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Low Cost Airlines In Europe  
User currently offlineRAFVC10 From Spain, joined Sep 2005, 1980 posts, RR: 6
Posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 6299 times:
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Hi all,

I'm making a compilation of what, in your opinion, are the "true" low-cost airlines in Europe (excluding regional, feeder and charter airlines). I made a list and need your comments about if you add or will remove any. The Wikipedia information is not feasible...

AUSTRIA = Niki, Intersky

CYPRUS = Eurocypria Airlines

CZECH REPUBLIC = Smart Wings

DENMARK = Sterling

FINLAND = Blue 1

FRANCE = XL Airways France

GERMANY = Air Berlin, Condor, Germanwings, TUIfly, XL Airways Germany

HUNGARY = Wizz Air

ICELAND = Iceland Express

IRELAND = Ryanair

ITALY = Air Italy, Blu-Express, MyAir, Volare Airlines, Volasalerno, Windjet.

NETHERLANDS = Transavia

NORWAY = Norwegian

POLAND = Centralwings

ROMANIA = Blue Air

RUSSIA = Sky Express

SLOVAKIA = SkyEurope

SPAIN = Clickair, Vueling

SWITZERLAND = Flybaboo, Helvetic Airways

TURKEY = Anadolujet, Pegasus Airlines, Sun Express

UNITED KINGDOM = Bmibaby, Easyjet, Flybe, Flyglobespan, Jet2.com, XL Airways, Thomsonfly, Zoom Airlines

Awaiting your comments.

Thanks in advance,

Gerard


El dia que los gilipollas vuelen, no podremos ver la luz del sol!
33 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSomeone83 From Norway, joined Sep 2006, 3367 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 6293 times:

Don't think Blue1 can be called a low-cost. Although they do have buy-on-board in economy, do they belong to Star Alliance, have 2 classes onboard their flights (business or economy extra and economy) and are a copy of SAS. To be precise, a Blue1 is in reality SAS Finland. They also offer connection with other carriers

[Edited 2008-08-15 11:42:38]

User currently offlineJoost From Netherlands, joined Apr 2005, 3167 posts, RR: 4
Reply 2, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 6293 times:



Quoting RAFVC10 (Thread starter):

What's your definition of a Low Cost Airline?

* A carrier that offers no drinks for free?
* A carrier that only offers one-way fares?
* A carrier that does not offer connections?
* A carrier that has a lower average fare than the average fare in ...?
* A carrier that has a low internal cost base? (think about a high-fare, low-cost = high-profit carrier?)


User currently offlineRAFVC10 From Spain, joined Sep 2005, 1980 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 6247 times:
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Quoting Joost (Reply 2):
What's your definition of a Low Cost Airline?

Hi Joost,

great question... in my opinion a low cost airline is the airline that:

- Only sells it's tickets via Internet sites

- That offers only one-way fares

- That has better fares that scheduled and regular airlines

- That operates from secondary airports

(...)

Are you agree with my thoughts?

Regards,

Gerard



El dia que los gilipollas vuelen, no podremos ver la luz del sol!
User currently offlineSandroZRH From Switzerland, joined Feb 2007, 3428 posts, RR: 50
Reply 4, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 6241 times:



Quoting RAFVC10 (Thread starter):

SWITZERLAND = Flybaboo, Helvetic Airways

I don't think either of the two are true low-cost airlines. Helvetic cancelled all scheduled ops, and merely operates 2 F100s on behalf of LX now.

Flybaboo is a small regional airline without low-cost concept, but rather a good, legacy-like product on board and on the ground.

There's Easyjet Switzerland which is a Swiss registered carrier.


User currently offlineJRadier From Netherlands, joined Sep 2004, 4678 posts, RR: 50
Reply 5, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 6233 times:



Quoting RAFVC10 (Reply 3):
- Only sells it's tickets via Internet sites



Quoting RAFVC10 (Reply 3):
- That operates from secondary airports

In that case, remove Transavia from your list. They are huge in the IT market and their largest base is AMS, hardly a secondary airport.



