Chuchoteur From France, joined Sep 2006, 700 posts, RR: 0 Posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 10119 times:
Tuesday evening I was flying back from Palma de Mallorca to Paris Orly on Air Europa, under an Air France codeshare (this was my 4th sector of the day, getting to Palma for meetings can be a bit complicated).
I was on a 737-800, flight UX1297 departing PMI at 19:15, Seat 10A.
I had selected my seat in order to be next to a window, as the departure from PMI is nice, then you cross the coast, overfly the east of the pyrennees and head up to Paris.
I was rather surprised to find that my "WINDOW" seat had... no window.
In fact, all I had was a blank panel.
You couldn't even peak out of the window in front or behind, it was really a BIG blank area.
I fly Air Europa a fair bit to go to PMI, but I had never noticed it before...
Why do they not have windows in that location?
I thought it was a bit of a downer, but hey, I survived...
Ikramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21029 posts, RR: 60 Reply 3, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 10097 times:
737NG have these windowless or misaligned window seats in most configurations.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
HAMAD From United Arab Emirates, joined Apr 2000, 1157 posts, RR: 7 Reply 4, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 9906 times:
a lot of airlines have specific seats with no windows. i saw that personally on United 777's, LH 747, UA 757, CO 737-700 and even our own EK 330's & 777 exit seats
Francoflier From France, joined Oct 2001, 3196 posts, RR: 10 Reply 7, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 9610 times:
Had one on a CO 777 one day. It felt terribly claustrophobic to be seated between a blank plastic wall, two seats on the right and two rows of seat front and back.
Fortunately the flight wasn't full and the f/a's got me another one.
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit posting...
Brilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 3175 posts, RR: 1 Reply 8, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 9583 times:
It sucks to be you guys. Most aircraft have ventilation or electrics running up the fuselage. If you fly as much as you say you should have known about the window situation.
Gr8Circle From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 2987 posts, RR: 4 Reply 9, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 9362 times:
I had this experience on a 9W 737NG and an AI A310.....most horrible feeling when you reach your seat on boarding and see the blank wall where there should have been a window....
Iloveboeing From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 750 posts, RR: 0 Reply 11, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 9309 times:
Quoting Chuchoteur (Thread starter): I was rather surprised to find that my "WINDOW" seat had... no window.
I'm sorry to hear that. Not having a window, IMO, truly makes the fly experience miserable. I was on a FL flight a few years ago and they selected our seats for us (which was really annoying!---it was before they allowed you to pay the fee to select your seats) and I had a "window" seat, but we were put in the last row on a B717, where there is no window! I was VERY upset! All the other seats were full at the time of check-in, so we couldn't change our seats.
IMO, they shouldn't have seats by the panels where there's no window. Maybe they should order the aircraft with more windows and/or put a galley or something in that space. It is quite upsetting to many of us when we don't get a window seat.
Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 2): It's a good idea to check out seatguru before you choose your seats online.
I agree. Check seatguru.com before you book your seats. It really helps!
Robsawatsky From Canada, joined Dec 2003, 597 posts, RR: 0 Reply 13, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 9192 times:
Quoting Iloveboeing (Reply 11): IMO, they shouldn't have seats by the panels where there's no window. Maybe they should order the aircraft with more windows and/or put a galley or something in that space. It is quite upsetting to many of us when we don't get a window seat.
I'm sure no airline shares your opinion; they put seats where they will fit. I can assure you that the galley, lav and seat layouts are done to maximize the efficiency of the aircraft and all the constraints and engineering trade-offs that go into those choices by both the aircraft maker and airline.
Unfortunately, a Window seat would be more properly be called a fuselage seat since there are several aircraft types where you will find: no windows, small window, offset window, etc, adjacent to certain so-called window seats.
I do recommend sites like seatguru since there are many other factors that may be important, including a window, like seat pitch variations, lav/galley locations, exit rows, bulkheads, seat recline limitations, etc. Be sure that not every seat is the same.
MD80Nut From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 871 posts, RR: 10 Reply 14, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 9139 times:
As a window seat fanatic I've learned the hard way, a window seat isn't always a window seat. I've experienced this annoyance on A300s, 767-300s and 737-300s. That's why I now go to Seat Guru.
