Considering the Wright amendment won't let them fly to DAL from either coast, that's not gonna happen. I agree that it would've been a much better decision if they opened SFO-ORD, but the costs of opening a new station probably have something to do with that.
Richierich From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 4137 posts, RR: 6 Reply 7, posted (5 years 6 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 7305 times:
Great ... another leisure market, although I am quite aware that LAS gets its share of business/conference traffic too.
The times look good - they are right in the middle of two JetBlue and two Delta flights, B6 leaving JFK-LAS at 0750 and 1015 and Delta leaving JFK-LAS at 0800 and 1000. Similar thing on the return.
Perhaps, but so far they have been holding their own. Even so, the LAS-NYC market is quite crowded. I would have thought the first non LAX/SFO-JFK market they would enter would be SEA or SAN but I guess they see a market for themselves JFK-LAS.
I would expect to see some interesting promotions to get this flight off the ground.
Very good schedule. This is going to draw both business and leisure traffic..
Quoting Richierich (Reply 7): Great ... another leisure market, although I am quite aware that LAS gets its share of business/conference traffic too
Las Vegas has a strong business and conference traffic demand. I suspect this route isnt being laid out for the Las Vegas locals. This route is being geared at the inbound business/leisure traveler from the New York market to Las Vegas.
Just the way that Jet Blue has killed Virgin America on SFO-JFK, and LAX-JFK (Jet Blue backed out of LAX before it had a chance to start). Virgin America has been holding its own. I think that it can be more than explained that Virgin America has a very loyal following and a very solid product. In fact there are many on this forum, and people like myself that enjoy the Virgin product that are more than willing to pay the premium to fly the Virgin America first class product.
SANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 4967 posts, RR: 15 Reply 11, posted (5 years 6 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 6803 times:
Of the 2 "under-served" (by VX) start-up cities, LAS and SAN, I was hoping SAN would see its first non-SF route but maybe this LAS-JFK announcement is a sign that more connect-the-dots will come. This now means that San Diego is the only VX station that sees service on only 1 route (and only 5x daily.)
Since Virgin seems to be having trouble getting the next city up-and-running, they have to put their new a/c somewhere and I'm happy to see it's somewhere other than LA/SF-NY!
Quoting Richierich (Reply 7): The times look good - they are right in the middle of two JetBlue and two Delta flights, B6 leaving JFK-LAS at 0750 and 1015 and Delta leaving JFK-LAS at 0800 and 1000.
Exactly...And I can't wait to see it. This is for all the VX cool aid drinkers!!!
Quoting Lambert747 (Reply 10): Just the way that Jet Blue has killed Virgin America on SFO-JFK, and LAX-JFK (Jet Blue backed out of LAX before it had a chance to start).
I dont know the loads for VX from SFO-JFK but B6's numbers are great. Talk to me when VX makes a profit. And by all means VX had nothing to do with B6 not starting LAX...LMAO. That was all fuel prices. I thing between JFK-LGB/ONT/BUR we have LA covered...
Lambert747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 14, posted (5 years 6 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 6694 times:
Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 13): Based on what information? It's easy to do when you have hundreds of millions of dollars to burn through
How many people said Virgin America would not get off the ground?
How many people said that Jet Blue and United were going to kill them?
How many people said Virgin America wont get the premium traffic?
It would appear that Virgin America is holding its own. In fact the fact that people are willing to infuse money into the long term future of the airline only goes to prove that Virgin America is gaining traction and their is a genuine interest in the product and offerings from not only the flying public, but investors.
I am not here to knock Jet Blue. However on two of my most recent Jet Blue flights, as a roundtrip LAS-JFK, I have to say that the image and product arent being taken care of as much as it has been in the past. The wear and tear is starting to show on the Jet Blue fleet. The costs to fly Jet Blue are equal to that of the majors. There is a lack of premium product to infuse additional income into Jet Blue.