For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and ther
User currently offlineSomeone83 From Norway, joined Sep 2006, 3367 posts, RR: 3
Reply 6, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 6223 times:

Quoting RAFVC10 (Reply 3):
- Only sells it's tickets via Internet sites

- That offers only one-way fares

- That has better fares that scheduled and regular airlines

- That operates from secondary airports

Using these requirements, Blue1 is NOT an LCC

[Edited 2008-08-15 11:54:19]

User currently offlineFlySSC From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 7411 posts, RR: 57
Reply 7, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6199 times:



Quoting RAFVC10 (Thread starter):
FRANCE = XL Airways France

 no  XL Airways France is NOT a LCC. It's a Charter company working mostly with T.O

TRANSAVIA FRANCE is a mix of LCC and Charter Airline, though they operate from ORY.

Quoting RAFVC10 (Reply 3):
Hi Joost,

great question... in my opinion a low cost airline is the airline that:

- Only sells it's tickets via Internet sites

- That offers only one-way fares

- That has better fares that scheduled and regular airlines

- That operates from secondary airports

In that case, many airlines you mentionned are not LCC either : EasyJet operates from CDG and ORY, idem for Vueling and Clickair ...
Actually, in France only Ryanair, Wizzair, and Blue Air operate from secondary airport (ie Beauvais Tille iso Paris).


User currently offlineJoost From Netherlands, joined Apr 2005, 3167 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6177 times:



Quoting RAFVC10 (Reply 3):

Hi,

Well, my personal idea of an LCC matches of course your definitions.

The point is, IMO, that it is getting more and more difficult to define a true LCC, or to draw a clear line between LCCs and Full Service carriers. Many carriers are becoming more and more "hybrid". In a way, maybe Ryanair is the only real LCC left.

* Many of the carriers you list (Transavia, Tuifly, Air Berlin, Thomsonfly, XL, Condor, etc) sell many tickets through tour operators. It's quite normal that up to 80% of seats on these carriers are pre-sold to tour operators; the airlines then sell the remaining seats.

* Many LCCs serve similar primary airport-routes as full service carriers. Norwegian, SkyEurope, easyJet, Sterling, fly many "classic" routes. In the UK, you see that former Full service (BA)-airports like MAN and BHX are becoming the home turf of easyJet, Ryanair, Jet2 and bmibaby, or look at BCN. (Clickair largest carrier now)

* Full service carriers are lowering costs and imitate LCCs, like Aer Lingus and to a lesser extent SAS and Iberia (selling drinks on board).

* More and more traditional carriers move towards the one-way pricing structure. SAS was one of the first, now BA has similar pricing structures, as has SN. KLM has mentioned in the press to evaluate one-way fares.

* Typical LCCs start offering "flex fare" or "business class" fares, with greater flexibility. First the german LCCs (AB, Germanwings) and now even easyJet.

Just some thoughts  Smile


User currently offlineJoost From Netherlands, joined Apr 2005, 3167 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6174 times:



Quoting FlySSC (Reply 7):
Actually, in France only Ryanair, Wizzair, and Blue Air operate from secondary airport (ie Beauvais Tille iso Paris).

But then, what's the definition of a secondary airport?


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25154 posts, RR: 22
Reply 10, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6154 times:



Quoting RAFVC10 (Thread starter):
SWITZERLAND = Helvetic Airways

Helvetic announced in June that they are suspending all scheduled services at the end of October and will then operate only as a wet-lease and charter carrier. They currently operate a few routes for LX under contract which will apparently continue but they will no longer have any scheduled flights under their own name.


User currently offlineLevent From France, joined Sep 2004, 1718 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6108 times:



Quoting RAFVC10 (Reply 3):
in my opinion a low cost airline is the airline that:

- Only sells it's tickets via Internet sites

SkyEurope also has ticket offices in downtown Vienna, maybe in Bratislava too...


User currently offlineJoost From Netherlands, joined Apr 2005, 3167 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 6046 times:



Quoting Levent (Reply 11):
SkyEurope also has ticket offices in downtown Vienna, maybe in Bratislava too...

Now you say it...

* easyJet has a ticket office at Amsterdam Airport and sells it tickets via a call center
* I believe that even Ryanair has ticket offices at the airports they fly to...


User currently offlineBlueFlyer From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 3970 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 5993 times:
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Quoting Joost (Reply 9):
But then, what's the definition of a secondary airport?

Oh, that's easy. You can begin with any frigging airport in Europe where FR was the first scheduled operator. Add to the list any other airport serving the same city as another airport, if the former has less than half the traffic of the later.



