Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
A380's For US Air Carriers?  
User currently offline1821 From Greece, joined Jul 2007, 271 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 7756 times:

Hello to all. Don't know if this has been discussed before but i was wandering if any US carriers would end up buying the A380. Your thoughts!!!!!!!


734 , 737 , 738 , 742 , 744 , 757 , 767 , A320 , AVRO RJ 100 , ATR 72 . ATH , ZTH , RHO , EFL , LHR , MAN , DUB , AMS ,
51 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineYULYMX From Canada, joined May 2006, 977 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 7731 times:

maybe NW or UA, but i dont think so

User currently offlineTullamarine From Australia, joined Aug 1999, 1638 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 7437 times:

Even if they wanted it, it is unlikely any US carrier could afford to introduce a new type at the moment. Carriers such as UA and NW definitely have routes where the efficieny of the A380 would be a benefit, particularly as many of their competitors will soon be placing the A380 in competition to their ageing 744s but they can't afford it and are unlikely to be in a stable financial position for some time....if ever.


717,721/2,732/3/4/5/7/8/9,742/3/4,752/3,762/3,772,W,310,320/1,332/3,388,DC9,DC10,F28,F100,142,143,E90,CR2,D82/3/4,SF3,AT
User currently offlineTF39 From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 110 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 7412 times:

I don't think so at least not in the next three-five years. I think at least one of the big majors will finally go under permanently if the oil prices remain the same or go higher. Only then would I think a US carrier might buy the A380 for the international routes, with even that unlikely. I think the current widebody offerings (787, 777, A330 and A350) are what the US carriers will stick to.

User currently offlineSYDAircargo From Australia, joined Jun 2008, 242 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 6731 times:

with Oil as high as at the moment , America might chance from frequency to bigger planes.
Inland and on International flights. i think UA, US and DL/NW would have Int'l routes.

why does AA need 15 flights daily from ORD to DFW? between 6am and 10pm


User currently offlineFlyPBA From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 431 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 6658 times:

America is never going to accept bigger planes for less frequency.

Regardless ... unless Airbus offers to pony up the $$$$ to upgrade airports ... then it ain't gonna happen anyway.


User currently offlineWingedMigrator From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 2259 posts, RR: 56
Reply 6, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 6613 times:



Quoting FlyPBA (Reply 5):
America is never going to accept bigger planes for less frequency.

...just like America is never going to accept downsizing from SUVs and pickup trucks.  Big grin


User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7089 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 6595 times:



Quoting FlyPBA (Reply 5):
America is never going to accept bigger planes for less frequency.

Never say never - as I experienced many Americans are now very concerned with global warming, higher fuel prices etc....and that might also change the way of thinking regarding air travel. Many major airlines around the world have a hub to hub network - and I strongely believe America would have, too, if it were not for the deregulation in the 1970s.
Lets wait some years after all the mergers we might see a comeback of the major international hubs and the use of bigger aircraft simply because it costs less.



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineBeaucaire From Syria, joined Sep 2003, 5252 posts, RR: 25
Reply 8, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 6574 times:

That might change once a new take-over law would open the door for foreign companies to own US carriers. Imagine Delta owned by Air France or United owned by Lufthansa-that would be the day things would change.While this day might be years away,the scale of economy on thick,hub-to hub flights will make the seat-mile costs of a A380 look better than on a 747-400 as currently used by the big national carriers.


Please respect animals - don't eat them...
User currently offlineBurkhard From Germany, joined Nov 2006, 4409 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 6425 times:

For international flights into the US or from the US, the US carriers just get less attractive more and more. When you can get the same miles on an SQ or LH for the same prize, why fly UA?

User currently offlineMotorHussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3334 posts, RR: 9
Reply 10, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 6229 times:

If you're flying to/from the U.S., there are just so many better options than flying any U.S. carriers IMHO and I think others concur as there aren't really any American carriers that could support an aircraft this size internationally.

Whereas, to the States, airlines using them will include SQ, TG, QF, KE, LH, AF, EK et al.

Regards
MH



come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5723 posts, RR: 24
Reply 11, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 6174 times:



Quoting Burkhard (Reply 9):
For international flights into the US or from the US, the US carriers just get less attractive more and more. When you can get the same miles on an SQ or LH for the same prize, why fly UA?

This is where non-Americans dont realize things. The US legacy carriers all have these massive Domestic systems which are ALL under constant and gouging competition. Nowhere else on the planet do you have such a saturated system. If the US carriers werent dealing with this competition, then they surely would order the bigest and sexiest planes on the market at any given time. Their service would be up to par with the likes of Singapore and Emirates (who have no domestic services whatsoever).