There are a lot of things that Virgin America holds over Jet Blue. Of note is its presence in key markets. Virgin America isnt going to be doing the Florida shuttles, or connect the dots to markets that are less than robust. Virgin America from what I have experienced, and what I have heard is dedicated to premium O/D markets and the clientele in those markets. While Jet Blue may be content flying a route like BUF-MCO, Virgin America is content flying a route like JFK-LAX.
Quoting Lambert747 (Reply 14): In fact the fact that people are willing to infuse money into the long term future of the airline only goes to prove that Virgin America is gaining traction and their is a genuine interest in the product and offerings from not only the flying public, but investors.
EOS, Skybus, Maxjet, and Silverjet also had investors opening their wallets, for a while...
LASOctoberB6 From Japan, joined Nov 2006, 2380 posts, RR: 1 Reply 19, posted (5 years 6 months 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 6473 times:
hmmm... Fly CO to EWR for Thanksgiving or fly VX to JFK for Thanksgiving? Eitherway, it's nice to have an alternative to B6's flight to JFK. Too bad it's not effective in July and they don't fly to SYR... But in the end, I think i'll still be flying jetBlue for my summer trips to upstate NY and Continental for Thanksgiving.. Oh well.
Flighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 7917 posts, RR: 3 Reply 20, posted (5 years 6 months 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 6448 times:
LASJFK may be a _crowded_ market, but it is a _big_ market. Many of the persons on it will wish for a stylish and cool airline. Especially, the VX front cabin is pretty unique for the LASJFK market. This is the VX claim to fame. I think they should do fine, since they have no exact competitor. They are carving their own niche.
Lambert747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 21, posted (5 years 6 months 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 6398 times:
Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 18): EOS, Skybus, Maxjet, and Silverjet also had investors opening their wallets, for a while...
They are totally different business models. Not one was like Virgin America. To start Virgin America had instant brand recognition. Then you have the multiple destinations served by Virgin America. Lastly you have the clientele base of Virgin America.
One route, Two more announced - never started. A business plan geared at purging the loyalist of BA, VS, and AA Business and First Class flyers in the New York market. With one route, on the most competitive TATL corridor you have problems. You are putting all of your resources into one corner. The most competitive corner in the North Atlantic.
Handfull of routes to distant out of town destinations. The business model for Skybus was so out of touch that not even its loyalist of flyers, could imagine their long term plans. Honestly how much money can you make with $10 Trans-Con airfares, and destinations served 50 miles from the market it advertised.
Antique 767-200 aircraft with a horrible, horrible maintenance record. Honestly how many people remember the Maxjet fleet when it came to a near stand still last year due to mechanical issues on multiple aircraft all at once. An airline that based its business plan on travelers that want a in between economy class and business class product. STN-LAX, IAD, LAS, JFK. The verdict is still out on the new revived charter operation.
SANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 4967 posts, RR: 15 Reply 23, posted (5 years 6 months 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 6358 times:
I just did a schedule check and was amazed to see that today, 13 n/s operate between LAS and JFK! (That's B6 with 5, DL has 4, US flies 3x and AA has 1 flight.) I had no idea there was that much capacity (or that many cx); I didn't even look at CO to EWR.
So, as has been said, just another huge market that VX is jumping into...
Ikramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21312 posts, RR: 60 Reply 24, posted (5 years 6 months 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 6330 times:
Quoting Lambert747 (Reply 14): How many people said that Jet Blue and United were going to kill them?
How many people said Virgin America wont get the premium traffic?
It would appear that Virgin America is holding its own.
It takes time to "kill" a competitor.
They get premium traffic by discounting it, and by having a solid product. But with only 8 seats, they aren't getting much premium traffic.
