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AA Flight From JFK To BCN How Is It Doing  
User currently offlineBullpitt From Spain, joined Mar 2004, 871 posts, RR: 8
Posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 11146 times:

Hi all

Can anybody tell me how AA direct flight to BCN is doing?


These are my principles but if you don't like them I have others
39 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8090 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 11009 times:
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Hopefully better then the Continental 757 from EWR to BCN alwasy makin afuel stop on the way back. Iberia being a partner helps.

User currently offlineLHR777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 10980 times:



Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 1):
Hopefully better then the Continental 757 from EWR to BCN alwasy makin afuel stop on the way back. Iberia being a partner helps.

What are you talking about?

First, CO operates two 757's a day on the EWR-BCN route, not one.

Flight 121 did not fuel-stop yesterday or today.
Flight 143 did stop at SWF briefly yesterday. It did not stop en-route today. So, the flights are not "alwasy makin afuel stop" on the way back. It's simply not true.

AA may well be assisted by having IB as a Oneworld partner. However, CO has more US domestic connections via their EWR hub onto their 2x daily services, and also connects to SkyTeam partner Air Europa from BCN.


User currently offlineTonytifao From Brazil, joined Mar 2005, 1011 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 10979 times:

I flew on it in May and both flights were oversold  Smile

User currently offlineJfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8090 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 10947 times:
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Quoting LHR777 (Reply 2):
What are you talking about?

First, CO operates two 757's a day on the EWR-BCN route, not one.

Flight 121 did not fuel-stop yesterday or today.
Flight 143 did stop at SWF briefly yesterday. It did not stop en-route today. So, the flights are not "alwasy makin afuel stop" on the way back. It's simply not true.

AA may well be assisted by having IB as a Oneworld partner. However, CO has more US domestic connections via their EWR hub onto their 2x daily services, and also connects to SkyTeam partner Air Europa from BCN.

AA market is New York City not connections, My post is about a 767 making JFK or Newark 99.9 % or Continental's 757, 70% of the time.

With 2 757's CO should fly a least one with a bigger plane, miraculously they have a ton of 767-400ER or even a mighty 777. I am not debating the superior EWR connections CO's has for its European flights. If an airline offers a NONSTOP then the passengers should expect it especially in the summer months of agreeable weather.


User currently offlineSeaBosDca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5095 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 10854 times:



Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 4):
With 2 757's CO should fly a least one with a bigger plane, miraculously they have a ton of 767-400ER or even a mighty 777.

From what destination would you have them take away 767 or 777 service?

(crickets chirp)

I thought so.



Most gorgeous aircraft: Tu-204-300, 757-200, A330-200, 777-200LR, 787-8
User currently offlineLHR777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 10780 times:



Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 4):
With 2 757's CO should fly a least one with a bigger plane, miraculously they have a ton of 767-400ER or even a mighty 777. I am not debating the superior EWR connections CO's has for its European flights.

You mentioned the fact that AA partners with Iberia. Therefore, you allude to the concept of connecting traffic. Hence, I countered with CO and their EWR hub, and their onward connections from BCN onto Air Europa, as a valid argument.

Also, CO doesn't exactly have a "ton of 767-400ER" aircraft. Have you perhaps thought that the yields in the EWR-BCN market could not support a 777, nor a 767-400ER? Or even a 767-200ER? For the record, CO operates just 16 B767-400ER's and only 10 B767-200ER's, as well as 20 777-200ER aircraft. As a comparison, AA operates 58 767-300ER's and 47 B777-200ER aircraft. A substantially larger fleet than CO.

Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 4):
AA market is New York City not connections, My post is about a 767 making JFK or Newark 99.9 % or Continental's 757, 70% of the time.

I think you'll find that CO's market is New York City, and they're easily the bigger carrier in the NY area. Can you please provide a link to your 'fact' that CO has only a 70% completion rate on their BCN services?

Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 4):
If an airline offers a NONSTOP then the passengers should expect it especially in the summer months of agreeable weather.

No airline absolutely guarantees a non-stop service between two points.


User currently offlineJfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8090 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 10690 times:
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Quoting LHR777 (Reply 6):

You mentioned the fact that AA partners with Iberia. Therefore, you allude to the concept of connecting traffic. Hence, I countered with CO and their EWR hub, and their onward connections from BCN onto Air Europa, as a valid argument.

Also, CO doesn't exactly have a "ton of 767-400ER" aircraft. Have you perhaps thought that the yields in the EWR-BCN market could not support a 777, nor a 767-400ER? Or even a 767-200ER? For the record, CO operates just 16 B767-400ER's and only 10 B767-200ER's, as well as 20 777-200ER aircraft. As a comparison, AA operates 58 767-300ER's and 47 B777-200ER aircraft. A substantially larger fleet than CO.

