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DOT Approves AA And DL New Flights To Brazil  
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11436 posts, RR: 58
Posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 15024 times:
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Effective today DOT has approved the following:

AA daily service MIA-SSA-REC-MIA
eff. Nov 02

AA 3x weekly service MIA-CNF
eff. Nov 02

DL daily service ATL-MAO
eff. Dec 22

DL 4x weekly service ATL-REC-FOR-ATL
eff. Dec 18


Now Brazil begin to be served thru other gateways and the Northeast can be more easily reached.

AA also increased it's leadership on Brazil-US service.

As a side-note, TAM got approved on ANAC more 7 frequencies to begin a third new flight this year, besides GIG-JFK and GIG-MIA, and will be closer to AA, with 56 weekly frequencies (8 daily flights).

Felipe


New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
135 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32736 posts, RR: 72
Reply 1, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 15025 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Thread starter):
As a side-note, TAM got approved on ANAC more 7 frequencies to begin a third new flight this year, besides GIG-JFK and GIG-MIA

It is my understanding that this new service will be a fifth daily flight to Miami, split between three weekly MIA-FOR and four weekly MIA-BSB. It will operate with a widebody (767?) and it will be redeye from Miami; daylight to Miami. Though that is unconfirmed. Somebody else might know more.

TAM will not allow that Delta have a monopoly on US-FOR.



a.
User currently offlineTonytifao From Brazil, joined Mar 2005, 1019 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 14975 times:

WOOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! I'm so happy! Can't wait to less hassle travel back home to Brazil  Smile

User currently offlineTonytifao From Brazil, joined Mar 2005, 1019 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 14995 times:

Hey, do you think we will see any fare specials to start out with?  Smile

User currently offlineLH506 From Ecuador, joined May 2007, 464 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 14995 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 1):

It is my understanding that this new service will be a fifth daily flight to Miami, split between three weekly MIA-FOR and four weekly MIA-BSB. It will operate with a widebody (767?) and it will be redeye from Miami; daylight to Miami. Though that is unconfirmed. Somebody else might know more.

TAM will not allow that Delta have a monopoly on US-FOR

JJMNGR mentioned on another thread that TAM will start a new destination in the US. It won't be LAX or SFO. So speculation is about ORD, IAD, MCO or maybe a codeshare with CO to EWR or IAH.



NOT FLOWN: 707 717 736/9 764 77L 787 300B2 300B4 345 RJ70/146-100 F27 ATR72 CRJ1/4/10 E120/135/40/95 Q1/2/3 M87
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11436 posts, RR: 58
Reply 5, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 14961 times:
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Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 1):
It is my understanding that this new service will be a fifth daily flight to Miami, split between three weekly MIA-FOR and four weekly MIA-BSB. It will operate with a widebody (767?) and it will be redeye from Miami; daylight to Miami. Though that is unconfirmed. Somebody else might know more.

I believe FOR and BSB will be served to the US only in 2009. At this time i believe TAM will be focusing a UA hub where they can send their connections that are not going to MIA or JFK ... or.... they will begin a flight to MCO.

Quoting LH506 (Reply 4):
JJMNGR mentioned on another thread that TAM will start a new destination in the US. It won't be LAX or SFO. So speculation is about ORD, IAD, MCO or maybe a codeshare with CO to EWR or IAH.

Too early to see such a code-share with CO as they only now signed an agreement with UA

Quoting Tonytifao (Reply 3):
Hey, do you think we will see any fare specials to start out with?

Yes, you may expect a fare around US$ 900 as TAM just begin a special fare for it's GIG-MIA. Now AA would be ready to respond.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32736 posts, RR: 72
Reply 6, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 14945 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 5):
I believe FOR and BSB will be served to the US only in 2009

That is correct. I did not notice that you mentioned the new frequencies are for a flight in 2008. MIA-FOR/BSB is planned for the first half of 2009, probably May/June.



a.
User currently offlineFURUREFA From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 801 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 14835 times:

This is a stupid question, but I'm assuming AA won't have eighth freedom rights ( true cabotage) to sell SSA-REC tickets?

