Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
KL Taken To Court Over Not Used Train Ticket  
User currently offlineBuyantUkhaa From Mongolia, joined May 2004, 2907 posts, RR: 3
Posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 6151 times:

Article(in Dutch only).

Some interesting consequence of the new tax that the Dutch government slapped onto flights originating in the Netherlands:

It's becoming popular, especially among people living near the border, to get tickets DUS-AMS-X or ANR-AMS-X to skip this tax, as transit pax don't have to pay it.

Recently a man bought a ticket ANR-AMS-MNL and drove from his home (not clear whether in the Netherlands or Belgium) to AMS. The ANR-AMS section is not flown by KL but carried out by rail. Since the man hadn't used his train ticket, his further segments had been cancelled, as would be common procedure in case ANR-AMS had been a flight (unused coupon).

But now the problem: on that train, tickets are often not checked at all (happened to me again a few weeks ago AMS-BRU), so pax could be refused on flights for not having their train ticket inspected?! Or does KL have a check-in desk at Antwerp railway station?

The man was offered compensation by the travel agency through which he had bought the ticket, but refused. He preferred to take KL to court so that a judge can set a clear precedent, whatever the outcome may be. KL must be interested in the outcome too. KL may have its own conditions of carriage, but the system is not waterproof.

It has more interesting aspects: a train ticket stamp doesn't say at what time the ticket was stamped, so somebody could get, say, this ticket ANR-(train)-AMS-MNL, only get on the ttrain in The Hague and thus avoid the taxes. Would a.nutters living in the Netherlands have any thoughts on this?

[Edited 2008-08-09 07:47:41]


I scratch my head, therefore I am.
7 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7553 posts, RR: 8
Reply 1, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 6083 times:

I thought that I read that KLM does have some sort of ticket office at the train stations but I could be wrong.


"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineOzzietukker From Netherlands, joined May 2007, 62 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 5839 times:

When you do a booking, there is stated that at Antwerp train station you have to change your KLM reservation for a Thalys trainticket.

More interestingly is if KLM is allowed to cancel a flight if the first leg is not a KLM plane, but a train, if the outcome is negative, you will see a lot of bookings starting in Antwerpen.
KLM is somehow able to charge € 385,56 TAX when departing from Amsterdam, but when you depart from Antwerp (and use the rail) it is suddenly 'only' € 290 TAX. (The dutch 'environment' tax is 'only' € 45 euro, and the AMS normal tax is € 28 euro... Adding that the base price of tickets for KLM starting in Belgium is already lower, KLM would not want to loose this in court!


User currently offlineMEA-707 From Netherlands, joined Nov 1999, 4341 posts, RR: 35
Reply 3, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 5730 times:



Quoting BuyantUkhaa (Thread starter):
But now the problem: on that train, tickets are often not checked at all (happened to me again a few weeks ago AMS-BRU), so pax could be refused on flights for not having their train ticket inspected?! Or does KL have a check-in desk at Antwerp railway station?

You are not supposed to go on just any train but in the Thalys and check in in ANR already. There is a way they found out they didn't check in in ANR and then cancelled the onward journey.
It's the talk of the day amongst my not-into-aviation-friends, all complaining how KLM is so arrogant that they ask less for a DUS-AMS-onwards or ANR-AMS onwards rail/flight and they should not care if people skip that flight , but they never heared of yield management, I can follow KLM on this one.



nobody has ever died from hard work, but why take the risk?
User currently offlineLJ From Netherlands, joined Nov 1999, 4461 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 5711 times:



Quoting Ozzietukker (Reply 2):
KLM is somehow able to charge € 385,56 TAX when departing from Amsterdam, but when you depart from Antwerp (and use the rail) it is suddenly 'only' € 290 TAX. (The dutch 'environment' tax is 'only' € 45 euro, and the AMS normal tax is € 28 euro...

Airport tax for connecting pax is lower. As you connect at AMS from a KL "flight" number to another KL flight number it´s considered a connection. Hence also the reason why you don´t have to pay the EUR 45 environmental tax.


User currently offlineMoo From Falkland Islands, joined May 2007, 4016 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 5681 times:



Quoting Ozzietukker (Reply 2):
More interestingly is if KLM is allowed to cancel a flight if the first leg is not a KLM plane, but a train, if the outcome is negative, you will see a lot of bookings starting in Antwerpen.

No you won't, they will jsut stop offering the routing if it costs them hassle and money.


User currently offlineAdools From Egypt, joined Oct 2006, 72 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 5136 times:

The same question exists with LH flying SXB (Strasbourg) -FRA-XXX, where the SXB-FRA leg is on a bus. C class fares for SXB-FRA-XXX are often way cheaper than FRA-XXX. One wonders if one could book SXB-FRA-XXX, and not take the bus but check in at FRA? Anyone with experience on that?

User currently offlineVfw614 From Germany, joined Dec 2001, 4013 posts, RR: 5
Reply 7, posted (6 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 2854 times:

Check out the 500+ posts thread "Today I Earned Continental 1800 US$" by Falcon84. There are a lot of posts in it dealing with the problem hidden city ticketing, cross-border selling etc., including legal precedents on the subject from a number of jurisdictions.

In short, there are currently more than 20 court cases pending in Germany in which airlines have been sued by a consumer organization for a fare rule that allows the airline to cancel a trip if one leg is not used by the customer. The first to lose in court was British Airways a couple of month ago. Also, Lufthansa has lost a couple of cases brought by customers after Lufthansa cancelled their ticket and charged a business class fare when they showed up at the airport. The customers sued Lufthansa for damages and won as the courts held that the fare rule was void.


Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Manitoba Taking Air Canada To Court Over Job Cuts posted Thu Oct 30 2008 14:20:03 by CB97
AMS Airlines Take Dutch State To Court Over Tax posted Fri Jan 25 2008 03:53:36 by BuyantUkhaa
HV Considers Taking AMS To Court Over Pier Access posted Wed May 31 2006 12:53:14 by BuyantUkhaa
EC Takes Greek Govt. To Court Over State Aid posted Thu Apr 27 2006 17:58:13 by BuyantUkhaa
Broward County Takes FAA To Court Over FLL posted Thu Sep 8 2005 05:10:31 by Lowecur
United Airlines Heads To Court Over US Union Contr posted Wed May 11 2005 23:13:39 by Rsmith6621a
Purser Takes IA To Court Over 'tash! posted Sat Jun 30 2001 03:24:35 by Mas777
SIA Pilots Want More Money - SIA Taken To Court posted Wed Mar 14 2001 17:07:08 by Singapore_Air
Qantas Taken To Federal Court By Pilots posted Mon Feb 26 2007 00:19:10 by Sparklehorse12
Lawsuit Over Falling Luggage Goes To Court (USAir) posted Mon Oct 10 2005 00:04:24 by SonOfACaptain