My post is about a 757 vs a 763ER's ability flying from BCN to Newark or JFK, not all this other stuff about connections, yields and CAL only having 20 777 vs AA's 47.


User currently offlineEWRCabincrew From United States of America, joined May 2006, 5523 posts, RR: 56
Reply 8, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 3 days ago) and read 10670 times:



Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 7):
My post is about a 757 vs a 763ER's ability flying from BCN to Newark or JFK

I thought your post was about how AA was doing on the JFK-BCN route?

FWIW, both planes are able to do the route. As for your need, AA is probably doing well with full flights.



You can't cure stupid
User currently offlineRafabozzolla From Brazil, joined Apr 2000, 1184 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 10497 times:

IB as a partner? Most fligths out of BCN are now Clickair!

User currently offlineLACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 3945 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 9036 times:
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Is the JFK-BCN trip "safe" from doing well enough to possibly avoiding getting the axe?

User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11116 posts, RR: 62
Reply 11, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 8951 times:

I think AA's JFK-BCN route is probably performing fairly well in the summer, as AA has a massive presence in New York, and the Iberia marketing presence at the other end also doesn't hurt.

Now, whether the flight survives the winter - and even more seriously the fall - remains to be seen. It's losing one weekly flight for the winter, so we'll see how it does.

Quoting LHR777 (Reply 6):
You mentioned the fact that AA partners with Iberia. Therefore, you allude to the concept of connecting traffic.

It's less about connections and more about Iberia's market presence on the BCN end of the route. There are lots and lots of Iberia frequent flyers in BCN who fly on IB and ClickAir and this now gives them nonstop, in-FF-network access to the U.S. for the first time in years.

Quoting LHR777 (Reply 6):
Can you please provide a link to your 'fact' that CO has only a 70% completion rate on their BCN services?

According to FlightStats, CO120 is on time 54% of the time, while CO142 is on time 58% of the time.


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16691 posts, RR: 51
Reply 12, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 8835 times:



Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 4):
AA market is New York City not connections, My post is about a 767 making JFK or Newark 99.9 % or Continental's 757, 70% of the time.

Please back up your "99.9% vs 70%" statistic, for all you know CO may have a higher completion factor than AA.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11116 posts, RR: 62
Reply 13, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 8726 times:



Quoting STT757 (Reply 12):
Please back up your "99.9% vs 70%" statistic, for all you know CO may have a higher completion factor than AA.

In terms of punctuality, it looks like AA's JFK-BCN is even worse than CO's EWR-BCN flights - with CO's two flights being on time 54% and 58% of the time, and AA slightly lower at 52%.

Ah, gotta love that NY ATC.


User currently offlineNYCAAer From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 690 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 8698 times:

From all accounts I've been hearing within the company, so far American has been very pleased with the results of JFK-BCN. The flight looks like it will be a keeper.

JFK-MXP has been less successful than JFK-BCN, but it's too soon to make an assessment.

Also, ORD-DME has been a disappointment so far. Loads have been quite low, usually in the mid-90 range on a 247-seat 772. And I keep hearing ORD-DEL is on the watch list.


User currently offlineOA412 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 5225 posts, RR: 25
Reply 15, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 8636 times:

Quoting NYCAAer (Reply 14):
Loads have been quite low, usually in the mid-90 range on a 247-seat 772.

Mid 90's is low?

Never mind. I just realized you are talking about a load factor of 90 out of 247 seats rather than a 90% load factor.

[Edited 2008-07-13 07:56:14]


Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11116 posts, RR: 62
Reply 16, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 8603 times:



Quoting NYCAAer (Reply 14):
JFK-MXP has been less successful than JFK-BCN, but it's too soon to make an assessment.

Yeah, should be interesting to see how MXP does - they should have done it from MIA, not JFK, now that AZ isn't flying MIA-MXP anymore.

Quoting NYCAAer (Reply 14):
Also, ORD-DME has been a disappointment so far. Loads have been quite low, usually in the mid-90 range on a 247-seat 772. And I keep hearing ORD-DEL is on the watch list.

Yeah - as soon as the 763s get the new EFIS cockpits, DME will likely lose the 777. It doesn't demand that big/premium a plane, anyway.

I do hope that route makes it, though.

As for ORD-DEL, I think it's been iffy for about the last 12-18 months, especially because of how exceedingly long it is, which kills on fuel.

Quoting OA412 (Reply 15):
Mid 90's is low?

I think he was referring to raw numbers of passengers, not load factors.


User currently offlineBbinn333 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 8559 times:

On CO Both BCN Flights Follow On To MCO So the PTV's Are GREAT !!!