Matt


User currently offlineOa412 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 5246 posts, RR: 25
Reply 8, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 14784 times:

Is there flexibility on the part of the airlines as to which city is served. Say DL decides that daily ATL-MAO is too much and want to reduce service and switch some of those frequencies to, say CNF, is that possible?


Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32736 posts, RR: 72
Reply 9, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 14759 times:



Quoting Oa412 (Reply 8):
Is there flexibility on the part of the airlines as to which city is served. Say DL decides that daily ATL-MAO is too much and want to reduce service and switch some of those frequencies to, say CNF, is that possible?

Yes, they are not city paired specific, but they are limited to select cities (they can't be used to GRU or GIG, for example).



a.
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11559 posts, RR: 62
Reply 10, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 14702 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Thread starter):
AA also increased it's leadership on Brazil-US service.

Among U.S. carriers, yes, AA has, indeed, increased its lead in both frequencies and capacity between the U.S. and Brazil.

Based on previous (before today's ruling) schedules, AA was to have 44.3% of U.S. carrier frequencies and 46.4% of U.S. carrier capacity this winter, with Delta #2 with 22.6% of frequencies and 22.8% of capacity.

With today's ruling, AA will have 46.8% of U.S. carrier frequencies and 47.7% of U.S. carrier capacity, with Delta still #2 with 28.1% of frequencies and 26.3% of capacity.

So, incrementally, Delta is actually gaining the most - in percentage terms - from these new frequencies - jumping 5.5 points in frequency and 3.5 points in capacity.

Interestingly enough, though, because these new flights will be with aircraft substantially smaller than Delta's 767s that presently fly all of their flights to Brazil, their average flight capacity will decrease, leading to their actually not carrying the same share of capacity as they control as a share of frequencies. Continental and United, the other two U.S. carriers between the U.S. and Brazil, have shares of capacity and frequencies that are almost identical.

Quoting FURUREFA (Reply 7):
This is a stupid question, but I'm assuming AA won't have eighth freedom rights ( true cabotage) to sell SSA-REC tickets?

No, they won't, and it would be pretty worthless anyway since they could only sell tickets one-way.

Quoting Oa412 (Reply 8):
Is there flexibility on the part of the airlines as to which city is served. Say DL decides that daily ATL-MAO is too much and want to reduce service and switch some of those frequencies to, say CNF, is that possible?

I believe so.

In the DoT's Notice of Action taken, the department references both AA's and Delta's requests that the frequencies allocated not be subject to city-pair specificity and then, based on my quick scan (though could be wrong), doesn't reference it again. However, the fact that the DoT granted the airlines' requests leads me to believe that they did, indeed, give these frequencies as non-city-pair-specific, meaning that yes, Delta could move frequencies away from MAO, etc. if they needed to.


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32736 posts, RR: 72
Reply 11, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 14664 times:



Quoting Commavia (Reply 10):

In the DoT's Notice of Action taken, the department references both AA's and Delta's requests that the frequencies allocated not be subject to city-pair specificity and then, based on my quick scan (though could be wrong), doesn't reference it again. However, the fact that the DoT granted the airlines' requests leads me to believe that they did, indeed, give these frequencies as non-city-pair-specific, meaning that yes, Delta could move frequencies away from MAO, etc. if they needed to.

AA really wanted this flexibility because if they are not granted frequencies in the next round - or if the REC/SSA route under performs - they can then transfer 3 or 4 of those frequencies to MIA-FOR-BEL-MIA.



a.
User currently offlineOA412 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 5246 posts, RR: 25
Reply 12, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 14641 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 9):
Yes, they are not city paired specific, but they are limited to select cities (they can't be used to GRU or GIG, for example).


Quoting Commavia (Reply 10):
I believe so.

That's what I thought. Thanks!

[Edited 2008-08-08 14:11:04]


Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
User currently offlineRafabozzolla From Brazil, joined Apr 2000, 1227 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 14604 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 9):
Yes, they are not city paired specific, but they are limited to select cities (they can't be used to GRU or GIG, for example).

Any chances of having one MIA-SSA-REC-MIA (6 times a week) dropped in favor of 4 weekly to CNF?

I mean, if MIA-CNF is scheduled as redeye both ways, eyeing biz pax, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to have only 3 flights per week. OK, it might be just one more frequency but, with 4 flights per week you avoid the two day gap between flights.

