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UIO-MAO By Tame Begining Today!  
User currently offlineJJ8080 From Brazil, joined Aug 2008, 932 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 1713 times:

TAME Ecuador started today flying from Quito (UIO) to Manaus (MAO).

There will be 2 weekly flights, with a stop in Guayaquil (GYE) on the way back to Ecuador.
So: UIO-MAO-GYE-UIO.

They will use the Embraer 170, configured with 76 seats. They are considering the possibility to improve the service to a 190 on the future if there is demand. The also operate a couple of 320s and 722s.

That's the 4th international non-stop route departing MAO, the others: MIA, CCS and PTY. Looks like it's becoming a important hub for international flights....


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43 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJJ8080 From Brazil, joined Aug 2008, 932 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1615 times:

Someone have any info about loads on MAO international services?


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User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 16934 posts, RR: 48
Reply 2, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1613 times:



Quoting JJ8080 (Thread starter):
That's the 4th international non-stop route departing MAO, the others: MIA, CCS and PTY. Looks like it's becoming a important hub for international flights....

Who on earth is going between Ecuador and MAO? I can't imagine you could fill a single 170 in three months.



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineAbrelosojos From Venezuela, joined May 2005, 5014 posts, RR: 55
Reply 3, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1611 times:



Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 2):
Who on earth is going between Ecuador and MAO? I can't imagine you could fill a single 170 in three months.

... and your MIDT data shows this  Wink?

-A.



Live, and let live.
User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 16934 posts, RR: 48
Reply 4, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1592 times:



Quoting Abrelosojos (Reply 3):
... and your MIDT data shows this ?

It says nada...but there isn't even a nonstop to GRU from Ecuador...hasn't been since the 90s.



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineAbrelosojos From Venezuela, joined May 2005, 5014 posts, RR: 55
Reply 5, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1589 times:



Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 4):
It says nada...but there isn't even a nonstop to GRU from Ecuador...hasn't been since the 90s.

= Ya. I have no idea. I don't have access to ex-Ecuador MIDT ... and it is probably one of the few markets where MIDT data still has some reliability I guess. Paxis shows low demand as well. Stretching it, perhaps TACA feed into UIO for beyond?

Cheers,
A.

PS: I am impressed by their website. Even a year back, it was pretty crappy.



Live, and let live.
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11365 posts, RR: 59
Reply 6, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1537 times:
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Quoting JJ8080 (Thread starter):
That's the 4th international non-stop route departing MAO, the others: MIA, CCS and PTY. Looks like it's becoming a important hub for international flights....

Less... less.... CCS is a joke, sometimes got 1 passenger. PTY is now 3x weekly... UIO will be 2x weekly... only MIA is a real international regular flight with daily service.

Quoting JJ8080 (Thread starter):
They will use the Embraer 170, configured with 76 seats. They are considering the possibility to improve the service to a 190 on the future if there is demand. The also operate a couple of 320s and 722s.

They had plans in the past to extend the flight to GIG but of course, without rights MAO-GIG would be a bad performer.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 2):
Who on earth is going between Ecuador and MAO? I can't imagine you could fill a single 170 in three months.

Not to MAO, but to Rio de Janeiro and São Paulo. Petrobras has a small oil extraction in Ecuador (now going to 15,000 barrels/day or US$ 450 million/monthly revenue) and holds some providers together. Odebrecht is building a hydroelectric plant powerhouse in Ecuador, Andrade Gutierrez also has concessions in Ecuador. Exports are growing and includes from the eletronic pool system made by Unisys (Rio), trucks from Mercedes (Campinas), chemicals from Braskem (Canoas in the south). Exports from Brazil reaches US$ 400 million JAN-JUL while imports are very limited (US$ 25 million).
Last year about 2,100 corporations from Brazil deal with Ecuador.

If there is demand.. yes, and probably nowadays reaches GIG and GRU thru LIM, PTY and BOG.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3652 posts, RR: 19
Reply 7, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1533 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 6):
while imports are very limited (US$ 25 million)

I guess Tic Tacs take a very large chunk of that.


User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5900 posts, RR: 40
Reply 8, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1524 times:



Quoting JJ8080 (Thread starter):
Looks like it's becoming a important hub for international flights...

not really with only 4 routes and not even with daily flight to this destinations...