User currently offlineNYCAAer From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 690 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 8421 times:

I should have clarified my statement about ORD-DME- I meant that the flights are going out with only about 90 seats sold out of a possible 247 (or 246, minus the pilots' crew rest seat in F/C), not with load factors of 90%.

User currently offlineLHR777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 7897 times:



Quoting Commavia (Reply 11):
According to FlightStats, CO120 is on time 54% of the time, while CO142 is on time 58% of the time.

Which is interesting, but on-time performance isn't an indicator of flight completion.


User currently offlineLIPZ From Austria, joined Jun 2006, 1075 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7768 times:

According to AENA (Spanish Civil Aviation Authority) statistics 10.924 pax flew in May 2008, 1st full month of operation.

JFK-BCN 5,752pax/30 flights
BCN-JFK 5,172pax/30 flights


User currently offlineBullpitt From Spain, joined Mar 2004, 871 posts, RR: 8
Reply 21, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7745 times:

hi LIPZ

Where did you get those statistics? I would love to check a few other flights if pos.

Un saludo



These are my principles but if you don't like them I have others
User currently offlineMisbeehavin From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 914 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7729 times:

Let's see... For Friday (July 18) JFK-BCN looks like:


DL094 JFK 17:35-BCN 07:50 +1 767 J9 D9 I9 Y9 B9 M9 H9 Q9 K9 L9 U9 T9
AA152 JFK 19:00-BCN 09:10 +1 763 J4 D3 I1 Y7 B7 H7 K7 M7 L7 G7 V7 W7 N6 S0
CO120 EWR 19:10-BCN 09:15 +1 757 J7 D4 Z2 R1 Y9 H9 K9 M9 N9 B9 O9 V9 U9 Q9
CO142 EWR 21:15-BCN 11:20 +1 757 J4 D2 Z0 R0 Y9 H9 K9 M9 N9 B9 O9 V9 U9 Q9


User currently offlineLIPZ From Austria, joined Jun 2006, 1075 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7697 times:



Quoting Bullpitt (Reply 21):
Where did you get those statistics?

Take a look
http://estadisticas.aena.es/csee/Con...Estadisticas%2FEstadisticas&c=Page

(trafico del año en curso, of course : -) )


User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8604 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7695 times:
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Quoting Commavia (Reply 16):
Yeah, should be interesting to see how MXP does - they should have done it from MIA, not JFK, now that AZ isn't flying MIA-MXP anymore.

I agree 100%! Hopefully, AA MIA-MXP will come to fruition soon.


25 RIPCORDD : NYC AAER ORD-DEL I doubt it's on a watch list it is a very good flight for AA and also ORD-DME has been picking up a lot and the DME-ORD flight is doi
26 Commavia : "Giv[ing] it time to mature" is a concept lost on AA - they don't ever give routes time to mature. They either sink or swim, quite quickly, and AA do
27 TUSAA : ORD-DME has been performing horribly, in both directions. Y does ok, but F and J are not up to expectations. The flight carries hardly no cargo in ei
28 NYCAAer : Initially, ORD-DEL was a cash cow. But the environment has changed. Fuel costs are killing ultra long haul. The fares, although still expensive, do n
29 AAJFKSJUBKLYN : This is smart business........with one world there are many options and AA doesn't necessarily have to serve the destination non-stop if it's not mak
30 MAH4546 : While it will not happen this winter in order to allow the JFK-MXP flight to mature, I think that as long as the industry rebounds in '09, it will ha
31 LAXdude1023 : Actually it hasnt. ORD-DME is not doing well at all. I dont want to see it cut, but a 777 is way too much plane, even in high season. A very true and
32 Yellowtail : They didn't pull Asuncion because it was performing badly....it was because they had a situation where they didn't want to pay Gov;t mandate Agency t
33 LAXdude1023 : As far as Moscow goes, not really. SFO and MIA would probably make better shots at DME or SVO than IAH. Outside of JFK, LAX, and ORD they would proba
34 MAH4546 : Miami, San Francisco, and Seattle have much more demand to Moscow than Houston. They might even be larger markets to Moscow then Chicago.
35 LAXdude1023 : As of 2 years ago the largest markets were: NYC and LAX. I believe that is still the same, but I havent looked at the data since then.
36 Commavia : Who's disagreeing with you? I was never criticizing AA's ultra-conservative, sink-or-swim route planning strategy. Indeed, it has served them quite w
37 MAH4546 : NYC and LAX are most definitley the largest. I'd only assume the next five largest would be some ordered combination of Chicago, DC, San Fran, Seattl
38 Commavia : Don't get me wrong - I don't think the economy is nearly as bad as the media is hyping it up to be, and I definitely do think that will be on the ups
39 AAJFKSJUBKLYN : I would definately give the credit for this MASS HYSTERIA recession to the MEDIA. Without a doubt they have fueled the fears of the common person, cre
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