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BA Orders 777-300ER  
User currently offlineAPYu From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2007, 839 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 33024 times:

From Press Release

We have ordered six Boeing 777-300ER aircraft, and placed options for four more. The B777-300ER is 23 per cent more fuel efficient than the Boeing 747. The aircraft will give us greater flexibility in the longhaul fleet following delays to our Boeing 787 deliveries. We ordered 24 B787s and 12 Airbus A380s, for delivery between 2010 and 2014, to replace some of our oldest aircraft and expand our fleet


We'd like to welcome in particular our Executive Club members and those joining us from our Oneworld alliance partners.
159 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLegoguy From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 3313 posts, RR: 40
Reply 1, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 33034 times:

Sweet, although kind of odd when they are due to announce a reduction in flights out of Gatwick. However this is the deal many have been waiting for! 773ER's in BA livery. Good stuff.


Can you say 'Beer Can' without sounding like a Jamaican saying 'Bacon'?
User currently offlineTheginge From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 1132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 32963 times:



Quoting Legoguy (Reply 1):
Sweet, although kind of odd when they are due to announce a reduction in flights out of Gatwick

Not odd at all, even though BA have to reduce costs and cut capacity they still need to think long term and order more fuel effiecent aircraft.


User currently offlineFrigatebird From Netherlands, joined Jun 2008, 1645 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 32873 times:

Well, at last! This is one order we've expected for years... So, Boeing is probably taking Airbus' path in offering discounted airplanes to avoid paying compensation in cash (and buying something like, say, some A350-1000's or so with it  duck  )

It's certainly gonna be one of the better looking 77W's around! Any news when they will be delivered? I wonder if they will be used to replace some of their 747's as well... 23% more fuel efficient, wow.



146,318/19/20/21,AB6,332,343,345,388,722,732/3/4/5/G/8,9,742,74E,744,752,762,763,772,77E,773,77W,AT4/7,ATP,CRK,E90,F50/7
User currently offlineZK-NBT From New Zealand, joined Oct 2000, 5351 posts, RR: 11
Reply 4, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 32857 times:

Good News.

Whats odd is only 6 for an airline the size of BA. No doubt more to follow I guess.


User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21544 posts, RR: 59
Reply 5, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 32784 times:



Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 4):
Whats odd is only 6 for an airline the size of BA. No doubt more to follow I guess.

Well, they will have some A380s to replace 744s (1 for 1, increase in capacity), and some 77Ws to replace 744s (1 for 1, decrease in capacity) and some 787s to replace 744s (2 for 1, increase in frequency). They can decide which options to exercise first based from those three orders based on how the market plays out, and that takes care of their oldest 30 744s. This also leaves room for any combination to replace the remaining 27 744s at a later time:

more 77Ws
more A388s
more 787s
748s (roughly equal 1 for 1 replacement)
A389s (1 for 2 replacement, decrease in capacity and frequency)
A350-1000s (1 for 1 replacement, decrease in capacity)



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineTheginge From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 1132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32704 times:

Interestingly BA are grounding no aircraft this winter.

User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6939 posts, RR: 63
Reply 7, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32696 times:



Quoting APYu (Thread starter):
We have ordered six Boeing 777-300ER aircraft

Groan... (I hate this plane.)

Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 4):
Whats odd is only 6 for an airline the size of BA.

Which may suggest the order is "interim" and related to the 787 delays. (I can hope...)

Don't rule out the A350-1000 yet!


User currently offlineSlz396 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32560 times:



Quoting Frigatebird (Reply 3):
Boeing is probably taking Airbus' path in offering discounted airplanes to avoid paying compensation in cash.

I think it can indeed be assumed these 6 planes are compensation for the massive delays on the 787 and will allow BA to bridge the gap spanning many years between promised delivery dates and actual delivery dates of their 787s on order...

As such Boeing is trying to compensate in exactly the same way as Airbus did when they encountered delays on the A380, and as a manufacturer,this really is the best way to do it.

Quoting Frigatebird (Reply 3):
It's certainly gonna be one of the better looking 77W's around

For us aviation fans, I definitely think so too, although for the ordinary observer, I don't think so really, because what's another 6 777s amid such a huge fleet already?

