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Southwest January Schedule Changes  
User currently offlineJoeljack From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 937 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 9148 times:

I've noticed LOTS of schedule changes in January for Southwest. Does anyone know if there is a list of all the changes? Here are a few that I noticed:

I sure hope these are not permenant!!
OMA-LAS 3x to 2x
OMA-PHX 3x to 2x
OMA-MDW 6x to 5x

MCI-LAS 5x to 4x
MCI-PHX 3x to 4x
MCI-BWI 2x to 3x

93 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4659 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (6 years 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 9120 times:

BDL loses a BWI and MDW and a TPA
MHT loses a BWI and an MCO
PVD loses a MDW and a MCO (the 6th MCO has been going back and forth, I think its a sign that the 6th is "seaosnal" from March-August and Nov-Dec)

The MDW reductions for Jan and Feb make sense, but the fact that they are reducing places like PHX and LAS as you mention would indicate this is an actual reduction in capacity and not a seasonal "shift". Unless WN has somethign else up its sleeve.

[Edited 2008-08-22 08:05:07]


Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineJoeljack From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 937 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 9051 times:

By thumbing through a little more, there are a lot more reductions all over the place, mostly just a single frequency though. The bigger question is, where are these planes going? Early retirements? Temporary parking? Maintenance? Or just less utilization...which kinda looks like the case based of the times of the flights being cut.

User currently onlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6552 posts, RR: 51
Reply 3, posted (6 years 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 9044 times:



Quoting Joeljack (Reply 2):
The bigger question is, where are these planes going?

Denver?

I say that only half in jest. I'm sure DEN will see further expansion early next year.


User currently offlineMasseyBrown From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 5403 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (6 years 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 9052 times:

Seven flights to be cut at STL. One each to BWI, MDW, CLE, LAS, SDF, PHX, and TUL.


I love long German words like 'Freundschaftsbezeigungen'.
User currently offlineJunction From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 766 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (6 years 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 9037 times:

Aren’t there several non-stop markets from PHX going away? Thought I saw that someplace.

User currently offlineImapilotaz From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (6 years 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 9027 times:

The planes arent going anywhere. January and February are the 2 worst months of the year and with fuel costs now up to 35% of expenses and overall variable expenses close to 65-70% of total expenses, it actually makes sense to park airplanes during shoulder periods and to park aircraft early instead of flying to increase utilization.

Many of these flights will come back come Spring. Anyone that's ever nonrevved on WN knows that they have about 300 flights a day that depart fairly late (after 7pm to 9pm) across the nation that typically have less than a 50% LF. Those flights are starting to get parked as they no longer cover the variable expenses.

Welcome to the new world order where even SWA cant afford to fly weak flights.

[Edited 2008-08-22 07:54:45]

User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4659 posts, RR: 11
Reply 7, posted (6 years 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 8974 times:

For DECADES WN didnt adjust depand seasonally, and now that things are tight, its becomming necessary. Do airports really need that later flight to the frozen tundra that is Chicago in middle january right after the holoday rush? no... send that plane in for a D-check and it will be done just in time for the spring vacation florida rush.


Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineSW733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6318 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (6 years 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 8972 times:



Quoting Joeljack (Thread starter):
MCI-PHX 3x to 4x
MCI-BWI 2x to 3x

Sure hope they ARE permanent. I travel on these routes frequently, and more choice is great. Love it.


User currently offlineFlyCMH From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 2277 posts, RR: 10
Reply 9, posted (6 years 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 8945 times:

As of now, no changes to their schedule out of CMH.

User currently offlineMasseyBrown From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 5403 posts, RR: 7
Reply 10, posted (6 years 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 8897 times:



Quoting Imapilotaz (Reply 6):
Many of these flights will come back come Spring.

The presser announcing the STL cuts said WN hopes to restore some of these flights in March; but, sensibly, they didn't make any specific promises.