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 2):
Who on earth is going between Ecuador and MAO? I can't imagine you could fill a single 170 in three months.

couldnt agree more!

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 6):
Less... less.... CCS is a joke, sometimes got 1 passenger. PTY is now 3x weekly... UIO will be 2x weekly... only MIA is a real international regular flight with daily service.

well thought CCS is bad but really such bad.. well fares are low on the CCS-MAO-CCS route, even had plans to go to the amazonas and take this flight... it would be great if both countrys could revise the bilateral and TAM could go nonstop, a 767 or even A330 would be great on the route cargo yields are very high on the northbound route...



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineJJ8080 From Brazil, joined Aug 2008, 932 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1514 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 6):
Less... less.... CCS is a joke, sometimes got 1 passenger. PTY is now 3x weekly... UIO will be 2x weekly... only MIA is a real international regular flight with daily service.

Didn't even imagined about this poor performance. Thought it was performing well. So wonder why COPA chose MAO istead of BEL, FOR or BSB.

Quoting Avianca (Reply 8):
not really with only 4 routes and not even with daily flight to this destinations...

It is important when compared to other non-SP/RJ cities in Brazil. CCS-MIA is daily.



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User currently offlineAbrelosojos From Venezuela, joined May 2005, 5014 posts, RR: 55
Reply 10, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1508 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 6):
Less... less.... CCS is a joke, sometimes got 1 passenger. PTY is now 3x weekly... UIO will be 2x weekly... only MIA is a real international regular flight with daily service.

= I wonder why they maintain CCS as a daily service.

Quoting Avianca (Reply 8):
not really with only 4 routes and not even with daily flight to this destinations...

= CCS is daily though.

Quoting Avianca (Reply 8):
well fares are low on the CCS-MAO-CCS route, even had plans to go to the amazonas and take this flight...

= Let's go! And, I thought you are coming with me to Iran  Smile ... though, this might be a little problem unless I get my new passport.

Cheers,
A.



Live, and let live.
User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5900 posts, RR: 40
Reply 11, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1502 times:



Quoting Abrelosojos (Reply 10):
= Let's go! And, I thought you are coming with me to Iran ... though, this might be a little problem unless I get my new passport.

yes that were the plans! let me know, I am still open to go  Smile

a 1 weekly shipping tour through rio grande or amazonas would be really great ... and cheap these days... specially from CCS due the TAM flight... let me know if you are intrested.

cheers



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineAbrelosojos From Venezuela, joined May 2005, 5014 posts, RR: 55
Reply 12, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1498 times:



Quoting Avianca (Reply 11):
a 1 weekly shipping tour through rio grande or amazonas would be really great ... and cheap these days... specially from CCS due the TAM flight... let me know if you are intrested.

= Hmmm ... one week might be hard to pull off. Lets speak when I am back in VE. BTW, what fares are you finding? I just sent an SMS to this woman who gets me tickets and she says JJ is usually like USD 550?

-A.



Live, and let live.
User currently offlineJJ8080 From Brazil, joined Aug 2008, 932 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1492 times:



Quoting Abrelosojos (Reply 10):
= I wonder why they maintain CCS as a daily service.

They keep it to fly to CCS grom GRU. The bilateral between Brazil and Venezuala only have 7 weekly frequencies for each side, as RG detains it, they have to stop by at CCS



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User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5900 posts, RR: 40
Reply 14, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1488 times:



Quoting Abrelosojos (Reply 12):
= Hmmm ... one week might be hard to pull off. Lets speak when I am back in VE. BTW, what fares are you finding? I just sent an SMS to this woman who gets me tickets and she says JJ is usually like USD 550?

well the last time I searched it was arround 500 usd but not in high season we should get tickets for 350 usd... when are you back?



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11365 posts, RR: 59
Reply 15, posted (5 years 8 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 1421 times:
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Quoting Avianca (Reply 8):
well thought CCS is bad but really such bad.. well fares are low on the CCS-MAO-CCS route, even had plans to go to the amazonas and take this flight... it would be great if both countrys could revise the bilateral and TAM could go nonstop, a 767 or even A330 would be great on the route cargo yields are very high on the northbound route...