Quoting Frigatebird (Reply 3):
Any news when they will be delivered?

I think they will be delivered pretty soon, certainly not later than the first 787 was due.

Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 4):
Whats odd is only 6 for an airline the size of BA. No doubt more to follow I guess.

They take just 6, because they are interim lift.

As to your remark more are to follow, I wouldn't be too sure as it is interesting to see the low number of options BA secured, indicating BA clearly decided to keep this order for interim lift entirely apart from their RFP on the huge fleet replacement which is underway...

I can image Boeing will have done everything possible during the negotiations to inflate the number of options (and thus their chance to future add-on orders) so as to get some sort of foot between the door, but that clearly failed: BA just took the urgently needed 'free interim lift' and a minimal extra margin on top, meaning they clearly didn't want to limit their future choices by taking options on the 77W now, thus giving away their preference for their future fleet is likely elsewhere...

If you thus mean "2 to 4" with "more to follow", then yes I can agree with you, if you mean "15 to 20", then I wouldn't.


User currently offlineGkirk From UK - Scotland, joined Jun 2000, 24947 posts, RR: 56
Reply 9, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32537 times:



Quoting Theginge (Reply 6):
Interestingly BA are grounding no aircraft this winter.

Haven't they already announced that they will be grounding a few planes including at least 8 747-400s?



When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
User currently offlineFrigatebird From Netherlands, joined Jun 2008, 1645 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32472 times:



Quoting PM (Reply 7):
Which may suggest the order is "interim" and related to the 787 delays. (I can hope...)

Don't rule out the A350-1000 yet!

It's not unlike last year, when they ordered some 772's first and decided later on their 'big' order for 787's and A380's. There will be another order from BA this year I assume, which could indeed include A350-1000's. But also more 77W's...

As for the "interim" part of this deal: I guess they will be as interim as the A330's which are ordered in mass numbers this and last year...  tongue  Expect more to come...



146,318/19/20/21,AB6,332,343,345,388,722,732/3/4/5/G/8,9,742,74E,744,752,762,763,772,77E,773,77W,AT4/7,ATP,CRK,E90,F50/7
User currently offlineScbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12638 posts, RR: 46
Reply 11, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32478 times:
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Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 5):
some 787s to replace 744s (2 for 1, increase in frequency)

I don't think BA have ever said this.  no  The 787s are to replace and expand the 767 fleet.

The A380s were to replace the oldest 12 744s. The "next order" is the one designed to replace the remaining 747s (my personal opinion is they'll take A350-1000s and some more A380s).

Quoting PM (Reply 7):
Groan... (I hate this plane.)

Would it be a fine plane if it had RRs under with wing?  wink  As much as I lean towards Airbus, the 777 is a damned fine plane.

Quoting PM (Reply 7):
Which may suggest the order is "interim" and related to the 787 delays. (I can hope...)

Well, the PR does say...

Quoting APYu (Thread starter):
The aircraft will give us greater flexibility in the longhaul fleet following delays to our Boeing 787 deliveries.




Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana!
User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6939 posts, RR: 63
Reply 12, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32382 times:



Quoting Scbriml (Reply 11):
Would it be a fine plane if it had RRs under with wing? wink

It would be AWESOME!  Wink

Quoting Scbriml (Reply 11):
As much as I lean towards Airbus, the 777 is a damned fine plane.

Oh I respect it enormously. I just don't like it very much...  Sad


User currently offlineFrigatebird From Netherlands, joined Jun 2008, 1645 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32293 times:



Quoting Slz396 (Reply 8):
They take just 6, because they are interim lift.

 no  Don't think so, just as I don't think EK's 30 333's will be interim lift. Both the 333 and the 77W are very efficient aircraft, the 333 is one of the best for medium-haul, the 77W is unbeatable for long-haul, and will remain so till 2015 at least - like it or not. And even after EIS of the A350-1000, it will be a very popular airplane.

Quoting Slz396 (Reply 8):
I can image Boeing will have done everything possible during the negotiations to inflate the number of options

That doesn't make sense really. Options which are totally unsure to be converted only take up precious delivery slots.

