Cadet57 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 9081 posts, RR: 34 Reply 1, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 4517 times:
Quoting LAXintl (Thread starter): Second time around, WestJet will discontinue its daily YYZ-LAX service effective Nov 2nd
Maybe it will become seasonal?
Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
LAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 22021 posts, RR: 51 Reply 2, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 4423 times:
Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 1): Maybe it will become seasonal?
Well anything is possible, however its LAX handler was told this was a permanent cut, and the online schedule shows nothing all the way thru May 2009.
Funny how WJ has had such a hard time with both YVR and YYZ.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
MileHighFlyer From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 55 posts, RR: 0 Reply 3, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 4376 times:
I think Air Canada is handling the YYZ-LAX route well with their 4 daily flights, plus it seems like the type of route that only gets really busy over the summer.
LAXAgent From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 54 posts, RR: 0 Reply 4, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4311 times:
Air Canada has 5 Summer Flights (YYZ-LAX)
AC 791-0845
AC 799-1200
AC 787-1600
AC 793-1800
AC 795-2020
Wedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5524 posts, RR: 5 Reply 5, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4293 times:
Interesting. I wonder WJ's US routes will shuffle a bit due to their upcoming arrangement with WN.
Yegbey01 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1678 posts, RR: 3 Reply 6, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 4249 times:
Don't forget AA's service as well.
Way back Jetsgo used to do that run as well....I think WS is trying hard to carve a niche inn the Canada-US market....But as lucrative it maybe, it is quite competitive!!
I think the YEG-LAX will do quite well, as the market is underserved..
9252fly From Canada, joined Sep 2005, 1341 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 4249 times:
It's going to be very interesting to see WS 3rd quarter numbers come October. With load-factor slipping for the last few months and additional capacity continuing to come online,it certainly looks like they will have to get very creative. It doesn't help that they recently hedged a lot of their fuel at $135.00 USD(Canadian dollar is falling to make matters worse). Their trans-border efforts have been anything but easy for them(excluding pure sun destinations like MCO),hence why an arrangement with WN makes a lot of sense.
Pnwtraveler From Canada, joined Jun 2007, 2045 posts, RR: 12 Reply 8, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 4150 times:
If you are a regular on that route you want the perks. LA has some leisure travelers but more business ones that are frequent flyer plan lovers. LAX to YYZ has a bunch of regulars who shuttle back and forth.
Flyb From Canada, joined Aug 2006, 630 posts, RR: 0 Reply 9, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 3874 times:
Quoting 9252fly (Reply 7): I think the YEG-LAX will do quite well, as the market is underserved..
Agreed. I think WS will find that there expansion to the states from YEG will work better than from YYZ. Just like YYC, YEG has a good market share for them. YEG doesn't have much competition except on their LAS route.
Brilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 3163 posts, RR: 1 Reply 10, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 3824 times:
I think that WS is having a hard time because they do not offer any premium service and they seem to do better on the shorter trans-border runs. I also believe that the route is well served by AC and because they offer 5 flights daily they can give you flexibility and choice.
LAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 22021 posts, RR: 51 Reply 11, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 3791 times:
It seems to me, a big issue with WJ transborder service over the years has been the fact that the carrier barely has any brand recognition on this side of the border.
Just look at the failures at SFO, LGA, and continued schedule tinkering at LAX.
If not for my industry interest, I also would likely never have not heard of WestJet either, as I have yet to see a single bit of media advertising for the airline, nor is the carrier active chasing after US travel agents. As a result WJ is basically stuck relying on only half of the traffic pie - Canada origin traffic near exclusively.
Hopefully the future SWA codeshare improves upon this.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
Boeingluvr From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 13, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 3634 times:
Quoting MileHighFlyer (Reply 3): I think Air Canada is handling the YYZ-LAX route well with their 4 daily flights, plus it seems like the type of route that only gets really busy over the summer.
A friend of mine at LAX told me this summer that the average AC load for flights into LAX were extremly low and this spring as well!!... Go AC!!!
Osiris30 From Barbados, joined Sep 2006, 3182 posts, RR: 26 Reply 15, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 3026 times:
Still not sure why the abandoned the idea of operating more service from YHM. YYZ is horribly competitive and *expensive*.
If WJ operated YHM-LAX I know of at least one person who would be on two flights a week, every week, but since the service was only offered to YYZ, they opted to go AC for greater flexibility.
I don't care what you think of my opinion. It's my opinion, so have a nice day :)
Brilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 3163 posts, RR: 1 Reply 16, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 2971 times:
Quoting Osiris30 (Reply 15): Still not sure why the abandoned the idea of operating more service from YHM. YYZ is horribly competitive and *expensive*.
If WJ operated YHM-LAX I know of at least one person who would be on two flights a week, every week, but since the service was only offered to YYZ, they opted to go AC for greater flexibility
YHM is not easy to get to from Toronto, Canada's largest city. Living and working in Toronto, I had to fly alot for my job and there is no way I could afford the time for the two hour drive to YHM As soon as they could they jumped at the chance to get into YYZ. It is unfortunately the business centre of Canada and where people want to go.
MarcoPoloWorld From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 600 posts, RR: 0 Reply 17, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2852 times:
Quoting LAXintl (Reply 11): Just look at the failures at SFO, LGA, and continued schedule tinkering at LAX.
I do miss flying WestJet's San Francisco - Calgary service; it was affordable, and the departure / arrival times in both directions were convenient for leisure travel (midday flights).
9252fly From Canada, joined Sep 2005, 1341 posts, RR: 0 Reply 18, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2824 times:
Quoting Boeingluvr (Reply 13): A friend of mine at LAX told me this summer that the average AC load for flights into LAX were extremly low and this spring as well!!... Go AC!!!
