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Do Hawaiian Air 717s Ever Leave Hawaii?  
User currently offlineRwex414 From United States of America, joined May 2008, 82 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 7272 times:

I was looking at some pictures of Hawaiian Air's and I never found a 717 that was not in Hawaii. Are there any routes that the 717 fly that go outside of Hawaii?

27 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDeltaAVL From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1893 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 7277 times:



Quoting Rwex414 (Thread starter):
Are there any routes that the 717 fly that go outside of Hawaii?

How would they?



"We break, We bend, With hand in hand, When hope is gone, Just hang on." -Guster
User currently offlineHAL From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 2572 posts, RR: 53
Reply 2, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 7275 times:

No, they do not. They don't have the range to leave Hawaii unless we put extra fuel tanks in them, so they stay where they are, doing interisland service every day. We do our own heavy checks on them too, so they don't have to be ferried to the mainland for that maintenance.

HAL



One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7256 times:



Quoting DeltaAVL (Reply 1):


Quoting Rwex414 (Thread starter):
Are there any routes that the 717 fly that go outside of Hawaii?

How would they?

Exactly.

Do you think HA simply decides to install ferry tanks for fun?

It was a feat to get the TO Hawaii - there are several threads and a really good article in Airways Mag about it.

Why would the leave? To where?


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8956 posts, RR: 60
Reply 4, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7164 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
DATABASE EDITOR



Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 3):
Do you think HA simply decides to install ferry tanks for fun?

Geez, ANC....go easy on the guy. He was just asking. Just because the 717s limited (in this case) range is obvious to most of us doesn't mean it's common knowledge to everyone.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 3):
Why would the leave? To where?

...and he doesn't seem to be arguing that the airplanes should be leaving the islands. He's asking a simple question.

Rwex....as HAL explained, the 717s are strictly island-hoppers. Here's a photo of the ferry tanks used to extend the range of the very aircraft you're asking about:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © James Richard Covington



And for future reference, I suggest posting questions of a technical or operational nature in the Tech/Ops Forum. Some really great discussions stem from seemingly simple questions, and you learn a ton.  Smile

2H4



Intentionally Left Blank
User currently offlineFlyIGuy From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1160 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7153 times:

Did Hawaiian take over the flights that Aloha use to fly to Johnston Atoll and Midway Island for the military? I remember seeing those flights when waiting at the gate for an inter-island flight to Maui...


The opinions I post are of mine and mine alone, not of the airline I work for.
User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7124 times:



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 4):
Geez, ANC....go easy on the guy.

I kinda thought I was . . .no  sarcastic  or anything . . . sorry . . . .

Really . . . .

Also, looks like the same photos in your post are from the article I referenced . . .


User currently offlineBohica From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2751 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7101 times:



Quoting Rwex414 (Thread starter):
Are there any routes that the 717 fly that go outside of Hawaii?

Considering the range of a standard 717 is 1400nm, there are very few places they could go beyond the islands. Midway Island is possible but at over 1300 nm, that is pushing it.


User currently offlineWjcandee From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5366 posts, RR: 22
Reply 8, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7101 times:



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 4):
And for future reference, I suggest posting questions of a technical or operational nature in the Tech/Ops Forum. Some really great discussions stem from seemingly simple questions, and you learn a ton.

And often a lot more patient explanations from folks who appreciate enthusiasts' friendly interest.


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8956 posts, RR: 60
Reply 9, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7101 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
DATABASE EDITOR



Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 6):
Also, looks like the same photos in your post are from the article I referenced . . .

Sounds like an interesting article. It inspired me to find more photos of ferry tanks via Google's image search. Pretty cool stuff!

2H4



Intentionally Left Blank
User currently offlineNwaLAS From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 94 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7078 times:

Okay...Since no one is asking....I might as well!  idea 


How the h-e- double hockey sticks do you get those tanks in there??? I want to imagine the "ship in a bottle"....this is sort of the same thing.


NwaLAS

 scratchchin 



"But She's Sleeping"..... "Ma'am, you cannot have your 3 month old child at the slot machine with you!"
User currently offlineHawaiian717 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3212 posts, RR: 7
Reply 11, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7063 times:



Quoting FlyIGuy (Reply 5):
Did Hawaiian take over the flights that Aloha use to fly to Johnston Atoll and Midway Island for the military?

The military no longer uses either of these sites, and Aloha hadn't operated flights to either for a few years. The airfield at Johnston is officially closed, and while Midway is open to tourism, there isn't currently a regular program to bring visitors there.


User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7041 times:



Quoting NwaLAS (Reply 10):
How the h-e- double hockey sticks do you get those tanks in there???

Remove the emergency exit doors. Install tanks. Replace doors, more or less. Fly to Hawaii . Read the article, it was cool.

Quoting Hawaiian717 (Reply 11):
The airfield at Johnston is officially closed,

As an aside, I knew the last Command Sergeant Major at Johnston . . . was in charge of the final demolotion of our chemical weapons there and then shuit the place down . . .

I once landed there with CO back in the day . . . couldn't get off the plane . . . need per mission . . .