Quoting Slz396 (Reply 8):
'free interim lift'

Here we go again...  Yeah sure When I said "discounted airplanes" , it doesn't mean free... Or even a minimal margin. I'm sure Boeing makes a healthy margin on the deal, just as Airbus didn't gave away A330's for free either. Let's not go into this again please.



146,318/19/20/21,AB6,332,343,345,388,722,732/3/4/5/G/8,9,742,74E,744,752,762,763,772,77E,773,77W,AT4/7,ATP,CRK,E90,F50/7
User currently offlineEPA001 From Netherlands, joined Sep 2006, 4808 posts, RR: 40
Reply 14, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32260 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Good news for BA and Boeing. BA gets their intermediate capacity delivered and Boeing sells (no doubt heavily discounted) some more B-77W's. Probably the best way to get out of a nasty situation for both companies. And the B-77W will look great in BA's colours!

Now I am wondering, can Boeing do such a deal with all the delayed customers who want to compensate the 787-delays? Are there so many B777's available for such a solution for multiple customers?

And will this order have consequences for the next expansion/replacement order BA is going to place? Interesting times, as so often is the case Big grin!

Kind regards.


User currently offlineJerseyFlyer From United Kingdom, joined May 2007, 642 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32211 times:

Presumably they will still be receiving the 4 772s ordered last year - and I think they took 2 to 4 772 options at that time also.

User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6939 posts, RR: 63
Reply 16, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32147 times:



Quoting JerseyFlyer (Reply 18):
Presumably they will still be receiving the 4 772s ordered last year

Indeed. Serial numbers have already been allocated to the first three.

Quoting JerseyFlyer (Reply 18):
I think they took 2 to 4 772 options at that time also.

Four, I believe. Not sure what their status is now, though. They may have been subsumed into this order for 77Ws.


User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7078 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32149 times:

All this A330 and 77W orders really get annoying after a while I rather see some 747-8I, A340s or A380s being ordered. But I guess these are the days twin efficiency over quad elegancy  Sad
Anyway good news for Boeing and BA, took a long until BA jumped on the 77W wagon.



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineFrigatebird From Netherlands, joined Jun 2008, 1645 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32088 times:



Quoting PM (Reply 19):
Four, I believe. Not sure what their status is now, though. They may have been subsumed into this order for 77Ws.

They were subsumed into the 787 deal IIRC.



146,318/19/20/21,AB6,332,343,345,388,722,732/3/4/5/G/8,9,742,74E,744,752,762,763,772,77E,773,77W,AT4/7,ATP,CRK,E90,F50/7
User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6939 posts, RR: 63
Reply 19, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32069 times:



Quoting Columba (Reply 20):
took a long until BA jumped on the 77W wagon

"Crept" rather than "jumped", I'd say!  Wink  duck 


User currently offlineTristarSteve From Sweden, joined Nov 2005, 4025 posts, RR: 33
Reply 20, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 32072 times:

I can't see it on ba.com, but the news release to staff says that first delivery is in 2010.
How did BA get these aircraft so quickly?


User currently offlineFlynavy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 32914 times:

They'll be fine looking birds for sure!


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User currently offlineHypersonic From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2005, 149 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 32775 times:



Quoting PM (Reply 7):
Groan... (I hate this plane.)

And you regard yourself a lover of aviation!?? - well you must be to have wanted to be a member here? - If you truly were, you'd like 'every' plane, irrespective of who makes it, what it looks like, how large or small it is, what it's made of....

Personally, & I'm no Boeing Fanboy, the 777 in all its versions is a Gorgeous aircraft!


User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6939 posts, RR: 63
Reply 23, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 32800 times:

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...ba-orders-up-to-10-777-300ers.html

FLIGHT are reporting that the order is indeed "interim".

"British Airways has ordered six Boeing 777-300ER aircraft, and placed options on another four of the type, as an interim measure to cope with delays to the Boeing 787 programme."

(Mind you, they are also incorrectly reporting that most BA 777s have RR so what do they know?!)


User currently offlineSlz396 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (6 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 32650 times:



Quoting Frigatebird (Reply 15):
I don't think EK's 30 333's will be interim lift.

