 62.8%
RIC ATL 69.9%
RIC MCO 63.8%

June 2007
ATL RIC 74.3%
MCO RIC 60.6%
RIC ATL 78.5%
RIC MCO 67.9%

July 2007
ATL RIC 75.4%
MCO RIC 66.7%
RIC ATL 77.1%
RIC MCO 70.2%

August 2007
ATL RIC 75.3%
MCO RIC 72.8%
RIC ATL 75.9%
RIC MCO 71.5%

September 2007
ATL RIC 66.6%
MCO RIC 49.7%
RIC ATL 66.9%
RIC MCO 47.0%

October 2007
ATL RIC 72.0%
MCO RIC 65.0%
RIC ATL 74.4%
RIC MCO 65.5%

November 2007
ATL RIC 69.8%
MCO RIC 66.6%
RIC ATL 71.6%
RIC MCO 64.6%

December 2007
ATL RIC 60.6%
MCO RIC 61.4%
RIC ATL 63.2%
RIC MCO 68.0%

January 2008
ATL RIC 59.3%
MCO RIC 55.1%
RIC ATL 59.2%
RIC MCO 55.4%

February 2008
ATL RIC 72.8%
MCO RIC 70.9%
RIC ATL 76.2%
RIC MCO 72.2%


RIC ranks #9 of 32 markets in its stage length category for Revenue per Available Seat Mile (RASM).
1 PWM $0.124443 (average stage length: 539 miles)
2 DAY $0.117484 (average stage length: 520 miles)
3 PHF $0.114668 (average stage length: 501 miles)
4 BQI $0.111522 (average stage length: 600 miles)
5 LGA $0.111391 (average stage length: 640 miles)
6 STL $0.109244 (average stage length: 560 miles)
7 DCA $0.108255 (average stage length: 607 miles)
8 PIT $0.102701 (average stage length: 600 miles)
9 RIC $0.102357 (average stage length: 509 miles)
10 HOU $0.101984 (average stage length: 696 miles)
11 CAK $0.100445 (average stage length: 623 miles)
12 DFW $0.100170 (average stage length: 797 miles)
13 EWR $0.098477 (average stage length: 745 miles)
14 IND $0.098453 (average stage length: 782 miles)
15 IAD $0.095928 (average stage length: 593 miles)
16 TPA $0.095864 (average stage length: 669 miles)
17 ROC $0.093079 (average stage length: 701 miles)
18 BOS $0.092428 (average stage length: 662 miles)
19 SRQ $0.092261 (average stage length: 698 miles)
20 MDW $0.091603 (average stage length: 695 miles)
21 MCO $0.091237 (average stage length: 786 miles)
22 MCI $0.090035 (average stage length: 746 miles)
23 PHL $0.089357 (average stage length: 716 miles)
24 BMI $0.089294 (average stage length: 651 miles)
25 FLL $0.088389 (average stage length: 783 miles)
26 BUF $0.088229 (average stage length: 776 miles)
27 PBI $0.087819 (average stage length: 761 miles)
28 MIA $0.087257 (average stage length: 716 miles)
29 MLI $0.084924 (average stage length: 752 miles)
30 DTW $0.080792 (average stage length: 782 miles)
31 MSP $0.080011 (average stage length: 710 miles)
32 ICT $0.074114 (average stage length: 781 miles)


User currently offlineRICguy From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 111 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 2106 times:

Hopefully Jetblue will pullout since its not working ouut for us there...

Actually, things are working out pretty well for jetBlue at RIC. They upgraded their seasonal sevice to FLL and continue to increase on their customer base. Officials have also hinted at possible expansion with addtional Florida destinaitons too. Things may change somewhat with the economy however, I don't see jetBlue pulling out of RIC anytime in the near future. The airport continues to have record passenger numbers.


User currently offlineMOBflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 1209 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 2088 times:



Quoting RICguy (Reply 4):
Hopefully Jetblue will pullout since its not working ouut for us there...

Actually, things are working out pretty well for jetBlue at RIC. They upgraded their seasonal sevice to FLL and continue to increase on their customer base. Officials have also hinted at possible expansion with addtional Florida destinaitons too. Things may change somewhat with the economy however, I don't see jetBlue pulling out of RIC anytime in the near future. The airport continues to have record passenger numbers.

On this thread we see that in 2007 RIC ranked in the bottom 5 of B6 stations in revenue per seat, and ranked #4 out of 5 in their stage length category in RASM. Granted, B6 seems committed to the RIC market, but I wouldn't be surprised to see atleast a cutback in the market.