Check out my blog at fl310travel.blogspot.com!
User currently offlineVoodoo From Niue, joined Mar 2001, 2101 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 6134 times:



Quoting WesternA318 (Reply 11):
This is where non-Americans dont realize things. The US legacy carriers all have these massive Domestic systems which are ALL under constant and gouging competition. Nowhere else on the planet do you have such a saturated system. If the US carriers werent dealing with this competition, then they surely would order the bigest and sexiest planes on the market at any given time. Their service would be up to par with the likes of Singapore and Emirates (who have no domestic services whatsoever).

--

Hmmm
'Pan Am, makes the going great'?
Although I realize I am being a bit oversimplistic, I believe a major reason they (Pan Am Mk. 1) died was because they had no useful toe-hold in the domestic market. Furthermore, its a US domestic carrier, Southwest, that will be the last airline to go under.

-Voodoo (non-American)



` Yeaah! Baade 152! Trabi of the Sky! '
User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5723 posts, RR: 24
Reply 13, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 6109 times:



Quoting Voodoo (Reply 12):
believe a major reason they (Pan Am Mk. 1) died was because they had no useful toe-hold in the domestic market.

Pan Am had absolutely no domestic market at all from when they started up until the merger of National Airlines, which itself had a network that was very ill-suited for Pan Am's needs. Sure, they flew North-South and East-West, but nothing in between. Pan Am's problems stemmed from bad management and over-reliance on the behemoth 747's they ordered, not to mention other carriers encroaching onto their routes, especially TATL.



Check out my blog at fl310travel.blogspot.com!
User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 62
Reply 14, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 5983 times:

Of the US majors, CO and AA will try to upgrade to a 77W if they feel they need something larger than the 77E they both use right now, and US probably would upgrade if they could find the suitable airframes on the second hand market. None have the use for a VLA right now.

DeltaWest will have to replace their 744s eventually, but are likely to go down the 77W route. If they need a VLA the NW faction will certainly consider the A380 but DL may veto the purchase out of hand. I would have said NW were quite likely to get the A388 in the future but post-merger the chances are vastly reduced. Never say never, but its unlikely in the extreme.

That leaves UA, and they have a load of 744s that will need replacing. Some on here have suggested that they may go 77W and I am inclined to agree with that to some extent, but I see them needing a VLA at some point. A388 or 748i - its a toss up. Could go either way. I'd like to see UA take the 748i as they would be the blue chip customer to really give the plane the ordering impetus that it needs, especially as they'll likely take 20-odd. Likewise, it would be a landmark order for Airbus as well as it would show the world that the A380 can prosper literally anywhere.



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5723 posts, RR: 24
Reply 15, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 5907 times:



Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 14):
DeltaWest will have to replace their 744s eventually, but are likely to go down the 77W route. If they need a VLA the NW faction will certainly consider the A380 but DL may veto the purchase out of hand. I would have said NW were quite likely to get the A388 in the future but post-merger the chances are vastly reduced. Never say never, but its unlikely in the extreme.

I'm going to have to agree with you on this, to an extent. DL had Airbuses back in the early to mid 90's (mainly thanks to Pan Am) and even ordered some more to fill in the gaps until the 763ER's could take over the new TATL routes. I dont know what DL's opinion was of Airbus, but I'm assuming the NW folks are quite pleased with theirs?

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 14):
I'd like to see UA take the 748i as they would be the blue chip customer to really give the plane the ordering impetus that it needs, especially as they'll likely take 20-odd. Likewise, it would be a landmark order for Airbus as well as it would show the world that the A380 can prosper literally anywhere.

I wouldnt go as far as saying UA would be the blue chip customer for the 747-8i, but they will more than likely be one of the bigger customers for the plane, if/when it comes out. I would expect JAL or ANA to be the bigger players for the new 747.



Check out my blog at fl310travel.blogspot.com!
User currently offlineBurkhard From Germany, joined Nov 2006, 4409 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 5829 times:



Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 14):
DeltaWest will have to replace their 744s eventually, but are likely to go down the 77W route. If they need a VLA the NW faction will certainly consider the A380 but DL may veto the purchase out of hand. I would have said NW were quite likely to get the A388 in the future but post-merger the chances are vastly reduced. Never say never, but its unlikely in the extreme.

While I understand your arguments. and assume your prediction to become true, they show that there is no logic in the action. We agree that we speak about the planes New Delta uses to China and Japan. If the merger makes any sense, it must be to have more passengers from more destinations to fill the long range planes - so when NW needs a A388, new Delta should logically need the A389. If this isn't the outcome, the merger has failed and Chapter 11 next.