I've got $h*t to do
User currently offlineCYatUK From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 810 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5925 times:



Quoting RAFVC10 (Thread starter):
CYPRUS = Eurocypria Airlines

ECA is not a low cost airline. They mostly perform charter flights but also offer scheduled services.

Tickets are available both on line and via agents and there is always full service onboard.



CY@Uk
User currently offlineHumberside From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2005, 4918 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (6 years 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 5827 times:



Quoting RAFVC10 (Thread starter):
GERMANY = Air Berlin, Condor, Germanwings, TUIfly, XL Airways Germany

XL Airways Germany are charter

Quoting RAFVC10 (Thread starter):
UNITED KINGDOM = Bmibaby, Easyjet, Flybe, Flyglobespan, Jet2.com, XL Airways, Thomsonfly, Zoom Airlines

XL Airways are mostly charter. Theres a couple of scheduled services but thats it. And while ThomsonFly still have some low cost flights the vast majority of their operations are charter

Indeed it's worth noting that many airlines on your list do charters as well as low cost including Centralwings, Sun Express, Pegasus



Visit the Air Humberside Website and Forum
User currently offlineFlyhi From United Kingdom, joined May 2007, 79 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (6 years 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 5768 times:

If you're going to include Thomsonfly in the UK market then you may as well put Monarch there. After all, most of Monarch's service is now ZB scheduled low cost and not charter, unlike Thomsonfly.

User currently offlineAjd1992 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (6 years 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 5724 times:

Zoom is a Canadian airline too....

Not even a low cost at that.


User currently offlineCaspritz78 From Germany, joined Aug 2007, 518 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (6 years 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 5685 times:



Quoting RAFVC10 (Thread starter):
ERMANY = Air Berlin, Condor, Germanwings, TUIfly, XL Airways Germany

If have to disagree with this list. Neither Air Berlin nor Condor falls under the category LCC. Condor is solely a charter airline. Air Berlin may started as a LCC but changed.

Even TUIfly is a tricky thing to categorize. On the one side there are the LCC Hapag Lloyd Express remainings on the other side the charter airline TUIfly. Also XL Airways looks more like a charter airline but I could be wrong.

Germanwings is the only real German LCC in my opinion.


User currently offlineJoost From Netherlands, joined Apr 2005, 3167 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (6 years 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5666 times:



Quoting Caspritz78 (Reply 18):
Germanwings is the only real German LCC in my opinion.

I personally consider Germanwings to be in the same league as AB.

When they started, they were a typical low-cost carrier. One fare structure, only one-way flights, etc.

Since then, they have been adding "frills" continuously:
* Frequent Flyer miles (Boomerang club)
* Flex fare ticket (including more miles, free baggage, etc)
* Started selling connection-flights like EDI-CGN-BCN

And, AFAIK, they also sell large portions of the seats to tour operators, especially on flights to the Mediterranean.


User currently offlineLeskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 6075 posts, RR: 70
Reply 20, posted (6 years 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5647 times:



Quoting Caspritz78 (Reply 18):
If have to disagree with this list. Neither Air Berlin nor Condor falls under the category LCC. Condor is solely a charter airline. Air Berlin may started as a LCC but changed.

Air Berlin actually started as charter and expanded into LCC ops...  Wink

As for Condor, I think it's diffcult to call them "solely a charter airline", they sell quite a bit of their seats through non-tour operator channels. But they certainly aren't a LCC.

Quoting Caspritz78 (Reply 18):
Germanwings is the only real German LCC in my opinion.

That, I agree with.

Quoting RAFVC10 (Thread starter):
Easyjet

While I'd also call Easyjet a LCC, they actually don't qualify for the first criterium that you mention:

Quoting RAFVC10 (Reply 3):
Only sells it's tickets via Internet sites

Easyjet also sells through travel agencies.

As do Niki, (I think) Intersky, Blue1, Air Berlin, Condor, TUIfly, Norwegian, Clickair and Sun Express. There may be others as well on your list.

Quoting RAFVC10 (Reply 3):
That has better fares that scheduled and regular airlines

Hmm... define "better". I've regularly found fares on LH and similar that matched what I would have paid using FR (calculating in the extra cost of even getting to an airport from or to where FR flies), though I admit that they would often have turned out cheaper... with about three times the travelling-time from door (where I live) to door (where I had to go).