LHR777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 15, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 9116 times:
I always thought the missing window (that's in-line with the front fan on the engine) was missing in case of un-contained engine failure. can anyone confirm?
N104UA From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 889 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 8670 times:
On the UA 733 or 735 i forget row 8 has no windows
"Learn the rules, so you know how to break them properly." -H.H. The Dalai Lama
Danfearn77 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2008, 1780 posts, RR: 9 Reply 17, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8628 times:
There are not as many windows as rows of seats i think. If you look down the aircraft, isles and windows dont match up so occasionally there will be a blanks where a window should be. I think thats right anyway!
Eagles may soar high, but weasels dont get sucked into jet engines!
Tdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80 Reply 18, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8562 times:
Quoting Iloveboeing (Reply 11): Maybe they should order the aircraft with more windows
That's not an option. There's no window at that spot because there's stuff you have to have between the sidewall and the fuselage skin that can't have a window going through it.
Quoting LHR777 (Reply 15): I always thought the missing window (that's in-line with the front fan on the engine) was missing in case of un-contained engine failure. can anyone confirm?
Nope. The engine has to contain all the stuff that is containable (basically, individual blades)...if they get outside the engine into the fuselage that's a big no-no. Some parts are not containable (turbine disks) and if they escape the engine then they're going through the fuselage whether you want them to or not.
Pnwtraveler From Canada, joined Jun 2007, 2046 posts, RR: 12 Reply 19, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 8476 times:
I have noticed on AC's 767's (can't recall which model) that had seats in the front half of the aircraft without a window in a row. When I asked the flight attendant he said that is the strengthened section where the wing spar joins the body. A thicker ring of aluminum goes around the fuselage there. I have never questioned it or checked for myself - just assumed it was the reason.
NASBWI From Bahamas, joined Feb 2005, 1254 posts, RR: 0 Reply 20, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 8400 times:
I've never been on a DL MD-88, but I noticed that theirs (as well as their MD-90s) have a gap in the windows only on the left side of the fuselage. I believe it's for the A/C ventilation ducts. I also noticed that no other airline flying the type have the same gap. Is the placement of the ducts a customer option? And are there seats on that side of the cabin?
UltimateDelta From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 1993 posts, RR: 6 Reply 21, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 8356 times:
Quoting Iloveboeing (Reply 11): I was on a FL flight a few years ago and they selected our seats for us (which was really annoying!---it was before they allowed you to pay the fee to select your seats) and I had a "window" seat, but we were put in the last row on a B717, where there is no window! I was VERY upset!
I had that happen on Midwest once, but the F/As found me an actual window seat.
RoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 8748 posts, RR: 52 Reply 22, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 8330 times:
Quoting Iloveboeing (Reply 11): IMO, they shouldn't have seats by the panels where there's no window. Maybe they should order the aircraft with more windows and/or put a galley or something in that space. It is quite upsetting to many of us when we don't get a window seat.
On the 737 Jurassics (731 and 732) there were 6 riser ducts on each side that were separated around the windows so that there were no blocked windows. When Boeing created the 737 classics (733, 734 and 735), they switched to having two large ducts which require blocked windows. This saves weight on the airplane which obviously improves performance and decreases fuel burn. Airlines prefer a lower weight plane over having the extra windows.
Quoting LHR777 (Reply 15): I always thought the missing window (that's in-line with the front fan on the engine) was missing in case of un-contained engine failure. can anyone confirm?
No, they are there because that is where the air riser ducts for the ECS (environmental control system) are. The air packs are located just forward of the wheel well near the wing to body faring.
If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
Tdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80 Reply 24, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 8248 times:
Quoting Pnwtraveler (Reply 19): When I asked the flight attendant he said that is the strengthened section where the wing spar joins the body. A thicker ring of aluminum goes around the fuselage there. I have never questioned it or checked for myself - just assumed it was the reason.
It's part of something called a "pickle fork fitting". It's a fat bulkhead that carries load from the wing spar into the fuselage.
Tom.