So 6 weekly MIA-SSA-REC-MIA and 4 weekly MIA-CNF makes for a more balanced schedule than daily MIA-SSA-REC-MIA and 3 weekly MIA-CNF, wright?

Any thoughts.

[Edited 2008-08-08 14:30:07]

User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32736 posts, RR: 72
Reply 14, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 14606 times:

Quoting Rafabozzolla (Reply 13):

I mean, if MIA-CNF is scheduled as redeyes both ways, eyeing biz pax, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to have only 3 flights per week. OK, it might be just one more frequency but, with 4 flights per week you avoid the two day gap between flights.

I would not rule it out, but three weekly works for Montevideo between April and November; it will likely work just fine for Belo Horizonte. It's not exactly like people are hopping down to Belo Horizonte on one day business trips.

A much more likely option is that - like Montevideo - AA can offer a flight via a third point on days it does not operate.

[Edited 2008-08-08 14:22:29]


a.
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11436 posts, RR: 58
Reply 15, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 14530 times:
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Quoting Commavia (Reply 10):
In the DoT's Notice of Action taken, the department references both AA's and Delta's requests that the frequencies allocated not be subject to city-pair specificity and then, based on my quick scan (though could be wrong), doesn't reference it again. However, the fact that the DoT granted the airlines' requests leads me to believe that they did, indeed, give these frequencies as non-city-pair-specific, meaning that yes, Delta could move frequencies away from MAO, etc. if they needed to.

Yes, they can, but will be limited in the form authorized by the bilateral agreement which means up to middle of 2009, only North/Northeast and CNF. But in the near future, it's clear that these frequencies are not subject to a specific city-pair.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 14):
A much more likely option is that - like Montevideo - AA can offer a flight via a third point on days it does not operate.

Yes, you're right. All depend on the first months of operations. If it become a good flight with nice yields, AA could increase or extend a tag flight using the frequencies they rotate between the second and seasonal GIG-MIA (now with TAM competition) and the second and seasonal GRU-DFW.

Quoting Rafabozzolla (Reply 13):
I mean, if MIA-CNF is scheduled as redeyes both ways, eyeing biz pax, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to have only 3 flights per week

With 3 flights they use only one 763. Be in mind that adding more flights will demand a second 763. Then the first months it's good for AA to get a better knowledge on yields.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6751 posts, RR: 32
Reply 16, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 14483 times:



Quoting Commavia (Reply 10):
Among U.S. carriers, yes, AA has, indeed, increased its lead in both frequencies and capacity between the U.S. and Brazil.

Based on previous (before today's ruling) schedules, AA was to have 44.3% of U.S. carrier frequencies and 46.4% of U.S. carrier capacity this winter, with Delta #2 with 22.6% of frequencies and 22.8% of capacity.

With today's ruling, AA will have 46.8% of U.S. carrier frequencies and 47.7% of U.S. carrier capacity, with Delta still #2 with 28.1% of frequencies and 26.3% of capacity.

It's not quite correct to say that AA has "increased its lead" in either frequencies or capacity, although it is indeed correct to say that AA has increased its share of both. Assuming all the new flights operate as planned and assuming the other frequencies & capacity stay constant, by your numbers, AA's lead over Delta will decrease from 21.7 percentage points in frequencies to 18.7 points, while their lead in capacity will decline from 23.6 percentage points to 21.4 points.

In any event, it seems like good news all around for AA, DL, and passengers traveling to points in Brazil other than GIG/GRU -- and hopefully TAM's growth will also provide competition to keep the fares reasonable.


User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11559 posts, RR: 62
Reply 17, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 14459 times:



Quoting ScottB (Reply 16):
Assuming all the new flights operate as planned and assuming the other frequencies & capacity stay constant, by your numbers, AA's lead over Delta will decrease from 21.7 percentage points in frequencies to 18.7 points, while their lead in capacity will decline from 23.6 percentage points to 21.4 points.

I perhaps phrased it the wrong way, but the above is what I mean when I said:

Quoting Commavia (Reply 10):
So, incrementally, Delta is actually gaining the most - in percentage terms - from these new frequencies - jumping 5.5 points in frequency and 3.5 points in capacity.