I love long German words like 'Freundschaftsbezeigungen'.
User currently offlineJoeljack From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 937 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (6 years 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 8872 times:

If anyone has time to compare the LAS schedule from October compared to January, I think I would be very interesting...there appears to be a ton of reductions in LAS...I just don't have time now. I will later if no one else does.

User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7111 posts, RR: 13
Reply 12, posted (6 years 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 8778 times:



Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 3):
I say that only half in jest. I'm sure DEN will see further expansion early next year.

I've been told that the changes are seasonal by a friend at WN. Nevertheless, that is a frequent camouflage for other moves. I've been told they will not announce any new service at this time which would mean DEN isn't getting any flights...yet. I'm a little surprised to think that WN would park planes. You may see WN holding their powder with the leftover airplanes for a few weeks while they await developments at Frontier (DEN), Virgin America (SFO), and maybe even DL/NW (MSP/ATL). January is ski season so it wouldn't be surprising to them deploy these planes in DEN.

Another frequent airline tactic is to reduce seasonally, but then add something new by using the seasonal airplanes until deliveries arrive later in the year. In essence this allows them to move aircraft deliveries earlier for new services that were originally planned for later in the year.

Personally, I think they will announce something to utilize these newly available planes, particularly when they increased their fleet count for this Winter a few months ago. That didn't make a lot of sense if they were going to just let them sit idle for 60+ days. I had said in another thread that they often harvest airplanes on one date and then announce the new stuff when the timing suits their goals. That is what is going on here IMHO.


User currently offlineSWASFLA From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 79 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (6 years 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 8698 times:

I hope they will add more flights at FLL. I am waiting for a ramp position to open up. I hate this waiting in pool status thing...

User currently offlineAWACSooner From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 1900 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (6 years 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 8630 times:

Any major changes to OKC?

User currently offlineLACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 4006 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (6 years 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 8612 times:
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Now that UA is axing LAX-PHL, maybe WN will reinstate LAX-PHL which would be great since US has such horrible service.

User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7111 posts, RR: 13
Reply 16, posted (6 years 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 8562 times:



Quoting Enilria (Reply 12):
January is ski season so it wouldn't be surprising to them deploy these planes in DEN.

Well, I was wrong. I don't know the details, but apparently WN will reduce Denver flying as well.


User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6745 posts, RR: 32
Reply 17, posted (6 years 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 8508 times:



Quoting Enilria (Reply 16):
I don't know the details, but apparently WN will reduce Denver flying as well.

If that's true, it's not by much. The February schedule shows 112 daily departures from DEN.

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 1):
BDL loses a BWI and MDW and a TPA
MHT loses a BWI and an MCO
PVD loses a MDW and a MCO (the 6th MCO has been going back and forth, I think its a sign that the 6th is "seaosnal" from March-August and Nov-Dec)

You'd think the New England-to-Florida routes would come back in mid-February to provide capacity for winter school vacation week travel.

Quoting Imapilotaz (Reply 6):
it actually makes sense to park airplanes during shoulder periods and to park aircraft early instead of flying to increase utilization.

Many of these flights will come back come Spring.

As high as fuel is, it wouldn't surprise me if that's what they're doing. But they might even have some other ace up their sleeve, since they certainly could use the freed-up aircraft and people to do something like opening a new city.


User currently offlineSuper80DFW From United States of America, joined Oct 2007, 1692 posts, RR: 11
Reply 18, posted (6 years 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 8499 times:



Quoting AWACSooner (Reply 14):

Nope. Instead of adding a new OKC-MDW flight, WN just has 3-4 1 stop flights.



"Things change, friends leave, life doesn't stop for anybody." -- EAT'EM UP EAT'EM UP KSU!!
User currently offlineImapilotaz From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (6 years 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 8451 times:



Quoting ScottB (Reply 17):
As high as fuel is, it wouldn't surprise me if that's what they're doing. But they might even have some other ace up their sleeve, since they certainly could use the freed-up aircraft and people to do something like opening a new city.