I don't know where you got the idea from that the A330 order from EK could be considered interim lift? The order for 30 A333 from EK is not an interim order, nor was it linked to any delays at Airbus, because EK and Airbus made up long time ago on that issue.

The massive A333 order from EK is the outcome of a previously announced RFP to replace their entire A332 fleet, an RFP in which EK was known to be comparing the A333 against the 787 and which the A330 clearly won.

As such I do not expect any 787 order from EK, because the plane just fully lost out.

Now, this small 77W order from BA is said to be interim lift by the airline itself and is clearly kept apart from their existing RFP on fleet renewal... As such, I wouldn't compare the 2 types of orders.

Quoting Frigatebird (Reply 15):
Even after EIS of the A350-1000, the 77W will be a very popular airplane.

Don't forget the RFP from BA is aimed at the second half of next decade, meaning we're talking 2015 at best, with deliveries running till 2020.

From today's order, is seems to me like BA is convinced they will not order any 77Ws in December, which explains why they haven't bothered taking a considerable number of options even. I'd reckon Boeing would be more than willing to help BA on this, if not by signing a firm contract for 30 or so 77W right away, then at least in giving them the options for a few months (their RFP is known to come to an end in a few months).
But BA seems uninterested in any of those solutions and keeps looking elsewhere.
Could they still decide to order many more 77W in December after all? Sure, but it just seems like it is very unlikely, given the fact they did everything to keep this order as small as possible today (both in terms of firm as well as in terms of optioned planes) and explicitly mention in the press release it is just interim lift provided to them. Let's just say that right now, it looks like their hart is wanting to make them go another path than that of a 77W fleet for the future: is it the 748i (unlikely, given the negative comments from the BA CEO), more A380s, the A350-1000 or a combination of these? Time will tell...

Quoting Frigatebird (Reply 15):
Options which are totally unsure to be converted only take up precious delivery slots

BA is said to come with their decision end of this year, so it is not like they would be optioning those slots for long.