User currently offlineOA412 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 5246 posts, RR: 25
Reply 18, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 14446 times:

Has Spirit's application for FLL-MAO between approved yet? I haven't heard anything.


Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
User currently offlineRafabozzolla From Brazil, joined Apr 2000, 1227 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 14412 times:

BTW, any guess when schedules will be posted and tickets put on sale?

User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17444 posts, RR: 46
Reply 20, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 14410 times:



Quoting Rafabozzolla (Reply 19):
BTW, any guess when schedules will be posted and tickets put on sale?

For AA? ASAP. The booking window is fast closing. For DL? They'll ask for an extension to delay the start of service until JUN09 Wink



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11559 posts, RR: 62
Reply 21, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 14400 times:



Quoting Rafabozzolla (Reply 19):
BTW, any guess when schedules will be posted and tickets put on sale?

These flights are launching - at least in AA's case - in less than 15 weeks. They will probably want to get these up and selling ASAP: maybe this weekend and definitely by next would be my guess.


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11436 posts, RR: 58
Reply 22, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 14389 times:
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Quoting OA412 (Reply 18):
Has Spirit's application for FLL-MAO between approved yet? I haven't heard anything.

They postpone their request to get the frequencies to be available by June 2009 and DOT informed that 2009 requests will be analized only by 2009 and together with any new request.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineOA412 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 5246 posts, RR: 25
Reply 23, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 14361 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 22):
They postpone their request to get the frequencies to be available by June 2009 and DOT informed that 2009 requests will be analized only by 2009 and together with any new request.

Oh OK. I wasn't aware of that. Thanks.



Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
User currently offlineFXramper From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 7263 posts, RR: 85
Reply 24, posted (6 years 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 14321 times:
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Quoting LipeGIG (Thread starter):
AA daily service MIA-SSA-REC-MIA
eff. Nov 02