Or if TAM provides more connectivity at MAO. Now the only option by the time the flight arrives is exactly São Paulo! No MAO-GIG, no MAO-Northeast.
MAO is a good city, but it lacks ties with Latin America as it's never become a real exporter of electronics or motorcycles, the only exception is cellphone.

Quoting JJ8080 (Reply 9):
Didn't even imagined about this poor performance. Thought it was performing well. So wonder why COPA chose MAO istead of BEL, FOR or BSB.

The flight performs well from both Rio and São Paulo with good premium demand, and loads between 60% and 70% (but average fare is very high).

Quoting JJ8080 (Reply 9):
It is important when compared to other non-SP/RJ cities in Brazil. CCS-MIA is daily.

I believe you meant CCS-MAO...
Best way to compare MAO: They are 4th in number of international aircraft (POA is 3rd) (arrival+departure), but it's just 9th in number of passengers (lost position to REC, SSA, FLN, NAT and FOR) and soon will be 10th after CNF which will be soon ahead of MAO.
It's a clear indication MAO is just a stop over for the traffic from other places.

Quoting Abrelosojos (Reply 10):
= I wonder why they maintain CCS as a daily service.

TAM need this, the flight only can depart from North of Brazil, and MAO it's the best choice, even without traffic.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4339 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (5 years 8 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 1412 times:



Quoting JJ8080 (Thread starter):
TAME Ecuador started today flying from Quito (UIO) to Manaus (MAO).
There will be 2 weekly flights, with a stop in Guayaquil (GYE) on the way back to Ecuador.
So: UIO-MAO-GYE-UIO.

Neither TAM nor LAN Ecuador have previously demonstrated interest to link Brazil-Ecuador.




.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 4):
but there isn't even a nonstop to GRU from Ecuador...hasn't been since the 90s.

Yes. VARIG flew GIG-GRU-GYE-UIO-SJO up to the 90s.
It commonly utilized the 762 ER in such weekly route.




.

Quoting Abrelosojos (Reply 5):
perhaps TACA feed into UIO for beyond?

All their South American operations are rather concentrated exclusively at LIM for the time being.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 16934 posts, RR: 48
Reply 17, posted (5 years 8 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 1390 times:



Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 16):
All their South American operations are rather concentrated exclusively at LIM for the time being.

Seeing as LIM is growing like a weed and Ecuador is collapsing like a Bolivarian souffle, it's a no brainer.



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11365 posts, RR: 59
Reply 18, posted (5 years 8 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1374 times:
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Its a small market, but for sure one of the reasons is the lack of flights

With a small number of flights and we would see an interesting market

Felipe



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineJJ8080 From Brazil, joined Aug 2008, 932 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (5 years 8 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 1348 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 15):
believe you meant CCS-MAO...

Yes, sorry.



I'm convinced, though MAO was doing good on intl flights, but...



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User currently offlineJJ8080 From Brazil, joined Aug 2008, 932 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (5 years 8 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 1343 times:

Felipe, as you have good infos about DL, why are they going for ATL-MAO istead of ATL-BSB, ATL-BEL or so, if the loads are so bad? And why JJ upgraded the service to a 763?


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User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5900 posts, RR: 40
Reply 21, posted (5 years 8 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 1328 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 15):
TAM need this, the flight only can depart from North of Brazil, and MAO it's the best choice, even without traffic.

wouldnt be Boavista a better choice?



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32176 posts, RR: 72
Reply 22, posted (5 years 8 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 1325 times:



Quoting JJ8080 (Reply 20):
why are they going for ATL-MAO istead of ATL-BSB, ATL-BEL or so, if the loads are so bad?

Manaus-USA is a larger market than others and also is less reliant on traffic from Miami because it is a popular with American tourists, who use Manaus as a starting point for Amazon trips. Brasilia, Belem, etc. are much more MIA-centric.

Quoting JJ8080 (Reply 20):
And why JJ upgraded the service to a 763?

First of all, TAM has feed at Manaus that Delta does not. The MIA-MAO flight feeds to Belem, Fortaleza, Recife, and Brasilia.

Secondly, cargo demand.



a.
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11365 posts, RR: 59
Reply 23, posted (5 years 8 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 1318 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
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Quoting JJ8080 (Reply 20):
Felipe, as you have good infos about DL, why are they going for ATL-MAO istead of ATL-BSB, ATL-BEL or so, if the loads are so bad? And why JJ upgraded the service to a 763?