25 ACDC8: I had that happen to me back in 2004 with LTU. I was flying DUS-YVR and asked for a window seat, so they gave me row 10 or 11 (can't remember exactly)
26 Aviator86: Yea I always check seatguru.com or seatexpert.com just to make sure that doesn't happen. It is quite frustrating when you get such a seat. Perhaps you
27 GrahamHill: It happened to me as well on a WX BAe Avro RJ. I had the same claustrophobic feeling. Fortunately, it was only a 1,5 hour flight!
28 Moo: Anyone know if the case is similar on the Fokker 50? I have a flight from LCY to Antwerp next month on VLM...
29 Philzh: If you like your windows while flying, try not to get 29A and 29K in Emirates' A340... DXB to SYD tends to feel *really* long on these seats.
30 FlyingAY: "Would you like a window seat or an aisle seat?" "Window seat, please." And when I walked to the BA 767-300, I found out that my window seat actually
31 Emrecan: Same thing happened to me on a PGT flight (737-800) to AYT from IST. I was lucky that the flight has lasted only 1 hour...[Edited 2008-08-15 03:18:53]
32 Debonair: Check-In doesn't know either! In most of the check-in systems I know and I work with, there is no sign which seat has got a window or just a panel! S
33 Brilondon: If you check the airline websites you can find out this information, and if this does not suit you there is this website called seatguru that will te
34 WildcatYXU: I guess what ACDC8 is trying to tell us that even knowledge of seat configurations doesn't fully guarantee that you won't get such seat. That was esp
35 IAirAllie: I second the seatguru.com recommendation. I always refer to it when reserving a seat.
36 Bok269: It's due to the cabin they have in the middle of the rear cabin on the left hand side: http://www.seatguru.com/airlines/Del..._Airlines/Delta_Airline
37 Panova98: I agree with the comments about Seatguru.com. It's terrific, with one exception, the effect of the wing and engine limiting whether you can see the gr
38 ACDC8: Lets take Air Canada for example, I'm flying YYZ-FRA and I'm booked one one of their 763s, which layout can I expect? AC has 4 for their 763s. Point
39 PSAelectra: This topic hit a nerve with me as well, having been assigned "window-less window seats" many times over the years. Could never understand why Boeing f
40 Stratosphere: Try flying backwards with no window like I do at FedEx...It isn't like it was when I flew NW as an employee but atleast it's free.
41 Tdscanuck: They *can*, but why would they? The airline is paying Boeing for revenue seats, not window seats. If you ran it next to the door frame you'd just hav
42 Bok269: Seatguru notes the Exit rows-generally speaking, those are to be avoided if you want a view. As for being on the wing in a normal row, I've never rea
43 Brilondon: I know that people may find it hard to find out information but I just tried to give you the best resource I know and I find it quite accurate and us
44 Chuchoteur: ... I actually fly a lot (I oscillate between Gold and Platinum member on Skyteam, with a few other flights spread out with the other alliances), but
45 JetMech: I'm completely mystified as to why some appear to be blaming Boeing for the "windowless" issue Are some of you suggesting that Boeing develops a custo
46 Irobertson: My fiancee and I both encountered this in Air Canada's 773's from YYZ-LHR, in economy just two rows before biz class. I think it (and it's pair on the
47 Panova98: Dear mystified, and others.., these discussions are funny, to say the least, but it gives us a chance to rant, rave, kid, whatever. I don't mean my co
48 DCA-ROCguy: On AirTran, avoid row 14 on 73G's. On their 717's, avoid the last two rows (30-31). On a 767 on a carrier like AC with multiple versions, Y fliers can
50 JetMech: Sure, but the fact still remains, if the seat pitch is not an exact match for the window pitch, you will still have seats that are partially or fully
51 Brilondon: What is it with you guys I only suggested resources that would help you. Like life it not the definitive answer you seek. Stop ripping me for trying
52 Tdscanuck: Yes, but the core service is moving people economically and safety from A to B. The view on the way is *way* down the list of services. But you also
54 Brilondon: That is not exactly true. An airline exists as all businesses to earn its owners a profit. The way it earns a profit (for all you commie socialists I
55 Moo: Significant portions of people don't suffer motion sickness solely because they can see movement outside.
57 Chuchoteur: I can believe that... I'm not prone to motion sickness, but at pushback, with no external reference, I thought we were moving when in fact we were st
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