AA 3x weekly service MIA-CNF
eff. Nov 02

What metal will AA send on these two routes?  airplane 


25 MAH4546 : 767-300ERs. AA has decided against 757s to Brazil (at least for now) due to the larger premium cabin and increased cargo capacity of the 763s.
26 Aacun : Matt[/quote] Right on Matt.. the only pax allowed to get on in SSA and get off in REC on that flight will be non-rev pax. travelling on a D-1 or D-2 c
27 LipeGIG : Very smart decision. CNF will be a good route, but SSA-REC will surprise a lot of people ! Demand for both will be huge.
28 Iparkny : DL 4x weekly service ATL-REC-FOR-ATL eff. Dec 18 That sounds like an onerous trip to me, with a stopover in REC. I thought it was going to be ATL-FOR-
29 EXAAUADL : DL will have the only online single connect service from China to Brazil. I hope there is enough traffic to sustain ATL-MAO daily. I assume that both
30 United1 : UA & CO provide one stop online connections to and from Brazil.[Edited 2008-08-09 09:30:19]
31 MAH4546 : Indeed, as do Emirates and many European airlines.
32 EXAAUADL : Sorry I meant Northern Brazil. There is a lot of Chinese investment in the Amazon. Does Emirates fly DXB-GRU nonstop?
33 MAH4546 : Yup.
34 Hardiwv : Daily nonstop B772LR...rumours of double daily flights DXB-GRU for 2009/2010! Rgs,
35 LipeGIG : Yes, but there are more focus from Japan than China in MAO.
36 Alianza : Sounds very confident, but with that much potential demand, why wasn't that marketed fully served, or maybe they hadn't regained service that was los
37 BSBIsland : Regulation. US-Brazil frequencies are limited, so airlines prefer to use their scarce resources on less risky routes aka GRU or GIG.
38 Alianza : Thanks BSBIsland !
39 LipeGIG : Besides BSBIsland comment, another problem is the lack of a hub in other markets. BSB for example is good for early morning arrivals but it's night h
40 Jpyvr : Onerous perhaps, but significantly less onerous than flying into GRU or GIG and then facing customs and immigration, an unsure connection, and a thre
41 LipeGIG : That's the main reason for the new flight. To allow people to reach these destinations (FOR, REC, SSA) closer to markets like MIA but at this time, f
42 Miaami : Any idea when these flights will be showing up in Sabre?
43 LipeGIG : Probably next week.
44 MAH4546 : AA filed with DOT today for one of UA's unused Brazil frequencies so that AA can fly MIA-CNF 4x weekly as originally planned. So much for Delta coming
45 LipeGIG : You mean one of the 7 frequencies they are now using for the seasonal IAD-GIG ?
46 Rafabozzolla : That´s interesting. As I´ve posted before I did not quite believe that AA would go the leghts to have a redeye both way and operate it only 3weekly
47 MaverickM11 : AA's schedule appeared in OAG today so it should appear in the GDS and online this weekend.
48 MAH4546 : AA will operate it 3x weekly if that's all the frequencies they can get.
49 Incitatus : Delta only comes out ahead by the frequency count. If the objective was to take up bilateral space, they made it. Even with 10 AA frequencies (and 11
50 WorldTraveler : I know you are trying to do what you can to discredit what DL has accomplished but remember that it was some of the posters of the posts directliy abo
51 MaverickM11 : In your mind DL also pushed Aerogal out of GYEMIA and probably PK out of IAHMAN I think it has also cut more than AA as well.
52 MAH4546 : AR isn't even in the market right now. They were planning a re-entry this winter, but even that was iffy. Given AA nearly doubling capacity, combined
53 WorldTraveler : your fantasies are going wild. I never said or insinuated that. sounds like a prejudicial, unconfirmed opinion. they aren't coming back.... they pull
54 Commavia : Now I'll be the first to admit, when this all first popped up over a year ago, I doubted if Delta would get all the frequencies they wanted - since I
55 MaverickM11 : There's got to be at least 28-30 DL routes cut in the last year to Latin America. How many has DL dropped? You're the expert.
56 MAH4546 : Reading comprehension problems? I realize they aren't coming back. Their plans to return in the first place were iffy, and they never even officially
57 WorldTraveler : and you think I'm biased about DL? so is AA comfortable that what they have is enough and there is no longer any need to grow? DL has managed to move
58 Commavia : Well, when you already fly pretty much everywhere, it's hard to find places to grow, short of just bolstering your already immense lead in the market
59 MAH4546 : All I did was make a simple opinion which doesn't show any bit of a bias. Difficult for you to understand, I realize. Valencia has been approved by I
60 SCL767 : Agreed, AA is a strong brand name in Argentina, and is popular with both the business community and Porteños. Whereas, DL is a new entrant offering
61 LipeGIG : Both will be hurt. I doubt MAO has enough market for 2 daily players, imagine for 3.And next year seems to be more of a challenge. If AA ask for MAO-
62 C010T3 : I don't know. With the possibility of adding GIG, I don't think MAO will get anything. AA really should go for 7 JFK-GIG frequencies, but I am under
