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Thompson Solutions - "Beetle" Vs. Cozy Suite  
User currently offline1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6441 posts, RR: 2
Posted (5 years 12 months 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 10428 times:

Please don't move this to polls, as this is not a poll; it is a question about Thompson's seats.

I was wondering, I know that Thompson Solutions offers two different types of Economy Class seats - the "Beetle" and the Cozy Suite.

With Delta installing the Cozy Suite as the exclusive U.S. airline, I wonder if other airlines will soon follow. However, there are differences between the "Beetle" and Cozy Suite. The Cozy Suite has more side padding. Also, I know that the Cozy Suite features a "shell recline", where the seat bucket moves instead of the seat back. I don't think the "Beetle" has any recline mechanism.

So, if more airlines soon follow, I would think that most of the international airlines will choose the Cozy Suite. However, I wonder if any airlines will choose the "Beetle" seats? It may be a less expensive option, however, the Cozy Suite is all-around a superior seat, and I don't see why any airline would choose the "Beetle".

I don't know if any LCCs (such as Ryanair) will go with the "Beetle", as most only operate narrowbody aircraft, and by law, seats cannot be more than two away from an aisle. A 3-4 layout on a 737/A320 would not be legal.


The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 1, posted (5 years 12 months 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 10393 times:



Quoting 1337Delta764 (Thread starter):
With Delta installing the Cozy Suite as the exclusive U.S. airline

When will the first aircraft with Cozy suite fly? Is any non-US airline already flying with these seats?

IIRC, there was a thread about staggered seating to enable Delta to go 8-abreast in Y. Will it be with Cozy Suite?


User currently offline1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6441 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (5 years 12 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 10384 times:



Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 1):
When will the first aircraft with Cozy suite fly? Is any non-US airline already flying with these seats?

IIRC, there was a thread about staggered seating to enable Delta to go 8-abreast in Y. Will it be with Cozy Suite?

The first aircraft with them will fly in 2010. Currently, Thompson hasn't awarded any contracts outside the U.S., however, that could soon change.

And yes, Delta's seats will be the Cozy Suite.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently offlineSingapore_Air From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 13738 posts, RR: 19
Reply 3, posted (5 years 12 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 10354 times:

I could be wrong but I think Thompson have ditched the Beetle design in favour of the Cozy Suite.

Side note: I wasn't aware the Cozy Suite had recline. I thought you just slouched to one side?

http://www.thompsonaerospace.co.uk




The patented tip-up seat pan has made seat access much easier than seats installed at the same pitch. The patented seat recline which slides down and forward, reclines you to your perfect lounging position. This all happens inside your own fixed cocoon. The seat's has a fixed backshell, which does not recline into the person behind.

Cozy Suite by Thompson Solutions



Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 4, posted (5 years 12 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 10321 times:



Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 2):
The first aircraft with them will fly in 2010. Currently, Thompson hasn't awarded any contracts outside the U.S., however, that could soon change.

And yes, Delta's seats will be the Cozy Suite.

Thanks. Is Delta installing them on B767? If so, will it be with staggered seating to enable 8-abreast in Y?


User currently offline1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6441 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (5 years 12 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 10307 times:



Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 4):
Thanks. Is Delta installing them on B767? If so, will it be with staggered seating to enable 8-abreast in Y?

Yes, they will be installed on all 767-300ERs, 767-400ERs, and 777s. The domestic 767-300s though will remain with the Weber slimline seats. I would assume that Delta will also install the Thompson Cozy Suites on the NW A330s and 747s as well.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21474 posts, RR: 60
Reply 6, posted (5 years 12 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 10269 times:



Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 5):
Yes, they will be installed on all 767-300ERs, 767-400ERs, and 777s.

Or until customers complain so much they scrap their plans. I don't see this ending well.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 7, posted (5 years 12 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 10269 times:



Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 5):
I would assume that Delta will also install the Thompson Cozy Suites on the NW A330s and 747s as well.

If with staggered seating, I would expect A330 to be 9-abreast Y, and the 777 with 10-abreast Y? Is that correct?


User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (5 years 12 months 3 days ago) and read 10204 times:



Quoting 1337Delta764 (Thread starter):
I don't know if any LCCs (such as Ryanair) will go with the "Beetle", as most only operate narrowbody aircraft, and by law, seats cannot be more than two away from an aisle. A 3-4 layout on a 737/A320 would not be legal.

Probably not. But what about a 6 abreast 150 seat GTF powered C130..



New concepts like these become attractive if an airline can put more people in the same airframe. If you loose little or no comfort that's a big plus in communication.