Nope no ace up the sleeve, that's all SWA is doing. The March schedule wont be done for a few months, so it gives SWA time to look at what the final tally is for who kills what markets and then respond accordingly. But no new service would ever be started in January. Even ski destinations lose money in January. They only make money in the Feb-Apr Winter/Spring break periods.


User currently offlineStapleton From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 280 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (6 years 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 8451 times:

I believe they are setting up for an expansion to MSP. With the NW/DL merger looking very likely, now would be a good time look at MSP. MSP in my eyes is the most likely target since there is very little low cost carrier competition and is most vulnerable right about the time of the merger as DL will be focusing on many issues at that time. Just my thoughts.

User currently offlineStapleton From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 280 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (6 years 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 8444 times:



Quoting Imapilotaz (Reply 19):
But no new service would ever be started in January.

They started their Denver expansion in January.


User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7111 posts, RR: 13
Reply 22, posted (6 years 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 8420 times:



Quoting ScottB (Reply 17):
If that's true, it's not by much. The February schedule shows 112 daily departures from DEN.

They were previously showing 115. A decrease of three isn't significant, except that it marks a rare breather for WN's growth in Denver.


User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6745 posts, RR: 32
Reply 23, posted (6 years 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 8348 times:



Quoting Stapleton (Reply 21):
Quoting Imapilotaz (Reply 19):
But no new service would ever be started in January.

They started their Denver expansion in January.

PBI was also started in January of 2001. I think they like to start during a slightly slower period in order to iron out any possible glitches before traffic ramps up.


User currently offlineATLgaUSA From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 144 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (6 years 2 days ago) and read 8182 times:



Quoting Junction (Reply 5):

Aren’t there several non-stop markets from PHX going away? Thought I saw that someplace.

BHM-PHX is gone in February.