As for what it would "appear" I don't know. They are losing money hand over fist, their Y loads are poor (which is most of their plane), and they are having trouble figuring out where to fly next, so much so that they are now entering the LAS-NYC market, not exactly the highest yield or most underserved market around.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
25 Humberside: Whats the chance of LAX-LAS. Another joining the dots route, but another one with heavy competition?
26 Lambert747: So then I ask.. For their frequent fliers on JFK-SFO, JFK-LAX, is Virgin America to ignore the demand of JFK-LAS and let the others in the market kee
27 B6fll: No, Im definetly in favor of LCC's over the legacies. LCC's have much better service, nicer aircraft, and alot better customer service. Th only reaso
28 MaverickM11: I'm not in favor of one versus the other, but everyone blames legacies for the "overcapacity" and then you have someone like VX adding capacity to ma
29 Lambert747: I am not blaming the legacies for overcapacity. I dont think for a minute we would see as many LCC's in the market if the legacies had better treated
30 BigGSFO: Really? 1. Focus on higher yielding markets/travelers who will pay a little extra 2. A worldwide brand which most airlines could only wish they had f
31 Ikramerica: that's the crux of it. I liked flying VX on LAX-SEA, and that's not an overserved market, at least in terms of number of carriers. I just don't get t
32 Flighty: Why not... this is a classic VX market. They are a premium carrier. They are like BMW. Just because a lot of Chevys are sold in JFK-LAS does not mean
33 B6fll: LMAO..If VX is BMW, Jetblue must be Bentley!!!
34 Lambert747: If you have flown Jet Blue, you would be saying a Ford..
35 NIKV69: This had to happen I wanted to try them to fly back to NY for Xmas last Dec and had to fly to SFO first so said nay. Hope to try them soon!
36 MaverickM11: LCCs have been successful because of one thing and one thing only: low fares. VX will not get any high yield travelers with such a limited schedule,
37 Ikramerica: "better make way" BMW's, at least here in SoCal, are driven by: 1. daughters who's daddy bought them 2. hollywood assistants who think they are more
38 B6fll: LMAO..Not really. I have flown Jetblue many of times, even before I worked for them. Thats why I work for them now. Because of what they are and beca
39 MAH4546: Except for over many, many, many people like me that actually live in L.A. and aren't going to shelp out to other airports with LAX a 20-25 minute dr
40 B6fll: Well I am sorry to hear that. I guess you will have to settle for less and fly VX or the other "Ford" and "Chevy" carriers.
41 B6fll: http://www.virginamerica.com/va/pres...Jun/Announces-Fuel-Surcharges.html There you go Lambert, here is your so called BMW airline...LMAO. Last time I
42 InTheSky74: With the issues at LAX like security, etc - it's sometimes faster just driving to LGB.... A lot of people drive to LGB or the other airports for convi
43 MAH4546: Or, rather, I won't resort to immature classifications of airlines, and just fly Virgin America because they fly to LAX, and LAX is convenient to me.
44 VX4Ever: Everyone just needes to calm down, yes 1. there are many options from NYC-LAS 2. The market is over crowded and 3. There are many similar products...
45 Ikramerica: I'd be a B6 regular by now if they flew to LAX. Well, at least 4 flights a year for the last 7 years. But oh well, I just fly CO and DL and AA instea
46 PlanesNTrains: As someone who has never flown B6 or Virgin America (though we will be flying both this summer), I am rapidly finding your posts to be repetitive, pr
47 EK345: VX is a good airline, as is B6. I have flown both, but I do have a preference, and that is VX. EXCELLENT inflight staff, good product, young fleet. A
48 F9Animal: TWA did fine from LAS to JFK, and so did National N7. While both airlines are now gone, I can tell you that these flights were packed. I really wish
49 Panamair: Not really. In Y, VX is no more 'premium' than most other legacies out there. Let's take a look at their supposed "premium" features: Leather seats?
50 Asteriskceo: Honey, I'm sure that those B6 passengers that were stuck in the aircraft at JFK for 8 hours would have loved to drink some of the "VX cool aid"