See Mark comments, plus, they want to connect NRT and ICN to this flight, because Amazon is also very popular for Japanese. I remind that people from NRT use to connect at GRU to MAO, now they would have an option.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 22):
First of all, TAM has feed at Manaus that Delta does not. The MIA-MAO flight feeds to Belem, Fortaleza, Recife, and Brasilia.

Secondly, cargo demand.

JJMNGR can confirm to us, but for me, it's a focus on cargo from MIA to MAO (the opposite is quite non-existant)

Quoting Avianca (Reply 21):
wouldnt be Boavista a better choice?

May be, but MAO was selected because they already keep staff at the time they desire the flight. For BVB they probably need to hire more people, and the demand could be for 5 to 10 passengers a day, but it's not enough for the additional cost. That's why they select MAO.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineJJ8080 From Brazil, joined Aug 2008, 932 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 8 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 1315 times:



Quoting Avianca (Reply 21):
wouldnt be Boavista a better choice?

Well if MAO is lacking CCS traffic, BVB would be even worts.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 22):
First of all, TAM has feed at Manaus that Delta does not. The MIA-MAO flight feeds to Belem, Fortaleza, Recife, and Brasilia.



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 23):

I agree with you guys, is just that in another threath (the UIO-MAO by Tame) is being said that MAO intl. services are going bad. Let's also remember, that when BSB-MIA non-stop starts, MAO-MIA will lose a lot.



100 146 319/20/21 332 722 732/3/4/5/G/W/8/H/9 742/3/4 752/3 762/3 772/W BE2 BET E75 CNJ CR2 D10 F27 F50 ER4 LRJ M11 M80
25 C010T3 : No, because the MAO stop important for GRU-MAO traffic, not to mention the fact that at MAO you have feed, at BVB not.
26 LipeGIG : May be not. The more service you add, the lower fare the market will see, and more demand will come. Lets wait.
27 Avianca : wouldnt say this, BVB has much more relationship to Venezuela than MAO
28 JJ8080 : My point is that, as everyone is saying, MAO-MIA is not so consolidated yet, and with the new BSB-MIA service, they will maybe lose in both sides. Th
29 LipeGIG : TAM will always hold the option to downgrade the route back to A320 or even A319. The BSB-MAO-MIA works while there is no competition on the route as
30 C010T3 : I think so too, but BVB is so small that I think a turboprop would be the best choice for the route. Conviasa should try flying an ATR to BVB, perhap
31 Avianca : sounds good, I am sure there is a market!
32 LipeGIG : For a small plane, i agree !
33 JJ8080 : With no C? Relationship yes, but passenger and cargo traffic no. Than a smaller plane would make sense. Would be more like a regional service, like M
34 LipeGIG : Could be or could not. Nowadays they have no A319 with C seats. One comes with the other !
35 JJ8080 : You didn't understand. I mean that passenger and cargo traffic is what makes flights possible and wannable, not relationship in general. So, even wit
36 LipeGIG : I got your point. I just complete that the mix between them allow to develop passenger traffic. If they got a relationship, a flight will help it to
37 JJ8080 : Agree, they would do a great job on CCS route! But as we said, with a small plane, considering Meta's EMB120's 30 seats, 85% is something like 25-26,
38 LipeGIG : Yes, but lets consider the size of each city. CCS can support even a daily BVB-CCS service with no doubt, and if Meta can feed it with BEL and MCP, w
39 JJ8080 : Agree. A BVB-CCS service, if feeded properly from MCP, BEL, STM, etc, could run a 50-seater with good loads. If we go on this line, if well feeded, I
40 LipeGIG : Because MAO is a city with industrial base focused on the domestic market. BVB, MCP and BEL are less concentrated on the domestic market and a little
41 JJ8080 : But don't even the strong industrial activities in MAO makes business passengers traffic to nearby big cities in other countries?
42 LipeGIG : Think about the kind of industrial activity is going on MAO and what is strong in CCS for example. Try to connect both... you can't by plane ! Explai
43 JJ8080 : Got you. Thanks for the complete explanation.
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