User currently offlineCOSPN From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Oct 2001, 1661 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 7015 times:

AQ quit the MAJ/KWA flights a few years back CO still operates 4 flights a week HNL-MAJ and 3 times HNL-MAJ-KWA and 'downline Island hopper' to Guam

User currently offlineDLflynhayn From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 442 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6524 times:

Yeah pretty cool and sad! when i saw DC-9s landing in LAX in the mid to late 90s,Sad cause i knew they were headed for the desert,and i grew up on those planes as a youngster growing up on the islands....But that's all good those 717 are beautiful! and quiet too!

User currently offlineKunta67 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 46 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 6407 times:



Quoting HAL (Reply 2):

Wow, I didn't know that Hawaiian did the heavy checks in HNL. For some reason I thought you guys did heavy checks on the mainland. I guess it makes perfect sense when I've been flying interisland and you see a couple of 717's across the way with no engines in the hangar. A question I do have is if the plane needs to be repainted, is there a paint facility in Hawaii at all? Also of all the picture's I've seen of planes having a heavy C or D check, they usually strip the plane of paint. Does Hawaiian do that if they conduct the heavy checks in HNL?


User currently offlineAloha717200 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4525 posts, RR: 15
Reply 16, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 6139 times:



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 4):
Just because the 717s limited (in this case) range is obvious to most of us doesn't mean it's common knowledge to everyone.

Not to mention, if you look at the OP's profile, he just barely joined a.net. Let's feed his interest in aviation rather than assume that he should already know these things.


User currently offlineImapilotaz From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 6075 times:

The big question is once they need to start doing serious structural/D checks, does HA do them in HI? That seems pretty specialized and a lot of money and expertise needed for a not too common long heavy checks.

User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 24
Reply 18, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 6049 times:



Quoting HAL (Reply 2):
We do our own heavy checks on them too, so they don't have to be ferried to the mainland for that maintenance.

 drool  Where do I apply? I LOVE heavy checks!!!!!



A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlinePHLBOS From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 7558 posts, RR: 23
Reply 19, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 5919 times:



Quoting Imapilotaz (Reply 17):
The big question is once they need to start doing serious structural/D checks, does HA do them in HI? That seems pretty specialized and a lot of money and expertise needed for a not too common long heavy checks.

In the Airliners magazine article (Sept./Oct. 2001 issue), in addition to the HA 717 delivery article (that talks about the use of auxilary tanks for ferry flights to/from the mainland); there's a sub-article that goes through the history of airlines installing and removing of additional tanks for flying the mainland (the main focus on the sub-srticle was on a DC-3).

From what I remember, the main article stated that HA would from time-to-time need to ferry their 717s back for heavy maintenance checks. Mind you, the article was written years before the shutdown of the 717/MDD production facility in Long Beach.

If HA still has to do ferry their 717s for heavy maintenance checks, where would these birds go now? From what I read in the article, HA has had a lot of experience installing and removing those auxilary tanks for flights to the mainland; their older DC-9-50s went through the same process (but required 9 tanks vs. 4 on the 717).

Note: the posted photos of the tanks still bear the old Pulani logo.



"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
User currently offlineTdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 20, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 5070 times:



Quoting NwaLAS (Reply 10):
How the h-e- double hockey sticks do you get those tanks in there???

The hard tanks are sized to just get in the door.

There are also soft tanks, which you move in rolled up then fill with fuel once they're installed.

Tom.


User currently offlineBoeing767mech From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 1031 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 3295 times:



Quoting DLflynhayn (Reply 14):
Yeah pretty cool and sad! when i saw DC-9s landing in LAX in the mid to late 90s,Sad cause i knew they were headed for the desert

In the mid to late 90's the DC-9's where heading to SBA for D checks with Santa Barbara Aerospace. We used to do lots of HAL's DC-9 checks at that SH@#hole. Until the owners sucked all the money out of the company and filed Chapter 11. Was interesting seeing the airplane ferried from the inlands with all the interior stripped and tanks installed, They also used to temp install a GPS unit in the cockpit for the flight over.
For being over in the inlands the airframes weren't in too bad of shape.

David



Never under-estimate the predictably of stupidty
User currently offlineHa763 From United States of America, joined Jan 2003, 3673 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 3251 times:
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HA can do up to C checks in HNL for the 717s. I remember seeing the DC-9s going through C checks, when I worked there. D checks would require ferrying the aircraft out of HNL.

Quoting Tdscanuck (Reply 20):
The hard tanks are sized to just get in the door.

 checkmark  I have stood right next to them. They are not that big. IIRC, the diameter of the tanks is only slightly more than the width of the seat tracks.


User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7566 posts, RR: 8
Reply 23, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 2805 times:



Quoting Hawaiian717 (Reply 11):
Midway is open to tourism, there isn't currently a regular program to bring visitors there.

True, apparently, the last time I was on the Midway website, they are hoping to have flights come back within the next year or so. Of course with fuel and all that might be hard, and the field is night ops only due to all the birds there. Midway looks like a very interesting place, I would love to visit it one day, I guess the easiest way now is you either work there, or you take a cruise that stops at Midway.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineB4REAL From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2661 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (6 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 2789 times:



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 4):
Here's a photo of the ferry tanks used to extend the range of the very aircraft you're asking about:

I like the cable ties holding the hose around the row 12 marker!



B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
25 Post contains links STT757 : ANCFlyer, have you seen these sites? http://www.johnstonmemories.com/usacap/index2.html http://home.earthlink.net/~markinthepacific/index.html
26 AirframeAS : To where?
27 Ha763 : That I don't know since I'm not with HA anymore.
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