25 Columba : What are the aircraft BA will replace next ? 1) The 737 classics will be replaced with A32x, but the A319 is much bigger as the 737-500 so might the r
26 AirbusA6 : BA are unlikely to order a large number of the current 77W in their main order in December, as from the second half of the next decade, it will be out
27 Post contains links Frigatebird : I don't, and I have no idea why you thought otherwise I haven't read that anywhere in their press release: http://www.britishairways.com/travel/bapre
28 PM : I'm sure you are right. Maybe "interim" is the wrong word. Might "marginal" be better? I think the argument is that BA seem not to have decided that
29 Slz396 : I have assumed so, seeing you've put the EK A330 order and this BA 77W order in the same league, which obviously is not correct. I stand by the idea
30 PM : My apologies. I seem to have punched the wrong button. I was quoting (or trying to!) Frigatebird.
31 Frigatebird : Hehe, it was actually me who said that... If I lose the bet poor AirbusA6 would have to order the But otherwise, fully agree with your post
32 NA : I fully agree with you. What we need least, is another boring 773 order. A shame, they should have taken the 747-8I. The A380s ordered will replace t
33 Frigatebird : Maybe some, but certainly not all of BA's 772's. I think when BA will issue a separate RFP to replace their 772's in a few years time, and that's gon
34 AlanUK : I haven't heard about the 747 grounding, but the 737-500 at LGW are going this Winter I believe, and more 757s will go to OpenSkies. 767s will remain
35 PM : Rumour has it you may only have to wait a few months rather than years.
36 CHRISBA777ER : This was my understanding, yes. A350-10 and more A388s to follow by year end.
37 Astuteman : Happy day for this username, I'd have thought... Rgds
38 GCT64 : Interestingly, the info I have is that only 2 of the 77Ws are purchased as 4 are going to be leased from GECAS. As I don't know the lease periods of
39 Frigatebird : Probably the reason why they can get the first ones as soon as 2010 I guess...
40 Post contains images Stitch : Ah, so nice to see the "fans" come out and bash another order because it wasn't the one they expected from their manufacturer of choice...   A 777-30
41 Astuteman : Although that said, it's a tad more sensible than an A330 serving as interim lift until an A388 can arrive - at least the 773ER can do pretty much mo
42 Jfk777 : What took them so long. BA should have ordered 777-300ER's when Rod Eddington was CEO. I see the day when BA operates 30 of these beauties. On routes
43 BA777ER236 : And for this one!!!! Long overdue IMHO though! Cheers
44 Brilondon : I don't think that you would commit this kind of money on an aircraft and add options as well if it were an "interim" order.
45 PM : That's a bit sour from you. Unusually so. I'd have thought the 777-300ER is closer to a 787 than an A321 is to an A380. And what else did Boeing have
46 PM : Well, if it wasn't I'd expect the order to be bigger than ... six.
47 YULYMX : B772LR???
48 AirbusA6 : This board is getting expensive, now it looks like I owe someone a bottle of champagne !!! 23% fuel savings over the only slightly larger 744 is pret
49 Stitch : It just seems that, as of late, the focus on these order threads is why an airline made a mistake in buying the plane. And it's not just on this site
50 NA : That roll will go to the second generation 737, the -300 and -500, which are fuel guzzlers, and MD-80s, which are too. I have the new LH Balance repo
51 EA772LR : This is just not true yet. Airbus have already had to make more changes to the 3510. Will it be more efficient, yes obviously, but certainly with the
52 Mysterzip : The designations for BA's classes are F, J, W, Y. Is there a link to these news? Or is it supposed to come out in a few days? - I don't see anything
53 VV701 : What "kind of money"? Do you have an evidence at all that BA has committed to spend a single dollar more in placing this order over and above that th
54 Theginge : No. The first announcement BA has made regarding the winter flying program reductions has been today, there has been lots of speculation though. Prob
55 A388 : I wonder if BA will use these 77W's on their MIA route or the A388 or a combination of both. Anyone know or have an inside scoop on this? A388
56 Scbriml : Interestingly, Boeing is carrying a UFO order for 2 x 777 placed this month. BA certainly didn't use the "I" word, but did specifically say they woul
57 JoeCanuck : You're asking the wrong people. Until BA explains the purchase in detail, every other explanation will be speculation, no matter how thoroughly prese
58 JAL : Has the order been confirmed?
59 EA772LR : Come again?? How exactly is this pot calling the kettle black??? He basically said perhaps if BA ordered the 748I when they ordered the A388, maybe t
60 Astuteman : Yeh. But you're 772 specific!!! Only kidding buddy. It's great to see enthusiasm for the 773ER in BA colours.. In all honesty, it's probably been bec
61 Ikramerica : Whenever I read that name, it comes across as 'BA 777 hater'. Have you read the thread? Very negative thread, with a lot of people in denial about so