63 Jetlanta : Can I propose everyone just drop the "told you so's"? We had a few nice days on the board, let's keep it going. Can't we all just get along?
64 MAH4546 : AA isn't looking at expanding GIG. They want to enter more markets in the Northeast and Central Brazil.
65 LipeGIG : Well, but would be smart to fight for a JFK-GIG with TAM than fight for MAO with TAM and DL A BSB flight would destroy the most important connecting
66 C010T3 : That's great, because I'd love to see more of DL and CO at GIG.
67 Klkla : I thought Delta has a very successful daily flight from EZE-ATL and that they are adding the 5X EZE-JFK "in addition" to the ATL flight.
68 OA412 : You're correct. JFK-EZE is going to be flown in addition to daily ATL-EZE.
69 SCL767 : Yes, and also SCL-ATL, I was referring to the JFK market with AR not flying the route as planned this winter. Most customers will use AA's 12x weekly
70 WorldTraveler : I’ve never heard a no-growth strategy as being considered a viable business plan when the market and your competitors are growing. Half of AA’s s
71 SCL767 : That's good, however, considering that Miami is the gateway to Latin America; AA along with its Oneworld partner LAN, offers more flights to Latin Am
72 LipeGIG : And next year i expect DL to apply for a JFK-GIG also. They could cover three out of the 4 most important markets in deep South America with flights
73 Incitatus : Oh, it is indeed so rude of us if that thought ever crossed our mind... Not for a second we thought that. Somebody, possibly another poster, wrote ab
74 Jetlanta : I go on those to get away from all this! Thanks, btw.
75 MAH4546 : Except, of course, the difference from NYC is pretty insignificant. American will offer 21 weekly flights to Buenos Aires, Caracas, Rio de Janeiro, a
76 MaverickM11 : AA will have over a quarter more ASMs, however, which as we know, is the industry standard measure of capacity
77 Skyzheimers : you guys always make me smile with your bickering back and forth... keep it up
78 WorldTraveler : Even if AA gets its one additional frequency, it will have precisely half of the new frequencies to be added in the Brazil market this year…. And m
79 PlanesNTrains : Why would you even say that? What is the point? I think this may be the point where I just have to choose to ignore your posts. If someone would plea
80 Incitatus : Then they'd be able to calculate rocket science stuff, such as a mileage ratio or the expected fuel consumption of a flight! Wow. In the end what air
81 LipeGIG : Good picture. I just add that the new flights will also provide a potential 5 to 15% increase for the rest of Brazil. However, we will see a strong 3
82 Klkla : One can assume more people will fly on 12 flights than 5, that goes without saying. The real question is can Delta successfully fill those 5 flights
83 WorldTraveler : the whole point of the new route awards is that they are intended to develop new markets. It has been proven over and over again that air service con
84 SJOtoLIR : CM PTY-CNF 5x weekly will start services on August 21st and it would allow a red-eye pattern into the southward path. CM MIA-PTY will also match perf
85 Incitatus : To look at elasticity of demand one has to split the market into personal and business travel. And then one can look at short term and long term. Sho
86 LipeGIG : Yes, but you have to consider the fact that leisure demand that fly now thru GRU and GIG will find options. It means the demand for business also wil
87 MAH4546 : American's new flights are now bookable. Delta's? Nope.
88 LipeGIG : Not thru AA website, yet. However they were uploaded to GD's. Probably a matter of hours.
89 SCL767 : The real question is if they can fill up their business class cabin; AA's 12x weekly JFK-EZE-JFK flights, (993/994 and 955/956) are now bookable on A
90 Jetlanta : You enjoy fanning the flames, don't you?
91 Tonytifao : Felipe, what is GD? Are the fares published? When can we see them on AA.com?
92 MAH4546 : Facts are fact. I'm sure they will be published soon enough, I just find it interesting that they haven't published them yet considering they could f
93 C010T3 : It's actually GDS, global distribution system. Examples for GDSes are Amadeus, SABRE, Galileo, Worldspan...
94 LipeGIG : AA is the one in a rush as their routes will begin before DL ones. DL will have if they upload their flights in two weeks, 30 days of advance booking
95 C010T3 : That leads me to the question if AA is able to track their passengers origins in order to contact them and offer rerouting. For example, a passenger
96 Aacun : Flights are already bookable on sabre....... 980 MIA-SSA-REC-MIA starts 02NOV 991 MIA-CNF starts 04NOV/992 CNF-MIA starts 05NOV
97 LipeGIG : If the passenger was booked on a entire AA ticket, yes, and could be interesting to release one seat in favor of a new and empty flight. But since th
98 Jetlanta : Yeah, that seems like a reasonable explanation to me. Considering that AA hasn't even announced the service, I doubt that they are selling many ticke
99 C010T3 : I mean a through-ticket with interline between JJ and AA.