User currently offline1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6441 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 10076 times:



Quoting Keesje (Reply 8):
Probably not. But what about a 6 abreast 150 seat GTF powered C130..

What about a 6-abreast MD-88/90? With regular seats, the Bombardier CSeries is a 5-abreast aircraft. Something similar could be done with the MD-88/90.

If these Thompson seats become the standard, I think it would be a good idea if Boeing/Airbus made the 737RS/NSR a twin-aisle instead of a single-aisle. With regular seats, they should have a 2-2-2 layout, and with Thompson seats, they should have a 2-3-2 layout.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently offlineJoeCanuck From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 5405 posts, RR: 30
Reply 10, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 9961 times:

It will be interesting to see how these seats work in practice. I can't imagine any problems with flights under 3 hours but long haul will be the test. I think they could work out very well.


What the...?
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 11, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 9742 times:



Quoting Keesje (Reply 8):
Probably not. But what about a 6 abreast 150 seat GTF powered C130..

It will decimate the B737/A319 with a GSM(gallon seat mile) that is 60% of B737, with GTM(gallon ton mile) at 65% of B737. Unfortunately, the B737 can not respond with a 7-abreast Y section.


User currently offlineBeeweel15 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1741 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 9695 times:



Quoting 1337Delta764 (Thread starter):
With Delta installing the Cozy Suite as the exclusive U.S. airline

Is it me or am I seeing something

Look at this from Continental

http://prn.newscom.com/cgi-bin/pub/s...tos-73822&redir=preview&tr=1&row=1

http://prn.newscom.com/cgi-bin/pub/s...tos-73823&redir=preview&tr=1&row=1

Now look at this from Thompson Solutions

http://www.thompsonsolutions.co.uk/benz3.html
http://www.thompsonsolutions.co.uk/benz1.html


User currently offlineSingapore_Air From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 13738 posts, RR: 19
Reply 13, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 9587 times:



Quoting Beeweel15 (Reply 12):
Is it me or am I seeing something

I thought so too but Continental's is by B/E Aerospace.



Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 9509 times:

Cozy Suite is a coach product and DL does have US - poss. N. America - exclusivity on it... which probably most affects AA and then UA.

Short haul is more of a test than long haul. But the airplanes w/ these seats are not intended to be used on short haul segments other than the occassional US positioning flight.

The seats are not certified by the FAA yet so any plans cannot be made firm. It is a radical change in aircraft seats so it will not just sail through the process - although I think it will be approved.


User currently offline0NEWAIR0 From United States of America, joined May 2007, 939 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 8735 times:



Quoting 1337Delta764 (Thread starter):
Also, I know that the Cozy Suite features a "shell recline", where the seat bucket moves instead of the seat back. I don't think the "Beetle" has any recline mechanism.

They have the same seat bottom recline.

Quoting 1337Delta764 (Thread starter):
I don't know if any LCCs (such as Ryanair) will go with the "Beetle", as most only operate narrowbody aircraft, and by law, seats cannot be more than two away from an aisle. A 3-4 layout on a 737/A320 would not be legal.

The narrow body version can offer the airline 1 of 2 options. 1) a wider seat with no increase in capacity or 2) a standard sized seat with an increase in in the number of rows (not the number of seats per row). I do not believe the airlines can have both a wider seat and an increase in capacity; however, I may be mistaken.



"The future belongs to those who believe in the beauty of their dreams."
User currently offlinePcbm From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 95 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7549 times:

This is a great step forward ... dont have to share the armrest OR have spillover.

But at 17" wide might be tight for (dare i say) many.


User currently offlineSingapore_Air From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 13738 posts, RR: 19
Reply 17, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7532 times:



Quoting Pcbm (Reply 16):
But at 17" wide might be tight for (dare i say) many.

The High Comfort version has a seat width of 19" which is as wide as Singapore Airlines' New Economy Class and apparently wider than Emirates' A380 Business Class

here



Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
User currently offlinePcbm From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 95 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7515 times:



Quoting Singapore_Air (Reply 17):
High Comfort version has a seat width of 19"

What makes me think that delta will not opt for the "high comfort" version. Remember that with the shell you are restricted to this width at shoulder hight as well.


User currently offlineSingapore_Air From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 13738 posts, RR: 19
Reply 19, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7453 times:



Quoting Pcbm (Reply 18):
Remember that with the shell you are restricted to this width at shoulder hight as well.



From that picture it would seem that hip / abdomen width is slightly impeded however shoulder width is probably alright.



Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
User currently offlinePcbm From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 95 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (5 years 12 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7407 times:

Im looking at post 8, where the max width of the seat (at its widest point) is 17"

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