62 Columba : Which are the second most inefficient aircraft 744s or A306s ?
63 WestWing : If BA have ordered two and have made arrangements to lease four, wouldn't one expect the BA statement to say exactly that instead of "we have ordered
64 NA : A319. The A300 is the guzzlers among the widebodies, 744 the thirstiest longhaul jet (but still using less than 50% per pax than a 733). Most efficie
65 ElbowRoom : Interesting discussion. BA have kept a fairly simple longhaul fleet recently, based on three types: 763, 772 and 744. The recent 787 + A380 order loo
66 EA772LR : As others have stated in other threads, fleet commonality is just too overrated anymore. Especially when you're dealing with fleets as large as BA/LH
67 Post contains links Scbriml : This FlightGlobal report mentions the dreaded "I" word. http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...ba-orders-up-to-10-777-300ers.html No mention of leased
68 Kaneporta1 : With the BA-IB merger gaining momentum, I'm sure these 77Ws are just for interim lift until they can get their hands on some beautiful A340-600s...
69 Columba : Interesting, did not expect that always thought that the A319 is one of the most fuel efficient aircraft in LH's fleet and would have expected that t
70 Post contains images EA772LR : A 340-600 in BA colors would be absolutely beautiful, but highly highly unlikely.
71 Gatorman96 : I just don't get why people here care whether or not the order is for interim lift. Yes, BA probably ordered the 773ER to help ease the delay of the
72 Post contains links PlaneHunter : Not again that apples vs oranges comparison, please. All these aircraft listed in the report are equipped with different interiors (two class, three
73 EBJ1248650 : I suspect we'll see more 777-300ER orders from BA.
74 Jfk777 : There has to be a middle airplane between the 787-9 and the A380. Could BA no operate nonstop from LHR to Sydney nonstop ? Naturally the reurn would
75 Stitch : BA may very well have held certain delivery slots and informed Boeing that they would take them at the time they placed their recent 77E top-up order
76 Scipio : If I'm not mistaken, these figures are for actual fuel consumption on the Lufthansa network. This means they reflect a combination of the efficiency
77 Dano1977 : a little birdie tells me that...... The first one arrives in june and will be owned outright by BA. Then 2 will follow in July and September 2010 and
78 Ikramerica : Every carrier who's taken delivery of one has been so impressed they ordered more and changed their thinking going forward about their fleet. (Well,
79 Revelation : More 77Ws. From what I see, BA has a history of ordering in batches instead of the huge one-time order, so I would not be surprised to see them add m
80 GDB : Since no evaluation was carried out, that this order was outside of the planned sencond stage of the longhaul re-equipment programme, that we've been
81 PM : Or didn't buy the 'right' plane? So why not 20 x 77W? I think that is the question some people here are asking. And it seems a fair one to me. I don'
82 Post contains links PM : "not"?! Apologies if I have missed it above but has anyone yet posted the Boeing statement? SEATTLE, Aug. 01, 2008 -- The Boeing Company [NYSE: BA].
83 WestWing : Well the Boeing press release does seem to clear up the fact that the two unidentified 777s orders in July were not placed by BA. I seriously doubt t
84 Acheron : Heh, you obviously where not around in the years when the first A380 airframes were being built. Some members went as far as saying that the A380 wou
85 VV701 : You are correct in saying that every explanation put forward will be a guess. But be assured that BA will never explain the purchase in detail just a
86 ElbowRoom : I'm glad I wasn't around to read that stuff. One of the best things about A.net - for me - is the frank and committed arguments between knowledgeable
87 RIX : - the only advantage of 330 is much earlier availability. Any other assumption of "clear win" is nonsense (Airbus wouldn't need even "old" A350 then,
88 Theginge : BA don't spend a large amount of money without evaluating the aircraft, they probably first evaulated the 773 years ago and are probably still doing
89 Ikramerica : BA isn't going to be an A350-1000 launch customer, so you'd expect 2017 or so for the A350-1000. That's over 8 years from now. And airline can't wait
90 EA772LR : Oh I have been reading on here since end of 2004 and joined beginning of last year, so I clearly remember the '380 attack days'. Those were just as p
91 AirbusA6 : I was amazed to read about the 77W order here, as it slipped out very quietly - there was nothing in the general press or on the British media, with a
92 ComeAndGo : Well, these folks might be right. BA has rejected the 77W as a replacement in their upcoming RFP yet ordered 77W in a compromise deal over 787 delays
93 Stitch : But at that point, why just not tell Boeing they just want the cash and buy more Airbuses? If Walsh really wanted to squeeze Boeing, he'd get more gr