100 LipeGIG : That's what i meant saying GD's... But fares are not available yet on AA.com
101 MAH4546 : AA's Brazilian offices announced the services publicly last week. They already have staffed offices running in downtown Recife and Salvador; Belo Hor
102 LipeGIG : Seems the only think missing is the definition of Y fares. I tried to check thru other websites and only come the business fare ($ 8,299). When i ask
103 SJOtoLIR : Detailed schedules: American Airlines: Miami - Belo Horizonte - Miami AA 991.....MIA 23:15.......CNF 10:30+1........Tu, Th, Sa.......763 AA 992.....CN
104 Tonytifao : Will AA work with a 3rd party company to provide service in CNF, SSA and REC to perform checkings, baggage handling, etc? Or will they have their own
105 Aacun : If they are bookable on sabre, then that means that fares are posted....... Dont you think? How are you going to book a flight without having a fare
106 LipeGIG : Yes... but please before just post try to give us a Y fare and let us know. If you got $ 8,000 for Economy i would say... no thanks! This is the only
107 MAH4546 : Not really sure. I bet REC/SSA might have their own employees since the flights are daily; CNF might be contracted out. At Recife, I believe that the
108 Tonytifao : I just searched travelocity and found Y for 6k
109 Post contains images LipeGIG : Cheap   Still say.. .no thanks   As i mentioned, there are no Economy (in fact) fares. With 6K you can fly 3 times thru CM flights on Business....[
110 AACUN : The reason why you cant ge anything for less right now is that the only fares posted are C and unrestricted Y for the flight going to REC on 02NOV.. N
111 LipeGIG : Thanks for confirm ! And i'm sure will be a very nice deal to fly non-stop to Northeast instead of facing the (now) very high fares from GIG/GRU to N
112 C010T3 : The only available fares in the MIA-CNF flight are J, I and Y.
113 Tonytifao : How do you think MIA-CNF fare will compare to MIA-GRU? Do you think AA will increase fares on MIA-CNF since they are the only ones who offer them? Or
114 LipeGIG : Tony, in my view, fares on CNF will be the same as both GRU and GIG as probably AA will not allow a reduction on yields. May be during the first 45 da
115 JJ8080 : What about CNF-PTY? They will have a special offer now, when you buy with MasterCard one ticket, you can buy another for half the price. It will be a
116 Tonytifao : MIA-CNF now bookable on AA.com although you can only get Y fares. When you select your flights it says Subejct to Government Approval. Maybe that is w
117 LipeGIG : The flight is authorized both ways, Brazil and US. It's just a matter of fare construction by AA (only Y and Business (J and another one) are availab
118 Post contains links Incitatus : American's press release is out: http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/080818/lam528.html?.v=18
119 LipeGIG : And now it's possible to book on AA.com. Economy is now available on lower fares!
120 Tonytifao : Yup, CNF fares are out... but they seem so expensive! Departure Fare per Person 863.88 USD Return Fare per Person 879.00 USD Total Fare per Person 174
121 Post contains links Panamair : DL announced their new flights today: http://biz.yahoo.com/pz/080827/149266.html Delta's schedule between Atlanta and Manaus, effective Dec. 19, 2008:
122 JJ8080 : Very interesting the use of 737-700 on MAO route... There were many talking about wich routes they would fill ith these birds, and now we are gonna s
123 MaverickM11 : What eqp was in the route application?
124 C010T3 : It was a 752.
125 MAH4546 : 752. So in one month, Delta's application quickly changed from: First: 4x 763 CNF / 4x 752 FOR / 7x 752 MAO Second: 4x 752 FOR+REC / 7x 752 MAO Third
126 Panamair : The 752s for REC/FOR will have the international BusinessElite seats (16 up front).
127 JJ8080 : Nice!! Agree 100%.. With the 738 having almost the same flight costs and more cargo capacity, they sould have gonne with it istead of the 73G. Also t
128 Incitatus : It is prudent from Delta to use 737s to Manaus. The business class demand is very close to zero. Even with a 737 a daily schedule may be too much fre
129 MAH4546 : I wouldn't hold my breathe on that. That's a year-round change, not a high season change. The additional frequency is being transferred from United A
130 JJ8080 : AA is going with 763s on daily MIA-SSA-REC-MIA and 3x/4x weekly MIA-CNF, and I do believe they are correct. I really se a huge space for growing on n
131 LH506 : Does this mean that UA will only have 20 frequencies left and cannot offer daily IAD-GRU, IAD-GIG and ORD-GRU during high season anymore??
132 Incitatus : I am not aware that has been approved. MIA-CNF is only showing 4 x week to the end of January. In that case, American seems to be using the right to
133 C010T3 : UA had 23 frequencies, but was only using 21.
134 MAH4546 : It hasn't, but it should be next week. AA is allowed to market and sell this additional frequency "Subject to Government Approval."
135 LipeGIG : MAO isn't a cargo hub (and can't be with so few flights), it's just a city with strong demand for Imports (electronics) and domestic flights to VCP.
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