User currently offlineRwy04LGA From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 3176 posts, RR: 8
Reply 17, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 5795 times:



Quoting WesternA318 (Reply 11):
This is where non-Americans dont realize things. The US legacy carriers all have these massive Domestic systems which are ALL under constant and gouging competition. Nowhere else on the planet do you have such a saturated system. If the US carriers werent dealing with this competition, then they surely would order the bigest and sexiest planes on the market at any given time. Their service would be up to par with the likes of Singapore and Emirates (who have no domestic services whatsoever).

Something that I've always had to explain to others. SG, EK, CX, QR, and most others don't have ANY domestic systems, make HUGE profits on international routes, and are the 'darlings' of the industry. Puhleeez.  sarcastic 

Quoting Voodoo (Reply 12):
I believe a major reason they (Pan Am Mk. 1) died was because they had no useful toe-hold in the domestic market.

Acquiring National was the START of their demise.

Quoting WesternA318 (Reply 13):
Pan Am had absolutely no domestic market at all from when they started up until the merger of National Airlines, which itself had a network that was very ill-suited for Pan Am's needs. Sure, they flew North-South and East-West, but nothing in between. Pan Am's problems stemmed from bad management and over-reliance on the behemoth 747's they ordered, not to mention other carriers encroaching onto their routes, especially TATL.

Bingo!!!! Welcome to my RM list!



Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
User currently offlineGlareskin From Netherlands, joined Jun 2005, 1308 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 5704 times:



Quoting FlyPBA (Reply 5):
America is never going to accept bigger planes for less frequency



Quoting WesternA318 (Reply 11):
This is where non-Americans dont realize things.

I don't want to make this a US vs rest of the world thing but I do want to remind you that America slowly but surely is GETTING OUT OF MONEY.... At some point there is no other option left than to give up frequency and network and drive an economical sedan.

Quoting WingedMigrator (Reply 6):
...just like America is never going to accept downsizing from SUVs and pickup trucks.  

LOL

Quoting Burkhard (Reply 9):
When you can get the same miles on an SQ or LH for the same prize, why fly UA?

First of all: SQ and LH are definitely more expensive. Secondly I don't see why UA isn't as good as LH. At least in Y and C UA is better than LH.



There's still a long way to go before all the alliances deserve a star...
User currently offlineUPPERDECKFAN From Spain, joined Jun 2007, 992 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 5298 times:



Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 14):
That leaves UA

Not so fast, if one day they start PHL-PEK, US might order the A380  Big grin

In fact if they keep delaying it, one might suspect it's in the wait of the A380



744,742,741,772,773,762,732,735,738,752,727,717,DC10,DC9,M82,M87,319,320,321,343,346,L1011,CRJ2,CRJ9,E190,ATR42,DSH8,
User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5723 posts, RR: 24
Reply 20, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 5120 times:



Quoting Glareskin (Reply 18):
I don't want to make this a US vs rest of the world thing but I do want to remind you that America slowly but surely is GETTING OUT OF MONEY.... At some point there is no other option left than to give up frequency and network and drive an economical sedan.

We're running out of money because too many airlines are trying to be the king of a very crowded hill.



Check out my blog at fl310travel.blogspot.com!
User currently offlineAither From South Korea, joined Oct 2004, 859 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 5097 times:

Well even Airbus does not see a big Very Large Aircraft market for the US carriers for the years to come. This is what they kept saying : demand is moving eastward.


Never trust the obvious
User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5723 posts, RR: 24
Reply 22, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 5091 times:



Quoting Rwy04LGA (Reply 17):
Acquiring National was the START of their demise.

Actually, if Pan Am didnt beat Texas Air and Frank Lorenzo over the head and jack up the price of the buyout, National had a system PAA couldve built up. Instead, they were so desperate to get into the US market, they gave themselves a poison pill.



Check out my blog at fl310travel.blogspot.com!
User currently offlineBrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4414 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 5038 times:

Quoting Tullamarine (Reply 2):
Carriers such as UA and NW definitely have routes where the efficieny of the A380

UA would not be that interested until they are in a more financially stable position in terms of mergers and acquisitions and know what direction they company will be taking. with NW, we will have to see what happens with its acquisition, er... merger by DL as they seem to be in control of NW.