User currently offlineOaktowntwinz From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 33 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 1946 times:



Quoting MOBflyer (Reply 5):
On this thread we see that in 2007 RIC ranked in the bottom 5 of B6 stations in revenue per seat, and ranked #4 out of 5 in their stage length category in RASM. Granted, B6 seems committed to the RIC market, but I wouldn't be surprised to see atleast a cutback in the market.

Could you break this down for those of us who have no background in this area? For example, how is it a bad thing that RIC is #4 out of 5 cities with an average stage length of 301 - 500 miles? I also don't understand your reference to B6's committment to the RIC market. With the economy being what it is, I find it hard to believe that B6 is only in RIC because of its committment to the city. Allegiance doesn't pay the bills. If RIC wasn't making money for B6, they would pull out just as they've done in other cities.


User currently offlineOzarkD9S From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5107 posts, RR: 21
Reply 7, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1910 times:

I flew STL-ATL-RIC on the 15th of May and returned on the 18th. I didn't count pax or anything but a very rough estimate was a healthy 75% LF at least in and out of RIC. (Same with STL actually, nice to see them doing decently here, at least on the flights I was on.)


Next Up: STL-LGA-RIC-ATL-STL
User currently offlineMOBflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 1209 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 1856 times:



Quoting Oaktowntwinz (Reply 6):
Could you break this down for those of us who have no background in this area? For example, how is it a bad thing that RIC is #4 out of 5 cities with an average stage length of 301 - 500 miles? I also don't understand your reference to B6's committment to the RIC market. With the economy being what it is, I find it hard to believe that B6 is only in RIC because of its committment to the city. Allegiance doesn't pay the bills. If RIC wasn't making money for B6, they would pull out just as they've done in other cities.

Being ranked #4 of five cities in your category is obviously not stellar. RASM comparisons must be made in respect to stage length differences, because shorter markets generally are much higher yielding than longer markets, and levels of locality differ among stage lengths, further calling for segmentation by stage length. For the year 2007, RIC performed 13.75% below BUF, 7.3% below RDU, and almost identically to the much storied PIT. My comments regarding B6's commitment to the RIC market are based in that they have spoke of MAJOR expansion from there, and they have a relatively substantial (albeit not the most profitable) following in the market. Given that, they have the ability to shift capacity and have more flexibility with fare levels. I just think they would want to give the RIC market more of a chance than some other markets. But in the end, as you said, allegiance doesn't pay the bills. So if their efforts to reprofitize the market fail, they'll be gone. But I think they can do it, and they think they can too.


User currently offlineOaktowntwinz From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 33 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 1785 times:



Quoting MOBflyer (Reply 8):
Being ranked #4 of five cities in your category is obviously not stellar. RASM comparisons must be made in respect to stage length differences, because shorter markets generally are much higher yielding than longer markets, and levels of locality differ among stage lengths, further calling for segmentation by stage length.

Stage length differences, RASM comparisons, segmentation by stage length etc etc. I appreciate your attempt at breaking it down for me but it still sounds like Greek to me. Although being ranked #4 may not be stellar, as you say, but seeing as how there are only 5 cities in the category, I fail to see how this could be statistically valid. I agree that RIC has a huge business market and a large number of New York transplants and this may influence B6's decision to continue serving RIC. However, airlines are no longer gambling on markets, nor can they afford to. Either RIC works for B6 or it doesn't.


User currently offlineMOBflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 1209 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1672 times:



Quoting Oaktowntwinz (Reply 9):
Stage length differences, RASM comparisons, segmentation by stage length etc etc

Sorry, I should have been more clear.
Stage length is the average distance each seat is flown on nonstop flights out of a city. RASM, or revenue per available seat mile, is a relative measure of profitability. It answers the question 'How much money do we make for every seat we put in the market?' It doesn't tell you that an airline is or isn't profitable, but rather how much more/less profitable they are in station A vs. station B. Because passenger typically pay less overall, but more per mile, on shorter flights - and conversely the other way around - RASM comparisons must take distance into account, hence why each city is in a distance category. Statistical validity for a sample size of merely 5 is not useful for much more than relative comparisons, but it serves that purpose more than adequately.


User currently offlineOaktowntwinz From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 33 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 1608 times:



Quoting MOBflyer (Reply 10):
Sorry, I should have been more clear.
Stage length is the average distance each seat is flown on nonstop flights out of a city. RASM, or revenue per available seat mile, is a relative measure of profitability.

etc etc

I appreciate your taking the time to explain. It helped me get a clearer picture of what you were referring to. Thanks.


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