25 Post contains images SANFan : Maybe there are charter opportunities in the winter months (to sun and beach or ski destinations) that some of these newly-available a/c can be used f
26 LoneStarMike : AUS remains unchanged with 52 daily departures to 19 destinations. SAT loses 1 n/s to DAL and will then have 51 daily departures to 15 destinations Lo
27 Usairways85 : Well if WN said it wasn't making money on the route to begin with, and now UA is saying the same thing, why would WN re-enter the market just because
28 Lightsaber : I would phrase it differently. Welcome to the new high variable costs where WN must cut unprofitable flights. The host city, Las Vegas, is going thro
29 LACA773 : To give US some competion on the route as there won't be any when UA discontinues there LAX-PHL flight and it would also be nice to see US get some c
30 PVD757 : The BDL-BWI flight actually gets cut on 12/4/08.
31 SANFan : For those interested in SAN's status with the new schedules: the 1/11/09 re-worked sked (the optimized one with mostly new flight numbers) -- or perha
32 Ouboy79 : OKC will go from 3 to 2 daily to PHX.
33 MAH4546 : Anybody know what other non-stop markets are being cut? I haven't found any yet.
34 Flyboy7974 : I think also as in the past, attention to detail is that with a first notice, and now more careful scrutiny, this shows how well some know the airline
35 TDubJFK : You're that anxious to work for $8.95 an hour?
36 Silver1SWA : Hmm, and the airport has a need for a 1A? Figured it would be completed by then allowing for the opposite...
37 Silver1SWA : So? I was very eager when I applied 4 years ago. Money wasn't really the motivation... But I believe the pay scale was modified a while back starting
38 SWASFLA : I am not sure who gets paid 8.95hr. A few years ago maybe....Your a little late there. If I am going to stay in this industry I want to work with an
39 TDubJFK : Have Have you worked the ramp before? In the Florida heat? Climbing in and out of hot aircraft bins on your knees? With the sun blaring down on you? A
40 SWASFLA : Actually I have, for a while now.... Actually smart guy it is...Unless alot of my friens and the WN recruiters are lying to me????
41 TDubJFK : I wish you the best of luck, then.
42 Silver1SWA : LOL uh, yes...for the past 4 years! And to add to my statement above, the 4 years have been with WN. So I just might know what I'm talking about.
43 Atrude777 : Can also confirm what the two others are saying, CSA and Ramp both got a raise to 10.18 an hour for starting pay and continuing upwards as the year(s
44 Lightsaber : Its tough making a profit on the lower yielding transcon routes. For LAX-PHL, the market is adequately served with a plane transfer at one of WN's ma
45 TDubJFK : I am very curious why you are not with WN any longer? For years, we all read report after report about how your dream was to work for WN. You did get
46 SJC4Me : I noticed the SMF-MCI nonstop is being dropped completely. Never really understood why it was there to begin with. The ONT-BNA route is a bit odd too
47 LoneStarMike : DAL - loses 1 n/s to SAT (goes from 15 to 14) but gains 1 n/s to TUL (goes from 6 to 7) Schedule remains at 137 total weekday departures to 15 destina
48 Atrude777 : You sent me an email asking the same question and I responded, did you not get it? Alex
49 TDubJFK : No i did not.
50 Atrude777 : Ok, I tried again through the yahoo/a.net account you had sent it to me before. Alex
51 Iowaman : There must be a new city coming up or some new route additions not loaded yet. I can't believe WN would park any planes when they reversed their decis
52 Michman : Here are DTW reductions -- DTW-MDW 8x to 7x DTW-BWI 4x to 3x I don't really see WN challenging NW/DL in MSP given that they keep retreating at DTW. (E
53 SANFan : Hey R. Yeah, kind of disappointing isn't it? But I think this whole reduction in flights that's going on happened after the decision to add the new g
54 Kohflot : Both of these were/are very likely for connections. Notice most of the big west coast stations have service to MCI or BNA or both.. SEA, PDX, OAK, LA
55 SANFan : I agree with you but the question remains: why the SMF-MCI flight was cut. (I guess the obvious answer is that WN didn't get enough traffic -- local
56 Post contains links LoneStarMike : Here's a link to that blurb, btw Southwest to cut 7 flights from Lambert More coverage from the Tulsa World: Tulsa flight reductions include ExpressJ
57 SJC4Me : I'm betting it died because they started up SMF-MDW.
58 SANFan : I didn't realize that. That would explain it; certainly Chicago would be the prime connecting point to the east and southeast from Sac. Thanks for po
59 Joeljack : So I had a little time to look at LAS...here is what we got. From October Schedule to January Schedule, we had a reduction in total out going flights
60 SWASFLA : Very glad to see FLL getting LAS among other new routes. Althought I dont see many new routes out of FLL I can always wish!?!?!