94 FlyDreamliner : congrats to BA, BA, and GE.... it's great to see that there will be more GE in the BA fleet, and the 777-300ER joins the fleet of another great world
95 JoeCanuck : I absolutely understand speculation. Everyone does it. It can be interesting and informative. What I don't understand is when it gets to the point of
96 Alangirvan : BA might have ordered the 773 a long time ago, if they had been able to run an engine competition. I think they did look at how high they could set th
97 ZK-NBT : I'm still picking BA to order more 77Ws myself. Why would they only take 6 even as an interim solution, why not more 772s since they are already in th
98 VV701 : I made my guess, I hope intelligently. I invited others to make their hopefully intelligent guesses to see if I was obviously going down the wrong ro
99 JoeCanuck : It's not the discussion of possibilities I find pointless, it's fighting and arguing about a point which can't be proven, I find pointless...but that
100 PM : Of course they can. The arrival of any new plane doesn't immediately render all previous types uneconomical. But they will also be asking themselves
101 GDB : Yes PM, like a pratt I missed out the 'not'. In summary then, this order allows BA to retire some older 747-436's (of which the oldest will be 21 year
102 Post contains links Kaitak : Just looking at the current BA 772ER config (4 class), I was wondering whether it might be possible to predict some possible BA 77W configs? http://ww
103 ANstar : They won't do 10 abreast. they tried it from LGW and it was a failure.
104 Scbriml : I would say a combination of availability and fleet integration. BA could have selected a small fleet of A330s as a tactical order, but that really w
105 Skyhigh : I think I have read all the posts and that this has not been overlooked. It may be a stupid question but does anyone know which routes BA has in mind
106 Kaitak : I'm sure they wouldn't want to do 10 abreast, but when this was tried at LGW - about 8-10 years ago, fuel was less than half what it is now. Adding an
107 Bongodog1964 : If the order had been announced on a separate day to the fall in profits, the media would have reported it; as it was however the headline drop in pr
108 Dano1977 : I dont think the 747-8i was a possibility. They don't like being launch customers anymore since they got there fingers burnt with the 772 (joint laun
109 APYu : No, even if a plane could be bought to fly such a distance theyd never get crews to work such a long shift. The unions at BA are currently very stron
110 VV701 : Almost certainly not just you. It can be worthwhile when the arguments are developed. But I have to agree with you entirely if the riposte says nothi
111 Jfk777 : Your average A340-300 will have less passenegers then an A333. The A340 operates in a 3 class intercontinental configuration while the A333 is widely
112 Stitch : I can't speak for WW, but the board was ready and willing to order it. However, with many airlines looking to do very well with a mix of A388s and 77
113 Post contains links OldAeroGuy : Actually the 772ER burns less trip fuel than the A343. See the second chart in Reply 33 from this thread: http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/te
114 EGCC777LR : So happy to see the 77W in BA's fleet, it will sure be one of the best looking Just such a pity that they have deserted my local airport MAN and we wo
115 Jetlife2 : While I agree with the thought (and, in fact, the 77W really is the nicest crew rest in the world), I can attest from personal experience that BA cre
116 CityofAthens : I think not, Sir. The vast majority of hotels used for BA crew are indeed 5-star, and located in central areas. I can guarantee it.
117 Post contains links Viscount724 : JL's newest 777-300ERs now going into service on some U.S. routes have 246 seats in 4 classes, 8 first (1-2-1), 77 business (2-3-2), 46 premium econo
118 Ikramerica : I still believe that as a large 744 carrier (57 in service?) and their LHR location, BA is uniquely suited for a mix of A380s, 748s and 77Ws. But lik
119 Post contains images Jacobin777 : Can't wait until one of these babies are B773W's..
120 Alangirvan : Remember that Lufthansa was the launch customer for the passenger version of the 748, AFTER they had already ordered A380s and A346 ( equivalent to 7
121 Ikramerica : And LH is a smaller 744 operator than BA. Of course there are those who still think LH will not take the 748I, but assuming they do, it will have rou
122 GDB : Ikramerica, as BA have stated, as it has been said internally, the competition for a new VLA was decided last year, for the A380. BA are only going to
123 PM : GDB, your answer is that he is...
124 Jfk777 : Many BA 744 were ordered late in the 1990's, when the 777 were available. BA didn't take many 777-200, waiting for the 777-200ER which ddn't arrive u
125 VV701 : I completely understand where you are coming on and I held the same view until very recently. What changed my mind? Well, I've been having a quite de
126 Travelhound : .... and if these orders are for interim lift (as being suggested) than the contractual aspect of the order would be very different to that of a orde