[Edited 2008-06-03 13:45:20]


Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently offlineIliriBDL From Germany, joined May 2007, 1205 posts, RR: 14
Reply 24, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 5031 times:

US might in a few years. (being that they're going Airbus only fleet)


delta.com
25 Atlanta : It seems to me a Twin-Jet burns less fuel ( not sure just an assumption ) I don't know if the new DELTA will stay loyal to Boeing except A330 and A32
26 EMBQA : Because the market demands it...!!! What would you want to do..? Run 2 or 3 A380 flights then sit in DFW for 4-6 hours to wait for your connection...
27 Superfly : I'd have no problem with that. 15 daily flights between Chicago and Dallas is a bit overkill. If it were a 6 hour layover in Chicago, hop on the CTA
28 Ikramerica : A USA based carrier can't have a vast international network without a domestic feeder system. International routes are profitable, and the most profi
29 Charles79 : In other words, we could say that some of the US legacies are profitable international carriers with a money-loosing domestic subsidiary! You beg the
30 Ikramerica : It's possible but again, the american LCC model avoids the exact airports that the international airlines fly to. So it's not as simple as that. I su
31 Vincewy : I know many will disagree, but I think (UA and NW/DL will definitely need them) AA could use a small number under 20 - ORD/JFK - LHR: except the morni
32 Avek00 : Extremely unlikely. The USA market is ahead of most of the world with respect to deregulation and fragmentation of longhaul flying, forces with contr
33 TylerDurden : They flew to Hawaii from Los Angeles, San Francisco, Portland, and Seattle prior to National. That's domestic.
34 Gsosbee : Hub connector plus there is a fair amount of business between DFW and Chicago.
35 Nwarooster : Remember, you have fill an airplane to make money. The bigger they are the more passengers it takes to fill them. Also, the larger aircraft are more l
36 Vincewy : Correct, except the sectors I mentioned (AA) are exceptions to the rule where the markets are big enough for VLAs to operate efficiently with moderat
37 OzGlobal : What a lot of nonsense offered in defense of the American status quo. If anything is clear about the American aviation industry it is that it is not w
38 TISTPAA727 : Classic, you can add food to that category too! Too bad ignorance will get in the way of common sense. If a US airline does acquire the A380, it won'
39 AirFrnt : It always amazes me how people can look at the gas price, and resulting capacity collapse, and then determine that a bigger plane is the best solution
40 Avek00 : Because the US carriers, instead of "leveling the playing field", instead seek competitive advantage over their foreign rivals by offering superior s
41 Ikramerica : Why does CO have 11 between IAH and EWR? Why does UA have 13 between DEN and ORD? etc. Why? Connections, coverage of missed connections, coverage for
42 Jacobin777 : Those would go from MadDogs to B757's or B767's...
43 ItalianFlyer : How bout Family Airways...that proposed start up out of LAS? lol
44 OzGlobal : I don't think you understood my post and this sounds like "this is what we do in the US so it must be right." Clearly it's not a competitive advantag
45 YULWinterSkies : And your point is? It could be a good management idea to focus only on international routes with top-notch service and newest planes. Nothing prevent
46 Banjo76 : And this is where Americans don't realize things. It's not like European passengers all come from round the corner and go to the airport by bike to f
47 Brilondon : And pigs will become airborne and Santa and the Easter bunny...before foreign carriers control any U.S. based major airline.
48 WesternA318 : No one likes connecting onto another airline when there are easier options available. This is one small reason that killed Pan Am, along with a thous
49 Bobnwa : Othrt than yourself, do you think many others even on A.net think that?
50 Avek00 : Who told you that bold faced lie? Slap him or her and tell the transgressor to look at the international networks and ASMs offered by US legacies on
51 OzGlobal : "Seem to be..". Based on what, their recent market leading profits, very young fleets and improved products?? Appalling service, cabins and years bei
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Is The New CEO To Late For US Air posted Tue Apr 20 2004 05:48:07 by GREATANSETT
A380 For US flag carrier ? posted Sat Mar 20 2004 20:44:40 by PBIflyguy
Airspace Clearance For Commerical Air Carriers posted Mon Mar 18 2002 22:38:48 by Soupthansa
Can US Air Carriers Order Il-96Ms? posted Tue Aug 22 2000 02:28:11 by AerLingus
Royal Air Falcon (Jordan) Applies For US Service posted Sun Feb 10 2008 08:23:48 by LAXintl
Prize Draw For A380 Flight With Air France posted Mon Oct 8 2007 06:56:06 by DernierVirage
Why Not A340 For US Carriers? posted Thu Aug 10 2006 22:28:47 by Eastern023
Tail Numbers For Two US Air Flights From 7/29 posted Sun Jul 30 2006 22:10:08 by Cadet57
Funding For US Airport Mods For A380 Questioned posted Mon Jun 26 2006 21:08:12 by KarlB737
Airbus A380 Orders For US Airlines.. posted Tue Apr 18 2006 18:07:38 by BHXDTW