61 MAH4546 : FLL is also getting new ALB and MCI non-stops; and this past year they got MHT, BUF, RDU, and AUS. A few more new FLL routes are coming in 2009. FLL
62 SWASFLA : I know DEN is but do you really think that FLL is? Do they have room to grow? I believe they have 6 gates as of now. Im pretty sure NW will be giving
63 MAH4546 : JetBlue will be moving to the new A gates when they are finished, although admitedly that might be a while. There is a significant amount of space in
64 LoneStarMike : Oops. I lied. AUS currently has 53 daily departures, which include 7 to HOU. AUS-HOU falls to 6 daily departures in January. I could have sworn that
65 Iowaman : Looks like PIT is losing a flight to MDW, PHL, and PHX.
66 LACA773 : Any chance WN will add PHL back from LAX now that UA has axed it?
67 Usairways85 : doubful, there's a reason WN, F9, and UA have cut this route When WN first entered PHL they threw a ton of capacity at routes that were formerly US s
68 Post contains links Knope2001 : Per the Dallas Morning News, they have a net reduction of 190 flights per day coming with the new January schedule.. http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedc
69 EXAAUADL : I actually think ATL is better than MSP. More gates will be freed up. NW has 4-5 gates on D. Plus F9/YX have 2 I think. Then move AC over to T with U
70 LACA773 : Thankyou for the information. It would seem to me someone would want to give US some competition on this route.
71 Smed63 : I just saw that DL is closing concourse C in CVG. Is that an opportunity for WN to serve the city with the newly freed gate space? Can concourse C sup
72 Toltommy : No. C concourse is not connected to the rest of the airport. If you check in at front of the airport, you then must walk or take train to A or B conc
73 Stapleton : The disadvantage to ATL is that there is already an entrenched LCC there in Air Tran and that DL is the surviving carrier which means they are much m
74 SWASFLA : I agree that DL would fight tooth and nail at ATL but FL??? I don't think would or even could put up at fight against FL in ATL...
75 Knope2001 : I checked Chicago for Monday 1/5/09 versus Monday 1/25/09 and only found 12 dropped flights. Perhaps the stat of "22 fewer flights to 20 cities" at MD
76 Post contains links SWABrian : Bill Owen has a blog post on our blog about the schedule changes. http://www.blogsouthwest.com/blog/whoopsjanuarys-hereand-i-forgot-blog Brian
77 SANFan : I did my comparisons between the 11/02/08 schedule (a complete, major, "optimized" revision) and the 1/11/09 release (the next complete, major, "opti
78 Knope2001 : Ahh..thanks for the explanation, SANFan. I suspect that the stats the Dallas Morning News referred to included some winter cuts prior to the early Ja
79 SANFan : Apparently so. I also still wonder if my discussion in reply 58 is valid; without actually counting the cancelled flights, 196 actual flights disappe
80 Post contains links ABQ747 : ABQ will see reduced frequencies to several cities. ABQ-DAL (-1) ABQ-MCI (-1) ABQ-LAS (-1) ABQ-SEA (-2) http://www.koat.com/news/17302840/detail.html
81 SANFan : Hmmmm. >ABQ-SAN, -1, was not included in the list (and there will still be 2 flights left between the cities.) >And ABQ-SEA is actually -1 (from 2 fl
82 Lightsaber : Thank you for quantifying the cuts. Does anyone have a number on the total flights per day for WN? What is the relative cut in daily revenue passenge
83 SANFan : This is all I could find... bb
84 LACA773 : Any chance WN will add an additonal frequency on MDW-SJC since UA is axing this route? What do the MDW-PHX-MDW schedules for the winter look like? Ar
85 SANFan : Unless UA cancelled the flight due to traffic fall-off; WN very possibly has the same issue but probably would not cancel their single flight... It s
86 MSYguy : I think this is covered in the blog post linked above, but I haven't seen it anywhere on this site. MSY is losing two flights as part of the cuts: MSY
87 PVD757 : That's all well and good, but did you consider what CO will charge you for your bags, drinks, and any other service that WN will not? All that and yo
88 United1 : When did CO start charging for bags or non-alcoholic drinks?
89 Usairways85 : For this trip i can't fly nonstop on WN because the the lone daily flt doesn't fit my schedule, so i would have to go with a 1 stop on WN Only going
90 LoneStarMike : I noticed that several flights that "leave" in January come back in mid-February. I was curious as to how all these changes will affect the city rank
91 N7371f : Spokane (GEG) loses a daily flight to both Seattle (SEA) and Portland (PDX) going from 4 dailies each to 3 each. Several years back WN ran 7 or 8 dail
92 Post contains links RJdxer : Part of it is winter time planning. Spokeswoman Brandy King said the reductions will let the airline have more aircraft available to cope with the unc
93 SANFan : You and your calculator have been busy Mike; I hope you'll be doing this every time there is a new "optimized" (major revised) schedule released! Nic
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