127 PM : Which certainly appears to be the case here.
128 PM : I think it's mildly interesting that today's (Monday) ATWOnline makes no mention of the order.
129 Scbriml : I don't think the "order" has been placed yet. Boeing's PR talked of "working with BA to finalise the deal". Today's electronic version of Flight con
130 Asiaflyer : Compensation for 787 delay might have forced Boeing to give BA an offer they couldn't resist, but there is no doubt that they will be a great replace
131 Post contains links LHR27C : BA and Boeing have now firmed up the 77Ws, with as stated earlier, BA ordering 2 outright and the other 4 from GECAS. http://www.boeing.com/news/relea
132 A340600 : As much as there is to love on the 777 I still hate flying on it every single time. I second the earlier post that this is not true at all and that t
133 Columba : Seeing the picture on Boeing's website, the 77W made me think the fuselage is too long for two engines, 4 smaller engines would make the 77W more aest
134 Ikramerica : Funny, I think the same thing about the A346. I think they both look "too long" to be great looking. The A345 and 777-200 are almost perfectly propor
135 PM : Sort of like ... four RR Trent 500s? Actually, I disagree. The 777-200 looks badly-proportioned. The 777-300ER with two big GE90s almost gets away wi
136 Columba : The problem with the A340-600 is that the fuselage is too narrow to for this long stretch which makes the A346 look very odd. That was my idea, too..
137 Ikramerica : The thing about the A330 to me is the honking wing body faring underneath the plane disrupts the lines. Thought the A340 has the same shape, there's
138 Kappel : Of the current gen aircraft I absolutely agree, especially the a345. However, my love goes to the DC10 for best looking widebody... IMHO the 763 is o
139 Columba : The proportions are right other with the 772 which is too fat for my taste. Me, too, nothing beats the Dc 10 and MD 11.
140 Kappel : LOL, it's always funny to see that what one person likes, is just not attractive to another person. To be honest, I like all Douglas aircraft. They a
141 Revelation : Me too! Me too! It's been an interesting thread. A lot of emphatic postings about how Boeing is giving 777W away to BA, and how 777W has only a niche
142 VV701 : Thanks for posting the link to the Boeing web site confirming the BA order. Two points. First the Boeing statement refers to BA obtaining the 77W on
143 Jfk777 : BA's compensation may be in the 2 77W it ordered directly from Boeing. The compenstion airlines are seaking is limited in the contracts.
144 Kappel : Indeed. From the Boeing press release: GECAS will supply BA with 4 77W, two newly ordered and two from an order from 2007, hence the early delivery d
145 Parapente : I may have missed it in these threads but we know that there is a major pitch going on for the final replacements to the 744 fleet. We know that the 3
146 LHR27C : So it seems safe to assume that the two from the GECAS 2007 order will be first to join the BA fleet.
147 Post contains images Solnabo : This hread look like a beauty contest so here´s my vote for the twin, tri and quads: Quads - Convair 990 Tri - MD-11 Pax/F Twins - A330-200/300 *beau
148 Stitch : Ah to each their own. To me, the 777-200 family is perfectly proportioned. Big fuselage with big engines and big wings all in symmetry. The 777-300 i
149 Columba : The A332 is okay the smaller fuselage helps a lot. The A333 looks like a A343 has lost two engines. BTW would it be possible to fit the A333 engines
150 Jacobin777 : ..I think the B773's are a bit too long as well..the B772's have the best proportions..add in the "raked" wingtips of the B772LR and its probably the
151 VV701 : I agree with those who say the 77W will look great in the BA livery but it is a bit too long in the fuselage. With my 70-300 mm lens at Myrtle Avenue
152 Post contains images Ikramerica : Yep. Which is why lease companies order planes on spec!   My guess is that they will get the 2 77Ws from GECAS first, at the same time. Then the two
153 GDB : I don't think we'll see further A380 orders any time soon, from BA. Or any 4 engine type. Frankly, the options are probably under review right now, (
154 B747forever : On what route can we expect to see BAs 77Ws operate??
155 Stitch : My guess is North American routes that see a single daily 747-400 (LHR-SEA, LHR-PHX, LHR-DTW).
156 VV701 : In the current summer schedules LHR-SEA gets 5-weekly 744 and 7-weekly 772 BA flights and LHR-PHX gets a 6-weekly 744 BA flight. BA used to fly to DT
157 B747forever : Could we for example see them change one of the 3daily 744s to LAX to 2x744 and one 77W??
158 YULWinterSkies : I see this as yet another blow for the 748I. It seems unavoidable that the tremendous 744 fleet will be replaced by a combo of 388 and 77W, leaving op
159 Ikramerica : I don't think so, at least not at first. LHR-LAX-LHR can't be done with one aircraft. The flights+turns add up to over 24 hours. So it would be diffi
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