Symptomatic of the market in general as all carriers are in the same boat,probably explains WS withdrawal from the YYZ-LAX market again.
Quoting Flyb (Reply 9): Agreed. I think WS will find that there expansion to the states from YEG will work better than from YYZ. Just like YYC, YEG has a good market share for them. YEG doesn't have much competition except on their LAS route.
Yes,WS will likely do well on the YEG-LAX market over the winter. Expect that it will only be seasonal as AC can't seem to stimulate the year-round market profitability enough to up-gauge the 705 to a E90 indicating that the market is not that large with US (or is it UA) also serving the same route.
WS is still a leisure carrier outside of Canada and that is what has limited their ability to succeed in the trans-border market. Their success against AC in Canada is not easy to replicate when you are challenging massive legacy carriers south of the border. That of course is likely to change once they team up with WN,then again it's suggests that WS has pretty much given up on tackling the trans-border market alone.
Osiris30 From Barbados, joined Sep 2006, 3182 posts, RR: 26 Reply 19, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2796 times:
Quoting Brilondon (Reply 16): YHM is not easy to get to from Toronto,
The same is true for YYZ if you live outside of Toronto. Which is kind of the reason that less YHM traffic surprises me.
Quoting Brilondon (Reply 16): It is unfortunately the business centre of Canada and where people want to go.
Well based on the traffic on the QEW on Friday, approximately 1 billion people commute from Hamilton, Burlington and Oakville to Toronto every morning. So business center it may be, but the actual population is commuting to that business location every day.
I don't care what you think of my opinion. It's my opinion, so have a nice day :)
SANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 4716 posts, RR: 15 Reply 20, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2738 times:
Quoting LAXintl (Reply 11): It seems to me, a big issue with WJ transborder service over the years has been the fact that the carrier barely has any brand recognition on this side of the border.
Just look at the failures at SFO, LGA, and continued schedule tinkering at LAX.
If not for my industry interest, I also would likely never have not heard of WestJet either, as I have yet to see a single bit of media advertising for the airline, nor is the carrier active chasing after US travel agents. As a result WJ is basically stuck relying on only half of the traffic pie - Canada origin traffic near exclusively
All of the above remarks apply as well to their short-lived SAN-YYC attempt 3 summers ago...
Yegbey01 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1678 posts, RR: 3 Reply 21, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2672 times:
Quoting MarcoPoloWorld (Reply 17): do miss flying WestJet's San Francisco - Calgary service; it was affordable
UAL and AC offer amazing deals to California from Alberta....I think that myth that WS ic=s cheaper than AC is a joke...
Yegbey01 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1678 posts, RR: 3 Reply 22, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2669 times:
Quoting 9252fly (Reply 18): will only be seasonal as AC can't seem to stimulate the year-round market profitability enough to up-gauge the 705 to a E90 indicating that the market is not that large with US (or is it UA) also serving the same route.
I don't get why AC flies to LAX from YEG...
Between the time AC started flying to LAX from YEG and now, United added 3 flights to SFO, Delta added 2 daily flights to SLC...and still AC can't fill a aplne profitabilty (at that's what they say)....
Alamost al;ways, flying to LAX from YEG is way cheaper on AC when connecting though YYC or YVR (since they have flooded theses two markets with flights to LAX)...
so go figure!!
9252fly From Canada, joined Sep 2005, 1341 posts, RR: 0 Reply 23, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2448 times:
Quoting Yegbey01 (Reply 22): Between the time AC started flying to LAX from YEG and now, United added 3 flights to SFO, Delta added 2 daily flights to SLC...and still AC can't fill a aplne profitabilty (at that's what they say)....
Not too sure what the profitability numbers are for AC YEG-LAX. AC benefits from the ability to connect to other Star Alliance carriers at LAX,something that WS lacks for now ( WN ) . That's probably what sustains the route more than the O&D traffic,so even though it may be marginally profitable,it's the connection traffic at both ends (primarily LAX) that keeps it from being cancelled.
Brilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 3163 posts, RR: 1 Reply 24, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 2393 times:
Quoting Osiris30 (Reply 19): The same is true for YYZ if you live outside of Toronto. Which is kind of the reason that less YHM traffic surprises me.
YYZ has bus service and highways connecting to it, congested and hard to get to when between the hours of 0400 to about 2300 but still a way of getting to the airport. YHM has no freeway access and no bus service that I know about from Toronto and the rest of SW Ontario.
Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
25 Osiris30: Actually the new highway 6 extension and the 'Linc' make it pretty easy to get to YHM these days. What you say was true a few years ago, but not anym
26 LACA773: It also allows AC the flexibility to fly different equipment depending on loads. I'm sure this works well for them as it does for AM & MX to Mexico.
27 9252fly: I recall AS indeed operated YYC-LAX non-stop for a period of time,perhaps a year or two then it reverted back to a direct flight via SEA.
28 YEGinLeduc: AS operated YYC-LAX with a 739 two years ago as well as 3 flights a day to SEA with a mix of 734/CRJ/DH4 Last year QX did 4 flights a day YYC-SEA on
29 Flyb: Air Canada has not stated since 2001 that this route is not profitable when they pulled the Canadian route out of LAX. These days that route is profi
30 Multimark: This is troubling news for WS. If they can't make a go from Canada's largest city to a major market like LAX, where are they going to place all the ad
31 Viscount724: AS also operated YYZ-LAX nonstop for a while several years ago. I don't think it lasted more than year, possibly less. An AS MD-80 wasn't much compet
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