So what's better? 3 hours travelling time for €150, or 9 hours for €50? I know I'll take the €150 fare anytime...  Wink

Quoting RAFVC10 (Reply 3):
That operates from secondary airports

That, alone, eliminates quite a few airlines on the list...  Wink



Smile - it confuses people!
User currently offlineLH470 From Germany, joined Jan 2008, 56 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (6 years 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5622 times:



Quoting Joost (Reply 19):
Since then, they have been adding "frills" continuously:

* Started selling connection-flights like EDI-CGN-BCN

True, 4U now offers connecting flights as well. However, the passenger will have to go to the transfer desk - taking his claimed luggage with him - to get his boarding pass for the connecting flight. You can look at it as having two seperate flights with the guarantee that somebody takes care of you in case that you miss the connection...

Moreover
- 4U has a baggage fee of EUR 5,-/10,- per piece; AB doesn't
- 4U charges you for drinks/food on board, AB doesn't
- AB is an IATA-member and can issue "real" ticktes.
- 4U has no interline agreements with other airlines


Therefore, there are still quite some differences between 4U and AB.


LH470



319-321,313,AB6,333,343,346,388,732-738,762/3,772/3,747SP,741-744,DC9,M81/3/8,D10,M11,L10,DH1/3/4,CR1/2/7/9,E70/90,AR8,1
User currently offlineJoost From Netherlands, joined Apr 2005, 3167 posts, RR: 4
Reply 22, posted (6 years 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 5565 times:



Quoting Leskova (Reply 20):
Easyjet also sells through travel agencies.

Of course this is true, but basically this is a tricky criterion. There are also travel agents who sell Ryanair tickets, and who charge a service fee for the booking. This is of course inevitable: everyone can help people booking tickets at Ryanair.com, and they are free to charge a fee for the time they spent helping to people.

Quoting LH470 (Reply 21):
Therefore, there are still quite some differences between 4U and AB.

Thanks for the information. I agree that there are some difference between both.


User currently offlineJakTrax From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 4936 posts, RR: 7
Reply 23, posted (6 years 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 5538 times:



Quoting JRadier (Reply 5):
Quoting RAFVC10 (Reply 3):
- Only sells it's tickets via Internet sites



Quoting RAFVC10 (Reply 3):
- That operates from secondary airports

Well I was going to add ZB to the list but by these quotes I think I'd have to withdraw them pretty quickly...

Seriously though, I consider ZB to be a low-cost now. They still have charter op's (they started as a charter outfit) but the majority of their business comes from their internet-based no-frills scheduled division.

As for secondary airports, I do not see this as being a qualifying factor for an LCC. ZB fly mainly from MAN, BHX and LGW - hardly secondary airports. In fact, if you look at some 'original' LCCs, such as U2 and LS, you'll find that they now operate (and in some cases always did operate) to and from main hubs, e.g. LGW, DUS, MAD, AMS, etc.

Karl


User currently offlineDavidkunzVIE From Austria, joined Mar 2007, 431 posts, RR: 4
Reply 24, posted (6 years 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 5193 times:

Take InterSky from that list. I once wanted to go from VIE to FDH for a day and I couldn't believe how expensive it was.


DH3 DH4 CR1 CR2 CR7 CR9 F70 732 733 734 73G 738 752 762 763 772 742 743 319 320 321 333 343
25 Flyhi : Which begs the question... why make the definition of a low cost carrier one that flies from secondary airports? Surely at the heart of a low cost ca
26 OkAY : At least in the minds of Finns, as far as I know, Blue 1 is considered as a low cost carrier, though they fly to primary airports, but then again so
27 AmricanShamrok : I'd add Aer Lingus to the list too-sometimes EI's fares are cheaper than FR.
28 Humberside : There is a Canadian operation and a UK operation with a UK AOC
29 Viscount724 : That is not correct. DE dispays their schedules and availability in the major reservations systems and can be booked like any other scheduled airline
30 TriStar500 : Using your definition, neither one of the German airlines is a LCC, since they all either sell their tickets also via conventional travel agents or d
31 Leskova : The difference being that all of the airlines I mentioned, including Easyjet, can be booked through Amadeus. Ryanair is internet-only, the ones I men
32 Post contains links Joost : Oh yes, I remember the press release about easyJet now, and their cooperation with Amadeus and Galileo. We might add SkyEurope to that list too, they
33 GT4EZY : Absolute rubbish and pure snobbery. I used to operate BA and BACON services under GB Airways. Other than the "cabin tidy" (which is literally just a
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